*Official* Football Manager 2023 Feedback Thread

[Mr Tonio]

Il y a 6 heures, bahmet a dit :

Here the guys tested the tactical settings for 2880 matches. https://fm-arena.com/board/10-tactical-instructions-testing/

 

I had a look at the other experiments, this doesn't shine a great light on the ME... Line of defense does not seem to matter. Most of the tactical "buttons" neither... Gosh. This looks bad. Pressing, mentality and tempo are the only 3 variables that seem to have any effect.

Edited November 17, 2022 by Mr Tonio

[anagain]

8 hours ago, KillYourIdols said:

IMO (And i've said this for a few weeks now), Match Engine is Good, However The Animations are not great at displaying any sort of noticable football and poorly reflect the game in motion. Like the Animations at times really struggle to convey what the Engine is proposing.

Defender Left for dead for Pace? Show him Running to Catch up, Don't artifically mimic it by making him stand still for 2-3 Seconds then run. They are two different Things.

I've had as Similar Issue (Albeit not REALLY the same) With FIFA and other games for years. Up the Difficulty? Make the OTHER TEAM better, Dont make MY Team worse. It's not the same thing.

 

I dont Deem FM "Unplayable" or "Broken" in any way. It does, however, Need a polish IMHO.

I think you make some good points. I've said before that I would be more than happy to see FM24 release as just a polish of all existing features in the game. Just spend a development period looking at every aspect of the game from UI, to social mechanics (including promises) and to extra work on the match engine and associated animations.

I would happily pay the annual price of £40 for that.

I think it would make the game better in the long run, but I've no doubt there would be even more anger than usual.

[alancheti]

how do i add more than 5 nations on my career mode on Xbox?

[themadsheep2001]

18 hours ago, warlock said:

Yes, it's fantastic. Loving the variety of goals scored (and conceded!), improved dribbling in all areas of the pitch, and just not seeing the long-ball problem (I'm giving up a handful of goals per season that way, which doesn't seem unrealistic).

There are a couple of very minor issues that could do with improving...

1. It seems like far too many shots are fired over the bar. I'm not asking for more goals, but it would be good to see a greater variety of missed shots or saves in the games.

2. There isn't enough variety in the way the ball is deflected from blocked shots or crosses. Almost every time, the ball goes up in the air but continues on the original trajectory rather than being deflected to one side or the other, or rebounding towards the kicker.

Otherwise, the ME is great and just a couple of minor tweaks away from being the best we've ever had.

There's some animation bugs that needs to be squashed and I think several areas need tweaking to improve quality while still keeping some of the chaos. But the variety makes it my favourite release engine ever. What's more is the variety from the AI. Never enjoyed anything more/less than the AI targeting my deep playmaker with a press that forced me to change half my instructions on the fly. 

[anagain]

16 minutes ago, Mr Tonio said:

I had a look at the other experiments, this doesn't shine a great light on the ME... Line of defense does not seem to matter. Most of the tactical "buttons" neither... Gosh. This looks bad. Pressing, mentality and tempo are the only 3 variables that seem to have any effect.

Does it show anything really?

What was the team? Who were they playing? Were the matches instantly simulated?

I find it hard to take anything concrete from a test when the parameters are not disclosed.

I looked through the forum and just saw results. Must be missing something. 😁

[Domoboy23]

15 minutes ago, anagain said:

Does it show anything really?

What was the team? Who were they playing? Were the matches instantly simulated?

I find it hard to take anything concrete from a test when the parameters are not disclosed.

I looked through the forum and just saw results. Must be missing something. 😁

Exactly.

Also which mentality were they using for the pressing? Did they then do the pressing alongside the different mentalities?

It means nothing.

 

[Mr Tonio]

il y a 23 minutes, anagain a dit :

Does it show anything really?

What was the team? Who were they playing? Were the matches instantly simulated?

I find it hard to take anything concrete from a test when the parameters are not disclosed.

I looked through the forum and just saw results. Must be missing something. 😁

Those are great questions, should ask them overthere. Some of the parameters are disclosed though but this clearly is not a scientific experiment. What is mind buggling me still is the absence of inconsistent results, unless these are just lazilly made up, the defensive line, for exemple should not work at all like that. Team should completely crumble with a high intensit press, high line of engagement and a very low defensive line, shouldn't it?

Edited November 17, 2022 by Mr Tonio

[Mr Tonio]

il y a 3 minutes, Domoboy23 a dit :

Exactly.

Also which mentality were they using for the pressing? Did they then do the pressing alongside the different mentalities?

It means nothing.

 

You should have a look before commenting.

[Tony Wright 747]

7 hours ago, Christmas said:

Are you sure we are talking about the same thing? 

I very much doubt that when I take my pink away kit to another Conference South team's stadium they paint their own 'away team' dressing room pink to match the pink kit my team is turning up in. 

Yet in fm they do. 

Yes I thought you meant the away dressing room was painted in the home colours, my misunderstanding

[roykela]

Not so fun taking over a team in Belarus.
Trying to get some staff in. Not many want to join me. 
Almost every single person is demanding at least twice the amount i can afford.
Even the worst scout available to me wants more than i can afford (double).

That in itself is fine with me. Shouldn't be easy getting decent staff in.
What does annoy me though is that i have "Realistic appointments - First Team" checked.
Most of the results shown are definitely not realistic.
The top guy, when looking for a coach, demanded 10 times more than i could offer at most. That isn't something i'd categorise as a "realistic appointments".

The realistic filter definitely needs some work.

[Christmas]

I genuinely believe that in its current state this is a worse game than FM22.

Over the years I've regularly thought that the new edition was 'worse' than the previous ones once adjusted for development trajectory / against expectations.

Can't recall actually thinking its an objectively worse game in a while though.

[Choi seung won]

I will be looking at the december update and rate the fm23.

If the issue raised in the bugtracker drags on until March, I have no intention of buying the fm series anymore.

Issues raised in the bugtracker (particularly the match engine defense issues) should have been resolved prior to official release.

Users who bought it with money are currently playing a game full of bugs, which is a ridiculous situation.

[alian62]

2 hours ago, csw4228 said:

I will be looking at the december update and rate the fm23.

If the issue raised in the bugtracker drags on until March, I have no intention of buying the fm series anymore.

Issues raised in the bugtracker (particularly the match engine defense issues) should have been resolved prior to official release.

Users who bought it with money are currently playing a game full of bugs, which is a ridiculous situation.

Guess we all have our own expectations . There is not one game on the market that isn't full of bugs though but I get what your saying . SI should just own up and say sorry we can't fix those bugs that have been in the game for years but we will persist , otherwise it comes across as arrorgant and non caring. It seems like every year we post the same bugs . Im not sure where the quality inspection happens though.  Saying that though I really love the game and I dont know if any game you can get into and change it or add to it . Skins , kits , tactics plus all the pre-editor stuff is amazing 

Edited November 18, 2022 by prot651

[Just4Downloads]

Match engine desperately needs to be fixed asap. Looks like 95% of goals come from a ball over the top or into the channels the the defence refuses to deal with. It’s currently a game of how nonsensical a defence reacts to aerial balls, directly relates to how many goals will be scored. Never seen anything like it.

Lower leagues is riddled with it. Long balls behind the defence or into the channel…rinse and repeat. 

[alian62]

25 minutes ago, Just4Downloads said:

Match engine desperately needs to be fixed asap. Looks like 95% of goals come from a ball over the top or into the channels the the defence refuses to deal with. It’s currently a game of how nonsensical a defence reacts to aerial balls, directly relates to how many goals will be scored. Never seen anything like it.

Lower leagues is riddled with it. Long balls behind the defence or into the channel…rinse and repeat. 

It doesn't relate to how many goals are scored at all as the 3D is just a representation of what's been processed 

[Just4Downloads]

2 minutes ago, prot651 said:

It doesn't relate to how many goals are scored at all as the 3D is just a representation of what's been processed 

Whatever you want to call it then. It’s broke. 

[Just4Downloads]

20 minutes ago, Just4Downloads said:

Match engine desperately needs to be fixed asap. Looks like 95% of goals come from a ball over the top or into the channels the the defence refuses to deal with. It’s currently a game of how nonsensical a defence reacts to aerial balls, directly relates to how many goals will be scored. Never seen anything like it.

Lower leagues is riddled with it. Long balls behind the defence or into the channel…rinse and repeat. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by Just4Downloads

[Just4Downloads]

21 minutes ago, Just4Downloads said:

Match engine desperately needs to be fixed asap. Looks like 95% of goals come from a ball over the top or into the channels the the defence refuses to deal with. It’s currently a game of how nonsensical a defence reacts to aerial balls, directly relates to how many goals will be scored. Never seen anything like it.

Lower leagues is riddled with it. Long balls behind the defence or into the channel…rinse and repeat. 

Time to turn off the stream. 

[tajj7]

20 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

I played Germany in the Euros last night.

Defend great for 50 minutes then they launch a long ball over my defence for a striker, my CB responds by running 10 yards up the park and stopping while their attacker now has a free run at goal.

I always feel like its an animation issue, the code says the CB misjudged the flight of the ball and is then outpaced by the striker, but the game shows it in a truly awful way.

I think some of the things are animation issues, certainly some of the close contact stuff that just looks odd, but I don't think these issues are. I think they are issue with positioning/awareness of defenders to threats. 

Someone above said it's a bit like when you are playing FIFA or whatever and you couldn't select the right player you need, it's like defenders have a very small sphere of influence and anything out of that they are completely oblivious. I just don't think there is much logical explanation to a lot of them that you could explain away with animation issue, when you watch it you are just left scratching your head as it makes no sense, for example my Grealish goal I described the defenders were nowhere near where they should have been and their subsequent actions made no sense. 

Like I would understand if say a player kind of phased through a defender and that was the animation failing to show him getting beaten on the dribble.

Or say a player just runs in close proximity to the attacker, that might be the ME showing the attacker muscling the defender off and keeping him from getting the ball, but the animation can't show their shoulder to shoulder running battle.

Stuff like that yeh I could see logical explanations between what the game is trying to do and what the game is showing. 

Also I have seen defenders miss headers from long balls and getting outpaced, so the game can show that. 

The issue is their positioning, awareness and reactions. From my experience -

1. They can't react or react slowly to balls played from long distances, like they can only 'see' it when it enters a certain range from them but this 'rule' doesn't seem to apply to attackers.

2. If an attacker is being trailed by one defender, other defenders, even in better positions do not interact to close down, tackle or head off the attack. Again similar to say in FIFA where you select a player and use that player to chase an attacker, who you are trailing behind, instead of selecting to a defender in front of the attacker, because you don't select those other defenders they don't do anything to stem the attack. That is what it looks like to me, an old FIFA or ProEvo game where players not selected by the human player would basically do nothing but loiter around in their position until they were 'activated' by the human player selecting them.

Those are the two main things I see that I don't think can be explained by animation issues.

[3maldini3]

Is it just me or 'XYZ to consider options at the end of contract' is VERY common?

[bahmet]

The beta version should be released in September so that there is time to fix ME. 

[damjanovski]

I think I had enough time to write short summary of the match engine.

First of all I want to write about the positives:

1. The game look more natural and realistic, the pressing works really nice and the players make more mistakes which is a positive thing. Now about the negative things and most of them repeat year after year:

1. Crossing - this is one of the most annoying thing in the game. The players get in the position to cross often all alone in the wing and they just stay there waiting for a opposing player to catch them and play it back to a team mate, or make back turn and cross from an awful position or pass to the other side of the pitch witch is extremely not realistic. 

2. Passing - for this there is big comment section about the pass above the head, but I want to notice that most of the time the players make really fast pass as soon as they receive the ball without even trying to dribble at all.

3. Dribbling or the lack of it - this is also mentioned by the members here but I want to stress it further. The problem is that often time the players do not try to make space with the ball to shoot/pass/cross they just shoot/cross/pass with player next to the. Even world class players make these stupid things which is nonsense. 

4. Shooting - Here it lack variety. Players just blast the ball. In the past editions in the earlier versions ex. 2012, 2017 the shooting was far better than today. As I mentioned previously the players do not try not make space to shoot the just shoot even if there is player in front! 

I hope that these thing can be improved so we can play the game.

Cheers.

Edited November 18, 2022 by damjanovski

[dunk105]

32 minutes ago, damjanovski said:

I think I had enough time to write short summary of the match engine.

First of all I want to write about the positives:

1. The game look more natural and realistic, the pressing works really nice and the players make more mistakes which is a positive thing. Now about the negative things and most of them repeat year after year:

1. Crossing - this is one of the most annoying thing in the game. The players get in the position to cross often all alone in the wing and they just stay there waiting for a opposing player to catch them and play it back to a team mate, or make back turn and cross from an awful position or pass to the other side of the pitch witch is extremely not realistic. 

2. Passing - for this there is big comment section about the pass above the head, but I want to notice that most of the time the players make really fast pass as soon as they receive the ball without even trying to dribble at all.

3. Dribbling or the lack of it - this is also mentioned by the members here but I want to stress it further. The problem is that often time the players do not try to make space with the ball to shoot/pass/cross they just shoot/cross/pass with player next to the. Even world class players make these stupid things which is nonsense. 

4. Shooting - Here it lack variety. Players just blast the ball. In the past editions in the earlier versions ex. 2012, 2017 the shooting was far better than today. As I mentioned previously the players do not try not make space to shoot the just shoot even if there is player in front! 

I hope that these thing can be improved so we can play the game.

Cheers.

Re: Crossing. Maybe try early crossing. We all love work ball into the box but finding this year that this option will end up with what you describe. For me first time I've ever really seen the early crossing option visibly do something.

[anagain]

1 hour ago, bahmet said:

The beta version should be released in September so that there is time to fix ME. 

I think there may be selected persons playing the game that early.

Of course, though I feel this would be obvious to many, the game would be in a much more raw state in September. It would possibly hamper the process to release to the masses this early, by swamping QI with even more bugs and slowing development further.

I'd argue the ME is never 'fixed'. I'd argue it it is in a constant state of development. Hence what I thought was a perfectly good explanation regarding how they tried to fix some well voiced issues but ended up with different issues...all because the ME is not a simple fix.

I think the best fix is for people to have more patience and to understand that SI do a phenomenal job to recreate a very complex game via the medium of a computer program. There is so much more good about this ME than there is bad.

Not sure why I feel the need to make my point. Not like many listen to explanations...

[fc.cadoni]

Story of my life in FM23 so far. Ahhh

 

 

[damjanovski]

1 hour ago, dunk105 said:

Re: Crossing. Maybe try early crossing. We all love work ball into the box but finding this year that this option will end up with what you describe. For me first time I've ever really seen the early crossing option visibly do something.

It is not about early cross or work the ball. I am talking about situations where the player is all alone on the wing in a situation where the only logical option is to cross, and he waits until the opposing player closes him. Or, he turn and cross after he missed the opportunity in the first place.

[Bielsa1975]

Well ive played 2 seasons ,and all the same things are still wrong with the game ,transfers /wages favours AI but wont go on a rant , gameplay you can hammer teams XG 4.5 but still clinging on to the 1-0 win 30 times a season or you get beat 2-1  AI can score 90% of time with .45 xG 

 

[fc.cadoni]

4 hours ago, Just4Downloads said:

Time to turn off the stream. 

Against me. Happens so often.

 

----

Another one

 

 

Edited November 18, 2022 by fc.cadoni

[Zoolok42]

16 hours ago, Domoboy23 said:

Exactly.

Also which mentality were they using for the pressing? Did they then do the pressing alongside the different mentalities?

It means nothing.

 

Uhm, it's all in there when you actually click the link. I can't be bothered to think about what it all means, though.

[zindrinho]

1 hour ago, fc.cadoni said:

Against me. Happens so often

No offence, but what did you expect to happen when you set your defense on the half way line before a goal kick without man marking a guy like willock? Seems like they all are running free, your RB has been drawn way out of position too, think you got played by the AI here..

And then you let it happen again the exact same way in the same game, same half?

[fc.cadoni]

8 minutes ago, zindrinho said:

No offence, but what did you expect to happen when you set your defense on the half way line before a goal kick without man marking a guy like willock? Seems like they all are running free, your RB has been drawn way out of position too, think you got played by the AI here..

And then you let it happen again the exact same way in the same game, same half?

The DCL and DL position staying close together leaving a gap.

Numerous examples of DC players being far away from each other creating huge gaps has been reported as well.

That's a known issue. Specifically the DCL position with DL. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by fc.cadoni

[BuzzR]

 

Spoiler

6 hours ago, Just4Downloads said:

 

Yeah, this is the current state of the game in lower leagues, a lot of the goals look like that. 

Here are the Goalkeepers stats after half a season (2022/2023 2023/2024) from National League and National Leagues North & South.

40 Goalkeepers with at least 1 assist in half a season.

Spoiler

I think there is a major issue with the weight of decisions for the defenders with the new changes added into the FM23 match engine. It doesn't look like an "animation hick-up".

Most often than it should happen probably - the decision to hold the line or to cover an empty corner zone is weighting more than the decision to stop the ball. Lower player attributes probably increases the imbalance.

Sometimes you can see the CD stuttering; maybe some contradictory decisions are made in sequence ( go after the ball vs stop & hold the line vs stop & cover FB is rushing ) and this also triggers the same effect for the keeper who seems to rush / stop / rush and finally getting himself out of position to intercept the ball. Some form of you get it - no you get it, oh ! maybe I will get - wait I have something more important to do.

There was a thread for FM22 where someone had analyzed the amount of long balls the keepers were playing on full game highlights. The results weren't pretty, if I remember correctly. The long ball over the top and defenders missing the headers was another issue in FM22 - not completely controlled.

Putting things together: a prevalence of long kicks for keepers ( that most likely has been inherited from previous version(s))  and a new logic for the defenders module added in FM23 (that most likely needs a revision) - gave us the current state of the ME, unfortunately.

 

Edited November 18, 2022 by BuzzR
spelling

[dannyfc]

4 hours ago, dunk105 said:

Re: Crossing. Maybe try early crossing. We all love work ball into the box but finding this year that this option will end up with what you describe. For me first time I've ever really seen the early crossing option visibly do something.

Have you had much luck with headed goals?

I'm about halfway through my first season - and haven't seen many from either my team or the opposition. However, I don't really have any great targets to aim at though so I'd be interested to know if it's a viable option with the right players. 

 

 

[Domoboy23]

19 hours ago, Mr Tonio said:

You should have a look before commenting.

I had a look at the information provided via the screenshots in the original post.

You should watch your completely unnecessary tone when replying to someone offering a viewpoint as to why the screenshots provided do not provide valid parameters for evidence.

[seeftweeft]

This game is an absolute shambles at the moment.

Never felt the need to actually create an account here and post on this thread until now but this year's edition is just not fun to play. Every team plays the same, every match plays the same no matter the league or the quality of team. 

Constant balls over the top that the defenders don't react to but somehow the AI team's defence line maintains their composure and shape most of the time, midfielders might as well not exist especially playmakers as their sole purpose this year is to hold on to the ball too long and lose it when they get pressed and that is when they actually get the ball and your defenders don't just kick it long despite having tons of options in front of them or your goalkeeper makes a save and decides to kick the ball to your striker despite having "Pass ball to centre-backs" and "Roll it out" ticked. 

Bugs that still exist from previous years, players still can't take throw-ins and just rush it to the opposition instead of taking their time and that causes a counter because your whole team decided to push up for a throw-in. 

Headline features either are useless (earrings and rings when we can't even see our manager) and a scouting centre that somehow has been made scouting even more tedious and that is, if your scouts even decide to respect the assignments given. 

 

Low point for the series for me honestly, and I have no hope this will actually be fixed with patches.  

[LeoFM]

I'm so sick of seeing these kinds of plays in the ME...

 

Edited November 18, 2022 by LeoFM

[eXistenZ]

So i  dont want to create a ticket/issue for this yet, but why do my staff take courses when im in total controll of deciding who gets those?

If they pay for it out of their own money, it should be made more clear

 

Also, i definitly want a patch soon for those ridiculous high over the top balls

Edited November 18, 2022 by eXistenZ

[anagain]

10 hours ago, Just4Downloads said:

I feel it worth noting that Zealand made a video about his thoughts on FM23 on YT. He commented on the defensive issues in the ME and gave a detailed, well explained reasoning as to why he thought the issue with defenders and high balls was happening. He was good enough to be constructive.

 

For my part, I have refrained from replying to some posts a few times. I just played a friendly with my main save team away to the team that won the division I am playing in this season. A game many would say we should have been favourites to lose. They are top tier, we are second tier.

I am playing a slow tempo, position based 4-2-3-1. In the middle of the park I have a segundo volante and I just adore how he plays. He does so many different things. He breaks with regularity and actually scored the opener with a beautiful drive from the edge of the area. In the second half he played a wonderful ball to the left IW who then used strength to fire in to the far corner.

They were really nice goals and looked like modern football. The IW goal was reminiscent of watching Salah drive in from the right and slot in to the far post for a trademark goal.

I am seeing a lot of very nice wide play. Much interchange between my IF/IWs and their corresponding WBs. In the centre the Enganche seems to be looking good as a subtle game changer, though I must confess that he wasn't as influential in the win I am speaking about, and nor was my AF. It was a game in which we beat our opponents with wide play.

I honestly was dead impressed with how the game looked. I've not had as much time to play as I'd have liked and have only managed to get in a few friendlies on my main save. I had played 10-15 or so games with a team playing low block counter in beta.

I think I am going to enjoy this MTK Budapest save.

[KamyKaze]

1 hour ago, eXistenZ said:

So i  dont want to create a ticket/issue for this yet, but why do my staff take courses when im in total controll of deciding who gets those?

If they pay for it out of their own money, it should be made more clear

 

Also, i definitly want a patch soon for those ridiculous high over the top balls

I already reported that

[eXistenZ]

4 minutes ago, KamyKaze said:

I already reported that

Do you know by any chance if its also a bug that B team doesnt get any friendlies despite asking your staff to shedule them?

[LeoFM]

2 minutes ago, eXistenZ said:

Do you know by any chance if its also a bug that B team doesnt get any friendlies despite asking your staff to shedule them?

I reported that bug in FM22 and it's still 'under review', guess they just forgot about it..

 

[eXistenZ]

31 minutes ago, LeoFM said:

I reported that bug in FM22 and it's still 'under review', guess they just forgot about it..

 

eurgh, very dissapointing...

Ok, guess ill have to do it myself.

[flauta kicma]

when can we expect new patch? Does anyone know it maybe?

Edited November 18, 2022 by flauta kicma

[GOODNAME]

24 minutes ago, flauta kicma said:

when can we expect new patch? Does anyone know it maybe?

1~10 December 

[FrazT]

34 minutes ago, flauta kicma said:

when can we expect new patch? Does anyone know it maybe?

Nobody can give you any exact timing of when the next update will be released- keep an eye on the forums for news.

[John Joe O'toole]

7 minutes ago, FrazT said:

Nobody can give you any exact timing of when the next update will be released- keep an eye on the forums for news.

 Do you think it will be save game compatible? 

[zindrinho]

4 minutes ago, John Joe O'toole said:

 Do you think it will be save game compatible? 

Everything except database updates have always been save game compatible, would expect this again, yes.

[anagain]

8 minutes ago, John Joe O'toole said:

 Do you think it will be save game compatible? 

I think, from experience, later patches usually are. Issues with league rulesets are often fixed for full release and later patches tend to concentrate on issues with the ME or game mechanics. It is database stuff that tends to make patches not save game compatible.

If it is just ME stuff then it will work with your save. Of course, you'd need to start a new save to take advantage of any changes to players they might make in the database.

Nothing is guaranteed, of course. This is just my experience of following for many years. I have always happily continued saves through.

[FrazT]

17 minutes ago, John Joe O'toole said:

 Do you think it will be save game compatible? 

To confirm what the others have said above:

ME changes and bug fixes are always save game compatible.  Any changes to data like player attributes and competition rules etc, require a new save to take effect.  Historically, unless your save has been affected by a specific rule issue, it is usually OK to carry on with your current save with a later update. and not notice any difference.

[muzza_m]

Anyone else noticing free kicks are almost always on target?

Switched to comprehensive highlights but still seems like almost all free kicks are on target, for me and opposition teams.