Young players preferring to remain on the bench, when they're brought on for their debut seems off.

[Swaban]

I brought 19 year old Charlie McNeill on for his debut, in which he scored. However at fulltime, his body language was "Would've preferred to remain on the bench" is this a bug? or is it normal

[dazza11]

I mentioned this on another thread the other day. If it’s not a bug, it should be because for young kids, especially those yet to make a debut, it’s absurd to think they wouldn’t want to come on. 

[SC00P0NE]

It should also matter when someone is subbed in... Like, subbing a youngster in when it's 0:0 during the clasico or ucl knockout stage or something might mean the yongster would have preferred to stay on the bench because of tension, not laziness...

But yea, atm it seems off..

Edited November 29, 2022 by SC00P0NE

[SergeiG]

I have seen it with older players too. It blows my mind that a rotation player or a youngster who is not getting minuted is moaning about getting minutes, And I am not talking about 2 minutes or so, I am talking about 25 minutes or more.

[DarJ]

Im not coming at anyone for anything but watch what people complain about this year has been very interesting for me because I tend to ignore most of these things as it doesn’t have any viable impact on gameplay.

A player comes to me because he’s unhappy and thinks he deserves a new contract, I just try to talk them down and if it doesn’t work, I just ignore them especially if they have a lot of time left in their contract and I address it when I feel like. I do the same with players moaning about playing time, I just ignore it since it doesn’t affect their performance when I need them to play 

[Bojanbbz94]

1 hour ago, DarJ said:

Im not coming at anyone for anything but watch what people complain about this year has been very interesting for me because I tend to ignore most of these things as it doesn’t have any viable impact on gameplay.

A player comes to me because he’s unhappy and thinks he deserves a new contract, I just try to talk them down and if it doesn’t work, I just ignore them especially if they have a lot of time left in their contract and I address it when I feel like. I do the same with players moaning about playing time, I just ignore it since it doesn’t affect their performance when I need them to play 

I do get what you are saying, and I don't disagree with you. But I also don't think this is a good thing.

For a start, if a feature of the game feels off or unrealistic to the extent that it is detrimental to the player's experience this is obviously not ideal for a game that markets as the most realistic football simulation out there.

But more importantly, it is really not good that so many features in the game right now really do have, as you say, no 'viable impact on gameplay'. If a feature really only has a minimal affect on the game at all (if any), what is it doing in the final product? What is it achieving other than adding unnecessary bloat to the game: more info for a player to read but to immediately dismiss,  screens for a player to click through even though the pages hold no meaningful information, more complexity (and frankly adding work) that I have to navigate before I actually get to the fun and engaging parts of the game? I can understand this with new features that are being implemented and tested in the latest edition of the game so that they can be refined in the future. But increasingly it feels like a lot of features to the game don't actually add any value to the experience.

Staff meetings being a formal event that I have to click through to advance the game, rather than informal pop-ups that I can choose to engage with or dismiss as I see fit. Recruitment meetings are forced on me multiple times a transfer window, even though they have literally not even once used any information to inform any transfer decisions (that's what my scouting assignments were and are already for). Squad dynamics has been in the game since 2018 but, to be blunt, it remains a mostly meaningless feature that you are totally safe to dismiss.

I certainly don't want to shoot the messenger here, and I agree with you that many player interactions feel mostly meaningless. But if it's an element to the game that only takes away from your sense of immersion if you think about it too hard, and can safely be ignored by a player who understands the systems enough, then it is a feature that seriously lacks polish.

[fc.cadoni]

5 hours ago, Swaban said:

I brought 19 year old Charlie McNeill on for his debut, in which he scored. However at fulltime, his body language was "Would've preferred to remain on the bench" is this a bug? or is it normal

Low Pressure hidden attribute

[DarJ]

10 minutes ago, Bojanbbz94 said:

But I also don't think this is a good thing.

I'm not saying people shouldn't complain if something isn't working as it should. They absolutely should, that's the only way to get a better game in general. My point was more the fact that personally I couldn't be bothered with any of that, I only play the game for the tactical aspect so it was interesting to see that so many people seem to care so much about the other stuff (as they should) 

[Mars_Blackmon]

4 hours ago, fc.cadoni said:

Low Pressure hidden attribute

This, the OP lack any context. Was he winning or losing? What type of game? Etc. Yes he scored but that doesn’t erase his low pressure attribute.

[Mars_Blackmon]

4 hours ago, Bojanbbz94 said:

I do get what you are saying, and I don't disagree with you. But I also don't think this is a good thing.

For a start, if a feature of the game feels off or unrealistic to the extent that it is detrimental to the player's experience this is obviously not ideal for a game that markets as the most realistic football simulation out there.

But more importantly, it is really not good that so many features in the game right now really do have, as you say, no 'viable impact on gameplay'. If a feature really only has a minimal affect on the game at all (if any), what is it doing in the final product? What is it achieving other than adding unnecessary bloat to the game: more info for a player to read but to immediately dismiss,  screens for a player to click through even though the pages hold no meaningful information, more complexity (and frankly adding work) that I have to navigate before I actually get to the fun and engaging parts of the game? I can understand this with new features that are being implemented and tested in the latest edition of the game so that they can be refined in the future. But increasingly it feels like a lot of features to the game don't actually add any value to the experience.

Staff meetings being a formal event that I have to click through to advance the game, rather than informal pop-ups that I can choose to engage with or dismiss as I see fit. Recruitment meetings are forced on me multiple times a transfer window, even though they have literally not even once used any information to inform any transfer decisions (that's what my scouting assignments were and are already for). Squad dynamics has been in the game since 2018 but, to be blunt, it remains a mostly meaningless feature that you are totally safe to dismiss.

I certainly don't want to shoot the messenger here, and I agree with you that many player interactions feel mostly meaningless. But if it's an element to the game that only takes away from your sense of immersion if you think about it too hard, and can safely be ignored by a player who understands the systems enough, then it is a feature that seriously lacks polish.

I agree that some features have minimal effect, which is probably by design considering that this Thread is complaining about a concept, There would probably be many more threads like this if it made a noticeable difference…With that said, there isn’t a right or wrong way to handle a situations, you can ignore things if that’s the type of manager you are. You don’t have to play the game on OCD mode.

[fc.cadoni]

7 hours ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

This, the OP lack any context. Was he winning or losing? What type of game? Etc. Yes he scored but that doesn’t erase his low pressure attribute.

The manual need to include and description of these (hidden) attributes IMHO

[Dagenham_Dave]

27 minutes ago, fc.cadoni said:

The manual need to include and description of these (hidden) attributes IMHO

They wouldn't be hidden then, would they?

You can learn about hidden attributes from a player's coach/scout reports. 

[rusty217]

Maybe he's just a Ronaldo fan trying to take after his idol?

[Swaban]

10 hours ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

This, the OP lack any context. Was he winning or losing? What type of game? Etc. Yes he scored but that doesn’t erase his low pressure attribute.

It was the final group game of the Europa League (season 1) we were 3-0 up at halftime against Sturm Graz so I brought him on to make his debut in a low stakes match having already qualified.

[HoChiKim]

There is no way this should be happening unless there are hidden personality traits and even then a young kid surely wouldn't have that much of an ego.

[enigmatic]

It's a straight swap for text which used to say "complacent" and just means the substitute is not very focused or motivated, probably because they're coming on when the game is already won

Not a very good change tbh though....

Edited November 30, 2022 by enigmatic

[dazza11]

2 hours ago, HoChiKim said:

There is no way this should be happening unless there are hidden personality traits and even then a young kid surely wouldn't have that much of an ego.

100% agree with this - and if he does have that much ego you should then be able to punish him, bit like Man Utd did with that young lad, Garnacho, who was dropped for poor attitude 

[starbugg]

All my players in FM 23 complain about coming off the bench, it has never happened to me in any other version, no one has ever complained about coming on before.