Youth Intake

[GeoffTaylor]

Apologies if this has been posted in the wrong area or this has been covered elsewhere.  
I am 12 years into a save, doing very well on the game - the only issue I have is that each year my youth intake is either mediocre or poor (half a star or one star at best).

All my facilities are exceptional (or whatever the highest rating is) and my head of youth development i nicked from Barcelona so is very highly rated.

Could anyone advise what I haven’t got right????

[Junkhead]

Who are you playing as? Remember, star ratings are relative to your squad, so if you have a squad full of the best players in the world, exceptional youth will be incredibly rare.

[Platinum]

2 hours ago, GeoffTaylor said:

Apologies if this has been posted in the wrong area or this has been covered elsewhere.  
I am 12 years into a save, doing very well on the game - the only issue I have is that each year my youth intake is either mediocre or poor (half a star or one star at best).

All my facilities are exceptional (or whatever the highest rating is) and my head of youth development i nicked from Barcelona so is very highly rated.

Could anyone advise what I haven’t got right????

What do you mean when you say they are one star at best? One star current ability or one star potential ability?

One thing I notice is that people can overlook players who actually have good potential just because they arent first team ready at 16.

[GeoffTaylor]

Thanks for the responses...I’m managing Bradford but mentioned all facilities are as good as they can be - the 1st team squad has a number of 4/4.5/5 star players.

in terms of the star rating I mentioned - the HOYD gives a star rating on the overall quality of the youth intake.  While I know it is rare to get world class potential players through a youth intake, I generally get a couple of 3 star potentials and that’s it.

 

I would have thought over the few years the facilities have been ‘exceptional’ I would have unearthed at least one player who could make a dent in the first team?  Especially you compare it with other clubs’ (whose facilities are comparable) intake?

[XaW]

Just now, GeoffTaylor said:

Thanks for the responses...I’m managing Bradford but mentioned all facilities are as good as they can be - the 1st team squad has a number of 4/4.5/5 star players.

in terms of the star rating I mentioned - the HOYD gives a star rating on the overall quality of the youth intake.  While I know it is rare to get world class potential players through a youth intake, I generally get a couple of 3 star potentials and that’s it.

 

I would have thought over the few years the facilities have been ‘exceptional’ I would have unearthed at least one player who could make a dent in the first team?  Especially you compare it with other clubs’ (whose facilities are comparable) intake?

One thing to note, the recent additions have made the coach reports much more ambiguous than before. It is to mirror the unknown potential of very young players. So I'd suggest keeping as many as you can afford, and just let them go at 18 if they are still rated very low. At the very least, I'd suggest keeping everyone with 3 star potential, and the great personalities with lower(Professional, Model Professional, Model Citizen, Perfectionist, etc). The latter group because they are more likely to improve, and thus improving the coach report for them.

[Platinum]

28 minutes ago, GeoffTaylor said:

Thanks for the responses...I’m managing Bradford but mentioned all facilities are as good as they can be - the 1st team squad has a number of 4/4.5/5 star players.

in terms of the star rating I mentioned - the HOYD gives a star rating on the overall quality of the youth intake.  While I know it is rare to get world class potential players through a youth intake, I generally get a couple of 3 star potentials and that’s it.

 

I would have thought over the few years the facilities have been ‘exceptional’ I would have unearthed at least one player who could make a dent in the first team?  Especially you compare it with other clubs’ (whose facilities are comparable) intake?

3 star potential players are players that your coaches judge can become good first team players. Anyone thats four stars or above means they have the potential to be the best players in your team. So you already have players who can make a dent in the first team.

 

And as @XaW said, the coaches wont always be correct so players can and often will have higher or lower potential than your coaches think

Edited February 23, 2022 by Platinum

[GeoffTaylor]

Thanks for the replies.  Just for context I have added two screen shots...first shows facilities, second shows youth candidates review stating group of poor quality players - I've never had a year when they havent been poor despite the facilities.... 

 

[XaW]

Just now, GeoffTaylor said:

Thanks for the replies.  Just for context I have added two screen shots...first shows facilities, second shows youth candidates review stating group of poor quality players - I've never had a year when they havent been poor despite the facilities.... 

I can see you are leading the Premier League in April, so I'd guess you have one of the best squads in the world from that. And a 3 star potential will be equal to an average player in your senior squad. So based on that you have quite the good intake, and the top rated player with 3.5 stars is expected to be a bit better than your average player, and that would be a pretty good talent if he reaches that potential. For you to get a 5 star potential player, he would have to more or less be Messi reincarnated.

[GeoffTaylor]

3 minutes ago, XaW said:

I can see you are leading the Premier League in April, so I'd guess you have one of the best squads in the world from that. And a 3 star potential will be equal to an average player in your senior squad. So based on that you have quite the good intake, and the top rated player with 3.5 stars is expected to be a bit better than your average player, and that would be a pretty good talent if he reaches that potential. For you to get a 5 star potential player, he would have to more or less be Messi reincarnated.

Guess so - it does appear that other clubs (man city, man utd etc etc) generally have a better intake each year though.  It'd be nice to get a superstar coming through...!

[XaW]

8 minutes ago, GeoffTaylor said:

Guess so - it does appear that other clubs (man city, man utd etc etc) generally have a better intake each year though.  It'd be nice to get a superstar coming through...!

I *think* I read somewhere that improvements to the facilities, coaching, and recruitment takes some years to give the proper effect, so if you just reached the max, then it might improve as the seasons roll on.

[DBSC]

Give RDF a follow on twitter. He has found great success with youth intakes by getting a HoYD that has the same tactic preference and style as your team. I haven't had a chance to try it but it seems promising.

[turnip]

If you're a Premier League team, just sign them all, stick 'em in your youth squad and check back in a couple of seasons. As others have said, coaches often have a lot of difficulty identifying the best players on Intake Day (this is even more obvious if you're playing with the Editor and can see how wrong they get things). 

With the best facilities possible and great staff, the players with good potential should make a lot of progress, even on a Youth Contract. 

[Bigpole]

19 hours ago, DBSC said:

Give RDF a follow on twitter. He has found great success with youth intakes by getting a HoYD that has the same tactic preference and style as your team. I haven't had a chance to try it but it seems promising.

What is considered great success in his case (I don't follow him, sorry)? According to star ratings in the game, 3 star player is squad player so having 3 or 4 of these in your intake is useful. I always say - if you think 3 stars are 'horrible', check your squad to see who has 3 stars and think if you would discard this player (Origi in Liverpool is a 3 star player for example).

On 23/02/2022 at 20:53, GeoffTaylor said:

Guess so - it does appear that other clubs (man city, man utd etc etc) generally have a better intake each year though.  It'd be nice to get a superstar coming through...!

I hate to use this kind of simpleton thinking but consider this situation - you're a coach in some semi-decent club (like Manchester United or Wolverhampton). The start of the March approaches, and at 9am you coming to this room, where there's maybe 10-15 young boys, aged 15-17.

You see these boys and think - okay, this is the new crop of players from our academy. Let's see what they've got. So you take them to a training ground, do a few sessions, organize 2 or 3 inter-squad games between them or versus your u18. You can see what they are good at, you can see their dedication, their approach towards each other and towards you. Few of them are shining already, they are better then the rest and you start to think - are they capable of becoming a good players? Do they have the desire, mentality and required level of professionalism to get themselves to the top?

Probably yes, probably no. Why you can't tell? Because they are 16 y/o. They haven't played a single senior game. Maybe what you see in a friendly game - this is their top. 

Realistically, there's no chance that you (or scout or hoyd or coach or anyone) could accurately rate 16 year old whether he will be a wonderkid or not. 

You have to develop them for a few years and around 19/20 - you should be able to at least know if he's around first team or international football. 

And we have to remember that 3 star player with good 'spread' of his attributes (like striker with high composure, off the ball, anticipation, finishing) is much better than 4 star all-rounder. That's why Dani Alves is better in right back than Dembele (both have good physicals, decent crossing, good technicals - weird example but I think you get the point).

[DBSC]

8 hours ago, Bigpole said:

What is considered great success in his case (I don't follow him, sorry)?

Multiple five star potential players in portugal for two or more years in a row and many more 4+ star. Also with attributes that compliment the playing style. But it's obviously a small sample size

Edited February 26, 2022 by DBSC

[JimbobWWFC]

In addition to what has already been suggested, I believe your club's reputation is also a factor. Based on your reputation and location, behind the scenes your club could be competing with the likes of Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham to try and get youths to join your setup rather than theirs. So the better your reputation becomes, the better the chance of getting better prospects

[2feet]

On 25/02/2022 at 01:00, DBSC said:

He has found great success with youth intakes by getting a HoYD that has the same tactic preference and style as your team. I

Is this more important than picking a Head of Youth with higher attributes or better Personality?

[Bigpole]

8 hours ago, 2feet said:

Is this more important than picking a Head of Youth with higher attributes or better Personality?

it's important but less important. Personality and working with youngsters are most important (and no, reputation is not important)

[Ultras500]

If you want better youngsters then you need exceptional youth recruitment. There is nothing you can do to influence the PA of a player, just the CA coming in. The CA is influenced by junior coaching and youth facilities.

You are Bradford City, so imagine a radius around Bradford that represents your scouting network. You will only pick up players based inside that radius i.e Players BORN there. The better your network, the larger the radius and the better chance of high PA players coming to Bradford and not Leeds or City/Utd.

You also have poaching. Players are created in the game at X years old. So you have several years youth teams waiting hidden in the pipe lines. HOYD can poach from other teams/nations, just as your players can be poached by other teams.

HoYD can influence intake personalities aswell as positions to fit THEIR tactical style.

Coach reports can be spotty. I play with CA/PA on in the team screen so I know how off the coaches can be. Give young players 6 months 1st team game time and the reports change massively.

Edit - The absolute key to young player development is performances over 7.0 coupled with good training performances. You get both of those and baby you got a stew going on.

One final edit. The HoYD will poach from his scouting knowledge, this is good for getting African wonderkids.

Edited March 28, 2022 by Ultras500

[Thebaker]

I think the biggest problem with the intake in the example given is the wording and stars given by the DOF. For a team near the top of the prem league a youth intake with 3 or 4  potential first teamers (3 star potential) is certainly not poor and 0.5 stars, should be more like good and 3.5 stars.

Also why is the DOF bringing through the players, is he better than your HOYD, what is his judging ability?

[fc.cadoni]

HoYD or DoF must not be judged with the quality about players which bring in the club based only in his/her JPA.

[danej]

This is hilarious. Have never seen a youth intake (preview) half as bad as this one. My infrastructure isn't even that bad, middle of the road.

Edited March 28, 2023 by danej

[XaW]

I have an excellent intake, but most of the players are poor... 

Feels a bit like there is a disconnect between the stars and the ratings, doesn't it?

[danej]

1 hour ago, XaW said:

I have an excellent intake, but most of the players are poor... 

Feels a bit like there is a disconnect between the stars and the ratings, doesn't it?

He, even better yes

[Rashidi]

6 hours ago, danej said:

This is hilarious. Have never seen youth intake (preview) half as bad as this one. My infrastructure isn't even that bad, middle of the road.

That image is common in December, you need to wait for the youth intake to be announced. Then you will see a more accurate report. I’ve never had any issues with producing quality youth players. 
 

Youth recruitment is extremely important, it’s the single biggest driver in my opinion.  Where your club operates, the reputation of your club and the league is also important. If you are in a league like England there are going to be plenty of other clubs they might want to go to.  
 

Your HOYD will affect outliers. Your youth coaching setup and facilities will affect the CA/PA of the players and I have found that the personalities of the youth players is just as important. I keep only the players with the best personalities. 
 

I don’t care about the coaching reports or their star ratings all I am interested in is their personalities. If they have good personalities and if they perform well in youth games they almost always develop well.