santy001
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Posts posted by santy001
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1 minute ago, Novem9 said:
I think this is a completely normal request, especially since I created it
Not necessarily, you've offered up the facts and figures from your save on a public discussion platform. People can discuss that as they wish as long as its within the forum guidelines. If you no longer wish to participate in the discussion, then you can simply stop posting within this thread.
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10 minutes ago, whatsupdoc said:
Example of attributes not mattering enough:
It doesn't really prove anything though because there's so little context. Were the goals simple tap-ins/deflections etc or has the player gone on a mazy run, beat six players, pirouetted and smashed it into the top corner? Professional footballers, in any position, aren't devoid of ability outside of that position. Put a simple enough chance on a platter at close range and 99.9% of footballers will get the goal.
It's then also only over a 2 game stint from the screenshots you've uploaded. There's space for a meaningful investigation into such a claim, but right off the bat you'll never know what the outcome would've been playing a conventional forward in those 2 games and whether they would have scored more.
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As @Rashidi mentions, there is so much in the game set-up that helps influence this. I do have a pretty powerful machine myself, but don't push out to the 200k mark. Instead I aim for around 80k, but with sort of pyramid of leagues I set up so that there are a few top tier leagues that make sense, with a wider supporting group of middling and lesser leagues to allow players to filter up and down based on ability.
There's also a huge difference between what human researchers set players to in terms of potential and how close to attaining that they are in the initial data-set versus newgens produced by the game. It is very likely the case that there will be far less newgens who get closer to their PA than real players, because of the natural way in which human researchers will assess players.
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But there hasn't been any switch to cater towards casual players.
Most of it is a figment of peoples imagination. Vanilla world of warcraft was considered very difficult by the players of the time when it came to raiding, when it came back out in 2019 it was laughably easy. Pick up an old FM and it will be the same. The only slight caveat may be the loss of collective knowledge over time of the old FM's compared to vanilla WoW.
FM will have one of the steepest learning curves a game series can have, certainly it will be comparable to paradox games like Crusader Kings. "Save scumming" is still a common thing within FM, people will talk about how they do it still in various threads.
I always see people latching onto this term of "proper realism" or "difficulty" like it actually means anything. In gaming the conventional way to simulate difficulty is to load up the AI with a bunch of cheats. More resources, quicker mobilisation times, actual scripting. No one ever actually outlines what these concepts really mean and how they would be implemented in the game. Those who do try to outline something usually touch on things that SI probably already are working on but need either end-user hardware to be capable of, or need actual advancements in AI technology to utilise.
If you add a difficulty to FM in the "conventional" sense all you end up with is either something like your player attributes are scaled down in matches vs the AI. Which destroys the integrity of the attribute rating system. Or the AI is set up in a way where it can simulate X amount of matches in advance against your team to see if it can find a working solution. That completely destroys the element of fairness and instead pushes the game down a path of needing to make frequent changes just to try and defeat this AI counter-checking system.
The most fulfilling difficulty and challenge you can get from FM is by far and away network games. A few hours a week on a network game when a couple of people are available and competing in the same leagues for the same honours and the adjustments you have to make are more intriguing than the base game can ever offer, and it likely will always eclipse anything SI can do because there can never be a "oh its scripted" excuse if you lose out to another player.
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Imagine thinking the game is scripted, and therefore anything you achieve in game is never down to your own ability and judgement. It's just the game scripted to give you a league trophy, CL trophy etc.
Must be pretty tragic when you watch a good sequence of play, a striker you spotted at 18 and brought through carefully developing them scores the CL final winning game, and its only because the game scripted you to win that match. Personally, I don't like to put what I achieve and succeed at in the game onto SI having scripted it.
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Considering FM attributes are only ever going to be based off a direct relation to football the goings on in the wider world aren't really pertinent to the remit of what we do as researchers for the game. If you want a general discussion about the Saudi government/individuals involved within that who also overlap with ownership structure of Newcastle then the Off-Topic/Football Forums exist for that discussion.
For specific attributes you can raise these within the data and research section of the bug tracker, but you'd probably need to get a better understanding of how the attributes to work because if you were to suggest changes in a similar vein to posted here it would just be ignored due to having no bearing on what the attributes in FM are supposed to represent.
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If you're that worried about such a thing then its likely no one can ever prove a point either way to the standards you would want. If you don't feel like you can enjoy the game, simply don't buy it/play it. There's not too much point engaging with the points based on your... 6 tests.
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As the Stoke researcher I'm perfectly aware of Frank Soo myself. For the teams in the championship at least, clubs have the final say on their Legends/Icons/Favoured Personnel and so if the club do not add them that would be reflected in the data.
If he were to have been added it would have been as an Icon rather than a legend. A lot of his career was lost to WWII, his story is unique among Stoke players but he isn't regarded in the same manner as those who are marked down as legends of the club. Gordon Banks was obviously a part of the world cup winning squad, but that took place during his time with Leicester. When he came to Stoke he was a part of the teams "best" era - wouldn't really do it justice to put most successful as there was a single league cup trophy to show for it. His time at Stoke was also cut short due to an unfortunate injury and loss of sight in one eye, but Gordon Banks remained involved with the club post retirement.
Sir Stanley Matthews started out at Stoke, returned to Stoke from Blackpool in his mid-40's, helped the club get promotion and continued playing for the club until he was 50 and is still down as the top flights oldest ever player in England. Certainly had more success with Blackpool but post retirement he also continued to be involved with the club and was held in such high regard. A long and eventful career and almost certainly the first player almost any Stoke fan will hear about when they begin to learn about their club.
Tony Waddington is the manager who brought the likes of Matthews back to the club. Set the club on the path to eventually signing the likes of Gordon Banks and was the manager who oversaw the period many fans look back on as being the club at its best. An awful lot of the players in the icons list are the signings of Tony Waddington and he was the manager behind the clubs best pushes towards competing at the top end of the old division 1. Had he not been left in a situation where the club had to sell the best players as the club had let insurance on the ground lapse and then a storm caused substantial damage the question of what-if always remains for Stoke fans.
Neil Baldwin got involved with the club under Lou Macari, the club was definitely down on its luck by this time but even as a humble kit manager he's managed to become someone incredibly known within the fan base of the club. Still a regular at many Stoke games as a fan, Neil just has a wonderful tale to his life and while I don't know if its still the case as he is past retirement age now he's also long since been involved with Keele university and making students feel welcome to the area. The BBC also put together a dramatised film based on Neil Baldwin called Marvellous: Marvellous - Wikipedia
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45 minutes ago, Freakiie said:
Mmaee went for €3.5m+ and is not a great player, comparing him to Chalá is just disingenuous. Lisztes is going for €4.5m, with bonuses up to €10.8m and that's an unproven 18 year old. Meanwhile, Chalá is 21, absolute class, worldwide reputation, but is valued at like €13m? That's just absolute nonsense, the guy looks good enough to walk into almost any starting eleven out there. Any club from a top 5 league buys him and the game will value him at €100m+ before he has even played a game.
It was an example to reference what you can kind of expect from the Hungarian division however. Most of the bigger sales historically in Hungary have been unproven youngsters with potential.
Ultimately the situation is reflective of the fact that most clubs in such a situation can put an offer of around £15m on the table and force a clubs hand by leveraging the fact the player will really want to join them. Put either of these players at a lower/midtable Premier league team and they'd probably command closer to £100m for sure. The difference? Much more likely to be tied down to a substantial contract with 7 figure bonuses included and proven performances at a more consistent level.
You can reject bids ad-infinitum if you can deal with the consequences of that decision. Even with temperamental players through a mixture of interactions, waiting out unhappiness and negotiating new deals at the right time you can maintain control a lot of the time.
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You're putting a lot more emphasis on the values than they really have in the game. As you always have the option to reject bids. Players will get unhappy but you can navigate that and if it comes to a head then there are situations in which you'll lose a player. Clubs have to accept this all the time.
Could the players be valued higher? Perhaps, but they're on very low contracts £20k per week isn't beyond the realms of what top half Championship sides can afford. The league reputation does in turn mean that the achievements of the players carry less weight.
The valuations are still more than double the record for any sale from a Hungarian side in real life. The Stoke signing of Ryan Mmaee from Hungary this summer is one of the biggest transfer fees paid to a Hungarian side.
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So you've used the editor to inform your decision to make a player purchase at a level you wouldn't normally do, because you saw the PA which is something you don't ordinarily have access to through the game.
You're then unhappy that Juventus aren't basing their price on this value that you have access to, but the AI doesn't. He's a decent player who likely in the position he plays doesn't accrue fantastic average ratings and at a club who don't likely have the power long term (particularly if you remove the human manager element) to stay competing at their current level.
The sensible solution is if you receive an offer you're unhappy with, reject it. If the player becomes unhappy about you rejecting the offer then it does show Juventus have hit a pressure point because the other attributes you likely haven't checked (so not PA) result in a player who would want to make that move.
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Coil whine can be incredibly obscure. I get it with one certain game and my audio set to speaker output. If I change the audio output to headphone (or the non-existent monitor output) it stops.
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13 hours ago, JD23 said:
If I save my transfer budget does the amount the following season reduce as I already have x amount in the budget or would I be provided the same amount the following season regardless of current transfer budget?
It isn't likely to reduce your budget. The next season your board will make an assessment about how much they would free up for transfers depending on various attributes set for the board member and the clubs financial position.
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A good starting point is often a stronger team + the highest reputation/coaching badges. There are a couple of reasons for this.
Why to pick a stronger team:
- Better quality players can cover for tactical weaknesses as you learn the game.
- They usually have better hidden/mental attributes which make them easier to manage/less confrontational.
- Often times there are better support staff to help with coaching players.
Why highest reputation/coaching badges:
- You get more respect from your players and more leeway. If you need a few games to get to grips with things or have a bad run, its a safety net with the players.
- The same is also true with the board, if things are going badly you'll have more time to turn it around.
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By the nature of being early access not everything will be included from full release. That is by design. To the best of my knowledge, the pre-game editor hasn't been available with any of the early access versions in recent years and I genuinely cannot remember if it ever was in the past.
The game and, by extension, tools like the pre-game editor are still under development.
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I don't know the wider context of the conversation that has been had and therefore I wouldn't offer a speculative answer.
I'd hope none of the researchers feel this way, its a strange comment as there is no cohesive "Europe" approach to research. The research teams for various nations & in some cases leagues, fall under different head researchers. Furthermore, in the background researchers can offer direct feedback on the ratings of others work. There is a whole infrastructure in place to ask questions, offer insight and feedback. Through the years I can attest to many fellow researchers doing this with my own data.
Again it comes back to the point though that when players first move clubs, the expectation is on the whole we would respect the opinions of our fellow researchers and not make any substantial changes unless the 5-10 games we've seen so far really suggest it needs to be made. The same guidance for people always applies to, when it comes to the data state what you think is wrong, what it should be and why. It is in no way an outdated game because all players will have been reviewed, whether by a Turkish researcher or another nations researcher, before they come into the FM24 DB.
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From a research perspective, when players first move clubs there isn't a particularly large expectation the new researcher will be making sweeping changes. After all, the player will have just had changes made based on the opinions of the previous researcher who had seen them play a lot more games.
There are times when players come into a new league and play very differently and more substantive changes are warranted. It's just that shouldn't necessarily be the normal expectation.
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My own understanding is that currently he's under a provisional suspension, until an outcome is determined. The provisional suspension means he would not be eligible for any footballing activity and would likely be the reason he is not included.
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It may be worth checking the detail level after you've set the game up. There might be more competitions running in a higher detail level, but it is an estimate and so should only serve as a loose guide. 80-90,000 players has been rated as 2 star for each year since I got this PC (during the year FM22 was current) so its consistent for me but there weren't really any issues with processing speeds running a DB of that size even 30+ years into the future.
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13 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:
Nah Dave I had this exact same issue!
Captain was unhappy I lacked depth in goal. My entire squad then became upset by this...nobody had even mentioned it to me at this point and my entire squad was upset!
Finally a whole team meeting takes place. I promise to strengthen. Which I do. He still says he's upset and refuses to talk to me anymore.
Fast forward to November and the media are asking me about losing the dressing room.
Look at the dynamics tab and yep it's all over the reserve goalie issue WHICH I Strengthened!
As I said yesterday afternoon in a post they are somehow even more broken than last year which is impressive because they were a nightmare even then.
I'm not even going into the various other interactions where players have gotten upset for being told they aren't training well (pretty much every week).
I'm just going to stop talking to my players.
*I also saw someone on Reddit who had the exact same issue too.l except it was at centre-back rather than Goalie they "lacked depth".
Save games & bug reports would help investigate this. One thing that immediately comes to mind is depending on the reputation you come in with as manager & the personality of the captain it could lend itself to a more confrontational outcome.
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I'm only offering some partial speculation, but below a certain level in football getting all the relevant agreements in place probably becomes more difficult due to the fact the various set-ups aren't professional. Licensing agreements for those leagues to be actively included in the game may be a barrier. One thing that always works against any kind of historical database file officially is the difficulty in pursuing rights because of how it works. How the rights of retired players vs active players would be handled etc.
The difficulty of research, licensing it, accurately representing it in game and testing it would all be potential barriers.
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Looks mostly there for me.
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Just now, Aljeks said:
Maybe BETA is the friends we made along the way
In that case we need a moments silence for those who haven't made it this far.
A number of people may have ended up banned from this thread.3 -
Just now, serkanedabasar78 said:
When you play against a simple team, 90 minutes ends in a draw and after 90 minutes that simple team suddenly goes into Real Madrid mode and scores a goal against you and eliminates you. Raise your hand if these are here.
It doesn't happen to me because I'm better than that. I can lose well before the 90 minutes are over.
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What the hell is SI using for deciding who is "developing" and "developed" country.
in Football Manager General Discussion
Posted
In most instances, particularly for nations with a strong and well established footballing system, FM has its network of researchers who live in and are native to the countries they research. It's a reflective measure of the in-game economies for those countries, and so any attempt to impose a direct view from something like GDP per capita or any other measure isn't really going to fit in with the way FM is utilising this exactly. A lot of mechanics in the background interact with each other, and to best reflect things from a footballing perspective the label or numerical value assigned to something in that background info may not always look the way people think it ought to at first glance.