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Everything posted by Los_Culés

  1. Garra charrúa! URU My beloved team is Argentina but with ARG out I support URU. I admire their long term project led by the Maestro Tabarez. I can only wish that a clone of Maestro Tabarez takes over ARG.
  2. Also Argentina wide players seldom tried 1 to 1. Both Meza and Di Maria were too static and alibistic.
  3. That was one of the best threads I have ever seen here. Where is THOG? :(
  4. I am playing FM11 (pretty much same engine as FM12) and I agree with you. I use tactics based on real life and I really do not have feeling that I exploit anything. I get realistic results and lot of fun (my striker with pace 9 has more goals than the other one with pace 15). The game is not just about pace, also the pace argument is getting quite old. Yes, pace is a bit overpowered, no doubt, but the pace works for the opposition in the same way as for the player. If somebody wants to exploit something, it can be done in every version of CM/FM.
  5. Compactness and individual freedom should be IMO totally separated from each other and therefore should not be combined in a team shape.
  6. A great post kandersson, I agree with pretty much everything you said.
  7. These are Thierry Henry moves ;). Well, I would not say that TH position in Arsenal was an inside forward, rather something between wide trequartista/complete forward.
  8. I do not think the debate should be where the wingers should be positioned by default when defending. The debate should be what tools to introduce for FM players so that we ourselves can decide where our players should be positioned when defending. Eg. Atlético has narrow midfield but this is compensated elsewhere (wider positioning of wingbacks, horizontal compactness with strikers coming very deep etc.)). What I want to say is that real life defensive concepts are quite complex and having one universal 4-4-2 with hard coded default positions of players will not satisfy FMers that enjoy emulation of real life concepts.
  9. @Rashidi I reckon that we can not emulate real life defending logic/principles because the FM simply lacks tools to do so and 4-4-2 flat is just a perfect example how underdeveloped is FM in this aspect. No sane real life manager would defend/position his players in 4-4-2 like we see in the game. Maybe 25-30 years ago when 4-4-2 (classic old 4-4-2 with two wingers) was popular but now is different era. Nowadays we see a "reborn" of 4-4-2 on top level (Atlético, Villarreal, Sevilla, Leicester, Paraguay...) and all these teams apply quite complex defensive principles that can not be replicated in the game. For example how Atlético defends as 4-4-2 is totally diferrent and incomparable with what we see in the game. I do not expect from FM to be able to emulate all tactical nuances but as a simulator we should be at least able to get the basic positioning right or allow players to have tools to get it right.. Even if Özil spends 500 hours in FM trying to defend with 4-4-2 like real life teams do he will not achieve that.
  10. Regarding the subject of this thread, anecdotically, Atlético IRL focus on defending these half spaces with their "Interiores" (Wide mids) and always forcing the opposition wide to press them in wide areas. Atlético (with arguably the best defence in European football in recent years) dispel the myth that 4-4-2 is vulnerable to formations like eg. 4-5-1 because of the central midfield numbers superiority. Villarreal use similar concept in their 4-4-2. Unlike in FM defensive positioning IRL is not about choosing some static formation but it is more about specific positioning of players depending on where the ball is. FM totally lacks this aspect.
  11. Problem is that that the tactical side of FM is a bit archaic, negected and does not reflect modern tactical trends. Instead of improvement we see every year pointless features being introduced by SI that do not add much to the "game core". Well, specifically the 4-4-2 that is played by Atlético is a totally different beast that what we can create in FM. 1) In FM selecting 4-4-2 means playing 4-4-2 all the time but Atlético do not play like that. They start defending more as 4-2-2-2 and morph into 4-4-2 (two flat banks) gradually closer to their goal. Not possible to recreate in FM at all as the defending formation is static. Bring back wibble/wobble!! 2) The positioning of Atlético players when defending is quite different than the positioning of players in FM. In Atlético the wingbacks defend wider whereas the midfield is very narrow (sometimes it looks like 4 central midfielders). Again, impossible to recreate. Below is roughly how Atlético defends. and we can continue like this...
  12. SFraser is a legend for me. He inspired me how to enjoy FM in so many ways.
  13. "Winger too wide" thread in the bugs forum. N. McFadden: " This is an area of the game that we need to improve for future editions of the game and something that we have not addressed for this patch that we have just released.". Seems like an acknowledgment for me. If not, then even worse, because the current positioning has very little to do with real life tactics. There should not be even debate about this. If FM pretends to be a football simulation then the players positioning should firstly reflect real life (and no top team playing fairly basic 4-4-2 would position wide players by default like that, moreover it is not only about wide players, the defensive positioning of strikers asked to track back is generally horrible too). If the users want their players to be positioned differently then the users should be given tools to do that (eg. WIBBLE/WOBBLE or SOMETHING else!) and I am strongly advocating for such tools. However fear of exploits from SI side seems to be too big. I play FM11 in good spirits, My aim is to emulate real life concepts. For people who look to exploit without any background philospohy or use certain tactics just because they work but have little to do with real life it can be easy, that's true.
  14. I take no responsibility of players unrealistic positioning created by SI. Even SI acknowledged that something is wrong. Bad thing they do not care to fix in the current release, same as with FM16. That screenshot proves nothing. There are different defensive phases/zones (depending on where the ball is) and in some of them the wingers positioning is atrocious (see the bugs forum).
  15. Well, I understand why a player is in a position I do not like. It is because SI does not devote enough time to one of the most basic/elementary thing of football simulation which is players positioning. In FM16 fullbacks positioning was horrible, now wingers. The result is a football simulation where even a basic concept of two compact banks of four can not be emulated.
  16. Which professional team IRL defends with wide mids (4-4-2) positioned like that? Certainly any of the top teams.
  17. Seeing that one huge game immersion breaking bug in FM16 - CROSSING + fullbacks positioning was replaced by another, also totally unrealistic one - WINGERS STAYING TOO WIDE WHEN DEFENDING (which btw. same as crossing bug in FM16 will not be fixed by SI). So glad I did not buy FM17.
  18. Hi Özil, Great, very inspirational reading. It actually inspired me to start a new game where I will try to introduce some "Invincibles concepts". 1. However, I will start in FM11 (my favourite version till this day). 2. As usual, I will start in South America. Specifically with Santa Fe (Bogotá based team that adopted club colours from Arsenal :)). 3. I will focus on my youth team (need to upgrade facilities, networking first). 4. Will send my scouts to Senegal/Ivory Coast to look for the new P. Vieira/K. Touré 5. Hopefully after a few seasons I will create the "Invincible" team (will be mega hard as there are simply soooo many matches to be played in Colombia during the season :)) and btw. huge thanks for the video with player attributes from CM03/04. Sweet memories :cool:.
  19. This is sooo untrue. You can not defend as Atlético do as defending as 4-4-2 in the game is totally robotic. You can not for example defend more as 4-2-2-2 further up the pitch and more as 4-4-2 nearer to your goal, you can not instruct your fullbacks to stay wider when defending than your wide mids etc., it is difficult to control the central axis because wide mids do not defend as narrowly as they do under Simeone....and this is just horizontal compactness, about the vertical one it is better not to talk at all.
  20. @Svenc That is a very nice post. I am btw. heavily disappointed how modern 4-4-2 ala Atlético (or Villarreal under Marcelino) is presented in the game engine. There are so many setback in trying to play the modern 4-4-2 that it is unbeliavable. Yet instead of concentrating on the core of the game we get pointless features every year :(. At least bring back wobble SI! I want to instruct my players how to position themselves defensively. Every manager is able to do this IRL!!
  21. I actually agree with a lot of what you say. Especially: 1) Player interactions, team talks, media ---> Last year I told myself I will never buy full fat FM again, mainly because of this. 2) Wibble/Wobble, sliders or some other tools giving more control control over tactics, players positioning are needed. Now the tactical side of the game is reduced to some fancy named roles and illogical concepts (eg. fluid means compact with more creative freedom..... SI, take a look at Atlético Madrid what it means to be compact, how is modern 4-4-2 played etc.)
  22. Yes, in FM11 and in FM16 as well and offensive wise was very unhappy with my "strikers". They were super late with their runs, did not move into channels as they should etc. They played like attacking central midfielders, not like strikers at all.
  23. @HUNT3R " Vertical positioning is how it has always been. Whether they're listed as CMs or not, they can behave how you want them to. " They won't. A central midfielder in FM will act differently on the ball, will make different runs than the striker and with different timing. No role in FM will make a central midfielder to act same as striker. Also why should it? Atlético strikers IRL are not midfielders, that's the whole point.
  24. Vertical positioning is one issue (btw. how effective will be a DR, DC, DC, DL, DMC, DMC, WBR, WBL, MC, MC team on defensive mentality with low creative freedom?). Will I ever score a goal? But seriously, these are just workarounds, not what FM players should be forced to do (also as far as I know Costa, Villa, Torres, Gameiro, Griezmann are not central midfielders in FM database). Horizontal positioning is even bigger issue. Look at the attached picture. On the left is how FM perceives defending as 4-4-2, on the right you see how Atlético defends as 4-4-2 (it is simplified, but gets you a picture). Am I able to this in FM? No. Also not mentioning a fact that when the ball is around the central circle Atlético players are defensively positioned more like 4-2-2-2.
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