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Why do wingers always struggle in FM?


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IRL some of the best performances comes from IF, IW players like Mbappé, Musiala, Leão or Khvicha.  But in FM it’s always the strikers who have the highest ratings compared to IF’s and IW’s. Best strikers around 8.00 in rating, while the best IF’s and IW’s hardly get above 7.50. So any tips on how to get my IF’s IW’s to perform higher than 7.50 so they can be Ballon D’Or potential like the strikers and like IRL. ?

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52 minutes ago, ThomasHK1979 said:

IRL some of the best performances comes from IF, IW players like Mbappé, Musiala, Leão or Khvicha.  But in FM it’s always the strikers who have the highest ratings compared to IF’s and IW’s. Best strikers around 8.00 in rating, while the best IF’s and IW’s hardly get above 7.50. So any tips on how to get my IF’s IW’s to perform higher than 7.50 so they can be Ballon D’Or potential like the strikers and like IRL. ?

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Well, you're asking Leao to mark tighter (he has 4 marking) and sit narrow (he's super quick) and playing as an IF he won't be utilized in buildup as much. His attribute distribution is much better situated to an IW than IF, so that could be why he's underperforming for you (as an IF you're also asking him to cross less often which is a great attribute for him). 

Leao also isn't a great fit for a high pressing system, with low stamina, workrate, and teamwork. With Milan he's devastating because they sit deep, which means on the counter he has space to utilize his pace and his 1v1 ability to wreck havoc before picking out the TF Giroud or fashioning a chance for himself. In your high press he likely has very little space to run into. Milans system IRL is designed around him to give him a free role to attack as a 1v1 specialist when the ball is won. 

Additionally in your system he's making chances for Diaz who as a CF (a) will be more selfish in his play. Diaz is not a natural striker and with 10 finishing and at 5"7 (6 heading and 7 jumping reach) he will have a hard time finishing the chances Leao creates for him. This will impact Leaos rating, less assists, less party. 

 

On the other flank: Saelemaeker will get you better ratings as an W(s). he's lacking the pace, flair, and dribbling ability to play in the attack role and has an attribute distribution to be a really effective hard working cog for the team. He'll also link up more with the AP on the support duty.

 

 

 

Edited by Cloud9
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21 minutes ago, Cloud9 said:

Well, you're asking Leao to mark tighter (he has 4 marking) and sit narrow (he's super quick) and playing as an IF he won't be utilized in buildup as much. His attribute distribution is much better situated to an IW than IF, so that could be why he's underperforming for you (as an IF you're also asking him to cross less often which is a great attribute for him). 

Leao also isn't a great fit for a high pressing system, with low stamina, workrate, and teamwork. With Milan he's devastating because they sit deep, which means on the counter he has space to utilize his pace and his 1v1 ability to wreck havoc before picking out the TF Giroud or fashioning a chance for himself. In your high press he likely has very little space to run into. Milans system IRL is designed around him to give him a free role to attack as a 1v1 specialist when the ball is won. 

Additionally in your system he's making chances for Diaz who as a CF (a) will be more selfish in his play. Diaz is not a natural striker and with 10 finishing and at 5"7 (6 heading and 7 jumping reach) he will have a hard time finishing the chances Leao creates for him. This will impact Leaos rating, less assists, less party. 

 

On the other flank: Saelemaeker will get you better ratings as an W(s). he's lacking the pace, flair, and dribbling ability to play in the attack role and has an attribute distribution to be a really effective hard working cog for the team. He'll also link up more with the AP on the support duty.

 

 

 

Thanks for the feedback. 
1) Don’t look into who play in each role. I never use Diaz as striker. 
2) I literally watched every Milan game for years. They press high. 
3) The IF/IW not playing with as high rating as forwards is a general thing. I played with Bayern, City and Real Madrid. It’s the same. IW/IF are never able to get as high ratings as your forward (over 8.00 average). 

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Firstly morale in your team is terrible, that's the first thing that needs addressed but secondly if you want Leao to be the main man and not your striker then don't set your tactic up to make your striker the main man. If my striker is not the guy I want scoring goals then I make sure he's helping the guy I want to score goals and he becomes the secondary scoring option not the primary option.

Edited by Crazy_Ivan
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I feel like I'm seeing the same thread time and time again :lol:

If you want an IF/IW or any wide role to shine, you need to give them space and supply, it's FM 101

Having 3 out of your attacking 4 on Attack, isn't really prioritising any role. The CF is a good idea but he's still on Attack, he's the highest positioned role on the team so he'll be in a good position to score goals Leao could be scoring.  Scoring goals = ratings 

You can use roles and TI's to create overloads to free up space 

See back to when Liverpool where actually good and how their system had Salah banging in the goals in a 4-3-3 DM

Personally, I think the 4-3-3 DM is a better shape than a 4-2-3-1 to really get the best from a wide attacker 

4-2-3-1 is still decent, here I spent a season with the Wide Target Forward, I really had to think about how I could get the best out of the role and factor in his limitations for the benefit of the team 

I did the same with RMDs and IFs but because they're more mobile, I used 4-3-3's for them

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18 minutes ago, mikcheck said:

@crusadertsar how have Ruiz been doing? Do you think he could score more if he had a stronger left foot or if playing on the left side?

He has been doing really well actually! Has something like 16 or 17 goals as of the beginning of December. I almost exclusively have been playing him as my right wing attacker so he can cut inside naturally onto his left foot. I tried him up front a few times but he was not as good in AF role. So of course he would probably score more if he had two strong feet. It's always an advantage to any forward. But then his attributes probably wouldn't develop as well. So I find two-footedness is always a double-edged sword.

In fact I am planning to post an update on this tactic in my Jogo Bonito thread so as not to detail this one. But thanks for asking! 

Edited by crusadertsar
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  • 2 weeks later...

The match engine feeds chance after chance to advanced forwards latching on to the end of long balls. While common in real life, it does seem much more common in FM to have these sorts of chances, which is part of the reason why strikers score a higher proportion of total goals in FM than they do in real life. If you ask inside forwards to sit narrow then they too will experience some of the benefit of this match engine favoritism. Playing them wider or even using wider roles such as winger and inverted winger will yield fewer scoring chances for those players. They should still be able to contribute with plenty of dribbles and playmaking. A lot of their assists will be feeding the striker, which means that when AML/AMR players get big match ratings, they will amost invariably come with big ratings from the striker. Strikers, however, can score big ratings without AML/AMR involvement, so they tend to get higher ratings over the long run.

But you can get an inside forward to score plenty of goals in FM. You just need to get a player who is miles ahead of his league peers, and he can dominate games. If your wide players are only league average then it becomes much harder to expect them to score. This is similar to real life where elite AML/AMR player such as Salah and Saka can score plenty of goals, while lower table clubs usually get very little from those spots. Another thing that can lead to better AML/AMR performances is to get taller players in those spots. They will win 6-10 headers per match, which is an odd FM quirk. You can also instruct them to tackle harder and press opponents, which will lead to a few clear cut chances from such pressing.

 

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23 hours ago, Overmars said:

The match engine feeds chance after chance to advanced forwards latching on to the end of long balls. While common in real life, it does seem much more common in FM to have these sorts of chances, which is part of the reason why strikers score a higher proportion of total goals in FM than they do in real life. If you ask inside forwards to sit narrow then they too will experience some of the benefit of this match engine favoritism. Playing them wider or even using wider roles such as winger and inverted winger will yield fewer scoring chances for those players. They should still be able to contribute with plenty of dribbles and playmaking. A lot of their assists will be feeding the striker, which means that when AML/AMR players get big match ratings, they will amost invariably come with big ratings from the striker. Strikers, however, can score big ratings without AML/AMR involvement, so they tend to get higher ratings over the long run.

But you can get an inside forward to score plenty of goals in FM. You just need to get a player who is miles ahead of his league peers, and he can dominate games. If your wide players are only league average then it becomes much harder to expect them to score. This is similar to real life where elite AML/AMR player such as Salah and Saka can score plenty of goals, while lower table clubs usually get very little from those spots. Another thing that can lead to better AML/AMR performances is to get taller players in those spots. They will win 6-10 headers per match, which is an odd FM quirk. You can also instruct them to tackle harder and press opponents, which will lead to a few clear cut chances from such pressing.

 

Thanks. This is the best answer I have got on this matter for years.

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On 05/02/2023 at 12:56, Cloud9 said:

Leao also isn't a great fit for a high pressing system, with low stamina, workrate, and teamwork. With Milan he's devastating because they sit deep, which means on the counter he has space to utilize his pace and his 1v1 ability to wreck havoc before picking out the TF Giroud or fashioning a chance for himself. In your high press he likely has very little space to run into. Milans system IRL is designed around him to give him a free role to attack as a 1v1 specialist when the ball is won. 

true leao isnt suited for a high pressing system but it works for milan cause giroud makes up for it and its like he doesnt press whatsoever, he just picks when. they also don't sit deep, they liked to press high. liked cause currently they sit much deeper after conceding an obscene amount in a month which'll probably(?) change back to the usual high press once they regain confidence and key players from injury. leao also drops VERY deep at times and stays wide without the ball unlike AML players in game who get into the box in the final third. 

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