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Match 35 & 36 France vs Portugal Live from the Ferenc Puskás Stadium (BBC One) & Germany vs Hungary Live from the Allianz Arena (BBC2) thread


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5 hours ago, GunmaN1905 said:

If you want to go to bloody twitter and circlejerk about everything, then go there.

Like what the f-k are any of us on this forum supposed to do with a dozen posts about racism and bombers?

Is that group of Hungarian fans racist? Yes.
Is their leader borderline fascist? Yes.
We all know that, there's nothing to gain from that discussion.

One of the reasons I enjoy this forum is that most people here aren't of the one-dimensional "keep politics out of football hurrr" variety but reflect about the matters where football, politics and culture intersect.

Regarding the 10 bombers, as a German myself I never found the lyrics to be particularly offensive at all, and I'm mostly amused when some drunken idiots think that this would rile up Germans. We have our own far-right hooligan problem, and as far as I'm concerned these guys all deserve each other.

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7 hours ago, PMLF said:

There is Copa América tomorrow (and tonight).

Just need a quick breakdown of each countries political structure and human rights record league table so we can decide who to support ;)

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Venezuela would be popular surely?

 I'd be supporting Colombia because I have friends there who bought me a shirt. Easy choice. ;)

Edited by Wiggins Top Boys
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13 minutes ago, Tikka Mezzala said:

I'll be supporting Uruguay because they have a decent contemporary human rights record and political structure. 

Oh dear, someone didn't see their last election where they have elected *gulp* conservatives for the first time in a long while. As BG would say they've LURCHED MASSIVELY to the far right.

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17 minutes ago, Tikka Mezzala said:

I'll be supporting Uruguay because they have a decent contemporary human rights record and political structure. 

They've been very quietly going about their business as a nation in terms of advancing socioeconomic status, and have some tidy players on the pitch too

But on a serious level, it's often those who have never had to suffer discrimination or a lack of representation who scorn why it's actually really important

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11 minutes ago, Wiggins Top Boys said:

Oh dear, someone didn't see their last election where they have elected *gulp* conservatives for the first time in a long while. As BG would say they've LURCHED MASSIVELY to the far right.

Well, that scuppers my plans then. Venezuela it is! 

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People talk about keeping football as football, wish that had been the case when I was in bermondsey, rather than having my teen years marred by the bigoted Millwall and NF lot around there. Still hate South Bermondsey station even now

You can apply it to most if not all sports, but football reflects society, and it probably does it more than most. It's the biggest sport in the world, it can't help but reflect society, and also be shaped by it

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Apparently both of Benzema's goals came at 46 mins 44s - one in stoppage time in the first half, the other just after the second half started.

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There is a difference between acknowledging the political story behind football and the childish extension of a football team as a government representative side.

I'll use Uruguay, does their general left wing politics matter more to the morality of their football team than their forward who has been banned for racially offensive language and biting other players?

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8 hours ago, GunmaN1905 said:

Sorry about that, I was referring to everyone who just kept posting more or less the same thing over and over again.

Fair enough.

Then everyone who's posting this over and over again should know better than not to generalize.

I'm sure that regular folk in Hungary all love and support Orban, right? He's in charge, so he must be universally loved?
You had the fortune to be born in a country where democracy is at least functional, don't judge people from countries where it's not.
Because fairytales of mass protest or anything similar are just fairytales and never work. Not without massive casualties, at least.

I'm done for the night, sorry if I offended anyone, but I hoped that at least here I can escape all that social media nonsense and talk about football.

No need to apologize at all. Actually good that you spoke out :thup:. I initially stayed silent as I know that there are quite some hotheaded social justice warriors here, but I completely feel the same way. It has been very annoying to see all the fuss surrounding the Germany vs. Hungary game in several threads that constantly needs to be brought up time and time again. I feel the whole thing has been laughable really and I am gay myself ffs. When I watch football, I want to see actual football, not constant virtue signalling. 

56 minutes ago, Wiggins Top Boys said:

Venezuela would be popular surely?

 I'd be supporting Colombia because I have friends there who bought me a shirt. Easy choice. ;)

Haha, absolutely. Socialism!!11!! :D

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Well this has escalated overnight. Just trying to enjoy England’s good fortune with the draw and the fact that it’s definitely coming home now, and you’re all arguing about Hungary’s equality fails and Uruguay’s politics.

Well done lads, way to kill the mood.

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7 minutes ago, The_jagster said:

There is a difference between acknowledging the political story behind football and the childish extension of a football team as a government representative side.

I'll use Uruguay, does their general left wing politics matter more to the morality of their football team than their forward who has been banned for racially offensive language and biting other players?

That football team was itself being used as in a political game, so tbf the lines are very blurred in that one. Part of the reason UEFA didn't upset Hungary is because they were going to potentially move the semi finals and final there. Football and politics forever intertwined. 

But could be worse, could be talking about Grealish. Again.

 

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5 minutes ago, Rob1981 said:

Well this has escalated overnight. Just trying to enjoy England’s good fortune with the draw and the fact that it’s definitely coming home now, and you’re all arguing about Hungary’s equality fails and Uruguay’s politics.

Well done lads, way to kill the mood.

Tbf, no one is seriously arguing about Uruguayan politics. :D

 

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9 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

That football team was itself being used as in a political game, so tbf the lines are very blurred in that one. Part of the reason UEFA didn't upset Hungary is because they were going to potentially move the semi finals and final there. Football and politics forever intertwined. 

But could be worse, could be talking about Grealish. Again.

 

Well sure, but didn't Gulasci release a statement in favour of equality once the law came in? The mayor of Budapest is one of Orban's bigger opponents according to Football Weekly so the crowd are presumably more likely to be anti-Orban unless the city's residents avoid the stadium.

Our government is right wing but one of our squad campaigned against it. I just think there is nuance being missed when cheering their elimination with glee. Football doesn't have to either be 0% political or 100% political.

Edit: this is also a German side who was criticised for racial bias/discrimination when two players were supportive (very personally in one case) with OTF favourite Erdogan.

Edited by The_jagster
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7 minutes ago, The_jagster said:

Well sure, but didn't Gulasci release a statement in favour of equality once the law came in? The mayor of Budapest is one of Orban's bigger opponents according to Football Weekly so the crowd are presumably more likely to be anti-Orban unless the city's residents avoid the stadium.

Our government is right wing but one of our squad campaigned against it. I just think there is nuance being missed when cheering their elimination with glee. Football doesn't have to either be 0% political or 100% political.

Yeah, its never binary, at all. I think it's more taking Hungary out was being seen as taking away Orbans drive to be welcomed, either way that ship has sailed and he's clearly welcomed by UEFA.

Yeah mayor is anti Orban, and anti Blackshirts, but not huge amounts he or residents can do because you don't **** with Orban, not that he doesn't try to do things anyway 

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1 minute ago, Marius_R said:

This really.

People were calling the Hungary team "nazis" last night ffs, and on multiple occasions. And why? Because of a minority of idiots that create trouble everywhere they go. They're 26 players representing their country, not Orban, not the Hungarian governement. They didn't come out with shirts supporting Orban or the recently passed anti-LGBT law, to have people rip into them, they, I say again, represented ther country in a European Championship. And as someone that has spent his entire lifetime living together with Hungarian ethnics, I can tell you they were damn proud of doing that, and the behavior of their dickhead ultras and their joke of a governement shouldn't be held against them.

 

 

I'd agree with that, Gulasci could have kept quiet but went and made a clear point. 

I also wonder how much of it is actually a frustration that UEFA bottled it slightly, and that's been aimed at Hungary

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7 minutes ago, Marius_R said:

This really.

People were calling the Hungary team "nazis" last night ffs, and on multiple occasions. And why? Because of a minority of idiots that create trouble everywhere they go. They're 26 players representing their country, not Orban, not the Hungarian governement. They didn't come out with shirts supporting Orban or the recently passed anti-LGBT law, to have people rip into them, they, I say again, represented ther country in a European Championship. And as someone that has spent his entire lifetime living together with Hungarian ethnics, I can tell you they were damn proud of doing that, and the behavior of their dickhead ultras and their joke of a governement shouldn't be held against them.

 

 

Hear hear.

The nazi comments were disgraceful. Some people want to be seen on the right side so badly they overcompensate and get it badly wrong

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2 hours ago, Wiggins Top Boys said:

Venezuela would be popular surely?

 I'd be supporting Colombia because I have friends there who bought me a shirt. Easy choice. ;)

I’ve got a Colombia shirt with Falcao on the back that I wore at the World Cup 2014. And then he didn’t even play :D 

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14 minutes ago, Weezer said:

I’ve got a Colombia shirt with Falcao on the back that I wore at the World Cup 2014. And then he didn’t even play :D 

Same actually. I loved him at Atletico. 

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9 minutes ago, Tikka Mezzala said:

Same actually. I loved him at Atletico. 

Made me a lot of new Colombian friends when I wore it to games.

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1 hour ago, Wiggins Top Boys said:

Hear hear.

The nazi comments were disgraceful. Some people want to be seen on the right side so badly they overcompensate and get it badly wrong

Tbf your reply wasn't great either. Don't think either Hungary nor Germany should be referred to as Nazis

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45 minutes ago, Weezer said:

Made me a lot of new Colombian friends when I wore it to games.

They weren’t Colombians, they just wanted your stash of coke

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1 hour ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Tbf your reply wasn't great either. Don't think either Hungary nor Germany should be referred to as Nazis

I mean it was clearly a joke in response to how stupid the post was

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Just now, Tikka Mezzala said:

Insufferable righties! :D

Oof! I'll take the light hearted jibe for what it is, but please, I am a boring lib dem centrist that would make Kier Starmer look interesting

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2 hours ago, Wiggins Top Boys said:

Hear hear.

The nazi comments were disgraceful. Some people want to be seen on the right side so badly they overcompensate and get it badly wrong

Who wants to be on the right side? Left is where it's at! 

Right and wrong it's all the same to me
Thick as thieves as far as I can see
They are leeches all
(Architects)

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20 minutes ago, Wiggins Top Boys said:

Oof! I'll take the light hearted jibe for what it is, but please, I am a boring lib dem centrist that would make Kier Starmer look interesting

Yer awright in my books, Wiggins! 

I have no excuses. I am indeed an insufferable leftie. Well, I'm actually more mild mannered than a lot of my contemporaries. A bit too sarky sometimes, admittedly. But I'm definitely not the wee arsehole I was years ago, challenging every **** that was to the right of Kropotkin. I've even read some Edmund Burke and John Stuart Mill since then :D

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12 minutes ago, DJ said:

Who wants to be on the right side? Left is where it's at! 

Right and wrong it's all the same to me
Thick as thieves as far as I can see
They are leeches all
(Architects)

DJ is a leftie! Noted. :D

 

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3 hours ago, Rob1981 said:

Well this has escalated overnight. Just trying to enjoy England’s good fortune with the draw and the fact that it’s definitely coming home now, and you’re all arguing about Hungary’s equality fails and Uruguay’s politics.

Well done lads, way to kill the mood.

giphy.gif

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1 hour ago, SouthCoastRed said:

They weren’t Colombians, they just wanted your stash of coke

Everybody knows Bolivia has the best coke anyway.

Source: A Bolivian 

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