Druid DR

Although FM24 looks like a big step forward compared to the last 6 versions of the game, it still doesn't look better than what we had with FM17. Below are a selection of screenshots from my current FM17 save (yes I'm still playing that version!). I hope the images SI released for FM24 are still work in progress as it'll be a little disheartening if they persist with those generic cornerless stadiums they introduced with FM18. FM17 had a very large selection of stadiums, we need those back imo (or a stadium editor so we can create them ourselves). FM17 in all its glory.....

Sadly, this is where we're at. If SI are proud of this facegen technology (which looks garbage btw), then its no wonder the 3d match graphics and Stadums aren't on their radar. They're more interested in trivial things like wrist watches, fancy suits, and rings for your avatar that can barely even be seen in the game, than the match day experience itself, which is actually the pinnacle of everything we do as mangers during a week leading up to the match. The match day is where everything accumulates, where we see our tactics play out, where we see our new signings perform, where we see our teams achieve glory or succumb to relegation. They've nailed the ME in FM23, it looks excellent, but they've yet again framed it in garbage. There is no more immersion because it plays out in such a dull and uninspiring background, unlike FM17 which was so much more immersive on that front. It's almost like they spent so much time getting the ME into the really good state it's in now and adding useless trivialities like the above, that they neglected the part of the whole FM experience that actually shows the ME off and instead we have worse graphics than those we had 6 years ago, with matches playing out in stadiums that look like an intern knocked up in during his lunch hour using MS paint back in FM18. This excellent ME deserves a far better presentation / arena than what it's got. I hope SI make the whole match day experience a proper headline feature next year. Its way overdue,

FM17 had dozens and dozens of different varieties of stadiums, and all with a their own 'identity' depending on where in the world you were managing. All of them were taken away for FM18, 19, 20, 21, 22, and now 23. Here's a few more.

A stadium editor would be a headline feature worthy of the name "headline feature! Heck, SI could even release it as a paid for DLC and it'd still be massively popular imo. But failing that, the very least they could do is give us back the wealth of different stadiums we had back in Fm17. After 17 they replaced them all with the garbage looking generic ones we've had for the past 6 years. Every time this kind of topic comes up, I'll continue to post screenshots of what we once had... for nostalgia. and to show new players to FM (and SI) how great this game once looked and how a growing number of players wish it'd look like again someday.. A small selection of FM17 Stadiums in all their glory. Please bring them back SI, ... we've been waiting 6 years now.

Yep, small stadiums were really small, many grassroots clubs never even had stands, some just looked like a field with a fence or wall surrounding it. I don't think we get that now in the current FMs, I think every stadium looks like it can hold a minimum of 5000 people. No immersion at all if you're managing a club from the Northern League. One other thing I miss is the wealth of camera angles we once had. They were all removed in FM18 and still haven't been put back.

The thing is though, the graphics on FM were pretty good at one point. They don't need to be on par with FIFA imho, not even a 10-year old FIFIA. FM17 was beautiful, especially its lighting, pitches, and the stadium variety we had. I make no apologies for posting more screenshots from my old FM17 save. I miss those 3D graphics so much, I just wish SI would explain what was gained in FM18 by stripping away the beautiful looking game we had prior to that edition and the 5 editions that followed,

It's even more crazy and sad when you realise the graphics 5 years ago where much better than what they are now. FM17 looks like it was done by a completely different studio to the 5 versions that followed it. I can't recall any other game from any genre where its graphics took a huge step backwards from one version to the next - that being FM17 to FM18 - and then still haven't gotten back to how good they were 5 versions later.

To this in FM18 and the versions that followed... One of the things that is also overlooked is how the aesthetics and environments in FM17 made you feel like you were managing a club in different places around the world. The stadium variety we had allowed this, as well as the lighting, which changed depending on what time of the day the game kicked off. If you look at the stadium variety in 18 - 22, it's not the same. The screenshots above show this, i.e. a match played in Stoke's stadium looks identical to a match played in the Argentinian lower leagues. Whereas the screenshots from my FM17 save show the distinct variety in stadiums from around the world, with the lighting and pitches adding to it too. It gave off a whole other vibe to the matchday experiences compared to the blandness of FM18 and onwards.

There's no denying the animation system in 3D has improved a lot since the FM17 days, but I'm not sure what that has to do with the actual downgraded look that the rest of the 3D match day experience underwent after 17. For example, there's no logical reason why the varied and great looking pitches, the stadiums, and the stadium variety, along with the numerous match camera angles we had and the overall lighting that FM17 excelled at should be stripped out for improved player animations that came in later versions. I'd love SI to explain what happened between FM17 and 18, and the 5 versions that followed (but I won't hold my breath as they rarely comment on anything 3D matchday experience related in anycase). Someone on this thread mentioned that it was probably a case of SI getting rid of their art department after FM17 and outsourcing the graphics. That sounds more plausible, as FM17 was clearly done by artists who took pride in their work. Its hard to say the same about every version that came after. We went from this in FM17...

If 85% of the players use 3D (and thus something you prioritise) then why is it overlooked and barely gets any love? Can you also explain why FM17 looked far better than the 5 (and possibly now 6) versions that came after it? 17 had beautiful graphics and lighting, the best-looking pitches and stadiums, more stadium variety, and a wealth of camera angles to choose from along with around 30 different graphical options to choose from in preferences. All of it was stripped away for FM18, whose 3D in comparison was horrendous. The incremental improvements since 18 have still not reached what FM17 offered.

Same for me. I'm at the point where I could care less about new features. Most of them get used once or twice and ignored afterward in anycase. These days I'm less interested in micromanagement and more drawn to sitting down to watch a game of football in 3D. The 3D match day experience has been neglected for the past 5 or 6 versions now, in fact it got worse after FM17.

Amen! The excuse about older computers holding back 3D development makes no sense in anycase since FM17 looked pretty impressive - and still does. 17 had great looking pitches, the best looking stadiums and stadium variety, and the lighting was second to none. 18 to 22 have been a big step backwards to what FM17 offered visually.

Exactly! Yes the "game play" is the foundation for everything and the priority, but the match day experience - which is supposed to be the visual representation of that game play - is important to plenty of players, but sadly the visuals for it after FM17 took a big step back. Hopefully SI will re-hire an art team for FM23 and get it back to how it once looked.

To each their own. But Football Manager to me isn't just about stats and numbers on a screen. I like all that stuff too, and look forward to the new features, but the bottom line for me is after all is said and done (buying players, making tactics, training etc), I like to watch the game unfold in 3D because what happens on the pitch is the pinnacle of everything that we do as managers during the build up to any particular match. If you're the type of player that instant results or likes to skim though a season asap then I can understand why match graphics don't register. But for those who like the match day experience as much as the stats and facts, and if the visuals are poor, then its a bit of an anti-climax. Which is a shame, because like I said, at one time the visuals were pretty good.

Then they should get rid of the graphics altogether if they're not important, and go back to a text based game. But personally speaking the graphics become more and more important with every version of the game as there are only so many bells and whistles new features they can add each year to keep it interesting (and most of those are designed to make it even easier to beat the AI), so its about time they gave some love to the visual aspects of the game - especially if SI want their game to appeal to new players. I still go back and play FM17 because it was visually the best version they ever released. I'd love FM22/23s engine and FM17s graphics. Ironically they were on the right track with FM17s visuals and lighting, then FM18 happened and it took several steps back for some reason, and still hasn't recovered.. although last years was a bit better. No one is asking for CoD or FIFA type graphics btw!

We can only assume that SI fired its art team after FM17 and had their programmers create the graphics for all versions that came after. The difference between FM17 and FM18 was shocking for instance. Later editions have improved a little but not to the standard of what FM17 offered. FM17 looked beautiful, especially the stadiums and pitches.