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[FM23.4] 40 team World Cup


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  • rusty217 changed the title to [FM23] 40 team World Cup

well done @rusty217:thup:

I am running my own 64 team World Cup as I want it bigger and more countries who you dont normally see taking part.

of interest have you tried changing hosts I am having mixed results-single host works fine

but joint hosts dont happen tried with Euros too, same outcome if you have any input much appreciated

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1 hour ago, Roy Race 9 said:

well done @rusty217:thup:

I am running my own 64 team World Cup as I want it bigger and more countries who you dont normally see taking part.

of interest have you tried changing hosts I am having mixed results-single host works fine

but joint hosts dont happen tried with Euros too, same outcome if you have any input much appreciated

Is your WC FIxed format or Flexible? IIRC the default rules override some of your host stuff if it's Flexible. Needs to be Fixed format to actually take your changes into account.

I haven't tried joint hosts. It can't be done randomly so it would need to be set for specific years in advance. Plus the hassle of automatic qualification for hosts.

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10 hours ago, rusty217 said:

Is your WC FIxed format or Flexible? IIRC the default rules override some of your host stuff if it's Flexible. Needs to be Fixed format to actually take your changes into account.

I haven't tried joint hosts. It can't be done randomly so it would need to be set for specific years in advance. Plus the hassle of automatic qualification for hosts.

rookie error cant believe I hadnt checked for that:applause:

now to resolve the 2 host auto qualification might try leaving an extra space or pulling 2 max host spaces 

think this could be the real fun bit

thanks for the input

cheers

e9ae96bd05b674b44e3f40342541ab1e.jpg

a829129ad361b56cab36673b5db33988.jpg

 

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On 17/11/2022 at 06:30, rusty217 said:

x World Cup 40 teams.fmf 44.66 kB · 21 downloads

A 40 team World Cup with 8 groups of 5 from 2026 onwards, rather than the proposed 48 team World Cup.

The host qualifies automatically (no co-hosting)
Africa: 6 teams
Americas (North/South combined qualifying): 8 teams
Asia/Oceania (combined final stage qualifying): 6 teams
Europe: 10 teams
Playoff: 9 teams
The playoff features 6 teams from Africa, 4 from the Americas, 6 from Asia/Oceania and 10 from Europe. With the 9 winners qualifying for the WC.

20221117122113_1.thumb.jpg.e9272d74744bb119f50decc454a33004.jpg

20221117122149_1.thumb.jpg.0110fd9cc1d2407c549a59b798ee43a8.jpg

Other changes:

Host selection for the WC, Euros, AFCON, Asian Cup & OFC Cup is more diverse than before (especially the Asian Cup which by default seems to just switch between 5 different countries forever).
The AFCON and Asian Cup alternate between winter/summer tournaments. Hot nations can still host the winter version and it's only ever 4 years (AFCON) and 8 years (Asian Cup) now so should disrupt seasons less.
Australia are now able to host (and therefore participate in) the OFC Cup, although it is rare.
The Euro/South American Super Cup can now be hosted by North American countries too.

Additionally, all the WC qualifying tournaments, Asian Cup quals and Euro quals should automatically adjust for extra teams if you want to add new countries. There's a limit to how many extra they can manage, around 5 or 6 is the limit I believe.

Known issues: Potentially Asian Cup/OFC Cup awards. The Asian Cup awards are given out if an Asian country is loaded (I assume a larger database size could also work) and I assume the OFC Cup is the same. They don't work if you only load 1 European, African or American league though.

If you spot any other issues, please let me know.

Thank you so much for this! I used your file last year

 

I wanna make some changes to this for my own use and since you know more than me about setting the WC up I hope you can help

 

1. I wanna change the location from Qatar(22) and USA(26) to USA(22) and Sweden(26). Is it as simple as changing the host?

2. I wanna change the Winter Schedule in 22 to summer. Is it a simple as changing the dates to jun/jul?

3. Could I manually add a double host or would that cause problems with qualifying?

 

 

Also I want every confederation to have a world cup on a rolling schedule, and if I understand you post up above if I set the interval to 20 with their starting year(as shown below) they should never overlap?

 

North America 2022 > 2042 > 2062 etc
Europe 2026 > 2046 > 2066 etc
South America 2030 > 2050 > 2070 etc
Africa 2034 > 2054 > 2074 etc
Asia 2038 > 2058 > 2078 etc

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5 minutes ago, HurkaDurk69 said:

Thank you so much for this! I used your file last year

 

I wanna make some changes to this for my own use and since you know more than me about setting the WC up I hope you can help

 

1. I wanna change the location from Qatar(22) and USA(26) to USA(22) and Sweden(26). Is it as simple as changing the host?

2. I wanna change the Winter Schedule in 22 to summer. Is it a simple as changing the dates to jun/jul?

3. Could I manually add a double host or would that cause problems with qualifying?

 

 

Also I want every confederation to have a world cup on a rolling schedule, and if I understand you post up above if I set the interval to 20 with their starting year(as shown below) they should never overlap?

 

North America 2022 > 2042 > 2062 etc
Europe 2026 > 2046 > 2066 etc
South America 2030 > 2050 > 2070 etc
Africa 2034 > 2054 > 2074 etc
Asia 2038 > 2058 > 2078 etc

1. Yep, you can just change the host for those years, a pretty easy change. Although you'll also need to edit the American qualifying section. Due to the winter WC the qualifying starts before the WC fully updates and the US aren't recognised as the current hosts yet so I had to add an extra instruction to remove them from qualifying just for 2026 since they already qualify as host. So change the hosts and then remove the Ignore USA instruction for American 2026 qualifying. You might need to add an Ignore Sweden instruction to Europe for 2026 too.

2. Pretty much, yes. Especially now that all the teams are there already and it doesn't need to wait for qualifying to finish, just changing the fixture dates to June/July should work.

3. If you add a co-host you'll also need to edit qualifying just for that specific year so that 1 fewer team qualifies. Otherwise you'll have 1 team too many. You might also need to change the draw process for the group stage, I've got it set to assign the host seeding 0 and put them in Group A. It'd probably still work, but would put both hosts into Group A which I guess wouldn't be ideal. IIRC I used an invalid groups for seeding instruction so it should block them from groups 1 to 7, if you change that to 1 to 6 it should put the 1 host in Group A and 1 in Group H.

4. Yep, that hosting setup should work. You have to set possible hosts by individual country though, so it will be a bit of work to alter all of those.

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1 hour ago, rusty217 said:

1. Yep, you can just change the host for those years, a pretty easy change. Although you'll also need to edit the American qualifying section. Due to the winter WC the qualifying starts before the WC fully updates and the US aren't recognised as the current hosts yet so I had to add an extra instruction to remove them from qualifying just for 2026 since they already qualify as host. So change the hosts and then remove the Ignore USA instruction for American 2026 qualifying. You might need to add an Ignore Sweden instruction to Europe for 2026 too.

Do you mean this? 

Spoiler

640969394_Skrmbild2022-11-24020726.thumb.png.2e08bdd12cae5a21a7ef11fe425954e7.png

Should I add the same rule for Europe(with 2023, 2023) here? Also, I am thinking of setting up the first "cycle" manually. Uruguay 2030, TBD Africa 2034, TBD Asia 2038. Should I set that up as well?

Spoiler

529253543_Skrmbild2022-11-24020957.png.5769a53d924dbf704d359ba9f55499ca.png

 

1 hour ago, rusty217 said:

3. If you add a co-host you'll also need to edit qualifying just for that specific year so that 1 fewer team qualifies. Otherwise you'll have 1 team too many. You might also need to change the draw process for the group stage, I've got it set to assign the host seeding 0 and put them in Group A. It'd probably still work, but would put both hosts into Group A which I guess wouldn't be ideal. IIRC I used an invalid groups for seeding instruction so it should block them from groups 1 to 7, if you change that to 1 to 6 it should put the 1 host in Group A and 1 in Group H.

Sounds like too much work haha 

Quote

4. Yep, that hosting setup should work. You have to set possible hosts by individual country though, so it will be a bit of work to alter all of those.

Should I use 2022 or 2042 for NA host nation with the 20 year interval?

Edited by HurkaDurk69
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1 hour ago, HurkaDurk69 said:

Do you mean this? 

  Reveal hidden contents

640969394_Skrmbild2022-11-24020726.thumb.png.2e08bdd12cae5a21a7ef11fe425954e7.png

Should I add the same rule for Europe(with 2023, 2023) here? Also, I am thinking of setting up the first "cycle" manually. Uruguay 2030, TBD Africa 2034, TBD Asia 2038. Should I set that up as well?

  Reveal hidden contents

529253543_Skrmbild2022-11-24020957.png.5769a53d924dbf704d359ba9f55499ca.png

 

Sounds like too much work haha 

Should I use 2022 or 2042 for NA host nation with the 20 year interval?

Yes, exactly that. You should do that with Europe too, but for Sweden instead of course. For Europe it's under Qualified Teams rather than Team Pool. Put it at the top of the list there to ensure it works correctly. You won't need to do it for any of the others, it's just an issue with the timing of the 2022 WC. Summer WCs update in time for the new host to be correctly picked up and ignored by qualifying tournaments. Plus in Asia the host participates still, since Asian WC qualifying also acts as Asian Cup qualifying.

2022 or 2042 for NA hosts should both have the same effect, so either is fine.

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17 minutes ago, verazmuhammadmasri said:

This file's amazing but how did you figure out the problem from the one that you did in fm22? 

A lot of trial and error!

But in short, competition setup and update dates were the issue. Sometimes they're needed to get a competition to run properly, eg. my WC Playoff won't work properly without the right setup date. But for the AFCON qualifiers setup/update dates just broke it. I'm not entirely sure why either, it seemed to work every 4 years so it wasn't 100% broken, it just wasn't working every 2 years like it was supposed to. With those dates removed it now seems to work though.

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15 minutes ago, HurkaDurk69 said:

I did something wrong but I have no clue how haha (Squad Reg rules)

  Hide contents

1280049152_Skrmbild2022-11-25051108.png.e317945cb3f239ce98579d09e22fff6b.png

:Bowen:

Are you using any other international files with it? It just uses the default fixture rules for internationals, so if there are any other international files that add fixture rules they may have overridden the default rules and so get used by the WC too. Basically anything under International Competitions > Fixture Rules would affect the WC.

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43 minutes ago, rusty217 said:

Are you using any other international files with it? It just uses the default fixture rules for internationals, so if there are any other international files that add fixture rules they may have overridden the default rules and so get used by the WC too. Basically anything under International Competitions > Fixture Rules would affect the WC.

Yeah I am, but none that adds that rule. But I did this on a small db setting, maybe that is why?. Will test tomorrow when I wake up

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19 hours ago, HurkaDurk69 said:

Yeah I am, but none that adds that rule. But I did this on a small db setting, maybe that is why?. Will test tomorrow when I wake up

It'd be this page, or whatever the basic editor equivalent is. Anything at all on this page could mess up WC squad selection.

20221126092914_1.thumb.jpg.3b22bc5faf27df0c61837e89acdf568e.jpg

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Hello rusty, your file is brilliant and I was able to adapt it for my purposes so that there is no longer a uefa nations league - so thank you for that. 

Unfortunately, I have a problem in June 2023, more precisely on June 10th 2023, when the Champions League final will take place and at the same time the qualifying matches for Euro 2024 will be played.

As a result, some players will of course not be available for the final, have you already had this experience? Is there a way to fix this?

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18 minutes ago, p1lleez said:

Hello rusty, your file is brilliant and I was able to adapt it for my purposes so that there is no longer a uefa nations league - so thank you for that. 

Unfortunately, I have a problem in June 2023, more precisely on June 10th 2023, when the Champions League final will take place and at the same time the qualifying matches for Euro 2024 will be played.

As a result, some players will of course not be available for the final, have you already had this experience? Is there a way to fix this?

Ah, I had that problem for a bit on FM22 as well. Thanks for the heads up. It should be a pretty easy fix.

Do you know if it's just a 2023 issue (due to the later final), or if it occurs other years too?

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vor 31 Minuten schrieb rusty217:

Ah, I had that problem for a bit on FM22 as well. Thanks for the heads up. It should be a pretty easy fix.

Do you know if it's just a 2023 issue (due to the later final), or if it occurs other years too?

Unfortunately, I can't tell you, as I have only simulated (gone on holiday) until the end of June 2023. I'll try to get to the next qualification in 2025 in the next few days.

I assume that the problem can be solved by adjusting the matchday dates for the qualifiers? 

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6 hours ago, p1lleez said:

Unfortunately, I can't tell you, as I have only simulated (gone on holiday) until the end of June 2023. I'll try to get to the next qualification in 2025 in the next few days.

I assume that the problem can be solved by adjusting the matchday dates for the qualifiers? 

Sorted. There's a new version in the OP.

It was a bit of a pain. I'm using the standard international dates, which are usually fine, it's just the 2023 UCL final isn't on it's usual date, it's been pushed back about 2 weeks interrupting internationals. Thanks Qatar. So I added a 2023 only date that's about 2 weeks later for the Euro quals too.

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17 hours ago, rusty217 said:

Sorted. There's a new version in the OP.

It was a bit of a pain. I'm using the standard international dates, which are usually fine, it's just the 2023 UCL final isn't on it's usual date, it's been pushed back about 2 weeks interrupting internationals. Thanks Qatar. So I added a 2023 only date that's about 2 weeks later for the Euro quals too.

Champions League,Europa League and Conference League and New European Competiton

can you do an alternate format of that

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1 hour ago, LazgoNNO2000 said:

Champions League,Europa League and Conference League and New European Competiton

can you do an alternate format of that

No, sorry. I'm not interested in making new continental club competitions as long as edited ones break coefficients and dynamic rep/prize money.

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5 minutes ago, verazmuhammadmasri said:

How does qualifying for the asian cup work?

Same as normal. The teams that qualify for the final stage of WC qualifying qualify for the Asian Cup automatically. The best teams that get knocked out in the 2nd round of WC qualifying play a short qualification tournament for the remaining places. And of course the host qualified automatically.

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27 minutes ago, rusty217 said:

Same as normal. The teams that qualify for the final stage of WC qualifying qualify for the Asian Cup automatically. The best teams that get knocked out in the 2nd round of WC qualifying play a short qualification tournament for the remaining places. And of course the host qualified automatically.

Then how can you make it like that? Cause I can't seem to find out how you did it in the editor

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1 hour ago, verazmuhammadmasri said:

 

Then how can you make it like that? Cause I can't seem to find out how you did it in the editor

Other Stage Actions to qualify the top two teams from the 2nd stage to the Asian Cup. Then another action to qualify the 18 best 3rd/4th placed teams. Both times excluding the host and passing their qualification place to a different team instead.

20221128000406_1.thumb.jpg.f67e31cb6b8976de6fb80987a5f201a3.jpg

Have a look at the file to see it better, it's pretty complicated! I think it's mostly still intact from the original setup, I don't believe I changed much. I did use very similar instructions for my Copa America file to use the Nations League as a qualifier for that too.

Edited by rusty217
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  • 2 weeks later...

Hey Rusty, 

just wondered how easy or hard it would be to change the amount of teams that qualify from each continent or changing the amount of teams that qualify for the play offs from each continent so for example take away 4 playoff spots for europe and make it the 6 best 2nd places qualify for the playoffs and something like give CAF 2 extra playoff spots so still have 6 playoff qualifiers and then an extra 2 for the best 3rd qualifier and something similar for the other continents??

 

 

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15 hours ago, J-Hood said:

Hey Rusty, 

just wondered how easy or hard it would be to change the amount of teams that qualify from each continent or changing the amount of teams that qualify for the play offs from each continent so for example take away 4 playoff spots for europe and make it the 6 best 2nd places qualify for the playoffs and something like give CAF 2 extra playoff spots so still have 6 playoff qualifiers and then an extra 2 for the best 3rd qualifier and something similar for the other continents??

Depends, if you're familiar with using the advanced rules editor and keep track of what you're doing it would be pretty simple. If not, then it could be difficult.

The main thing is just making sure any changes you want to make are reflected everywhere required, not just in one place. So for example, the playoffs are currently set for 26 teams. As long as it still has 26 teams it doesn't really matter where they come from. So if you remove 4 playoff spots for Europe and add 4 to Africa, that would work fine. If you just want to add/remove then as long as you adjust the number of teams required for the playoffs it would still work too. Making it say the top 6 2nd placed teams rather than all is a little complicated, but if you've done or seen it before elsewhere it should work in basically the same way, just using Extra Fate Places and setting the new fate as Top Playoff.

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On 10/12/2022 at 05:04, rusty217 said:

Depends, if you're familiar with using the advanced rules editor and keep track of what you're doing it would be pretty simple. If not, then it could be difficult.

The main thing is just making sure any changes you want to make are reflected everywhere required, not just in one place. So for example, the playoffs are currently set for 26 teams. As long as it still has 26 teams it doesn't really matter where they come from. So if you remove 4 playoff spots for Europe and add 4 to Africa, that would work fine. If you just want to add/remove then as long as you adjust the number of teams required for the playoffs it would still work too. Making it say the top 6 2nd placed teams rather than all is a little complicated, but if you've done or seen it before elsewhere it should work in basically the same way, just using Extra Fate Places and setting the new fate as Top Playoff.

 I think ultimately what I want to do is probably a bit to complicated for my knowledge of the advanced editor, could you direct me to the place where I can change the amount of playoff spots from each continent?

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On 19/11/2022 at 06:45, Roy Race 9 said:

well done @rusty217:thup:

I am running my own 64 team World Cup as I want it bigger and more countries who you dont normally see taking part.

of interest have you tried changing hosts I am having mixed results-single host works fine

but joint hosts dont happen tried with Euros too, same outcome if you have any input much appreciated

That sounds class any chance you'd be able to share the format of how to set it up in game?

 

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17 hours ago, J-Hood said:

 I think ultimately what I want to do is probably a bit to complicated for my knowledge of the advanced editor, could you direct me to the place where I can change the amount of playoff spots from each continent?

It's under the competitions rules for each qualifying competition. Here's the European one:

20221212210926_1.thumb.jpg.5e3af164279ca38042a1cad09347f051.jpg

Just above this it's got Number of Top Playoff Places set to 1, so it will assign the League Fate Top Playoff to 1 team in each group, this instruction then tells it to qualify any team with that fate for the WC Playoff. I think it works similarly in the others, I don't recall setting any up that qualify teams from a knockout at least so I think they all go straight from the group stage like this.

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1 minute ago, rusty217 said:

It's under the competitions rules for each qualifying competition. Here's the European one:

20221212210926_1.thumb.jpg.5e3af164279ca38042a1cad09347f051.jpg

Just above this it's got Number of Top Playoff Places set to 1, so it will assign the League Fate Top Playoff to 1 team in each group, this instruction then tells it to qualify any team with that fate for the WC Playoff. I think it works similarly in the others, I don't recall setting any up that qualify teams from a knockout at least so I think they all go straight from the group stage like this.

 

cheers, i thought it was there, looking at that it will still need the qualifying groups to be re-done. i think the best i can do without re doing things is changing the number of teams that go straight to the final of the playoff stageimage.thumb.png.1656645940d5d923a7ffde2b13bd3492.png

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18 hours ago, J-Hood said:

 

cheers, i thought it was there, looking at that it will still need the qualifying groups to be re-done. i think the best i can do without re doing things is changing the number of teams that go straight to the final of the playoff stageimage.thumb.png.1656645940d5d923a7ffde2b13bd3492.png

To be honest I'm not actually sure those instructions to skip the first round even work in game. Getting teams to skip a round of a stage is pretty finicky. It's possible, but it's hard to make sure it's the teams you actually want to skip it. Hard to test in game too to see if they're actually following those instructions or if it's randomly drawn with any teams potentially skipping the first round.

Increasing the number of teams in the playoff so that no teams are able to skip the first round would definitely work though!

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On 13/12/2022 at 12:02, rusty217 said:

To be honest I'm not actually sure those instructions to skip the first round even work in game. Getting teams to skip a round of a stage is pretty finicky. It's possible, but it's hard to make sure it's the teams you actually want to skip it. Hard to test in game too to see if they're actually following those instructions or if it's randomly drawn with any teams potentially skipping the first round.

Increasing the number of teams in the playoff so that no teams are able to skip the first round would definitely work though!

 

unfortunately you are right, I've simulated 100 years and each time it ignores the instructions it just seems to randomly pick the teams that skip through to the final. i like your format i just think it lets to many European teams in, on average 5 extra European teams qualified through the playoffs out of the 9 spots 

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Sorry to bother you again, but I have a problem

 

When simming up 2026, squads have 40 players when the WC is happening which is the same number as preliminary squads. I haven't touched the number or anything for the preliminary squads. I have however changed the amount of cash clubs get daily.

 

I have checked my other rule editing files, none of them mentions preliminary squads

 

I guess I should actually sim with your version with my files to see if the problem is me lol

Edited by HurkaDurk69
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4 minutes ago, verazmuhammadmasri said:

Sorry to bother you but for some fixtures in the euros, why do teams from the same group meet each other again in the round of 16 even though you put the flag for "Keep Same Teams From Previous Groups Apart"

This never happened before in the editor from previous years. 

yeah, I have noticed the same thing

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On 17/12/2022 at 23:02, verazmuhammadmasri said:

Sorry to bother you but for some fixtures in the euros, why do teams from the same group meet each other again in the round of 16 even though you put the flag for "Keep Same Teams From Previous Groups Apart"

This never happened before in the editor from previous years. 

I'm not sure, sorry. I don't know whether it's an issue with that flag generally not working, or if it's caused by 3rd placed teams going through too.

I wish I could make it a fixed draw like it is IRL, but with some 3rd placed teams it's just stupidly complicated, not even sure it'd be possible in the editor.

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It's ok np but I feel like it appears that this flag doesn't work anymore cause the u20 world cup appeared to have the same issue. It's probably the editor's issue

5 hours ago, rusty217 said:

I'm not sure, sorry. I don't know whether it's an issue with that flag generally not working, or if it's caused by 3rd placed teams going through too.

I wish I could make it a fixed draw like it is IRL, but with some 3rd placed teams it's just stupidly complicated, not even sure it'd be possible in the editor.

 

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  • 1 month later...
在 2023/2/6 在 PM8点36分, \'Appy \'Ammer说:

I love the look of this. One question... Your download on this page starts with an x. I saw on another thread you posted a download with a z at the start. Is that a newer version?

Screenshot_20230206_123443_Chrome.jpg

would you provide the link of thread?

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On 06/02/2023 at 21:36, \'Appy \'Ammer said:

I love the look of this. One question... Your download on this page starts with an x. I saw on another thread you posted a download with a z at the start. Is that a newer version?

Basically an internal identifier so I know which version of the file it is. I often do it to influence file loading order too.

Generally, no letter = not finished, v = database changes only, x = able to release publicly and z = final version for my game. Sometimes x and z will be the same, other times I change things just for me, eg. removing the managers at clubs I want to take over etc.

Specifically for the WC file the z version just adds russia, Kazakhstan and Israel to Asia. A change I know some people may not want, especially the russia part, hence it's not included in the publicly released version. The removal of the 2022 WC was added to that version too, again because I wanted it in my save. Oh and IIRC I increased the number of qualifying places for Asia in my version, due to being biased.

Edit: The z version in action on my current save with Israel (group 2), Kazakhstan (group 5) and russia (group 6):

20230208150213_1.thumb.jpg.937726a3a26f4cbdb15a991fc18307b2.jpg

The 5th team in russia's group is Bangladesh, a fair bit easier than their usual European qualifying groups!

Edited by rusty217
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