Football Manager 2021 Official Feedback Thread

[luka_zg]

7 minutes ago, Pav_Makarov said:

I'll update on my previous feedback on the absence of bookings from game highlights. Tackles that lead to non game-ending injuries are not there as well. It's terribly hard to control the game flow this way. Examples from my last game:

Game starts, first highlight on comprehensive comes up on 5th minute, by that time i already have a player booked and I only saw it when he got the ball on a highlight, situation repeats itself later on. By the end of the game I had 4 yellow cards and no foul has been shown as highlight.

In the second half I sub tired player for a fresh one, highlight comes up with a subbed-in DM going for a tackle, ball leaves for a throw-in and highlight ends. Few minutes later I want to give a PI, open a lower panel and see that he has poor condition. Apparently he suffered a blow, but nothing ever showed that, there was no animation of doctors taking him away, a highlight or a text commentary, as it used to be before.

I've opened a corresponding topic in a bug section, this is a game breaking thing in my view.

Match UI has: notable events, dugout, tablet with four screens, XG, tactics button, collapsable menu with your line-up, shouts and instructions. During a game user has to navigate between pieces of information, located in opposing parts of a screen, interacting with various blocks and while it is arguable that we can get used to that, but it's near impossible in this conditions to keep a track on the match itself. Imagine missing second yellow card just because you didn't know there was a first one? Or subbing a player, while unaware you have an injured CD limping on.

I understand that UI can't be changed at this point, but adding notable events to highlights (that's in the name notable events) can be done. It's as if manager is blindfolded, how this is realism?

I agree with you 100%.

So many times I miss player injury just because you don't see the little orange cross in the player rating menu and also the yellow cards. Why not on player rating menu? You can see them in match stats but it's so easy to miss them. Really stupid decision by whoever made that decision, sorry.

[rp1966]

6 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

And any of the issues they're seeing now were already issues in the Beta ME, because the only things changed between the beta ME and the release ME were:

1) Referees/VAR making stupid errors was fixed;

2) Goalkeepers making stupid errors (like running into the net with the ball) were fixed; and

3) Defenders move more narrowly against 3 striker formations to cover the 3 striker threats.

That's literally and objectively the only changes made, as stated by @Jack Joyce. So if you're saying more was changed within the ME, you'd not only be incorrect, you'd also be calling one of the guys who develops and knows the most about the ME than any person at SI a liar.

One thing you missed that was explained re beta -> full changes, not ME, but feeds into ME and can affect play.  Effect of morale was equalised between player and 'AI' in the ME (in beta player had a morale boost over 'AI'); so if you have low morale the effect will be more noticeable in the full release than it was in the beta.  

 

Edited December 2, 2020 by rp1966

[WHUkain21]

4 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

And any of the issues they're seeing now were already issues in the Beta ME, because the only things changed between the beta ME and the release ME were:

1) Referees/VAR making stupid errors was fixed;

2) Goalkeepers making stupid errors (like running into the net with the ball) were fixed; and

3) Defenders move more narrowly against 3 striker formations to cover the 3 striker threats.

Those are the changes that were made, as stated by @Jack Joyce. So if you're saying more was changed within the ME, and the ME is now completely different, you'd not only be incorrect, you'd also be calling one of the guys who develops and knows the most about the ME than any person at SI a liar.

I want to believe you guys and i really respect you opinions really but i also believe to my eyes, and i am playing this game 14 years so i respect also my juding abillty to understand ME.

[luka_zg]

2 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

Pretty sure they won't. They'll only show you players they believe to be 4.5 stars or higher.

ok, so if I put them on 3.5 star PA they will show me 4 star PA player if they find him? Because this way(minimum 2.5 star-maximum 3.5 star) is pretty limited. Is there any way to set just a minimum star rating?

[Footix]

All the UI issues ... do SI still support 1024 x 768 or whatever low-res they used to showcase the new games in? If they do I suspect it's a matter of not having time or resource to create proper layouts for all the various monitors out there. More like "make it look good on the lowest one and then scale up accordingly". Result: lots of empty space on higher res panels. 

[luka_zg]

2 minutes ago, WHUkain21 said:

I want to believe you guys and i really respect you opinions really but i also believe to my eyes, and i am playing this game 14 years so i respect also my juding abillty to understand ME.

Well you claim that striker will score 15,16 goals per season and I am telling you that my striker scored 21 goal and we still have to play 18 league games. So, barring any injuries, he will go 30+ goals in a season which you claim is not happening. And that is just wrong.

[Pav_Makarov]

4 minutes ago, luka_zg said:

I agree with you 100%.

So many times I miss player injury just because you don't see the little orange cross in the player rating menu and also the yellow cards. Why not on player rating menu? You can see them in match stats but it's so easy to miss them. Really stupid decision by whoever made that decision, sorry.

It's possible to keep track of it if you keep the lower tab with your squad opened all the time, but this reduces the pitch size.

And in any case, a foul and a booking are kinds of events that should be in highlights, after all we need to know where is our weak spot, comprehensive view shows us every blocked cross that goes for a corner, but ignores injuries and defensive failures we need to address. 

[WHUkain21]

7 minutes ago, luka_zg said:

Well you claim that striker will score 15,16 goals per season and I am telling you that my striker scored 21 goal and we still have to play 18 league games. So, barring any injuries, he will go 30+ goals in a season which you claim is not happening. And that is just wrong.

You are spiking just about one part of the game, and this is puzzle. It was just one of my examples. 

 

I am looking and bigger picture. And also so many people said the same, it's not a coincidence. 

[upthetoon]

16 hours ago, Double Indemnity said:

Just to illustrate some of the UI complaints with an example.

In the screenshot, I've highlighted where my eye naturally falls in red; it's where it's led by the perspective of the scene. Meanwhile, things I will need to read or potentially interact with are in green. The yellow overlay is unused dead space. I'm playing on a 27" 1440p monitor, and my eye has to traverse all of the yellow to find the things in green, which are laid out in ways that defy reading order or any eye-tracking research I'm aware of. I have to go from the red to the green box to the green circles, read through the rote text, select one, then go back to continue in the top right (which, again, defies convention; most confirm prompts in most UI design sit in the bottom right because that's where readers finish). And that's a best-case scenario. If I want to do anything else, I have to go to the far corners of the screen or dig into other menus to find information not available on this screen, the overwhelming expanse of which is wasted.

And why is it wasted? To fit in a 3D "backdrop" of the corner of a flatly lit office with a drop ceiling and some cabling on the wall. And a "Football Manager" step and repeat that reminds me I'm playing a videogame called Football Manager, in case I'd forgotten. I guess the idea here is that I, the manager, am standing in front of this and being interviewed by James Mitchell? But why is James Mitchell represented, in 2D space, as being in front of the step and repeat, while I, the manger, am at the bottom of the screen? There is a 2D schematic of our conversation that is completely at odds with the pointless, gamey 3D depiction of it. I had to leave other, useful information behind to get to this full-screen presentation. Now consider how this conversation is depicted (up and down) versus every single conversation you've ever seen represented in, say, a messaging app, or social media DMs, all of which acknowledge that people read from left to right and from top to bottom, and that real-life conversations happen in lateral space.

The best user experience I can hope for here is that if I see this screen often enough—and I'll see it 50+ times a season!—I'll get good at clicking through it really fast by learning an algorithmic set of approaches to press questions, same as in previous years. But the act of reading and clicking on things is now harder and less intuitive than it was before, and I am far more conscious that I'm playing a videogame than I was in the past.

what a great post. the press conferences UI is practically unusable for me. it causes far too strain to my eyes and my eyes got tired easily from all the 'roam from position'. It's not healthy for the eyes.
i've delegated it to asst manager and never looked at it again. 

all those playing on high or wider resolutions i hope you are taking respective eye care from doing the press conferences.

Edited December 2, 2020 by upthetoon

[luka_zg]

I delegated all conferneces to the assistant. Can't be bothered frankly and I agree that the UI for this is frankly *****.

[Fraaj]

Can Mikel ****ing Arteta stop bothering me about using his player as an AF instead of a Poacher? The player is starting every match, scoring goals for fun and developing extremely well but he keeps calling my phone. Sometimes even during the night. My wife wants to divorce me. Is this issue adressed? 

[craiigman]

57 minutes ago, upthetoon said:

what a great post. the press conferences UI is practically unusable for me. it causes far too strain to my eyes and my eyes got tired easily from all the 'roam from position'. It's not healthy for the eyes.
i've delegated it to asst manager and never looked at it again. 

all those playing on high or wider resolutions i hope you are taking respective eye care from doing the press conferences.

My assistant manager is offering great protection in these trying times. Plus I think he loves the attention.

[Double0Seven]

1 hour ago, WHUkain21 said:

Football is not about stats and this game it is about enjoying it is art not stat. If you watch your matches you will see huge difference it is a fact.

 

So many people saw the same thing. 

Football is all about stats. Have you seen the amount of data teams, scouts, mangement, trainers, fysio's, cardio's use to determine stuff? The eye can only see so much. And it is biased. Stats dont tell it all, but if you come at me with "a huge difference" and its not measurable with any stat you are simply wrong, dont have a relevant sample size or are biased. 

[WHUkain21]

3 minutes ago, Double0Seven said:

Football is all about stats. Have you seen the amount of data teams, scouts, mangement, trainers, fysio's, cardio's use to determine stuff? The eye can only see so much. And it is biased. Stats dont tell it all, but if you come at me with "a huge difference" and its not measurable with any stat you are simply wrong, dont have a relevant sample size or are biased. 

So to conclude you have the same feeling now as you had in the beta when you watch a match? You don't see any difference? 

[Double0Seven]

2 minutes ago, WHUkain21 said:

So to conclude you have the same feeling now as you had in the beta when you watch a match? You don't see any difference? 

What I see or dont see doesnt matter. You are dodging my questions. You dont realise "well thats what I see" feedback doesnt mean anything? 

[zyfon5]

1 hour ago, WHUkain21 said:

Football is not about stats and this game it is about enjoying it is art not stat. If you watch your matches you will see huge difference it is a fact.

 

So many people saw the same thing. 

Lol have you seen how Liverpool plays? That is a team built with stats as baseline. I bet most people love watching them play.

And I can point you a biased example in real life. Sterling is a bad finisher is a comment I think will pop up once in a while in football discussions when in fact he is a above average finisher when we look at stats.

[SpecialOne Miko]

il y a 1 minute, Double0Seven a dit :

What I see or dont see doesnt matter. You are dodging my questions. You dont realise "well thats what I see" feedback doesnt mean anything? 

So what the point of having 2D or 3D representation if what you see doesnt mean anything?

[SpecialOne Miko]

il y a 1 minute, zyfon5 a dit :

Lol have you seen how Liverpool plays? That is a team built with stats as baseline. I bet most people love watching them play.

And I can point you a biased example in real life. Sterling is a bad finisher is a comment I think will pop up once in a while in football discussions when in fact he is a above average finisher when we look at stats.

Liverpool under Klopp was not build on stats. Klopp changed that. For the better.

[Double0Seven]

Just now, SpecialOne Miko said:

So what the point of having 2D or 3D representation if what you see doesnt mean anything?

Im talking about sample size. What 1 person sees or doesnt see doesnt mean anything in the grand scheme of things. SI run a ton of seasons to test things out and check if everything is correct. Do you think 1 player watching some games can spot a significant change to the ME, but somehow not see anything in the stats?

[SpecialOne Miko]

à l’instant, Double0Seven a dit :

Im talking about sample size. What 1 person sees or doesnt see doesnt mean anything in the grand scheme of things. SI run a ton of seasons to test things out and check if everything is correct. Do you think 1 player watching some games can spot a significant change to the ME, but somehow not see anything in the stats?

SI testing is based on stats. Not on playing seasons like we do.

And yes, if you're playing the games for so many years as me, you can spot changes in the ME. And you dont need stats for that.

[Double0Seven]

7 minutes ago, SpecialOne Miko said:

SI testing is based on stats. Not on playing seasons like we do.

And yes, if you're playing the games for so many years as me, you can spot changes in the ME. And you dont need stats for that.

I dont care how many years you have been playing this game or how many hours you have, you dont have the code and you dont have the sample size SI have. Saying you can spot big changes, but not being able to provide even a single stat is a plain lie. Simple as that. 

Edited December 2, 2020 by Double0Seven

[SpecialOne Miko]

il y a 1 minute, Double0Seven a dit :

I dont care how many years you have been playing this game or how many hours you have, you dont have the code and you dont have the sample size SI have. Saying you can spot big changes, but not being able to provide even a single stat is a plain lie. Simple as that. 

You dont know me, and call me a liar?

Have a good day sir.

[FrazT]

OK guys- lets move on and let other users leave their feedback.

[Pav_Makarov]

14 minutes ago, FrazT said:

OK guys- lets move on and let other users leave their feedback

Is it possible to take a look on my feedback on a lack of important highlights? I have a corresponding topic of course, but it would be great to have mod's input on whether or not it can be important questions? 

It's not about ME, which is all people see today, lol 

[Jack Joyce]

2 hours ago, WHUkain21 said:

I can't tell you anything about stats. But it's easy to see with the naked eye. The game is just not the same and it is easy to see.

 

For example with the same tactic in beta with weak West Ham i had 3rd best defence in first season in whole premier league. So with such a weak team 3rd best defence. And than after full version i started with Peterborough probably strongest team in League 1 i was 3rd worst defence on 21place. My free kick tacker scored 0  goals with free kick rating 17, Technique 16 and long shot 16 for League one he is Juninho Pernmbuckano in Peterborough. And in beta i had 3 direckt free kick goals against stronger keepers in first season. Of course in both saves i worked on set pieces for match preparation. And than passing, roles and how roles behave on the pitch are different. One on ones olso.  Strikes can't score close to reality. I checked best five leagues after full version no one scored more than 16 goals, that is not possible. And in beta usually top scorers in leagues achieve number of goals around 26,27 or even more. Wingers don't assist like in Beta etc etc... 

Just to address a few things here:

1.  Having the 3rd best defence in the league as West Ham is very unrealistic and you shouldn't expect to replicate that with every team, especially when managing a team two divisions lower without adapting your tactic.

2. It's absolutely possible to not score a free kick goal in a single season. Multiple teams do this every year, and free direct free kick goals on general are statistically fairly rare. One season is nowhere near enough sample data to draw a conclusion.

3. We run hundreds of soaks regularly to assess statistical balance across all leagues, and we're yet to see a season where no player in the top 5 leagues gets more than 20 goals. If you've actually seen this then report it on the bugs forum with a save game attachment.

4. One on one conversion in FM is very high and unchanged from beta. In real life a one on one opportunity contributes to around 35% of goals scored, with a 50% conversion rate. Our conversion rate is higher.

5. Just to reiterate - there were no changes to one on ones, passing, shooting etc at all from beta to live.

6. We don't just use stats to assess ME balance. We have multiple testers constantly playing matches, some of which are qualified coaches. We are working on a number of identified issues that we've assessed internally, but none were new issues from after the beta.

Cheers,

Jack

[Pasonen]

I just very very much need to defend current version Vs beta. Claiming beta was better because it was more reactive and that there was more through balls and it was more enjoyable etc. Etc. I respect people like to see their team attacking and see pass plays, but it's the same you would train attack on a field and then you would be mad for defending team to play too tight and interfere attacking plays. this is football SIMULATION not football highlight creator or football passplay editor. Balance is needed or it will not be football.

Edited December 2, 2020 by Pasonen

[zyfon5]

33 minutes ago, SpecialOne Miko said:

Liverpool under Klopp was not build on stats. Klopp changed that. For the better.

Sure Liverpool initial venture into data driven scouting was not successful (Downing+Carroll lol) but they have since revamped their scouting department. Read on about Michael Edwards how he come to Liverpool if you still have doubts that Liverpool make their transfer decisions based on data. And have you heard of the story of how Liverpool scouted and signed Salah? The fact that I have to mention all these things does make me feel a bit disappointed about a Liverpool fan when in fact he should be more familiar than me.

[Double0Seven]

Just now, Pasonen said:

I respect people like to see their team attacking

And thats another thing I think SI have also said. People dont play realistic in football manager. Everyone wants to attack. Now go watch actual real games and the majority of bottom tier teams dont play this super attacking game people try in game. A lot of boring defending, counter attacking, playing for a draw and so on. Nobody wants to play like that in the game, so SI already have to balance around an unrealistic player.

I cant imagine what will happen if they nerf conversion rate to a lower % to match reality. People dont want realism, at least not in a video game. 

[Deisler26]

I wonder if it would be possible to get recruitment analysts to pull up a list of stats for you when you ask?

Much like the old report card system, you request "Show me all players in the Netherlands U-19 league who have a pass completion of 90%+" and you immediately get that list.

Then you can send your scouts out. 

[Pav_Makarov]

26 minutes ago, Double0Seven said:

Nobody wants to play like that in the game

Don't speak for everybody please

[FrazT]

32 minutes ago, Pav_Makarov said:

Is it possible to take a look on my feedback on a lack of important highlights? I have a corresponding topic of course, but it would be great to have mod's input on whether or not it can be important questions? 

It's not about ME, which is all people see today, lol 

I read your feedback and I note that you have raised this in the Bugs forum and that is the best place for it.  Our task as Mods is to answer questions where we can, point people in the right direction and ensure that all users respect and abide by the forum rules- frankly it is of little relevance if the Mods think an issue is important or not to be honest

[KoKeMaN]

I have many issues with my FM21. It keeps crashing eveytime. I asked support but they didnt help at all..Any others with the same issue?

[FrazT]

2 minutes ago, KoKeMaN said:

I have many issues with my FM21. It keeps crashing eveytime. I asked support but they didnt help at all..Any others with the same issue?

This is not the right place to get help with a crashing issue- in your previous thread it was suggested that you raise a ticket with the tech support team- have you done that because that really is the best way to get the issue resolved?

[herne79]

39 minutes ago, Jack Joyce said:

Having the 3rd best defence in the league as West Ham is very unrealistic

*cough* this season *cough* .

(I am of course very biased and don't often get to gloat ).

[KoKeMaN]

9 minutes ago, FrazT said:

This is not the right place to get help with a crashing issue- in your previous thread it was suggested that you raise a ticket with the tech support team- have you done that because that really is the best way to get the issue resolved?

Yes i did and Nadim from support gave me some ways to resolve it but none of them worked..

[FrazT]

Just now, KoKeMaN said:

Yes i did and Nadim from support gave me some ways to resolve it but none of them worked..

Good - I appreciate that this is still unresolved, but as long as your system is capable of running the game, an issue with a crash can be resolved but it sometimes is a matter of trial and error, so keep the dialogue with the support team going and continue to ask for help.

[KoKeMaN]

2 minutes ago, FrazT said:

Good - I appreciate that this is still unresolved, but as long as your system is capable of running the game, an issue with a crash can be resolved but it sometimes is a matter of trial and error, so keep the dialogue with the support team going and continue to ask for help.

Ok mate..thanks for taking the time to answer to me and im sorry for getting on your discussion thread. Have a great day..

[Thalo]

Posted this in the bugs forum, still no reply. Is this a known issue?

Sorry but it is game breaking for me. How am I meant to assess my instructions when I don't know what my players are really doing?

[Nick_CB]

My team's defensive recovery in FM 

[Double Indemnity]

3 hours ago, Footix said:

All the UI issues ... do SI still support 1024 x 768 or whatever low-res they used to showcase the new games in? If they do I suspect it's a matter of not having time or resource to create proper layouts for all the various monitors out there. More like "make it look good on the lowest one and then scale up accordingly". Result: lots of empty space on higher res panels. 

I just checked the latest Steam survey, and it appears 2.26% of users are using a primary display resolution below 1366x768, which is still used by some cheaper-end laptops, I think.

Regardless, while some of the problems definitely stem from not paying attention to the 80%+ of users who use 1080p or higher, many of the principal UI problems are about layout, placement, design, etc. Most of my issues with the match engine UI would be a problem at 1024x768, too.

[StewG]

18 hours ago, ray27 said:

Am I being blind? Can not for the life of me find option to slow down replay speed, Used to be in the match option on preferences

I've noticed this since the full game launched. It was there on Beta. Is this a known issue or are we both suffering collective blindness? Love the game by the way.

[RHKC]

I have raised in the bugs forum that we can't switch between tactics and team talks at half time and I have so far been ignored 

 

Please tell me this is a known issue and will be resolved? It's so annoying making a half time substitution but then being unable to give the oncoming player an individual talk 

[Svenc]

1 hour ago, Jack Joyce said:

4. One on one conversion in FM is very high and unchanged from beta. In real life a one on one opportunity contributes to around 35% of goals scored, with a 50% conversion rate. Our conversion rate is higher.

Most one on ones are actually rated in the 0.3xGish range (individually up to xG 0.5+). They are considered 1 in 3 chances plain average. Coupled with that the conversion is now higher than even 50%, and the many misconceptions of FMers (they consider one on ones near penalties or even better), that explains why there are so many "pleased with one on ones" posts now though.  One on ones are great chances, but plain not open goals (as in other, even better chances that leave the keeper no chance of anticipating).

Edited December 2, 2020 by Svenc

[BadAss88]

23 minutes ago, RHKC said:

I have raised in the bugs forum that we can't switch between tactics and team talks at half time and I have so far been ignored 

 

Please tell me this is a known issue and will be resolved? It's so annoying making a half time substitution but then being unable to give the oncoming player an individual talk 

Backspace 😉

[Steve1977beyond]

I hate being negative but this is a feedback thread so...

 

But I really dislike the Match UI. I remember a few years back that Miles was saying how great it is to have widgets and you can choose what you want, amend them at your own free will - and he was right! 

I played the Touch mode mainly with FMT18 and in between highlights you can see both teams clearly in the center of the screen, both teams stats, how the player is feeling, even how the weather is. Now it's off to one side with the main focus being a huge window with Assistant Manager feedback that hardly gets populated. 

If this game had the match UI of FMT18 and most other FM and CM's before it. Instead of offsetting it then it would be great. Im not even bothered by the new icons for fitness and morale. I get it, it's different and I like it. But having it all offset is awful. sorry

[Steve1977beyond]

Ive only played the demo but what is it with every single game having a goal in the opening minute?

[Junkhead]

Might have missed this, but is today's update save game compatible?

[kertiek]

7 minutes ago, Junkhead said:

Might have missed this, but is today's update save game compatible?

- Specific tweaks and updates to Brexit and work permit rules in-game
- Improvements to newgen generation in inactive leagues

 

ye i want to know that too, specially these too fixes, are save game compatible? my save with arsenal and a regen called michael scott, needs to know.

Edited December 2, 2020 by kertiek

[KlaaZ]

Just now, kertiek said:

- Specific tweaks and updates to Brexit and work permit rules in-game
- Improvements to newgen generation in inactive leagues

 

ye i want to know that too, specially these too fixes, are save game compatible? my save with arsenal and a regen called michael scott, needs to know.

The second one is. Not sure about Brexit.

[JordanMilly]

10 minutes ago, Junkhead said:

Might have missed this, but is today's update save game compatible?

The newgen bug fix is per the devs saying so in the bug thread the other day, but I'm currently trying to find out about the Brexit work permit stuff  I've just had confirmation that, whilst the rules changes for the likes of Korea, etc, aren't save game compatible, the Brexit work permit changes are, and so should apply fully in existing saves.