[FM23] & [FM24] Ernst Happel Challenge - If at First You Don't Succeed, Try, Try Again

[warlock]

3 hours ago, SixPointer said:

Standard Liege back on the summit

Outstanding! A couple of blips but done in style.

How does this fit into the overall challenge? Do you still need to win something in Europe?

[Jogo Bonito]

1 hour ago, SixPointer said:

Thanks mate. Yeah the league was always the main aim anything else was a bonus!

hope Lillestrom v Tromso is better than this. It’s my third match this season here as I work here. The only game we have won was again molde in the derby and we played quick. Again I feel the football is very slow. I need some Franz.

I’m Scottish and used to the fast paced, direct, physical nature of our game. I get Norway is more technical but it’s seriously lacks penetration, both teams defenders hold the ball for an age and let the opponent transition into defensive shape. 

I thought you were talking about the fans for a moment  but yeah I know what you mean. That's why I enjoy the Belgian league over the Dutch, I think it's much faster-paced and more entertaining. Well, yours may not have been a good watch but you won. Lillestrom was not a great game either, and they lost 1-0 at home (Adams was quiet - tidy mainly but had very few chances). 

Edited July 2, 2023 by Jogo Bonito

[SixPointer]

13 hours ago, warlock said:

Outstanding! A couple of blips but done in style.

How does this fit into the overall challenge? Do you still need to win something in Europe?

I need to re visit the rules. Because i skipped stage 2 cause the Salzburg title was pointless. I think I need another league title and cup to complete stage 3.

As for your European trophy it has to be done somewhere in stage 1-4 I believe. I’ll get back to you. 
 

13 hours ago, Jogo Bonito said:

I thought you were talking about the fans for a moment  but yeah I know what you mean. That's why I enjoy the Belgian league over the Dutch, I think it's much faster-paced and more entertaining. Well, yours may not have been a good watch but you won. Lillestrom was not a great game either, and they lost 1-0 at home (Adams was quiet - tidy mainly but had very few chances). 

I felt we were the better side, especially first half. Rosenborg had chances but lacked a cutting edge, the brought on my assassin from my Odd save from fm21 Oscar Aga so that was a nice moment. They say never meet your hero’s……

[SixPointer]

17 hours ago, warlock said:

Outstanding! A couple of blips but done in style.

How does this fit into the overall challenge? Do you still need to win something in Europe?

Another league title with Standard Liege opens up stage four.

UCL need to be won by the end of stage 4 in order to progress to stage five. When I can head to 4 star league. 

[karanhsingh]

59 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

Another league title with Standard Liege opens up stage four.

UCL need to be won by the end of stage 4 in order to progress to stage five. When I can head to 4 star league. 

Also if i remember correctly, you need to win one CL with a team which is not from a top 5 league. Will you be trying to do it with standard?

[SixPointer]

54 minutes ago, karanhsingh said:

Also if i remember correctly, you need to win one CL with a team which is not from a top 5 league. Will you be trying to do it with standard?

I will give it my best shot this year with Standard. But again the league must be prioritised. Mainly because stage four should allow the best chance for UCL glory.

Stage 4 requires 3 league titles, 2 cups and super cup. This should take the longest to achieve therefore should give me the best chance of building a team with UCL capability.

That said I feel I already have some seriously special players at Standard and we of course went close in Europa but the Champions league is a different animal. I would hope to win the league this year again and then look at what’s available.

[karanhsingh]

23 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

I will give it my best shot this year with Standard. But again the league must be prioritised. Mainly because stage four should allow the best chance for UCL glory.

Stage 4 requires 3 league titles, 2 cups and super cup. This should take the longest to achieve therefore should give me the best chance of building a team with UCL capability.

That said I feel I already have some seriously special players at Standard and we of course went close in Europa but the Champions league is a different animal. I would hope to win the league this year again and then look at what’s available.

That makes a lot of sense, I guess stage 4 should be more like a 4-5 year project. Have you thought ahead to the sort of clubs that you could target?

[SixPointer]

59 minutes ago, karanhsingh said:

That makes a lot of sense, I guess stage 4 should be more like a 4-5 year project. Have you thought ahead to the sort of clubs that you could target?

I need to see what the rep ratings are like at the time. I done Ajax last year but they have good track record. I think Benfica and Porto have to be in with a shout. I will have a look this evening 

[keeper#1]

8 hours ago, karanhsingh said:

Also if i remember correctly, you need to win one CL with a team which is not from a top 5 league. Will you be trying to do it with standard?

To complete Stage 4, you need to build something like Ajax did a couple of years ago and even then they lost in the semifinals to Tottenham.  It's a very thin needle to thread.

[SixPointer]

6 hours ago, keeper#1 said:

To complete Stage 4, you need to build something like Ajax did a couple of years ago and even then they lost in the semifinals to Tottenham.  It's a very thin needle to thread.

This is absolutely spot on btw!

[SixPointer]

The current top ten leagues in Europe, so in terms of potential movements in the future I would say Portugal and holland would be the best bets. That said I done holland last year, ideally Ligue 1 follows suit of real life and drops out of the top five. Belgium to France feels like a more realistic move than to Portugal.

As for clubs, the top four have all won the prestigious European cup in which ever format, so had Feyenoord. Time will tell and of course I still must get over the line with Standard Liege, and who knows what can happen in that time.

[karanhsingh]

Ligue 1 has dropped out of the top 5 IRL? Was not aware of that. 

[SixPointer]

2 hours ago, karanhsingh said:

Ligue 1 has dropped out of the top 5 IRL? Was not aware of that. 

I seen something on Twitter yesterday, not sure how sure a source it was 

[SixPointer]

Digging A Little Deeper

A record breaking season in Liege in doing so secured the clubs first ever domestic treble and there first ever league and Belgian cup double, something I was shocked discover considering how successful they are within Belgium.

Now I can look back over the season and display some key points and fact to round it all up nicely before moving on to defend our crown.

We finished strong at the end and won the title with a seven point gap. Scoring an incredible 95 goals and only conceding 32, making us the best at both ends of the pitch. 

Cercle Brugge rallied to finish second, something am pleased about. It’s always nice to see the underdog from a big city derby doing well especially when the bigger rival had a disaster of a season. Gent and Anderlecht secured the last two European spots from the championship group, while the famous old club Union St Gilloise secured top spot in the euro places playoff.

Westerlo and Denize are both relegated, Eupen and Molenbeek coming up in place of them.

Awards Night

No better place to start than the magnificent Milosevic, Europe’s tops marksman. 39 goals in 37 starts in all competitions, breaking the record for average rating in Belgium and winning a host of awards. He also breaks the record for most goals, most league goals, and most POMs for the club.

The last time I had striker playing at this level it was none other than the Viking himself, Erling Haaland away back when I managed Aalesund FK. Naturally, there is a lot of interest in Jovan, but he signed a new deal after the January window and has a 40 million realise clause which should see the club bag a colossal profit if its activated.

A personal accolade for Franz, always nice to be recognised especially after such a terrific season. As always, the Austria deflected the praise onto his players, backroom team, and the club in general. This will only further intensity interest in the Austrian, but he insists he is here to see through his project.

Four players made it onto the team of the year, of course Milosevic made the cut. Rauta the one the media hyped up at the start of the season, the hit kid had a tremendous first season at the club a netted 30 goals in all competition.

Locko was another new arrival, originally planned as backup but he ended up first choice. His 12 assists from LWB proves there is always a bargain to be had and not to be put off by player pricing, transfer listing etc and he only cost 300k. Diakite was the final man to make the team, he has been the ever present in the backline and Mr consistent.

It was another successful recruitment campaign for Franz Schiemer something he is fast becoming well renowned for, often turning a profit, getting the best out of players and most importantly an eye for a value for money. There were several examples off that.

Rauta will be the most famed one, getting any wonderkid for 2.5 million euros must be seen as good business but it was backed up by his performances. I personal favourite for me is Jean Belocian, mainly because he was playing reserve football in France, but performing extremely well. Franz to a chance he would step up and he done just that and goes from strength to strength.

Bargain deals you can take your pick really, Locko (500k), De Winter (free), Sambo (1.8m) and Stoisa (2.5m) all performed excellently. The more expensive signings fell into place in the end Vandevoordt (6m) pushed on and finished the season with a club record for clean sheets, Benny (12m) cost us a million a goal but at 18 he is going places and is long term planning. KVDB (10.5m), started to settle into the team and looks to be either Raskin’s long term partner or replacement.

Matteo, Charlier, Dragus and Kaba took a step back as there was a lot of rotation but still performed and looked to continue good form from the first season we had together. Felipe Cruz takes most improved as he broke the record for assists and again becomes and incredible signing for 215k last January.

The only poor showing was Matam, the Belgian never hit the heights he did and could well be shown the door.

Nod To Franz Ball

Something am sure everyone is sick of me banging on about, CORNERS!! 14 Goals scored, 1 conceded. Taking the time really is worth it, I’m still holding out hope that FM24 sees an improvement in the creator because although I have success it’s a tedious process, and it’s really needing a revamp, but I would guess this will come in FM 25 after the latest news.

Our gegenpressing style is really starting to shine through, I’m not sure how accurate the OPPDA is on FM, but it’s all based of the same thing, so we are the highest pressing team in the league. This increases our efficiency when it’s backed up with how strong we are in the air after forcing the opponent long, and how effectively we prevent final third passes against us.

At the opposite, the extremely aggressive attacking nature, with a huge 700+ shots at goal back up by being the most efficient team shows just how incredibly potent our attack has become. We create the most chances, progress the ball into the final third more than anyone else, our crossing is second to none thanks to our highly creative wingbacks. 

Possession isn’t something we value its merely a by-product of being so dominant, winning the ball back and then progressing it quickly and taking risks is key to catch the opponent in transition, but when that fails the overloads and underloads kick in and then we look to break down the shape. I now have that progressive passing style to penetrate the lines.

These things all combined makes us the most potent but also most solid team when you get this forumla correct it more often than not results in championship titles.

[Lestri]

Lovely use of the in-house data analysis. I must admit I've looked at the data at a player level this save so far, so this gives me some drive to look at it from a team level! What's Milosevic value at the moment?

[SixPointer]

1 hour ago, Lestri said:

Lovely use of the in-house data analysis. I must admit I've looked at the data at a player level this save so far, so this gives me some drive to look at it from a team level! What's Milosevic value at the moment?

I’m by no means the man for the data analysis side of it. I’ve only really started to get to grips with it. The likes of @_Ben_ @Shrewnaldo @MattyLewis11 to name a few are much more on the ball than myself.

He is valued at 25-30 million. So if he goes we will make around 22 million in profit as minimum 

[SixPointer]

So it begins

His release clause is 26 million, now I always approach these as realistic as possible. I have an option trigger an extension in his deal for another year, but I may opt to accept the offer then offer him a new deal and see what he chooses? do you think that’s more realistic or trigger the clause? or just sell?

[Hootieleece]

16 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

His release clause is 26 million, now I always approach these as realistic as possible. I have an option trigger an extension in his deal for another year, but I may opt to accept the offer then offer him a new deal and see what he chooses? do you think that’s more realistic or trigger the clause? or just sell?

It all depends on what your club's bank balance looks like.....more than likely even with a healthy bank balance. A team that is in moneyball style soccernomics would sell and have a replacement at ready. If you have become attached to the player and are ready to win the league and advance in the CL then accept but offer him a new deal and see what he chooses.

If you want a player mad at you trigger the extension and or negotiate up to or over the release clause and then let him go.

[SixPointer]

10 minutes ago, Hootieleece said:

It all depends on what your club's bank balance looks like.....more than likely even with a healthy bank balance. A team that is in moneyball style soccernomics would sell and have a replacement at ready. If you have become attached to the player and are ready to win the league and advance in the CL then accept but offer him a new deal and see what he chooses.

If you want a player mad at you trigger the extension and or negotiate up to or over the release clause and then let him go.

Tbh I think he has to go. There’s no way the club in real life could knock that money back. We haven’t qualified for the UCL yet so the money is needed.

KDVB should be an adequate replacement. And I may use the money to find a really really good partner for him

Edited July 5, 2023 by SixPointer

[SixPointer]

Well that was very short lived, it appears the captains love for Liege was too strong. For now i say for now because i tried to offer a new deal after the rejected Forest contract. He wants silly money so no wonder he knocked them back but i wont be able to offer this either.

Edited July 5, 2023 by SixPointer

[keeper#1]

What was interest in signing with Forest?  I've found that goes a long way on whether a player leaves on not.  I get a lot of offers for my Palace players but they have little interest in signing with the new club so I decline the offer.

[karanhsingh]

You qualified for the champions league right? I'd say hold onto your best players unless they really kick up a fuss and want to leave. 

[SixPointer]

17 hours ago, keeper#1 said:

What was interest in signing with Forest?  I've found that goes a long way on whether a player leaves on not.  I get a lot of offers for my Palace players but they have little interest in signing with the new club so I decline the offer.

He decided not yo sign for them, and then triggered the extension so he should stay until at least jan window.

16 hours ago, karanhsingh said:

You qualified for the champions league right? I'd say hold onto your best players unless they really kick up a fuss and want to leave. 

Nope, we need to qualfiy as the league dropped its auto slot, 1 round will see us into it proper.

[SixPointer]

2.5 million i signed him for. I think he will be away. but i will offer a new deal and the player can decide

[SixPointer]

Would appear we are bigger than i thought!

[SixPointer]

new deal should keep him here for the foreseable, still has the 26.5m clause though

[karanhsingh]

Can we see updated screenshots of him and the other wonderkid striker?

[SixPointer]

18 hours ago, karanhsingh said:

You qualified for the champions league right? I'd say hold onto your best players unless they really kick up a fuss and want to leave. 

i got this wrong btw, we did go straight in.

[SixPointer]

8 minutes ago, karanhsingh said:

Can we see updated screenshots of him and the other wonderkid striker?

rauta is the wonderkid

Jovan is the goal machine, 22 now so not really a wonderkid

[karanhsingh]

Oh didn't realise Milosevic is a "real" player - part of the young Serbian brigade! It's a goldmine this year for cheap wonderkids. 

[SixPointer]

1 hour ago, karanhsingh said:

Oh didn't realise Milosevic is a "real" player - part of the young Serbian brigade! It's a goldmine this year for cheap wonderkids. 

He signed for Stuttgart in real life, he was top goal scorer in a under 17 euros   

[Jogo Bonito]

6 hours ago, karanhsingh said:

Oh didn't realise Milosevic is a "real" player - part of the young Serbian brigade! It's a goldmine this year for cheap wonderkids. 

He won me the Europa League as a substitute at Stuttgart 

Great updates, very interesting to see your players rejecting these moves. Looking forward to your new season!

[Hootieleece]

I could really use Rauta's pace on my team to beat the press. I have players with 15 pace but defenders always seem to catch them from behind.

I think he would be devastating as the Trequarista upfront in my 5-2-1-2WB Nesselquist Variant.

 

As for Milosevic I have found that big Center Forwards in the mold of Haaland work really well even if they don't have the same attributes. (I have a similar regen at Preston Named Finley Roberts)

[SixPointer]

9 hours ago, Jogo Bonito said:

He won me the Europa League as a substitute at Stuttgart 

Great updates, very interesting to see your players rejecting these moves. Looking forward to your new season!

The window is shut, so I’m writing an update up-to that point. Hopefully done by today.

Milosevic is a machine!

8 hours ago, Hootieleece said:

I could really use Rauta's pace on my team to beat the press. I have players with 15 pace but defenders always seem to catch them from behind.

I think he would be devastating as the Trequarista upfront in my 5-2-1-2WB Nesselquist Variant.

 

As for Milosevic I have found that big Center Forwards in the mold of Haaland work really well even if they don't have the same attributes. (I have a similar regen at Preston Named Finley Roberts)

Rauta is an expert at getting in behind the lines, in both systems. He like to chip the goalkeeper as well. When coming off the right he reminds me of Mo Salah! 
 

Milosevic is the best striker I have had since Haaland! 

[karanhsingh]

That's high praise indeed! Btw, when did you manage Erling?

[SixPointer]

Em I was either fm17 or fm18. Long before I used to do career updates. I signed him for Aalesunds FK (the team from the town I work in Norway) and we won 5 championships back to back he broke all the records for goals scored In Norway. And he came from molde, AAFK rivals!

[karanhsingh]

4 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

Em I was either fm17 or fm18. Long before I used to do career updates. I signed him for Aalesunds FK (the team from the town I work in Norway) and we won 5 championships back to back he broke all the records for goals scored In Norway. And he came from molde, AAFK rivals!

Nice, I also remember coming across and signing him directly from Molde on a Portsmouth save I did back in the day, before I or anyone had really heard of him IRL. Obviously he wasn't world class on that version, but he was still an absolute beast!

[SixPointer]

Building on strong foundations

This summer window the club would reap the benefits of having placed significant investment in the playing staff the previous summer, the squad proved capable on all fronts last season and would only need bolstered.

Potential summer outgoings have been well documented, Raskin, Rauta, and Brassier all had big fees accepted but all opted to stay, due to being offered poor wages, and the chance of UCL football which Standard can provide.

I got that bit wrong, I was convinced we had to qualify. But our new coefficient slot kicked in this year rather than next, a bug?

Into the big time for the Belgian champions, having enjoyed a significant rise up the rankings it was now time to show our metal in Europe’s top competition.

To compete I feel home games against, Fenerbahçe, Benfica and Hertha are all must win. Shaktar and Lyon away are two other games I would really like to have a go in. Real Madrid at the Bernabeu is the glamour tie and one am sure the loyal passionate fans will relish.

The 4.2 million sales of Matam weren’t included in the numbers, he joined Russian side Rostov after failing to hit the heights. This takes our total spend to 3.3 million euros, a far cry from the net spends of last summer.

Camara, Pepa (loan), Charlier (loan) and Lucas Noubi (loan) where the other four departures. Meaning a left back to challenge Locko, a backup centre back where necessary. 

Charlier never got enough game time last season to see him kick on, his loan to a league rival is gamble and if it goes well, they could well activate the 15million clause. Beno will now step up to first team duties after being loaned back to Podrebeza following his 250k move. He will challenge Rauta for the AF role.

Noubi was another who couldn’t get a solid run of games, so shipping him out on loan makes sense and hopefully he can come back ready for a starting berth. In the meantime, the powerful Yann-Aurel Bisseck arrives off the back of a solid season for AGF in Denmark and for a modest 2million. Off the three players I was interested in he boasted the bits stats, being great in the air and the tackle and being a great match for the squad.

Melvin Bard came in for 3.6 million to replace Matam, coming off a fantastic season in Ligue 2 for Lorient. Again, am challenging him to step up, but this is something Locko, Belocian have done and done so well. If he can do half as well as his French colleagues, he will prove a worthy investment. 

The final piece of the jigsaw was Aster Vranckx, the once highly rated Belgian had fell on hard times in Germany at Wolfsburg and found himself on the transfer list, the German club happy to pay half his wages I opted to take a chance, he was being brought in for a last minute Raskin departures but that never materialised. at 24 he is yet to peak, and if he can rediscover his form, he will be a solid asset to the team.

Academy Watch

Something I haven’t covered in great detail on this journey mainly because of just that, it’s a journey. Often in this type of save you don’t hang around to see the fruits of the labour from the academy, unless an exceptional talent (charlier) comes along, or you struggle to nail a stage.

Another reason is that it’s an area game that I struggle with, I find improving first team players through my training schedules a lot easier. I think it’s safe to say I’m also better at spotting value in the market than bleeding through a host of exceptional youngsters.

The club itself does an excellent job of producing talented players, Sint-Truiden set the standard in terms of players for the pro league, although they don’t produce as many internationals as say Genk and Anderlecht.

The club has had one excellent intake, and good one. For me, the players that came from the good, Jean-Pierre Gesbert, Léo Cassou, Ali Dumont and Richard Ewolo-Atangana all looked stronger than that from an apparent golden generation. Stefan Milosevic, Sören Dassy, Jacques Dewaele.

Gesbert, Dumont and Cassou all have a real chance of making it into the first team in the coming years, if I can get there development right, something that I will track closely from now on.

[Hootieleece]

Youth Development: Have your top 3 youth players train with the First team but make them available for all Reserve matches. That way you can decide training roles and ppm's and your first team training schedule will benefit them.

[SixPointer]

Quick out the blocks

The super cup was up first, after perfect pre season preperation. Cercle Brugge would be looking to put a dent in Franz Schemer’s plans for domestic dominance again. It would be the Austrians 100th game in charge of Standard Liege, how time has flown by in Belgium. I plan the updates to again be less frequent this season, in my race against time to complete the challenge.

Cercle were no match and slumped to a 3-1 defeat, back to back super cups and the club’s 6th one. The pick of the goals coming from club captain Nicolas Raskin, a swift break and stunning finish.

Unbeaten in the first six games allows us to take the summit at this early stage. Excitingly there are four teams who remain unbeaten, and one is our regional man rival in Charleroi, now a Walloon title battle would be quite the spectacle, and something am sure everyone would love. 

Milosevic has started where he left off last year 9 goals in 5 games, Raskin looks more inspired than ever with 5 direct goal involvements in 6 games. The blemish against Oostende could come down to a rested team, but I think their ability to bypass the press and hold onto the ball is the main factor.

A classic in the classic!

Our sheer grit and determination got us over the line here, Anderlecht were by far the better side. That man Milosevic digging us out a hole with a superb hat trick, while there was late drama it was enough to see the job done. 

[SixPointer]

15 minutes ago, Hootieleece said:

Youth Development: Have your top 3 youth players train with the First team but make them available for all Reserve matches. That way you can decide training roles and ppm's and your first team training schedule will benefit them.

ill keep that in mind bud

[warlock]

A strong start!

1 hour ago, SixPointer said:

a Walloon title battle would be quite the spectacle, and something am sure everyone would love

But only if Standard win it, right?

[SixPointer]

1 hour ago, warlock said:

A strong start!

But only if Standard win it, right?

It would be a disaster if the black and whites won it 

[Jogo Bonito]

A great start to the new season. Milosevic was one of the reasons I quit Stuttgart. After four years, Silas left and after nurturing him to be the ready-made replacement, Milosevic insisted on going too. Glad to see he is doing so well for you, even if it reminds me of my missed opportunity. On the young Haaland discussion, I also remember taking him from Molde to Young Boys where I also had Osimhen, Borna Sosa and a few others who went on to do good things. It would be nice if Charleroi keep up that challenge (just like Cercle did in your last season). 

[SixPointer]

1 hour ago, Jogo Bonito said:

A great start to the new season. Milosevic was one of the reasons I quit Stuttgart. After four years, Silas left and after nurturing him to be the ready-made replacement, Milosevic insisted on going too. Glad to see he is doing so well for you, even if it reminds me of my missed opportunity. On the young Haaland discussion, I also remember taking him from Molde to Young Boys where I also had Osimhen, Borna Sosa and a few others who went on to do good things. It would be nice if Charleroi keep up that challenge (just like Cercle did in your last season). 

I think he’s very hit or miss. I haven’t seen many others really going on about the Serbian. Sometimes a player just suits a style, a club a manager. Much like Kulenovic did at SV Ried.

I love how FM players have the inside track. No doubt if you like me your mates who don’t play are sick fed up of you saying I knew about the Viking years ago! Or any other gem that’s came from playing this wonderful game.

I welcome the Charleroi charge!

[Jogo Bonito]

10 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

I think he’s very hit or miss. I haven’t seen many others really going on about the Serbian. Sometimes a player just suits a style, a club a manager. Much like Kulenovic did at SV Ried.

I love how FM players have the inside track. No doubt if you like me your mates who don’t play are sick fed up of you saying I knew about the Viking years ago! Or any other gem that’s came from playing this wonderful game.

I welcome the Charleroi charge!

I like the unknown or less talked about players like that. I like to be ahead of the curve too, yes. I just don't have mates 

The Charlies have signed a good striker this summer so FM24 might be a draw.

[SixPointer]

1 hour ago, Jogo Bonito said:

I like the unknown or less talked about players like that. I like to be ahead of the curve too, yes. I just don't have mates 

The Charlies have signed a good striker this summer so FM24 might be a draw.

You have your SI Forum mates thats all that matters 

[SixPointer]

Champions league meet mr direct counter attack, ohh how do you do.........

[Jogo Bonito]

32 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

You have your SI Forum mates thats all that matters 

Haha, what more could anyone ask for 

[SixPointer]

1 hour ago, Jogo Bonito said:

Haha, what more could anyone ask for 

Amen lad