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Invincible team downed by fenerbache. I need help.


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I play an attacking 4-2-3-1 with Dortmund on an online save with my friends and i managed to take it all the way to mid February without losing in season 2 yet in recent months games have become progressively harder and i eventually lost to the rather easy champions league draw in the first leg 3-2 and i got off very lightly. It was total domination, players of mine where complacent while losing and drawing (is that a bug where they hadn't realised the importance of the match?) and i was very lucky to get away goals. I will attach my tactic that i used. It has been so domiant but has recently become weaker and weaker to the point where i am scraping results. My players were not defending at all and were just completely letting them attack and then ignoring my tiki taka tactics by just punting the ball away instantly. Any ideas of what i can improve? i switch to the 4-4-2 in times of need and it normally serves me well, but not today.

Football Manager 2021 Xbox Edition 27_04_2021 21_24_14.png

Football Manager 2021 Xbox Edition 27_04_2021 21_24_23.png

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5 minutes ago, StayFrosty said:

I play an attacking 4-2-3-1 with Dortmund on an online save with my friends and i managed to take it all the way to mid February without losing in season 2 yet in recent months games have become progressively harder and i eventually lost to the rather easy champions league draw in the first leg 3-2 and i got off very lightly. It was total domination, players of mine where complacent while losing and drawing (is that a bug where they hadn't realised the importance of the match?) and i was very lucky to get away goals. I will attach my tactic that i used. It has been so domiant but has recently become weaker and weaker to the point where i am scraping results. My players were not defending at all and were just completely letting them attack and then ignoring my tiki taka tactics by just punting the ball away instantly. Any ideas of what i can improve? i switch to the 4-4-2 in times of need and it normally serves me well, but not today.

Football Manager 2021 Xbox Edition 27_04_2021 21_24_14.png

Football Manager 2021 Xbox Edition 27_04_2021 21_24_23.png

That doesn't really sound like primarily a tactics issue then. If I was making changes, I'd make sure I had a defensive role in CM (and probably not a BWMd at that), and some more variation between the stratas e.g. a winger on support but a fallback on attack, or one striker supporting the other, as well as reconsidering the extremely high tempo on top of attacking mentality. But moreover it does sound like a motivation issue. It's not a bug that they're complacent - they think they'll beat Fenerbache easily and don't really bother putting in the commitment needed. Perhaps a matter of too much praise when they were winning, overly singing their praises in the media, and just a natural result of how much they won. It won't turn things around immediately because it's a longer-term impact, but it might be worth being more critical of poor performances especially if their personalities can handle it, even if you do win the match - reassert your expectations of them.

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Both tactics are incredibly intense with that bar indicator well into the red.  You will get tired players late in matches and more so toward the end of the season.  Fatigue and injury.

You also have 4 attacking duties in attacking tactics.  Take the 4231 with a CWB Atk.  His mentality is very attacking and he roams from position, ahead of him on that side is an IF Atk who'll play like a wide striker.  It makes that tactic unbalanced, well they both are.  As a big side you might be fine when you score first and pile it on.  A lot less good if morale & conditioning start to drop and you're against more astute opposition.

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3 hours ago, StayFrosty said:

My players were not defending at all and were just completely letting them attack

Not quite sure what exactly you mean, but with counterpress activated your defenders, especially the wing backs might struggle to get back into position for Defense which will open up space for the other team. That is also the weak spot of the 4231 formation as there is no CDM to cover for forward running wing backs. Eventhough CMs can provide some cover you still need to rely on your wingbacks to get back in time. 
 

3 hours ago, StayFrosty said:

and then ignoring my tiki taka tactics by just punting the ball away instantly.

Actually almost anything is set up to counter attack the opposition. Roles and duties are set up very direct almost no natural overlaps, high tempo coming with attacking mentality, counter TI. So if you look to transition and build up quickly to overwhelm the opposition on the break I suggest you to drop the line of engagement one notch, which will open up more space for your players to move into.

If you actually look for a tiki-taka playstyle the whole tactic needs an overhaul. 

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18 hours ago, StayFrosty said:

I play an attacking 4-2-3-1 with Dortmund on an online save with my friends and i managed to take it all the way to mid February without losing in season 2 yet in recent months games have become progressively harder and i eventually lost to the rather easy champions league draw in the first leg 3-2 and i got off very lightly. It was total domination, players of mine where complacent while losing and drawing (is that a bug where they hadn't realised the importance of the match?) and i was very lucky to get away goals. I will attach my tactic that i used. It has been so dominant but has recently become weaker and weaker to the point where i am scraping results. My players were not defending at all and were just completely letting them attack and then ignoring my tiki taka tactics by just punting the ball away instantly. Any ideas of what i can improve? i switch to the 4-4-2 in times of need and it normally serves me well, but not today.

Football Manager 2021 Xbox Edition 27_04_2021 21_24_14.png

Football Manager 2021 Xbox Edition 27_04_2021 21_24_23.png

Both of your tactics aren't great, in honesty, but you can tweak:

Tactic 1: problems and solutions

- overkill in TI'S and a couple not suited to your tiki-taka, I'd remove a good few of them

- BME practically means ''don't follow TI'S'' I wouldn't do such TI

- SK on AT very much contradicts the tiki taka style, and 2 BPD'S is very risky even for Dortmund

- i'd make your CWB'S WB (SU) and FB (AT)

- BWM is very aggressive, I'd say CM (DE) in its place

- AF is going to be fairly isolated, maybe have him as an attacking role but slightly deeper down

- tight marking does not fit with extremely urgent pressing, and with less then optimal defensive compactness, 

- counter is not logical with tiki taka

- WBIB can also overcomplicate attacking play

Tactic 2 problems and solutions:

- extremely attacking, your bank of midfield 4 is going to be flying forward and your IWB'S will attack a fair bit even on support.

- overkill in TI'S again

- your 2 ST'S are very very isolated, and 2 attack duties in tiki taka style is a big no-no

- why pass into space?

- 2 BPD'S, again, risky even for Dortmund

- wbib once more can overcomplicate attacking play

- counter is, again, not really compatible with such style

- why run at defence?

- also once more, less than optimal defensive compactness, paired with UTM and extremely urgent pressing.

- prevent short GK distribution isn't really great with a bottom heavy formation

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