The Jack Grealish (and occasionally England) Thread: It's coming home attempt 5782570

[themadsheep2001]

I'd start Walker or Tripper over either TAA and James anyway, both very comfortable tucking in as inverted full backs or playing traditionally. 

Actually think England can take a lot from that city 17-18 side when playing 4-3-3, in terms of overloading midfield. And the midfield is much more important than the near pointless debate about right backs

[Wiggins Top Boys]

433 please, trippier at RB

[brett.spurs]

48 minutes ago, EnterUsernameHere said:

I just find how he's judged to be laughably wrong.

In what sense? Pretty much everyone agrees that he's quality on the ball but defensively questionable. What's laughable about that? Where do you think he ranks defensively amongst the four right backs?

Edited May 31, 2021 by brett.spurs

[EnterUsernameHere]

14 minutes ago, brett.spurs said:

In what sense? Pretty much everyone agrees that he's quality on the ball but defensively questionable. What's laughable about that? Where do you think he ranks defensively amongst the four right backs?

I already said, I think he's the best of them defensively, or at least not noticeably inferior. They all have a mistake in them, but none are someone other teams can really target as a massive weak link (despite what people say about Trent).

[Rob1981]

I would have Trippier in the starting lineup for his dead balls alone.  So many goals from set pieces at big tournaments.

[Marc Albrighton]

Maybe Southgate knows that its "Scouse first, English second" and so Trent wont care anyway?

[Baptista_8]

7 minutes ago, Rob1981 said:

I would have Trippier in the starting lineup for his dead balls alone.  So many goals from set pieces at big tournaments.

I mean surely that would be Trent

[XuluBak]

FWIW, taken from fbref.com...

Option A

Spoiler

Option B

Spoiler

Option C

Spoiler

Option D

Spoiler

 

 

[brett.spurs]

37 minutes ago, EnterUsernameHere said:

I already said, I think he's the best of them defensively, or at least not noticeably inferior. They all have a mistake in them, but none are someone other teams can really target as a massive weak link (despite what people say about Trent).

Did Madrid not target him? Seemed like their entire game plan on the night was to get the ball to his side and run at him ... and it worked. I've not seen another FB struggle as badly against Sterling this season in the way that TAA did at Anfield either.

[EnterUsernameHere]

4 minutes ago, brett.spurs said:

Did Madrid not target him? Seemed like their entire game plan on the night was to get the ball to his side and run at him ... and it worked. I've not seen another FB struggle as badly against Sterling this season in the way that TAA did at Anfield either.

Yeah over the past 3 seasons he's had a couple of months where you could target him, both those games were in that slump along with a couple of other games.

Generally, not true before or after.

[XuluBak]

1 hour ago, EnterUsernameHere said:

I already said, I think he's the best of them defensively, or at least not noticeably inferior. They all have a mistake in them, but none are someone other teams can really target as a massive weak link (despite what people say about Trent).

Conversely, I'd say they're all targetable. TAA probably the most of the four, but that's largely because of his role within a system. He also offers more going forward than the other three combined, so...idk, seems like that might be useful to have around. 

[adhikapp]

If Trent's defending is anywhere near as relentless as Liverpool fans defending him, there's no way Southgate's cutting him from the squad.

[ryan045]

D-Day. Whatever happens today I’ll be putting my club alliances behind me. Time to see what the Euro 20/21 winning squad looks like. 🏆 

[pearcey_90]

I like James, but I really do think people have gone overboard in elevating him higher then he is. Guy has been playing RWB in a 5 to start off with, so straight away you are far less exposed defensively then in a single RB in a 4. Then it’s all ‘done it in UCL final’, like Trent hasn’t done that and more already  

Said it before Southgate stance with dropping TAA in March was weird, and it’s backed himself into a corner where he has to leave him out now as a result. Agree with TMS it shouldn’t be deciding factor to if we do well or not, but it does go towards the continued poor decisions by Southgate that will see us fail. 

[Baptista_8]

He doesn't have to leave him out at all. Southgate has extremely weird reasoning for stuff which you're right, could end up costing us.

Anyway, what time's the squad out?

Edited June 1, 2021 by Baptista_8

[Coulthard's Jaw]

Saka in surely.

[pearcey_90]

Lingz.

[Coulthard's Jaw]

OK Saka must surely be in the squad.

[pearcey_90]

Lingz left out  

[arenaross]

Well at least Southgate has got that right. 

[BigV]

3 minutes ago, arenaross said:

Well at least Southgate has got that right. 

Linagrd is a tourney player, always shows up and is versatile across the front 3. 

Not exactly the correct decision. 

[oche balboa]

Lingard wont be playing if he was selected too many better players then him.

[pearcey_90]

Wonder if Greenwood was omitted from original squad, then just withdrawn with injury after he was asked to stay around for at least the first friendly?

[oche balboa]

30 minutes ago, Coulthard's Jaw said:

Saka in surely.

Saka would have been in the top 10 names i would choose. The kid is class and can play in more then one position

[arenaross]

4 minutes ago, BigV said:

Linagrd is a tourney player, always shows up and is versatile across the front 3. 

Not exactly the correct decision. 

Lingard is getting nowhere near the first team so no point taking him. It’s not like we’re short on forward options.

[Coulthard's Jaw]

10 minutes ago, BigV said:

Linagrd is a tourney player, always shows up and is versatile across the front 3. 

Not exactly the correct decision. 

There's a debate to be had about whether he should be in there on ability, but he's played in one tournament in his career, feels a bit soon to be describing him as a tourney player?

[themadsheep2001]

2 hours ago, pearcey_90 said:

I like James, but I really do think people have gone overboard in elevating him higher then he is. Guy has been playing RWB in a 5 to start off with, so straight away you are far less exposed defensively then in a single RB in a 4. Then it’s all ‘done it in UCL final’, like Trent hasn’t done that and more already  

Said it before Southgate stance with dropping TAA in March was weird, and it’s backed himself into a corner where he has to leave him out now as a result. Agree with TMS it shouldn’t be deciding factor to if we do well or not, but it does go towards the continued poor decisions by Southgate that will see us fail. 

I don't think he's back himself into a corner tbf, he just has different reasoning. I'd have him in the 23, but ultimately I'm not fussed either way, because the system id like to see us play to get the best from the side, doesn't necessarily get the best from TAA or have him in the 23

[themadsheep2001]

3 minutes ago, pearcey_90 said:

Wonder if Greenwood was omitted from original squad, then just withdrawn with injury after he was asked to stay around for at least the first friendly?

Yeah, sounds like it could involve minor surgery. If he's not actually got a major involvement, let him get treated properly

[BigV]

6 minutes ago, arenaross said:

Lingard is getting nowhere near the first team so no point taking him. It’s not like we’re short on forward options.

Ofc but a great bench player to have and offers something different than the other traditional attacking players. Not sure whom he takes place of though.

6 minutes ago, Coulthard's Jaw said:

There's a debate to be had about whether he should be in there on ability, but he's played in one tournament in his career, feels a bit soon to be describing him as a tourney player?

Agreed but I was talking about his overall tourney experience inc younger years/qualifiers and lead up to them with that weird thing they introduced a while ago (forgot its name). Barely had a bad game playing for internationals and is usually counted upon for big occassions. Given internationals are mainly about morale and feel good nature more so then playing week in and week out, he'd also be good around the "kids"

[Rob1981]

Not until 5pm.

[pearcey_90]

We'll know by like midday'ish anyway  

[Darius1998]

Just in case TAA doesn't go, it might help him in the long-term anyway. Could take the summer off and get some rest. Then next season, if he continues to play at top form, he will be probably end up being pretty much undroppable for the World Cup next year.

[PaulHartman71]

Surely Greenwood wouldn’t have gone anyway 

[bigdunk]

22 minutes ago, PaulHartman71 said:

Surely Greenwood wouldn’t have gone anyway 

He was certainly in my list of 26 (from the 33 man squad anyway).  If I was picking the squad, I'd be loading up with attackers who can change games.  You pick your back 4 (or 5) and don't really change it, but you're probably throwing on at least 3 or 4 attacking or midfield subs every game.  I don't see the point in taking like 3 right backs, or 5 centre halves - you're never going to use them barring an absolutely disastrous run of injuries (at which point you're probably screwed anyway). 

[themadsheep2001]

9 minutes ago, bigdunk said:

He was certainly in my list of 26 (from the 33 man squad anyway).  If I was picking the squad, I'd be loading up with attackers who can change games.  You pick your back 4 (or 5) and don't really change it, but you're probably throwing on at least 3 or 4 attacking or midfield subs every game.  I don't see the point in taking like 3 right backs, or 5 centre halves - you're never going to use them barring an absolutely disastrous run of injuries (at which point you're probably screwed anyway). 

Yeah Greenwood was on my 26 for that reason, but I'm not sure that was Southgate's reasoning. Given that Rashford is also carrying an injury and still going, sounds like Greenwood was going to play a bit part at best

[ryan045]

41 minutes ago, PaulHartman71 said:

Surely Greenwood wouldn’t have gone anyway 

I’d have taken him. Every time I watch United he seems to score, most of the times out of nothing. But you can tell Southgate has his favourites boys... DCL being one of them. 

[Coulthard's Jaw]

A squad of 26 means you can overload every position doesn't it?

[bigdunk]

6 minutes ago, ryan045 said:

I’d have taken him. Every time I watch United he seems to score, most of the times out of nothing. But you can tell Southgate has his favourites boys... DCL being one of them. 

Greenwood and DCL are completely different players, they're not competing for the same spot. DCL is the closest cover for Kane we have, Greenwood is one of the wingers/wide-forwards with Foden, Sancho, Sterling etc.

DCL has a significantly better goals-per-90mins rate than Greenwood this season anyway though, if that's your yardstick.

[craigcwwe]

I think Greenwood would've make the 26.

[adhikapp]

1 hour ago, ryan045 said:

I’d have taken him. Every time I watch United he seems to score, most of the times out of nothing. But you can tell Southgate has his favourites boys... DCL being one of them. 

If Southgate were only picking his favorites, he'd have Dier, Ox, and possibly a cheeky Delph in the squad. Also Lingard wouldn't be cut too.

Think he might've had Greenwood ahead of Saka but now Saka is definitely in.

[enigmatic]

1 hour ago, bigdunk said:

Greenwood and DCL are completely different players, they're not competing for the same spot. DCL is the closest cover for Kane we have, Greenwood is one of the wingers/wide-forwards with Foden, Sancho, Sterling etc.

DCL has a significantly better goals-per-90mins rate than Greenwood this season anyway though, if that's your yardstick.

Think Greenwood's best chance of significant minutes was probably in a front two with Kane in one of those games where we end up completely in control except for an inability to shoot rather than replacing specialist wide men who are better in wide areas.

But yeah, don't think he was ever ahead of DCL, even in that situation.

[ryan045]

1 hour ago, bigdunk said:

Greenwood and DCL are completely different players, they're not competing for the same spot. DCL is the closest cover for Kane we have, Greenwood is one of the wingers/wide-forwards with Foden, Sancho, Sterling etc.

DCL has a significantly better goals-per-90mins rate than Greenwood this season anyway though, if that's your yardstick.

I don’t think Greenwood was ahead either. But I do think he’s a better option off the bench than DCL. Which is why I would have him. (Kane will start every game)

[craigcwwe]

 

 

[Haguey]

In-out-in-out, shake it all about

[Coulthard's Jaw]

TWIST

[bigdunk]

1 hour ago, ryan045 said:

I don’t think Greenwood was ahead either. But I do think he’s a better option off the bench than DCL. Which is why I would have him. (Kane will start every game)

Yeah, Greenwood is definitely more useful off the bench, but you've got to have cover for Kane.  If he gets injured and we're starting someone like Rashford or Greenwood up front, it completely changes the way we play.  Like I said, I'd have both of them in the squad - they're much more useful than a 3rd right back or a 5th centre half.

[adhikapp]

1 minute ago, bigdunk said:

Yeah, Greenwood is definitely more useful off the bench, but you've got to have cover for Kane.  If he gets injured and we're starting someone like Rashford or Greenwood up front, it completely changes the way we play.  Like I said, I'd have both of them in the squad - they're much more useful than a 3rd right back or a 5th centre half.

Looks like England might even have a 4th right back in the squad

[skybluedave]

Hang on, but somebody legit tweeted yesterday that he was getting dropped in favour of Rhys James and Kevin Trippier?

[Haguey]

2 minutes ago, skybluedave said:

Hang on, but somebody legit tweeted yesterday that he was getting dropped in favour of Rhys James and Kevin Trippier?

Nothing sells clicks like outraged scouse tears.

[Gazza D]

If Kevin Trippier makes it but Kieran doesn't then Gareth has lost the plot.

Edited June 1, 2021 by Gazza D