Uefa Euro tactics

[TommyToxic]

Any interest in sharing tactics inspired by/based on tactics from the ongoing Euro 2020? I remember reading threads about EC/WC tactics on this forum before, but couldnt find a thread from this tournament.

[jeerinho]

All the teams that use 4-3-3 are dominant in possession, but not necessarily translate to goals.

Denmark started with 4-3-3 against Finland, and failed to score. Then they switched to 3-4-2-1 (same as Belgium) and scored lots of goals without really dominating in possession.

Portugal used a 4-3-3 against Belgium's 3-4-2-1, and dominated possession, but lost.

I think 4-3-3 aren't necessarily bad, it just seems too mainstream and people have learned to counter it.

Edited June 28, 2021 by jeerinho

[FJW]

https://www.rdftactics.com/blog

[julle17]

@jeerinho
Don't think you have watched Denmark closely if thats your assessment of how our shape has been.
Against Belgium we did indeed use a 3-back, but against Russia the majority of the game was played in 4-3-3 with AC pushed into the holding midfield role, after the 3-back not proving too good.
And against Wales the switch from 3-back to 4-3-3 came even faster than against Russia, only the last 15 mins or so was defending in the 3-back but AC still pushed into midfield when we had the ball

[jeerinho]

50 minutes ago, julle17 said:

@jeerinho
Don't think you have watched Denmark closely if thats your assessment of how our shape has been.
Against Belgium we did indeed use a 3-back, but against Russia the majority of the game was played in 4-3-3 with AC pushed into the holding midfield role, after the 3-back not proving too good.
And against Wales the switch from 3-back to 4-3-3 came even faster than against Russia, only the last 15 mins or so was defending in the 3-back but AC still pushed into midfield when we had the ball

Interesting. So Christensen was moving back and forth between DCR and DM. I don't think that's possible in FM. In FM, the libero must be the DC in the middle.

[lfds89]

11 minutes ago, jeerinho said:

Interesting. So Christensen was moving back and forth between DCR and DM. I don't think that's possible in FM. In FM, the libero must be the DC in the middle.

You can check on the UEFA Press Kits: Christensen played the first 15 minutes of the match against Wales as RCB then his average position in each 15 minute interval was always in front of the defence until the 60 minutes, suggesting he played as CDM ; then he played as RCB and CB (after Andersen was subbed in) for the remainder of the match.

[julle17]

23 minutes ago, jeerinho said:

Interesting. So Christensen was moving back and forth between DCR and DM. I don't think that's possible in FM. In FM, the libero must be the DC in the middle.

Yea probably not completely replicable, but could maybe do something with a IWB-d. What i think is very interesting aswell would be to replicate how Mæhle plays as a LWB, kind like a withdrawn winger waiting to get the ball wide isolated to take on a defender in a 1v1, kind like how pep sets up situations for his wingers

[lfds89]

1 hour ago, TommyToxic said:

Any interest in sharing tactics inspired by/based on tactics from the ongoing Euro 2020? I remember reading threads about EC/WC tactics on this forum before, but couldnt find a thread from this tournament.

Nothing too spectacular. Most interesting things I've seen:

Italy almost with 2 DLPs (Jorginho and Locatelli). Difficult to recreate Spinazzola's movement - WB-A / IWB-A ?

Germany with a "false" back 3 - Ginter played too far right and advanced against Portugal, almost like a RB and even on defence, it seemed like Ginter and Kimmich were defending the same space. Nice interchanging between the front 3.

Belgium switching between 3-4-1-2 with De Bruyne (or 3-4-3 with a False 9) and 3-4-3 without him.

France trying to find a way to fit everyone, sometimes playing a 4-3-3 (with Pogba-Kante-Rabiot in line), sometimes resembles more a 4-4-2 with Tolisso wide on the right Mbappe on the left and Griez upfront/AMC.

 

Right now, 4-3-3 seems to be the formation of the tournament: already through are Denmark who played 4-3-3 most of the game, Italy always on 4-3-3 and Czech Republic on 4-3-3. Only Belgium on 3-4-3/3-4-1-2. Trending the WB pushing very high, inverted wingers/inside forwards (Denmark and Italy with a combination of both IW - Damsgaard/Insigne and IF-Braithwaite/Berardi), one deeper midfielder.

On FM terms, I would say

SK-S // FB-A BPD-D BPD-D WB-A // DLP-D // CM-A BBM-S // IF-S IW-S // CF-S. Positive Mentality, Play out of Defence

[jeerinho]

20 hours ago, FJW said:

https://www.rdftactics.com/blog

Superb finding and share

[TommyToxic]

I made a tactic based on Swedens previous matches, and they are playing against Ukraine tonight. 4 goals 4 assists from Forsberg in 7 matches, 6 goals 1 assist from Isak.

Tactic

Spoiler

PIs:

Both Fullbacks: Cross from byline
MR: Take more risk, cross more often, dribble less, pass shorter
MCL: Dribble less, hold position, mark tighter,
ML: Cross less often, sit narrower, roam, pass shorter
STCL: Move into channels, shoot less often.
STCR: PAss shorter, Mark DM position

 

 

OIs
 

Spoiler

 

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2525800466

 

 

[JoOSTAR]

43 minutes ago, TommyToxic said:

I made a tactic based on Swedens previous matches, and they are playing against Ukraine tonight. 4 goals 4 assists from Forsberg in 7 matches, 6 goals 1 assist from Isak.

Tactic

  Hide contents

PIs:

Both Fullbacks: Cross from byline
MR: Take more risk, cross more often, dribble less, pass shorter
MCL: Dribble less, hold position, mark tighter,
ML: Cross less often, sit narrower, roam, pass shorter
STCL: Move into channels, shoot less often.
STCR: PAss shorter, Mark DM position

 

 

OIs
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2525800466

 

 

Match Results?

[TommyToxic]

25 minutes ago, JoOSTAR said:

Match Results?

Steam Link. Only tested the tactic in euros, so not much to judge from.

[kennypavey]

@TommyToxic seems like a nice tactics, but not exactly "the Sweden way", judging by the screenshots. It's not really likely that Sweden would win the possession statistic against Spain and Belgium. I'm no expert, but seems to me that this low block is too aggressive. Sweden does not really play the aggressive low block, but are happy to let the opponent pass around and cross, or take a shot from distance. Then on certain opponent actions (such as mistakes), a player will initiate press, triggering a short spur of intensive press in order to win the ball. Also not sure about the overlap instructions, as the offense is more triggered by quick transitions and/or dribbling and through balls from Forsberg or Kristoffer Olsson. 

How the left midfield playing in this? I am having severe troubles replicating the Forsberg role, as it is basically "do what you like and go where you want" in offense, while really strict in defense. 

[TommyToxic]

28 minutes ago, kennypavey said:

@TommyToxic seems like a nice tactics, but not exactly "the Sweden way", judging by the screenshots. It's not really likely that Sweden would win the possession statistic against Spain and Belgium. I'm no expert, but seems to me that this low block is too aggressive. Sweden does not really play the aggressive low block, but are happy to let the opponent pass around and cross, or take a shot from distance. Then on certain opponent actions (such as mistakes), a player will initiate press, triggering a short spur of intensive press in order to win the ball. Also not sure about the overlap instructions, as the offense is more triggered by quick transitions and/or dribbling and through balls from Forsberg or Kristoffer Olsson. 

Agreed, but I wanted something that actually works. Passive defending in FM21 is suicide.

I like the WM (a) role for Forsberg, because it easy to customize and it worked very well.

[Flußkrebs]

On 28/06/2021 at 18:04, lfds89 said:

Difficult to recreate Spinazzola's movement - WB-A / IWB-A ?

Seems like a clear CWB-A to me, know? Very high and wide in build up, runs into the box to finish moves.

Generally my view is that a) tactics being geared specifically to squads available, b) tactics being highly reactive to opposition and c) tactics being relatively simple (e.g. no highly complex JdP systems) means that Euros recreations are fun but not on the same level as club recreations.

Having said that, England in the group stages were something like:

FBs-BPDd-CDd-FBs

        VOLs-DMd

       IW-AM-IW

              CF

The Declan Rice role could be a DMd/BWMd/Ad/HBd to be honest- he dropped deeper to build in a back three shape in some games. Stones was a BPD in the sense of playing longer raking passes, Maguire does his thing of stepping out with the ball into midfield and playing a pass to someone between the lines.

Mount drifted over to the left hand side a lot so either some PIs or maybe a TQ role. Foden and Sterling played inverted for the most part but stayed wide in build up, so maybe even the winger role for one or both of them could work. And trying to get a read on Harry Kane's role was difficult from the groups due to not actually... doing much?

And then to be honest, pretty default in a lot of the instructions. I'd say balanced mentality (the passive roles means that Cautious would be too much). Counter/Counterpress, pressing set to the medium maybe. Pickford mixed it up, sometimes going long, often building from the back. 

Against Germany, England obviously switched to a back three. I'd be inclined to line them up in a 343 or 3421 shape in FM, but the wingbacks definitely dropped to form a back 5 at times so not sure you could play them as WMs or DWs. They drew heavily in pressing from Tuchel's Chelsea imo (forming a 'pentagon', with a 5 behind them or WBs attached to the German WBs). So Sterling and Saka played variously narrow or wide depending on the ball and player position. That kind of shutting down of passing lanes isn't really doable in as much detail on FM.

Walker was (needlessly imo) doing the IWB thing and moving into midfield in the first half. Then in the second half he instead started doing the Azpilicueta thing and overlapping/underlapping Trippier. Getting that movement requires a lot of hijinks in FM involving lopsided formations. So, a limited recreation might look something like:

             CD-BPD-CD

WBs-DMs(SV?)-DMd-WBs

             IWa-PFs-IFs

You could move the DMs into the CM position for a better FM result. There are also strong arguments to moving the wide players into the AMC slots and maybe having a TQ/SS combo or something similar. When Grealish came on the balance changed, Sterling played as a SSa/IFa on the right I think, Grealish something like a IWs or APs or TQa. Kane shifted to be more aggressive as well.

Ah look, after I'd just explained why I think doing international football recreations (from this Euros at least) is a bit boring, I've ended up doing one anyway   

[kennypavey]

On 30/06/2021 at 10:41, TommyToxic said:

Agreed, but I wanted something that actually works. Passive defending in FM21 is suicide.

I like the WM (a) role for Forsberg, because it easy to customize and it worked very well.

True, my tries have ended in us just being murdered by the good teams and scraping wins against bad opposition.

What would you use as a role for the right wing if you used Claesson/Kulusevski instead of Larsson? My thinking was to use either WM(a) or IW(s). For Claesson I would want to replicate his late movement into the box, which I feel I get with a W(a), but am a bit afraid to leave the right wing exposed.