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A Simple Build, Evolution Leading to Success, Back Three Special


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Great post and good analysis of your squad. I also like the decisions you made about your tactics. It looks quite simple, but is well thought out.

Btw, I always wondered how to create those GIF's. Maybe someone can PM me to not disturb this thread.

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2 minutes ago, CARRERA said:

Great post and good analysis of your squad. I also like the decisions you made about your tactics. It looks quite simple, but is well thought out.

Btw, I always wondered how to create those GIF's. Maybe someone can PM me to not disturb this thread.

Thanks man.

i just wanted to show that it can be easy to get caught up in it all and get overwhelmed going back to basics can always help.

The second build should be far behind when things get a little more interesting and I’ll disclose my set piece routines. Before a do the final picture of the super system they became. 
 

in terms of GIF I use gyazo. Very easy to use but you need to pay 

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1 minute ago, halfspace3000 said:

Very cool thread , hope to see more of the evolution

Thanks! Hopefully tomorrow I’ll have the second title season written up with the evolution into a more attacking shape  

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1 hour ago, coach vahid said:

Happy to see you open a new thread. Always a pleasure to read you. 

Thanks very much. A different idea than doing recreation this time. As much as I enjoyed Atalanta it required a lot of external research. This time I thought I would show how i grow and tune my tactics rather than just building. 

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Brilliant write up.

I also really enjoyed your Atalanta recreation. They’re one of my favourite sides to watch in real life but it’s cool to see the journey you’ll be going on here too. Especially how your overload to isolate has been so effective with the amount of assists and goals coming from those areas. 
 

Do you think perhaps a modified version of this would work in the lower leagues? I’m currently implementing a counter attacking style in the 6th Tier in England mostly using a 4-4-2 or 5-3-2 but I’m often winning by just a goal and the games are very tight. Tempted to take some elements from here and see if it can be done! 
 

 

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1 hour ago, Fantasista10 said:

Brilliant write up.

I also really enjoyed your Atalanta recreation. They’re one of my favourite sides to watch in real life but it’s cool to see the journey you’ll be going on here too. Especially how your overload to isolate has been so effective with the amount of assists and goals coming from those areas. 
 

Do you think perhaps a modified version of this would work in the lower leagues? I’m currently implementing a counter attacking style in the 6th Tier in England mostly using a 4-4-2 or 5-3-2 but I’m often winning by just a goal and the games are very tight. Tempted to take some elements from here and see if it can be done! 
 

 

The easy answer is try it out. Am a firm believer that the game is fluid and there is no set in stone rules. Of course there is things you shouldn’t do and things that won’t work. But the true beauty of it all is you can often put your own spin on things much like real life. If we all followed the rules football would be boring and there would be no innovation. Imagine being Chris wilder getting promoted then using overlapping cb’s people would call that insane but the first year it caught so many people of guard.

I will explain more detail later as I link the tactics all into a big system but the most crucial thing in tactics is looking at the system as a whole rather just specific parts.

you say your using counter attacking So elements of the system will work for you but only if you have the right players. Hence why I showed the bit on comparison of my team in the league.

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I do like how simple you've made this tactic.  It's not a simple tactic, just simply done.  It means you can apply the general ideas to a lot of different playing and personnel situations. I used to put in so many instructions and micro-manage, but it often works so much better to figure out how you want to play, then set up roles and general TI's to allow the players you have to play the way you want them to.

Looking forward to going deep into this tactic.

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5 minutes ago, 13th Man said:

I do like how simple you've made this tactic.  It's not a simple tactic, just simply done.  It means you can apply the general ideas to a lot of different playing and personnel situations. I used to put in so many instructions and micro-manage, but it often works so much better to figure out how you want to play, then set up roles and general TI's to allow the players you have to play the way you want them to.

Looking forward to going deep into this tactic.

Couldn’t agree more. One of the biggest problems with most tactics is the use of unnecessary amounts of team instructions which are often contradictory of one and other and the desired style of play. When it comes to team instructions I don’t add them unless I’m trying to create some very specific that the mentality doesn’t give me. 

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Great write up. 

I've been playing around with a 3-5-2 in my current save and while I've significantly exceeded expectations (promoted with Holstein Kiel first season/6th in the Bundesliga the next) I never really feel in control at all. I have one of the lowest possession percentages and find the wingbacks are constantly running down cul-de-sacs because of limited passing options. 

 

I have a pretty decent squad for the league now and had hoped that we'd hold onto the ball better and create more chances but I feel I'm going to have to change things up fairly significantly if I want to make that next step. I'm at a bit of a loss on what to do they currently. 

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39 minutes ago, warlock said:

Thanks for taking the time to write it :thup:. Enjoyable and informative - great stuff!

Thanks. The third episode is on route. It’s more short and sweet but more of a easier read to help aid ideas 

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1 minute ago, causeforconcern said:

Great write up. 

I've been playing around with a 3-5-2 in my current save and while I've significantly exceeded expectations (promoted with Holstein Kiel first season/6th in the Bundesliga the next) I never really feel in control at all. I have one of the lowest possession percentages and find the wingbacks are constantly running down cul-de-sacs because of limited passing options. 

 

I have a pretty decent squad for the league now and had hoped that we'd hold onto the ball better and create more chances but I feel I'm going to have to change things up fairly significantly if I want to make that next step. I'm at a bit of a loss on what to do they currently. 

It sounds like you maybe need a few tweaks. Without knowing your squad, you possibly need add a little more technical players who keep the ball well. You sound like you also need a few tactical tweaks maybe shuffle a couple of TI’s around. Personally I wouldn’t  rip it up and start again as what you’ve done has been successful so far. But as your reputation grows your tactic also has to. 

I didn’t do away with the first league title tactic it’s still there and comes back into play later on with a small spin on it and possibly becomes one of the most effective thought out tactics I’ve made. so don’t discard your already working tactic just try refine it and solve the issues you are seeing. 

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11 minutes ago, SixPointer said:

It sounds like you maybe need a few tweaks. Without knowing your squad, you possibly need add a little more technical players who keep the ball well. You sound like you also need a few tactical tweaks maybe shuffle a couple of TI’s around. Personally I wouldn’t  rip it up and start again as what you’ve done has been successful so far. But as your reputation grows your tactic also has to. 

I didn’t do away with the first league title tactic it’s still there and comes back into play later on with a small spin on it and possibly becomes one of the most effective thought out tactics I’ve made. so don’t discard your already working tactic just try refine it and solve the issues you are seeing. 

Yeah, I'd absolutely like to persevere with the shape as wingerless tactics have always been something I've gravitated towards since I started playing management games.

I just hate the inconsistentency I'm currently seeing- we'll beat a mid table side and look decent and then get completely outplayed by some of the worst sides in the league despite having significantly better players. It's no different in Europe either- I thrashed a very good Atalanta 3-0 and then needed a 90th min equaliser to beat an awful PAOK at home after being dominated by them. 

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19 minutes ago, causeforconcern said:

Yeah, I'd absolutely like to persevere with the shape as wingerless tactics have always been something I've gravitated towards since I started playing management games.

I just hate the inconsistentency I'm currently seeing- we'll beat a mid table side and look decent and then get completely outplayed by some of the worst sides in the league despite having significantly better players. It's no different in Europe either- I thrashed a very good Atalanta 3-0 and then needed a 90th min equaliser to beat an awful PAOK at home after being dominated by them. 

Is there any pattern with the inconsistency? Is it home/away games? Is it when you come up against a certain system or style? Do you lose goals at certain times in games? Do you lose certain types of goals? All things to look out for to try and solve the issue. 

Top tip for this is to watch back game highlights after, because you know the result it allows you to focus more closely on the finer details that could be going wrong, as you don’t have the pressure of trying to alter the result. 

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The second episode didn't disappoint! Great stuff :applause:

I really like how you evolved your tactic (and playing squad) without forgetting your principles/original style. I must say I've never been brave enough to try a 3 striker system but seeing your success with it is inspiring. 

Thanks for sharing your set piece set ups too - I've have relative success with my own routines but could definitely do with a Plan B (or even Plan C) in those tightly contested games. 

Looking forward to part three :thup:

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3 minutes ago, Fantasista10 said:

The second episode didn't disappoint! Great stuff :applause:

I really like how you evolved your tactic (and playing squad) without forgetting your principles/original style. I must say I've never been brave enough to try a 3 striker system but seeing your success with it is inspiring. 

Thanks for sharing your set piece set ups too - I've have relative success with my own routines but could definitely do with a Plan B (or even Plan C) in those tightly contested games. 

Looking forward to part three :thup:

Thanks very much I really appreciate the support.

I would much rather evolve a system rather than start a fresh due to a few factors.

Rarely do you see managers change an overall philosophy, Sean Dyche isn't all of a sudden going to change from direct counter attacking to Tiki-Taka. He may tweak his system slightly, depending on players availability and opposition. But his core principle of being hard to beat and playing direct won’t change greatly. He may play slightly higher against weaker teams or slightly lower against stronger teams. Episode 3 is about this aspect of my tactics. 

I also have built a squad tailored to my style of high tempo football with quick transitions designed to catch the opponent of guard. if I changed the core principle to that I would have to rebuild my squad vastly. I am not stating this can’t be done cause of course I could go Burnley and slowly transition them into possession-based team, but it takes time.

Also the original tactic worked it just needed to evolve with the times after winning a league title and teams uncovering my plans. There was no need to start a fresh like I did after the first two seasons.

 

 

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Really cool seeing this in depth breakdown of your 3 striker system and how your instructions pulled the outside strikers out to the flanks when defending while still having their attacking threat and presence in the box.  The the center back stepping up as a stopper it sometimes had the look of a 4-3-3 when you play it like that but with a bit more brawn from the central defender rather than a DM and the forwards being more specifically central.

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7 hours ago, 13th Man said:

Really cool seeing this in depth breakdown of your 3 striker system and how your instructions pulled the outside strikers out to the flanks when defending while still having their attacking threat and presence in the box.  The the center back stepping up as a stopper it sometimes had the look of a 4-3-3 when you play it like that but with a bit more brawn from the central defender rather than a DM and the forwards being more specifically central.

Thanks again! The strikers movements worked well especially when man marking fullbacks it made for a perfect counter if we could find them with the diagonal balls over the full back quickly after turning over. The stopper did move into midfield on occasion to snap in and win the ball. 

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Be a slight delay on the 4th and final instalment. Works busy again and it’s a sizeable post that I want to get perfect please just bare with me hopefully get it rounded off quicker than expected hopefully Sunday night. 

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