[Simple crafting of a 4-3-3 DM]

Hi Johnny Ace

Brilliant thread indeed

What are your thoughts of using a roaming playmaker and a btb as 8s in front of a dm on defend or a halfback?

Do you think that you need a talented team to cover them in defence?

[OpenAI ChatGPT is a gamechanger for FM immersion]

22 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

As discussed back on page 2 it's pseudo knowledge. It has no access to, and therefore no context of the match engine. Much like when someone asked it to build a tactic based on Sir Alex Ferguson. It would be useful for generating text flavour. But not as an information tool in FM. 

i agree on this

but its the beginning as I said

he can surely help you better than FM assistant managers or 50% of FM gamers.

And its the GPT3.5...

[OpenAI ChatGPT is a gamechanger for FM immersion]

For example yesterday i asked GPT to create a guide for my beloved 433 DM system,roles ,pairings etc

You cant even believe how much details has put in it.

Just check for yourself with the right questions.

And all these.without.even scratching GPT 4 or at the end of the year GPT 5...

FM 25 would be most probably amazing.

Ofcourse there js a chance that we could be servants of AI untill then😀

 

[OpenAI ChatGPT is a gamechanger for FM immersion]

Just to add, this ChatGPT and the following relatives,will change the world as we know it.

We are only in the beginning.

Game industries will be a massive upgrade especially dealing with NPC ,dynamic scenarios , different paths and many more.

Things we we cant even imagine.

SI must and should catch the speed of it otherwise will be catched by some other relative company.

The potentials are limitless especially for games like FM

[Regista & False 9]

On 12/03/2023 at 14:17, Bird_SA said:

Thanks for the responses. Really appreciate it. I have been experimenting a bit and at the moment I am getting absolutely pumped!! I have been playing fm for a couple of years but never have I had it this bad. 
 

At the start of my save I started with the following tactic:

 

It worked really well the only role I changed a lot was the striker. Sometime changed to target man, complete forward or deep lying forward as above. Was playing some really good, beautiful football. Then the slump came and teams started playing more defensive against me and I have just not been able to recover. By the way I have improved to team with signings and young players have developed etc. But my results have still not recovered.

 

Then I started the new season with some optimism and a new tactic that I wanted to implement. This tactic:

To say things are a nightmare is a understatement. I have tried changing the false 9 to a complete foward (s), changing the Ramdeuter to a inverted winger (a), changing the car to a ball winning midfielder (s) & (d), left wingback to a fulback on (s) and nothing seem to work. 
 

I am fully committed to make the regista work everything else I am willing to change. I have a decent player for the regista role and a young player that is not too bad either. They played the role great before. @Cloud9 I read your comment about the Ramdeuter and I guess that is the first change to make what combination of roles would you suggest for the left flank? Any other advice would be much appreciated.

You are too attacking.I would start by changing iwbs to iwbd.

But in my mind in a positive mentality you must have a top team to leave alone a regista as a DM.

You need someone next to him ,i would change also passing to mixed while i would remove prevent GK short distr .

 

 

[4-3-3 Gegenpress Advice]

Hi man

Just to say my opinion

The first formation is too attacking that you will find yourself exposed

Furthermore you won't find space to attack.

The second  is even worse defending.

What you have designed suits in both cases to direct football.

So the the first question you have to answer yourself is my team able to play attacking risk football?

Is it one of the favorites in your championship?

Do you have dominant players for a dominant style of play?

Cause gegenpress is a dominant style and your players must be really capable to play it.

433 is an excellent formation for such dominant style but more for possession based tactics.Not that you can't play gegenpress but I believe 4231 suits better.

In my humble opinion and from my little experience if you want to play high risking football you must balance your instructions properly.

What I mean?

You are doing the same mistakes I was doing in the past.

My advice remove every team instruction and while watching the game add one a time to spot the changes during games.

You won't realise what these are without testing them one a time and see it during matches.Plus you dont need so many TI to play.

The same do with player instructions.

Then balance things

With positive risk choise you need to consider how many attacking duties you will put.Since there will be no space behind to attack while there will be few people to defend.

433 is a style that it's perfect for pressing high.But if you combine it with positive risk and attacking duties...then be sure your team has to be really good.

Positive risk also suits better to overloading or interchanging football which means more support duties to cooperate together to open space or to overload the opponents third.

So I would start by changing some duties

SK- support duty..you dont need at duty there

WBs- both of them will go forward runs really often.No need to send them early attacking.They have to defend also remember

CDs- in my opinion you dont need 2 BPDs.Just one.Balance is the key.Not force things.Have someone to pass safe also there to more advanced guys and not hurry up things.So  1 of them to keep it simple,so put an CDd there

DM - with aggressive WBs going forward what a better role than a HB in that position.Especially in positive mentality

CMs right-  carrilero  is fine .Just put him with forward runs

CMs left - box to box midfielder but with forward runs too.

In 433 you have in front of the CMs a huge space.its important 1 or even both of them (my choose always) to run into it with forward runs 

AM right - IFa the best scorer and the one that the others find him with direct passes just to mix things

AM left - IFs the other scorer but reaching the penalty area at different times while can help in overloading the area.Remember we have a WBs and a BTB midfielder with forward runs...Since I am playing older FM version IFs has no locked forward runs.So if it is the same  dont chance it.Leave it as it is WITH NO FRs.Or otherwise put there an IW

ST just a PF in support duty to do the job and help in build up

All of the above in positive risk style playing dominant and pressing hard with high lines

Also I would try to sign a carrilero with good passing ,vision,decisions,technique and flair.the better the best

Then you will have an industrial play maker there

 

As about TI i would start by playing shorter passing since you will have a lot of overloading game and be more disciplined just to balance slightly things

DL and LOE high ( for FM 22 and 21 at least but you got the idea in FM23)

No counter

No counterpress especially in the beginning.Put it there during the game and how the things are going 

Remember again to play is such attacking risk with a dominant formation you need capable players according to your league

Hope that I helped

 

 

[DM, Anchor or Half Back?]

On 16/12/2022 at 14:17, MarkJS1 said:

If playing a 4-3-3, what role is best for your single holding midfielder out of the 3?

You have to consider the rest roles of your team

for instance in my 433 i play with a right WBs and a left FBs with forward runs and underlaping an IWs with stay wider PI while my left midfielder is an CMa.

Then you have to think that if those FBs go forward what DM should i use.

I chose a HB to make a 3 back line for better protection even if the left FBs in not as aggressive as the right who goes all the way up most of the times and start higher

 

So what matters is the rest roles of your team and their duties

 

 

[FM23: The Art of Possession Football]

On 18/12/2022 at 20:44, Theodoros Yiorkas said:

I know that everything is important but to beat AI managers which is the most important? Which come first?

For me the ground breaking was when i realised what attributes mean and the combinations of them.

for instance i couldnt understand why good level opponents pass through my midfield 

Then i realise that i need not only off the ball att but also positioning among others.

Attributes are the most important thing and make a mediocre tactic look good

Anyway about the formation start to think who will pass,who will run for the ball and who will cover the space 

Its a good start point to make a good formation in order to beat an opponent

[FM23: The Art of Possession Football]

19 minutes ago, Cleon said:

I answered you in the last reply didn’t I? I said I prefer using more cautious/support roles/duties on higher mentalities. And more aggressive roles/duties on lower mentalities.

I meant do you use a specific number

 

For example I think positive and possesion style suits at most 2 attacking duties .

In the past you could play amazing possesion with no even one attacking duty but from FM 20 I think that changed.

Balanced I find 3 attacking looks good in possession 

Do you follow something like that?

[Trying to create a 4231 or 433 counter attack on fm23, cannot seem to get the balance right. Are my roles and tactical instructions ok. My main query is the roles of the Dmidfielders, AMC. Do my roles work for breakaways]

On 07/12/2022 at 14:23, Chingwu said:

Trying to maintain a balance between a defensively solid team as well as being able to break on the counter. 

Regarding 433 since you lack penetration and based on cautious you are too passive with your roles.

Use more aggressive roles in this mentality.

Check Cleon topic Art of Possesion  to get an idea

By the way remove more often pressing when you defend low

[FM23: The Art of Possession Football]

Is there a correlation between mentality and attack/support duties in your mind and the style you want to achieve?

 

 

[FM23: The Art of Possession Football]

On 07/12/2022 at 13:04, Cleon said:

Probably not it would likely result in more wasted chances. You hit a certain point possession wise (imo that is 60%+) where you are just keeping the ball for the sake of it and just passing around, without really probing. More attacking isn't always better. I wrote this previously;

One thing you will have noticed that I’ve not spoken about yet is the team mentality. The reason for not mentioning this topic yet is because, for me, it’s the least important part of the whole tactical creation. I know other people value this aspect as being really important and that’s fair enough but for me, I want to keep it simple.

In simple terms, the mentality is the base attacking intent of the team. This may be described as a measure of risk-taking. More positive mentalities instruct the team to take more risks, and more defensive ones instruct the team to take fewer risks. Essentially it's a risk modifier that affects a number of other teams and player instructions like width, passing directness, tempo, line of engagement and defensive line. The higher your mentality the more risk your players are willing to take in these specific areas of the game.

The team mentality also impacts individual player mentality, you can see the change this has on the player and his role by going to the player on the tactic screen, clicking the position, and then clicking his player instructions. You’ll notice when you change team mentality his own mentality is adjusted to reflect the change.

Like I said above, rather than overcomplicating things and making out mentality more complex than it actually is, I always play with a balanced mentality. This doesn’t mean I don’t take lots of risks or play conservative, I can still be as attacking if not more than someone plays on an attacking mentality. Sounds strange, doesn’t it? But not really if you think about it. It all comes down to efficiency and how you use the ball and make the most of it. Being more aggressive doesn’t equal more attacking.

I’ll show some analysis of how mentality changes impact the 4-2-2-2 box formation when we get into the actual analysis parts. But for now, some time ago I wrote this about the 4-2-3-1 and it should give you a good grasp of why I play with a balanced mentality with actual examples. I have debated adding this or not but I think it is useful and relevant to tactical building and because I’m trying to show step by step what I do, I think it fits.

For the purpose of this analysis, I compare a balanced mentality against an attacking mentality only.

Now, these average position images might confuse people at first and you’ll think I’ve got them the wrong way around.

That is the attacking average position map which looks deeper than you might imagine. There is a reason for this and we will come around to that a bit later in the analysis.

Believe it or not, these are actually the average positions for the players in the standard mentality structure that I am using. Yet it’s more attacking face value and players are positioned a lot different compared to the first screenshot I posted. A lot of the players are more attacking. The average positions are interesting in both screenshots.

You’d have expected the attacking mentality to be a lot more aggressive with the average positions for when they had the ball (the purple icon with the number in it). Yet it’s actually the standard mentality screenshot which looks more aggressive. In the first image, you can see even the defence is deeper when out of possession too.

There are a number of reasons why it could be like this;

The attacking mentality is making defenders hit the ball earlier than normal as they look to hit the front players a lot more quickly decision-wise than you’d see in the standard mentality. This is entirely plausible. In the standard mentality system players likely have more time and spend longer on the ball, meaning they move upfield much more because they aren’t looking to rush play.

In the standard system, players seem to be more spread out, especially in the central areas. One of the reasons behind this is likely the initial space a player has. In the standard one, the space is likely in front of the players, meaning they have time to work the ball and play with it at their feet. In the more attacking system, that space likely doesn’t exist due to its aggressive nature. The higher mentality should on paper push them further forward but as you can see in the images, this isn’t happening. This suggests the space isn’t there and the players are having to drop deeper to find space or by them being closer to the opposition players, it’s involuntary pushing them deeper and negating the actual attacking mentality.

Those are some of the reasons why this might happen and are the likely causes. But now let’s add some more context and briefly show the match stats to see if there is much difference between the two.

Attacking Mentality Stats

  

You can see I won the game 1-4 and despite the scoreline, I was incredibly lucky in terms of the score. An own goal and two goals on and after 90 minutes really flattered us. We played well on face value with the score but that doesn’t tell the true story.

The individual stats show us a little bit more of how the players play. Interestingly I notice the keeper's pass completion and have just realised that I’ve not actually set it up so he distributes it to the defenders. I’ll have to look into this more and see if his long distribution is worth the sacrifice for passes completed if it puts us on the front foot quickly.

The player's condition is also in the low 70s for most people. I’ll need to compare this with the standard mentality one and see if there is a drastic difference.

Standard Mentality Stats

  

We created a few more chances but overall there isn’t much difference between both sets of match stats and the score. We won the game 1-3. The times of the scoring were better though and it looks like we didn’t leave it to the last minute or rely on our own goal. Could this be a sign of the way we attack? Possibly.

I think the biggest noticeable difference is the condition, players seem to end the game with a much higher percentage left compared to the attacking mentality one further up. This is expected because they are less gung-ho in their approach and should conserve energy better. But due to the average positions above, it wouldn’t have surprised me to see it a little lower than it actually was.

The goalkeeper's distribution is still the same as I played the match the exact same way with the exception of one being done with an attacking mentality and one without.

Attacking Mentality Match Analysis

Here we can see just how much space there is between the fullbacks and the inside forward on my left-hand side. It’s quite the distance and one simple ball from the opposition's fullback to the wide player takes out my inside forward from this phase of play. It puts me on the back foot immediately because now my midfield has to shift across and deal with it or my fullback is left with a 1v1 situation. Or alternatively, my inside forward could try and sprint back to make up the ground he has lost.

If you want that to happen then it seems pointless having him so high, to begin with. You could play him deeper by the use of a different mentality and help him conserve more energy as well as reduce the space. We can also use the player's settings or role/duties to manipulate this but that brings up a host of other issues and isn’t really an option for this demonstration. The reason being is I need and want this space that appears just not as much of it. Space and time are what will win me the game by creating intelligent movement.

Here we have my left wingback Zeca on the ball. Instead of driving forward with the ball, which he can do because he has the space available and the time ahead of him, he is already looking to launch it to the strikers. However you can see the striker and inside forward aren’t positioned the best, nor are they really making a run forward, especially the one in front of him, that’s the inside forward he is launching the ball to. This is an issue as this inside forward is going towards the sideline rather than away from it. So when the ball is played what can he really do as he is going away from goal? Not only that but the opposition has plenty of cover to now allow the fullback to be caught in a 1v1 situation.

This is a rushed decision and my side is wasting good opportunities where the player can venture forward more. Instead, they’d rather look for the longer option regardless of how those players might be marked or what positions they are in. This is because the mentality is also a risk factor, the higher the mentality the more likely a player will take risks, or as most people would say, do dumb ****. I’m not saying on the lower mentality there isn’t a chance that this doesn’t happen as it very well could. However, if you’ve set the roles up correctly and have the right balance in the set up then it’s less frequent that you’ll see this happening. Whereas currently, this is very common to see.

At times when this kind of pass works, it's great and we look deadly but it doesn’t happen enough and for most parts, wastes the move or just cheaply gives possession away. Another thing is that when this happens, it also means the striker or inside forward isn’t making those dangerous runs because they’re not getting the chance to do them. Instead, they get backed into corners or are surrounded by too many of the opposition's players. So trying to move the ball forward quickly isn’t always the best for this reason. It also makes it harder for the supporting players to catch up with play and is often why you might see people say things like their striker is very isolated and not getting a good supply. It might not be for this exact reason but it’s likely it’s something along these lines.

In this situation, we have a move where the wingback is pushed on and is offering width. Then the inside forward is making a run forward too as is the striker. However, my Segundo Volante who is on the ball (Yuri) is driving forward with it but he has no real support as players are positioned too high on this occasion or surrounded by players who can easily cut out the pass or make the tackle. This is the downside of an attacking mentality when players get positioned too high, it means they have limited space to work with due to the high starting points.

It also makes it incredibly difficult for the player on the ball to pick out a pass and often sees him just crack a shot from distance. Which happens on this particular occasion. I also see posts relating to this and people pointing out the good positions they think my inside forward, wingback and even striker have taken up. I guess they have if you look at it but when you add context to it and the player's position on the ball, it’s clear to see he is isolated with what he can do. The attacking side of things is cut off from him. Not all the time though and it comes back to the frequency aspect of how often something happens. You’ll find that in attacking setups this is much more common.

In this screenshot, we can see why my defence is deep and that is because the opposition striker is very deep in my half, admittedly we’ve just won possession but we won that at the halfway line. So we see that the defence is deeper than everyone else and likely too deep. This is because of the space the striker has, he’s making them stay deeper than they should. Also, using the Segundo Volante role doesn’t help here as we have possession of the ball so are already looking to attack. And it’s a role I want to use, however it looks like it's too aggressive for this set-up and how attacking it is. He is making more risky decisions and being overly aggressive. The role is very aggressive, to begin with, and then the added mentality isn’t helping the situation. He’d be better by playing deeper and slightly more cautious than usual.

That would then provide two things. One would be to cover for the defence and pick up the opposition players who are playing between my centre-backs and the defensive midfielders. Secondly, it should allow the defenders to push up more because the defensive midfielders would become responsible for picking up the striker instead. At the minute due to the aggressive nature, the defensive midfielders push up and leave the defenders playing as a separate unit to the rest of the side. Again there are ways to combat this slightly by the use of different roles, maybe an even higher defensive line but I’m supposedly already playing with those anyway. And changing roles defeats the purpose of what I’m creating and how I want to play.

Another thing happening in this screenshot is that Nilmar, who is my inside forward is the one who won possession back and as soon as he gets the ball he is already looking to hit the striker with those more direct/long balls. The issue with this is when that happens my striker becomes isolated or the ball is cut out by the opposition defenders. Support is lacking because Nilmar is supposed to be the support player. Again if he looks around though, he has space and time to play and decides against it. You can see when we get the ball my players are looking to get the ball forward as fast as possible. This is what mentality does on the higher ones, players take more risks and look to get the ball to the front players in the quickest, fastest possible way.

Yet again another situation where the side is looking to get the ball to the front far too quickly again. This time we see Yuri do a long ball up to where the inside forward is. Typically the ball is cut out and instantly we are on the back foot again. We aren’t being clever with the ball at all and aren’t using it wisely. When these kinds of passes are pulled off properly it's a thing of beauty but it happens nowhere near frequent enough. Not only this but it’s making the whole side deeper than it actually should be. Every time we get into situations like this, the same thing happens. We look to go from the front to the back in the quickest possible way. But because the ball gets cut out time and time again players are always deeper than they should be. Hence the average positions we saw at the very start.

Here is another perfect example of what happens when we attack recklessly at speed and without precision. The ball is lost and a simple ball back into my own final third means my defenders yet again cannot push up because they have to deal with the opposition striker who stays high up the pitch. It’s killing my play because it's not precise and well-thought-out football. The players highest up the field are isolated or drifting too deep because the rest of the side just cannot push up and are being bogged down.

It just goes to show though that because someone is meant to be positioned high up the pitch because of his mentality, doesn’t mean he is. All sorts of factors play a part in why he might be higher than normal or deeper than usual. So far in the examples, you see players dropping off the front for two main reasons;

• Bogged down and can’t move upfield because we move the ball too fast for anyone to catch up. Going from a to b quickly isn’t always beneficial.
• The second reason is, that it’s hard to find space so players come deep in the hope of finding it.

It’s like a never-ending cycle, for this game at least. We still won the game and scored four goals but like I pointed out at the start, the score line is flattering when you take into consideration the own-goal and the two very late goals. On a different day, this could have been a 1-1 draw without those bits of luck.

I’m not saying never play attacking football with this shape, far from it. It’s more about understanding how the shape plays on different mentalities and how it differs. If you want to play attacking football then play it. Just beware of how everything links together. Also, remember that attacking doesn’t always translate to attacking.

Standard Mentality Match Analysis

It’s early in the game but you can see how deep my entire side is. Not only that, but my defensive midfielder is also picking up the opposition striker meaning my defence can stay intact and start moving higher up the pitch. My side is closing down and chasing the ball but I think you can already see how the small difference of the defensive midfielder picking up the striker is helping my back line and freeing them up, so they can push higher up. This is allowing me to reduce the space the opposition has in my own half as the defence is moving advanced upfield towards my own midfielders.

Nilmar has the ball and this time drives infield because he isn’t rushing. And my Segundo Volante is in acres of space in the centre of the pitch and is a little bit more reserved in the build-up play and isn’t looking to attack constantly when we get possession of the ball. He’s being more clever in his play.

Due to the team, not all advancing forward and beyond the ball, it means we actually have space to run into and people creating and using space as we all move together. In this picture, we have Yuri who can drive forward with the ball or play two different kinds of ball. One is a through ball straight down the middle for the inside forward to run onto. Or he can play it straight into the patch of the inside forward which is actually the more risky pass in this scenario due to how the opposition defender near the inside forward is positioned.

Yuri passes the ball through the middle, so basically a through ball for my inside forward to run onto. Now had the side not moved together and at a relatively steady pace, this move wouldn’t have happened. Or if it was on a higher mentality than standard, the chances are the ball would have been played the first time from Yuri instead of him driving forward a little with the ball at his feet first. Our play now is more dangerous because we are playing as a unit, all of the team moving up and down the field at the same time. This is one of the reasons why the average positions in this mentality structure are actually higher than the attacking ones. Because we are moving and working as a cohesive unit.

Bruno manages to get onto the end of the ball but is fouled literally on the edge of the box and we win a free kick in a dangerous place.

In the attacking section further up, I showed the inside forward playing closer to the opposition's fullback(A) and leaving my own wingback exposed and susceptible to 1v1 scenarios. However now, we can see my inside forward is much deeper and inside my own half picking up the opposition's wide player. This means my wingback is free and can recover any loose balls or pick the player up should my inside forward not get the ball. Less pressure on the wingback is great as it means he is less likely to be exposed. Not only this but if he wins the ball back, he can also run with it down the wing and channel, which would put the opposition on the back foot.

I win possession of the ball back here deep inside my own half. But if you look at my players' positioning, it’s not bad because they have space. The left-sided inside forward and the deep-lying midfielder are already doing their job. The inside forward is pushing up behind the fullback into where the space is. While the deep-lying forward keeps the two central defenders busy. Yuri the Segundo Volante can be seen unmarked in the centre of the pitch. So my defenders play him the ball.

Yuri passes the ball to the attacking midfielder, Lucas Lima. He then hit it the first time into the path of the inside forward because he was already aware of his run. Now Bruno Henrique is onside and away causing them all kinds of problems. You will have noticed that in attacking mentalities the space is in front of the opposition players and when playing on lower mentalities or using players further down the pitch, then the space exists behind the opposition. This is a prime example of what I’m usually talking about. Due to me being deeper this makes the opposition higher up when they break forward. So when they lose the ball we get situations like this and I can hit them with clever counterattacks or clever direct forward balls.

There was no chance of this happening on the attacking mentality because the player was either too advanced or forced to come deep because he was marked, bringing the marker with him. Also because it encourages getting the ball forward quickly, Yuri might have bypassed Lucas Lima in this move and looked to hit the striker or even the inside forward much earlier. This can make moves break down. On this occasion though we are more calculated in our play and it’s not rushed. Instead, the players are deciding when to take risks and the risks they do take are more likely to be successful.

This is the same move just shown from a different angle to better illustrate it. The inside forward Bruno Henrique drove forward with the ball when he received it from Lucas Lima. You can see that the opposition centre-backs have been split, one of them has gone very deep leaving the striker alone in space. While the other one has gone across to deal with the inside forward. Now Bruno Henrique can do a simple sideways pass to Ricardo Oliveira who has lots of time and space. He drives forward a little bit after receiving the ball and lets go of a fierce shot which flies past the goal by inches. It’s a brilliantly worked team move which should have seen a goal scored. It all started with my central defender too.

I’m not saying people can’t play on higher mentalities far from it. But you have to realise how they differ from the lower mentalities. Not only this but it’s vital you understand how the mentality works with the roles and duties you use. If you use aggressive roles and an aggressive mentality like a Segundo Volante on an attacking mentality, then you’ll see him venture forward constantly with disregard for any danger he might be leaving behind. While on a lower mentality you should see him play slightly differently and work better and make more intelligent runs and passes. He will still take risks but those risks will happen as and when he believes the right time to take them. Rather than allowing the mentality of the team to decide he should do it more frequently.

Cleon when you referring to agressive roles you arr speaking about roles that have forward runs or take more risks or dribble more i assume?

So you prefer to use such roles with cautious in Positive or Attacking mentality

 

Furthermore in your possession tactic you play as fairly narrow but in a narrow formation too.

I got that you want to play as close as possible to find passes but isnt an overkill?I see though your WB give you width 

[I was sacked five times yesterday using this tactic as an underdog, where am I going wrong?]

20 hours ago, trueblue9877 said:

In my defence we were predicted to finish bottom of the table by the media in all the save

My observations 

I would remove direct passing since as an underdog most probably you re not good at passing and furthermore if  it is given to anyone in such a level wont be a good thing.I would preper to give it to the players that have good passing,vision,technique, decisions,anticipation,tramwork and maybe flair.

Otherwise just play default passing

2.You are lacking penetration from right wing

3.test cautious mentality as an underdog too

4.remove run at defence.Most probably you are.lacking dribling,agility,balance,pace,acc as a bottom team.No need

5.remove distribute quickly too.

6.just leave it simple.A great advice from a person here was if you would like to learn how to play the easiest way is to take a big club.i agree on that.

Underdogs dont forgive mistakes

7.in your position i would play mostly on low block,counter,regroup, cautious mentality for start without something else

 

By the way 433 is a little demanding for a bottom team cause of the large gaps

I would choose 4-1-4-1

 

[Wiping the Slate Clean: A Logical Guide to Building a Tactic from Scratch]

On 02/12/2022 at 16:07, pedromanuelpinto said:

Hi,

This should be a good option, what do you guys think? Having some doubt if AMR or RB will be at Attack.

I think your formation is ok ,at least for my taste.

Just experiment with default passing or removing work ball into box since looks like a overkill for a balanced mentality in my opinion..

Default passing will be better with more att duties since your formation isnt a possession one

 

 

[FM23: The Art of Possession Football]

Great topic Cleon

Do you still believe that for aggressive mentalities it's better to use for possession football less aggressive roles?

For example FB I stead of WB,or IW instead of IF or Raum?

[Book of Roles - PDF Guide]

So nice to see the most experience players giving guides in the form of pdf

Thanks a lot

[Maximising Attack and Defence in a Classic 4-3-3]

6 hours ago, kazm said:

I've been using a 4141 and 433 with DMC-s, Mez-s and B2B and having great succes. Won the league first season at Fjolnir (Iceland) and Stabaek (Norway), got promoted first season with FC Dordrecht (NL), predicted 17th and atm won 12/12 first division games with ADO Den Haag. Might just be the match engine not being patched yet but I don't think you need world beaters atm to do well with this setup.

I think with a DMs the gap is not big and your midfield play well together.

The thing is that since the DM is on support someone else must do the job behind and I am not speaking about CDs.

What was your formation pal?

[Maximising Attack and Defence in a Classic 4-3-3]

In my 433 my trio in midfield consist of an Anchor Man,a DLPs and a CMa.

I am always on dilemma if i must use a MEZa instead of the CMa but since i always play with less capable teams i find that roaming creates holes in my midfield.

This is why i dont use both MEZ and BtB together.

In my opinion you need players with very good mental attributes especially concentration and a very capable 6 player to cover.

Dont you find that Mez +BtB along with a HB creates a big gap in midfield?

 

 

[[FMT21] don't understand why we either perform very well or play like amateurs]

On 28/11/2022 at 13:11, thebreadlady said:

3-0 against a mid table side

1-1 labored against another mid table side

6-2 against a top 6 side

0-3 amateur performance against a mid table side

4-0 against a relegation battle side

1-0 two total highlights against a relegation side

it has just been a yo-yo of performances. playing entertaining football, making logical plays in one game to absolute duds, making literally illogical plays the next game. similar scenarios in either game but result in the opposite plays. 

If i was in your place I would change some things in the tactic

1.remove dlp from DM spot and place there a more dedicated defensive player like an Anchor man

2.remove IWBs and place a FBs since you need  someone without roaming staying back

3.remove counter since you dont need it really pressing so high

4.remove counterpress since you are already in a aggressive mentality

5.remove very narrow TI.There is no reason to limit yourself offensively 

6.since your LOE and your DL are high with positive mentality you dont need extremely urgent pressing in my mind.Try more urgent or the default and check it from there.

7.playing so high staying on feet doesnt suit i think.Just remove it and add hard tackling if you see a low bravery -composure opponent or your players have good tackling ,decisions,concentration,aggression attributes

9.always check player attributes for the style and roles you want to play

 

[Wiping the Slate Clean: A Logical Guide to Building a Tactic from Scratch]

3 hours ago, HanziZoloman said:

I am missing the inspiring conversation in this topic like it has been on the pages before

Dcayton9 is missing

 that's why😀😀

 

[Maximising Attack and Defence in a Classic 4-3-3]

Looking forward for the next part

 

[Maximising Attack and Defence in a Classic 4-3-3]

We agree then on the style

Looking at your tactic dont you find at times that IFa and PFa have less space for action?

The same about MEZs and IWs that play in the same area.I got what you are trying to do with overloads just asking though

And what about your left wide channel?

It seems little action there for spacing as well 

[Maximising Attack and Defence in a Classic 4-3-3]

Since we are talking about offence of 433 and since its my favorite so many years in the game i would love to hear you what is your preference in tempo in such a bottom heavy formation.

I mean do you think suits better slow based tempo in order the deep players reach the attack or even higher tempo can be success.

Always in mind that we are playing at a middle table european team and not a world class that even a scrap tactic will propably succeed

 

[Maximising Attack and Defence in a Classic 4-3-3]

Amazing read as always man

Have you consider a Raumdeuter instead of the IFa on the left?

 

 

[Wiping the Slate Clean: A Logical Guide to Building a Tactic from Scratch]

This topic is one of the best in the history of sigames.

many thnks for your time to sit and write such interesting things.

I would love to see a book release from you with even more analysis