struggling to create chances

[Hoof-it]

Was reading herne to ti or pi post with west ham. With me struggling recently in game thought i would give it ago. 

Defensively i am quite happy but going forward we dont create nearly enough. Can't get aggressive down right hand

because Coleman is lacking legs and Holgate and godfrey havent got the technical abilty to preform higher up the pitch.

DCL is on Target man s to drop deep and link play, Richarlison IF a to get beyond DCL. Winger s to stretch the play down right hand side

with no full back able to go past reguarly. Left back is on Full back s however mykolenko has get forward whenever possible and 

didn't want him to be too aggressive. The same applies to CM A role between dele and Van de Beek.

[diLLa88]

Ask yourself who in the team should be the one creating the chances, because from the looks of it there is no one quite responsible for doing that, except for maybe the AMR.

The midfield is conservative with largely worker support roles, the Targetman is on support and will therefore probably drop deep quite a bit and the AML is largely aimed towards scoring without much support from other players leaving him quite isolated. FB on support is also not as supportive either for your attacks, as it is one of the more conservative roles for that position. In addition to these conservative roles, the balanced playstyle is also conservative.

Personally I would put the ST on attack role, the AML on Inverted Winger attack and put Donny in a creator role like a CM(a), AP(a). In addition you could try a more offensive role for your fullbacks in home-games.

Could also put Donny on the AMC position and move Allan up next to the BBM for more offensive support and experiment with a more positive mentality in home games.

 

 

[Hoof-it]

Thanks for the reply. I was hoping maybe we would get abit of creativty from mykolenko. Ive seen some really good moves from CM s with Van de beek and Alli making really good runs beyond the striker. AML is the person i wanted to be my main goalscorer which is why i selected inside forward. I can understand your reasoning for upping CM to attack. Is there a reason why you would put the st on attack duty. I thought he would get very isolated up. Also i could probably get more offensive with mykolenko but as stated at RB it would very hard until next summer to get aggressive with no real options there to do that in terms for players

[diLLa88]

1 minute ago, Hoof-it said:

Thanks for the reply. I was hoping maybe we would get abit of creativty from mykolenko. Ive seen some really good moves from CM s with Van de beek and Alli making really good runs beyond the striker. AML is the person i wanted to be my main goalscorer which is why i selected inside forward. I can understand your reasoning for upping CM to attack. Is there a reason why you would put the st on attack duty. I thought he would get very isolated up. Also i could probably get more offensive with mykolenko but as stated at RB it would very hard until next summer to get aggressive with no real options there to do that in terms for players

To have someone present in the box for the AML and AMR (and both fullbacks) to provide crosses in, and with a bit more support from midfield he should not be as isolated.

[Hoof-it]

That makes a fair bit of sense. Thanks for the advice. I'll try that now.

[diLLa88]

1 minute ago, Hoof-it said:

That makes a fair bit of sense. Thanks for the advice. I'll try that now.

Cool, will be interested to see if it changes anything to your results. With regards to Mykolenko, I would give him a more a attacking role on the left side to provide support to Richarlison and leave the right full back on support. Putting him on a more attacking role is more than likely to conflict with the winger on support anyway, and could also provide some more defensive support when you put Donny on a more creative role.

[Johnny Ace]

I think there you could afford to have at least one of the fullbacks on attack, probably on the left to really get up that flank, give the opposition an extra man to deal with. You've mentioned he gets forward but a duty bump up will also increase his mentality, he'll be less about recycling in midfield and more focused on getting forward and making things happen

I really like the TF this year, I think SI have given it a bit of attention, but a lone TF(S) is a bit meh, in a two up top formation, great & I know he's got the IF(A) but apart from that, your team don't really pose much threat. I don't really know DLC that well but I think a DLF(A) here would work well

I think your midfield 3 look a solid set up but if you go changing those I'd discard my above advice 

[Hoof-it]

I did look at DLC as a dlf however with it having take more risks and him having 11 passing i decided against it. Have change mykolenko to a fb a and DCL to TF A and gonna see how that goes. Have had some rough games with it but when you play man city etc in a run not much you can expect. Might get more agressive with Van de beek in the future but still getting great runs from him occassionly.  Might up it to cm A to get more.

[fc.cadoni]

IMHO, setting only a Balanced mentality "and-that-is-it" makes sense that you are struggling creating chances. Be more adventure.  

[Johnny Ace]

2 minutes ago, Hoof-it said:

I did look at DLC as a dlf however with it having take more risks and him having 11 passing i decided against it. Have change mykolenko to a fb a and DCL to TF A and gonna see how that goes. Have had some rough games with it but when you play man city etc in a run not much you can expect. Might get more agressive with Van de beek in the future but still getting great runs from him occassionly.  Might up it to cm A to get more.

See, I like a good old Target Man, just not as a lone striker. They're pretty static (along with the Poacher). I see them more of a role you'd use in 4-4-2 in league 2 or with an AMC close in behind for support.

A DLF is more like a technical Target Man (I should say Forward) and yeah 11 passing isn't amazing but it's not terrible either. Bumping him up to TF(A) is worth a try though for sure    

[Hoof-it]

I will look to DLF s if TF A doesnt work. Thank you to everyone for the advice defo have to be alittle more agressive with in the set up with also so limitations coming from players ie not a decent right back that can go forward.

[GIMN]

2 minutes ago, Hoof-it said:

I will look to DLF s if TF A doesnt work. Thank you to everyone for the advice defo have to be alittle more agressive with in the set up with also so limitations coming from players ie not a decent right back that can go forward.

What's DCL's traits?  I don't have the game to hand at the moment, but I thought he had something like Gets Forward Often, or Tries To Beat Offside Trap.  The kind of trait that means he's not necessarily going to be great in a support role.

[Hoof-it]

All he has is knocks ball past opponents

[herne79]

2 hours ago, Hoof-it said:

Defensively i am quite happy but going forward we dont create nearly enough. Can't get aggressive down right hand

because Coleman is lacking legs and Holgate and godfrey havent got the technical abilty to preform higher up the pitch.

DCL is on Target man s to drop deep and link play, Richarlison IF a to get beyond DCL. Winger s to stretch the play down right hand side

with no full back able to go past reguarly. Left back is on Full back s however mykolenko has get forward whenever possible and 

didn't want him to be too aggressive. The same applies to CM A role between dele and Van de Beek.

This is fantastic, it really is.  You are looking at your player’s abilities and thinking about how they may combine with various roles / duties.  Not everyone does that yet imo it’s one of the most important aspects when building a tactic.

I think there are several things you could try out to help create more.

Mykolenko - don’t be afraid of the Wingback (support) role.  It’s a bit more forward thinking than the fullback role and Mykolenko should have bags of energy to get up and down that flank.

Beek / Alli - even if they do have the get forward often Trait, you could still experiment with an attack duty role.  The Mezzala role or even an Advanced Playmaker role could also be options.  Giving these players the CM(s) role as you have done may be a little too conservative.  With 3 in midfield you can usually afford to take more risk with at least one player because you still have 2 midfielders covering.  You also have a fairly conservative right flank, which again leads me to think an attack duty role on the right of midfield might be a decent option.

Striker - if you have an attacking central midfielder the target man (support) role may turn out to be a good option as you’ll have an extra runner coming up to make use of his knock downs.  CF or DLF are other options with a support duty if the target man isn’t working out - they should have better movement and not be quite so static.

And finally, Pre-Match & Half time team talks and Touchline Shouts - these can be awkward to get right as they tend to be very contextual.  This was one of the aspects I discussed in that original thread and they can be quite useful.  First and foremost, avoid repetition.  Don’t use the same talks all the time, players will get fed up and they’ll switch off.  Before the match begins understand the context of the match.  If you expect a win, tell them just that.  If playing a local rival or in a cup final, pump your fists and tell them to do it for the fans.  If you stand a real chance of losing, tell them no pressure.  Again it’s all contextual, so try to gauge the player’s moods and the importance of the match.

Touchline Shouts during matches can be tricky, so I try to keep it fairly simple.  Goalless after 20 mins?  Encourage.  Goalless after 35 mins?  Fire up.  Same if still goalless after 55 mins.  I concede within the first 10 mins?  Not a word - the game hasn’t settled.  Losing by 2 goals?  Berate.  We score to take a 2 goal lead?  Demand more.  We take a 3 goal lead?  Praise.

Half time - leading by 1 goal?  You can do better.  Leading by 2?  Don't get complacent.  Leading by 3 or more?  Praise.  Drawing or losing at half time I find is more contextual based on the quality of opposition, however I'll tend to just tell them I expect better or have a go at them.

Don’t take that as a “how to” guide though.  As I said it’s all contextual and what may work for me in one match may not have the same effect in another match.  And you may get different reactions anyway because manager vs player personalities and those relationships have an impact.  Don’t be afraid to experiment.

[Hoof-it]

Thank you. Everything you have said i have done before. Where i havent paid attention to my players and tunneled on the roles and duties side with that ive kind of forgot im playing Harry winks for example as a anchor man and wondering why i've lost the game. I finished the season off, we didn't have a great end to the season however with the advice ive got and things i have highlighted. Im going to focus on getting a new right back which is peirre kalulu. Who is still steady not some pure attacking right back. Changed alli into more expansive role in mezzala a. Will change against bigger teams i think to help defense out. Also Mykolenko has gone to a wb s. Can now go in to next season where i can get a pre season in get the morale on top before first game and see where it goes. Also i'll give touchline shouts ago never really used them. see how it affect the game. Again thank you everyone for the tips.

[bababooey]

Hi OP. 

What type of football are you trying to get the team to play? Based on the above screenshot, it looks like you're trying to focus on possession, utilizing the mezzala + inside forward to get into dangerous areas and score goals. I'm not going to say that cannot work, but if I were you, I would look to take advantage of the physicality of the squad.  The reason for this, is because Everton simply aren't up to par with the top clubs in the Premier League.  So you're going to need to find a competitive advantage somewhere, particularly when playing against more talented teams.

Again, I'm not suggesting your idea cannot work, but I think you'll find that Everton will struggle against bigger clubs trying to play with a possession style.

Calvert-Lewin in particular is a guy I would want to ensure is using his physical attributes to his (and your) advantage. I think he would make a fantastic target forward because of his aerial ability. And, if you need to change things, he's very fast, so maybe there are situations where he can look to get in behind the other team.  DCL has poor passing + vision, and so asking him to play as a deep lying forward might not be the optimal choice. Sure, he can hold the ball up really well, but I don't think you want him trying to create chances for others through technical play.  I think he's better off being a "direct" type of forward who plays a very simple passing game and isn't expected to act as a deeper striker. A target forward knocking down balls into the path of an onrushing player would be ideal, IMO.

Given Richarlison's poor vision + passing + crossing, I would look to him to be a goalscorer primarily, and I think you've nailed that already by setting him as an IF-A.  That's a good choice.

You could also play Richarlison up top with DCL, and ask him to play as an advanced forward, while DCL could act as a target forward.  That will give you a direct partnership that could cause trouble for a lot of teams.

Once you get those two guys firing, you'll be in good shape, and you can focus on building the rest of the team.

 

[Hoof-it]

Hello, i'm not really trying to create any style of football. It's more to make the game much less complicated and easier to work out what is the problem. Since the advice everyone has given me season 2 with everton has gone alot better and ive only made one change to the tactic which is mezzala a to mezzala s. I bought a more well rounded full back in kalulu who rotates with holgate. Lo celso to rotate with alli as van de beek left. Masuaku as back up left back. Betteneli and chris wood as back ups to the first team choices aswell. I kept the original tactic up until liverpool where i changed to mezzala support. We look to have hit some kind of stability in preformances. Richarlison is on 9 goals already and he only hit 11 in whole of last season. Again thank you to everyone for the advice it helped loads.

[bababooey]

Looks like you're doing quite well! Good job!  *Also* don't be afraid to try Maximin as winger - attack. He's got so much pace and flair, it would make sense let him loose even more.

Edited April 7, 2022 by bababooey

[Hoof-it]

I do love football manager. Ive not got a clue whats gone on after the Qatar world cup. Kept it the same. I thought i would struggle after xmas cause we had the big boys and i didnt expect to keep the form we had up but we fell into a right slump.  We wasnt free flowing anyway and i was happy with that but we were decent defensively and then well. Lol i got sacked. Cheers everyone for the help. Believe it or not i have learnt a few things about putting things together. Defo got carried away after xmas and just kept spamming continue and not stop and think.

Edited April 7, 2022 by Hoof-it

[Johnny Ace]

Wowzers but fair play at sticking with it 

Still think you should have the DLF on Attack or go crazy with a CF on Attack, they pair nicely with the IF(A). You've got a great base with your defence and midfield setup 

[Hoof-it]

Ah it happens doesnt it. Still a game end of day. I did try it in desperation but i think morale and form was that bad it just didnt work. Defo learnt im way to passive with my attacking options. As stated sometimes i just dont stop and think and analyse kind of blind optimism itll change cause start of season form. When i lost to southampton and norwich i should of stopped and think. 

[Johnny Ace]

25 minutes ago, Hoof-it said:

Ah it happens doesnt it. Still a game end of day. I did try it in desperation but i think morale and form was that bad it just didnt work. Defo learnt im way to passive with my attacking options. As stated sometimes i just dont stop and think and analyse kind of blind optimism itll change cause start of season form. When i lost to southampton and norwich i should of stopped and think. 

Yeah, if you look at it, it's one Attack duty on a Balanced team mentality, needed a bit of grrrr 

[Hoof-it]

Yeah gonna give it another crack with Everton. In the 4231 going to try and be the 90th manager to revive dele alli. Hoping Alii and richarlison can play off calvert lewin with mykolenko providing width may need to be a wb s but starting with full back attack for now. Allan and doucoure should provide a decent base. Second one is more of your suggestion. Putting DCL on DLF a with richarlison still on attack duty. again using mykolenko to overlap. Considering using the mezzala or maybe use a cm on attack but going to try both at some point both defo look more agressive when looking at my previous versions. Also my reasons for staying on balance is i want to learn the game from a base point without going to positive or attacking and learning to deal with higher mentalities on players and balancing that.

Edited April 8, 2022 by Hoof-it

[Johnny Ace]

I wouldn't be playing Dele Alli as a DM 

The 4-2-3-1 is logical, I'm just not convinced it will work in FM, just play it out for a few games and keep your eye on the front 4 and adjust as necessary, I just think DCL is more than a TF(S)  

[Hoof-it]

Yeah he probably is. Its just a starting point but willing to adjust it. Maybe thats where everton are going wrong dele alli is a dm.

[glengarry224]

It looks to me like you need to be more solid defensively.  In your last screenshot, you allowed 28 goals in 16 matches.  Even with Liverpool's attack, you'd have trouble winning consistently, if at all, at that rate.

In the previous screenshot, 14 goals allowed in 15 matches and you did much better.  In your initial post, you allowed 24 in 18 matches.  With inferior talent, I'd target even lower, like 0.5-0.65 goals/game allowed.  When I am the superior team, I want my opponent to come out and play aggressively and try to create chances.

DLF has the PI 'moves into channels' and TF does not.  DLF might work fine with Mez/BBM if the players have good Ant/OTB/Team but because Mez has PIs 'moves into channels' and 'roam from position' and BBM has 'roams' also, they might be crowding into the same spaces.  Also IF might be crowding the same space.  Maybe not but I'd look out for that.

I like the TF/SS combo because SS has 'moves into channels' but TF does not.  I do like the idea of Dele as Mez and Richarlison on the opposite wing as IF.