Pressing the opposition full back

[ExploitedSpace]

Hey guys,

 

Long time lurker here. I've recently taken over Heidenheim in the Bundesliga, I am trying to employ a 3412 with defensive wingers pressing high on the opposition fullbacks/wingbacks.

I have attached a screenshot of the tactic below. The tactic has worked extremely well so far. The only issue I have is that my defensive wingers aren't aggressive enough.

I have also attached a screenshot of an opposition goal kick, ideally, I'd want my right defensive winger (No. 23) to be up on top of the opposition left back. In order to force them inside (Where my ballwinners are).

Anyone have any suggestions? Happy to discuss this!

[Raul10]

I've not got the game loaded to check. My understanding of a DW was that they are less aggressive than normal wingers, which may by why they are not pushing up as high as you would like.

I've had success in the past doing this with a 424 and regular wingers on support/attack, I would put a regular winger in the AML/R spot with PI/OIs. You will be really exposed on the flanks though.

[DarJ]

Because of the way pressing and marking works in the game it's not possible unless you specifically ask your defensive wingers to press those players but that is a bad idea because they will follow the player all over the pitch ruining your shape. The best thing you can do is use opposition instruction to mark them tight that way when ever they get into the zone of any of your players they get closed down very quickly or you can ask your defensive winger to mark the wingback and you accomplish basically the same thing I just explained but it will be your defensive wingers specifically closing them down

[ExploitedSpace]

23 minutes ago, DarJ said:

Because of the way pressing and marking works in the game it's not possible unless you specifically ask your defensive wingers to press those players but that is a bad idea because they will follow the player all over the pitch ruining your shape. The best thing you can do is use opposition instruction to mark them tight that way when ever they get into the zone of any of your players they get closed down very quickly or you can ask your defensive winger to mark the wingback and you accomplish basically the same thing I just explained but it will be your defensive wingers specifically closing them down

Thanks for your reply! I am currently using opposition instructions to mark the wing backs tight, I am also using an individual man-mark player instruction. I really want to have an aggressive press, but I don't think it's possible unless my defensive winger is in the AMR/AML strata.

[dzek]

7 hours ago, DarJ said:

Because of the way pressing and marking works in the game it's not possible unless you specifically ask your defensive wingers to press those players but that is a bad idea because they will follow the player all over the pitch ruining your shape. The best thing you can do is use opposition instruction to mark them tight that way when ever they get into the zone of any of your players they get closed down very quickly or you can ask your defensive winger to mark the wingback and you accomplish basically the same thing I just explained but it will be your defensive wingers specifically closing them down

DId you tried Mark Tighter PI and is not working as expected?

[chewbaccaloveaddiction]

I used a 3232 and 3241 as a proper Gegenpress in FM23. With a 10 and 2 CF, you only have to create a 2nd tactic where the DW are W(s) in the AM strata and switch between both tactics during the game.

[Johnny Ace]

3 minutes ago, chewbaccaloveaddiction said:

 create a 2nd tactic where the DW are W(s) in the AM strata and switch between both tactics during the game.

I think this is the answer, your wide players would need to be in AML/R strata to press that high up seeing as the DW's starting point is from M L/R

[Rashidi]

The defensive winger is an aggressive winger, and under some circumstances it can put pressure on the backline, however in your set up against some formations that would be too risky.

Against a 4231 there are multiple threats, I actually used your formation, but I had to change the defensive line and apply the PI take more risks and go down byeline to cross to TM to get the DW to apply pressure on opposing wingbacks. This however, only happens during a counterpress, when your side has just lost the ball.

Using the same formation you are using, the DW during a counter press did close down the fullback once the AI decided to try and pass out from the back.

However when it comes to preventing them from taking the short gk, it will depend on the formation you are up against.

In this match I am playing against a 4231. If the DW goes to sit on the opposing fullback their winger will always be free.

Here my defensive winger is number 77 and is he in a good position not too close to the opposing fullback, and he does not create a problem for the WCB, by pushing too high.

This positioning is important because if the DW is needs to block the passing lane to the Winger, because you could be hurt by a cross diagonal ball.

This is an example of what I mean, if the DW no 77 does not cut out the fullback from making the pass then we get a dangerous cross diagonal ball.   Here my DW using your tactic with adjusted player instructions and team instructions does a fairly decent job of shutting down their fullback.  Whenever I use DW, i look to play higher up the pitch with a higher defensive line if I want them to put pressure on opposing wingbacks. In most cases, the DW will always position himself between the fullback and the winger in a 4231, he won't sit tight to the winger, because this could leave them exposed.

You are also using two rather defensive minded roles that will not venture too far forward in the DM tier, so I think you could try pushing up your defensive line, providing your CDs are good mentally, otherwise like the others have suggested play a system with wingers, whose zones will naturally include fullbacks and wingbacks.

[ExploitedSpace]

On 29/10/2023 at 13:58, Rashidi said:

The defensive winger is an aggressive winger, and under some circumstances it can put pressure on the backline, however in your set up against some formations that would be too risky.

Against a 4231 there are multiple threats, I actually used your formation, but I had to change the defensive line and apply the PI take more risks and go down byeline to cross to TM to get the DW to apply pressure on opposing wingbacks. This however, only happens during a counterpress, when your side has just lost the ball.

Using the same formation you are using, the DW during a counter press did close down the fullback once the AI decided to try and pass out from the back.

However when it comes to preventing them from taking the short gk, it will depend on the formation you are up against.

In this match I am playing against a 4231. If the DW goes to sit on the opposing fullback their winger will always be free.

Here my defensive winger is number 77 and is he in a good position not too close to the opposing fullback, and he does not create a problem for the WCB, by pushing too high.

This positioning is important because if the DW is needs to block the passing lane to the Winger, because you could be hurt by a cross diagonal ball.

This is an example of what I mean, if the DW no 77 does not cut out the fullback from making the pass then we get a dangerous cross diagonal ball.   Here my DW using your tactic with adjusted player instructions and team instructions does a fairly decent job of shutting down their fullback.  Whenever I use DW, i look to play higher up the pitch with a higher defensive line if I want them to put pressure on opposing wingbacks. In most cases, the DW will always position himself between the fullback and the winger in a 4231, he won't sit tight to the winger, because this could leave them exposed.

You are also using two rather defensive minded roles that will not venture too far forward in the DM tier, so I think you could try pushing up your defensive line, providing your CDs are good mentally, otherwise like the others have suggested play a system with wingers, whose zones will naturally include fullbacks and wingbacks.

Thanks for the reply! Long time watcher of your videos/streams, love your work. I have rather slow centre backs so I didn't want to play the defensive line too high. I will look to recruit faster ones. My hope was to have defensive wingers that could have a good enough engine to both press high on opp. full backs but get back enough in time to prevent any potential danger. I now realize, that's both probably unwise and impossible in the M.E. I will slowly switch to a back 4 formation. Thank you!

[Rashidi]

You should have seen my latest stream I used defensive wingers and showed how I would use them. They not only tore up defenses but were on more than one occasion players who were not only scoring but creating goals. The defensive winger is immensely underrated. I have been using him in my back 3 systems for quite a while now.

If you are want them to press high then they will but you need to depend on those WCBs to be first line in case u get exposed. I also showed how I would use a trap inside to help

If your centre backs are slow but have great mentals I would still give it a try.

[ExploitedSpace]

Just now, Rashidi said:

You should have seen my latest stream I used defensive wingers and showed how I would use them. They not only tore up defenses but were on more than one occasion players who were not only scoring but creating goals. The defensive winger is immensely underrated. I have been using him in my back 3 systems for quite a while now.

If you are want them to press high then they will but you need to depend on those WCBs to be first line in case u get exposed. I also showed how I would use a trap inside to help.

I will check it out today! Thanks again.