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Whats wrong with match ratings?!


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Honestly what the hell is wrong? I cant get a player to average above 7.00 no matter what he does.

Premier League 

My star AML last season 33 games 12 goals 12 assists - He finished with 6.70
My striker who score 31 goals in championship in 40 games finsihed with 7.01


All my AMRS combined had rating of 6.40. At beginning I was maybe they are bad players but then I noticed that no matter what happens people get bad ratings. Usually in past an assist from AML or goal would get him 7.5 + or more especialy if its a winning goal


In 90 of the cases an assist or a goal even in low scoring game gets my AML/AMC maximum 6.9 6.8

I just dominated Fulham 4:1 I have only 2 players above 7 thats my striker who scored brace (7.9) and my CB who scored (7.5). The AML that scored finished 6.9

Its annoying every game by half time if its 0:0 all my attacking players have abysmal rating even if its 1:0 for me. They all are 6.4 6.3 . People scoring hat tricks barerly get to 9

 

I have to substitute half my attacking line up since they appear to have bad game at 50 minute mark... God forbib my wingers do not score or assist they finish with 6.1 rating or 6.2 then I am questined if I am idiot that I kept them in play.
Same players always look dangerous in all highlights..  Last year we had the abysmal one on ones and idiotic AML and AMr blasting side net...

 

And dont give me the crap that ratings are overhauled..  My AML is not getting picked up cuz he is averaging 6.6 and even Bulgaria does not want him since he is playing "bad".. My new season so far 4 games in 2 losses against United and liverpool and two games in which he scored brace in 2:0 and then once in 4:1..

His average rating for those 4 games combined is 6.40..

 

Some more stats for my AML over last 4 seasons 

38 games 19 goals 8 assist 5 potm = 7.03

41 games 17 goals 8 assist 6.92

42 games 19 goals 10 assist 7.00

34 11 9 6.70

 

The stirker

44 games 30 goals 4 assist  7.06

43 games 31 goals 7 assist 7.19

 

P.S You go and check for example Non full detail Messi

34 games 10 goals 10 assist 7.90

39 years old Cristian Ronaldo

35 games 10 goals 10 assist 7.60

 

Salah finished 7.90 with 36 games 19 goals . 

Edited by Toshevbgg
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IMO the ratings system is not perfect and never has been particularly in some positions like DM and GK, and overall it doesn't paint an accurate picture of performance.

Why does a centre back jump from 6.7 to 9.0 just because he scored a goal from an unlikely position? The weighting towards various things is not appropriate.

So IMO you are better off checking under the Analysis of each player regarding interceptions, tackles won, pass completion, key passes etc.

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6 hours ago, greenz81 said:

Put up your tactics with your players. I believe scores are judged on how good they are playing in the 'role' more than just position.

So my AMl who is INSIDE FORWARD finsihes with 12 goals and 12 assist in 30 games and my fans are crying for me to bench him

 

The annoying part is the players for the computer get amazing ratings since the detail is off.. I would never get a playet in team of the year etc no matter what I do

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7 hours ago, greenz81 said:

Put up your tactics with your players. I believe scores are judged on how good they are playing in the 'role' more than just position.

I am playing gegenpress my formation. Doing quite welll problem is in games I dominate nobody seems to play better


I get clean sheet my LB RB are 6.3 6.4.. My MCS are always 6.4 6.5 no matter what they do. My defensive CM finished 32 games 5 goals 5 assist 

which is absolute amazing for his position his average rating 6.50 

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1 hour ago, Toshevbgg said:

The annoying part is the players for the computer get amazing ratings since the detail is off.. I would never get a playet in team of the year etc no matter what I do

If you're talking about teams in the same league as you (your league's team of the year), their matches will also be in full detail.

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3 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

If you're talking about teams in the same league as you (your league's team of the year), their matches will also be in full detail.

What about trying to get world player of the year or the like? Isn’t that affected?

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1 hour ago, DP said:

What about trying to get world player of the year or the like? Isn’t that affected?

Ofcours its affected no way to get it..

 

My AMR a brazil wonder kid 5 games in he is averaging 6.4 as AMR and the fans are questining my judgement by letting him play..

Just won 1:0 against liverpool I was outplayed but kept clean sheet and won. I had 1 player above 7. The defenders were all below 6.5 .. All attackers 6.3 6.4

I dont think I can continue to play the game like that

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6 hours ago, Toshevbgg said:

I get clean sheet my LB RB are 6.3 6.4.. My MCS are always 6.4 6.5 no matter what they do. My defensive CM finished 32 games 5 goals 5 assist 

Imo main problem in current version is with CM's rating. Other positions are fine. It depends a lot on your tactic. For example I have 4-4-1-1 tactic with heavy usage of WBs on both sides and one of my best players according to average rating is my LB who even if don't get any assists get very high ratings because of huge amount of key passes. I had game where he didn't have goal or assist and he became MotM with rating 9.0. While on the other hand I can't get my CMs rating higher than 7. From all my CMs only my one Mezzala have average rating higher than 7.0 despite the boys having much better attributes for their role than for example said LB. Also my wide midfielders have high ratings but they assist and score so it's natural that they will have higher ratings. CBs on the other hand can win few headers and their rating skyrockets. I had games where I had perfect control over the game and yet my CBs had much higher ratings than CMs despite not having much to do.

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@Toshevbgg What is your league position and how many of your players have average rating over 7? Because I don't think it's possible for example to win the league while having all player with that low ratings.

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3 hours ago, Orion_ said:

@Toshevbgg What is your league position and how many of your players have average rating over 7? Because I don't think it's possible for example to win the league while having all player with that low ratings.

Right now I am fifth I am playing ok football but my player ratings are awful

My AML who is my best player by far has average rating 6.30 so far in 7 games .. 

I just beat 4:2 tottenham.

AML - Goal final rating 6.8

AMR Goal and great game (eye test) 7.00

Striker Goal rating 7:0

 

Finsihed 2:2 now my striker again scored and played and tormented my opponents his rating 6.9 my AML finished 6.3 and he had this since 15 minute into the game
He finished 77% passes 3 key passes 3 tackles won from 3  rating 6.2


I mean my tactic works but I guess something is off cuz everybody has pathetic ratings no matter if I win or lose. I get trashed by united 5:0 attack is 6.2 6.3 . . I beat tottenham 4:2 same thing .
My striker scored a wonder goal played great and finsihed with 7.00.. 

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Do you by any chance play something like park-the-bus-counter-attacking tactic?

Because frankly that's the only thing that came to my mind just out of thin air without looking at your team. That kind of tactic could possibly get low rating because it has:

  • low number of key passes (in compare to possession based/offensive tactics)
  • low percentage of completed passes (you just get the ball, put long pass and hope for the best)
  • low number of created chances
  • very little possession (low number of passes in general)
  • low number of interceptions/recovered ball if you play very very deep cautiously waiting for opposition to come and lose the ball

I think that whole team very good defensive off the ball movement (like Atletico Madrid style) might be low rated by FM rating system because it lacks of statistics that are fuel for ratings. You basically can't put into numbers how many opposition chances you prevented just by your team defensive shape.

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The game I just finished, my striker didn't score or assist anyone and finished with a 7.3. The striker who did score, received a 8.1. The outfielders all finished above 7.0. It was just the keeper, with very little to do, who recorded a 6.8.

Thing is, we played well. We won 4-0 and everyone played well. A few matches before this one, we won 3-0, so it should be a comparable match. The striker who had a 7.3 in the match I just finished, only had a 6.4 in this one. He was less involved and, to name one factor, his passing % was only 57% compared to the other match where it was 80%+. My right wingback had only 71% passing completion and 50% tackling completion and had a 6.4 rating too.

Just before that match, in a 6 - 0 win, my AMC only had a 6.8. Looking at the stats, I can see why. 15 passes (fairly low) at 93% completion, but no key passes, assists or goals. 1 off target shot and 3 tackle attempts with 2 won. He wasn't extremely involved. My striker had a 10.0 for his 4 goals from 5 shots, 1 assist and 2 key passes.

9 matches in, my 2 strikers have avg ratings of 7.74 and 7.44.

Looking at a 1-1 draw I had earlier, my striker ended on a 6.2. He had only 10 pass attempts compared to everyone else who had 28+ passes. Won only 1 of his 4 aerial duels and completed 1 of his 3 crosses. Didn't even take a shot at all.

If your players are getting poor ratings, look at their stats.

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After 10 games (6 leagues wins 1 leage draw & 2 CL wins and 1 CL loss) here are my ratings with Ajax

 

GK - 7.12

 

RB: 7.20

CB: 7.06

CB: 7.04

LB: 7.84

 

MCR: 7.53

MCL: 7.74

 

AMR: 7.24

AMC: 7.60

AML: 7.22

 

ST: 7.84

 

In my experience the ratings are not broken. I don't know why yours are so low but it's not a problem of the core game otherwise we'd all experience it.

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Just checked my other save with Hearts in the Scottish Premiership, season 3 in save sitting 7th out of 12 after 24 games (7 wins, 10 draws, 7 losses). Average ratings are:

 

GK: 6.69 (not surprising when we've conceded 35 goals)

 

RB: 7.04

CB: 7.14

CB: 6.76

LB: 7.46

 

DM: 7.13

CM: 7.09

CM: 7.28

 

AMR: 7.44

AML: 6.70

 

ST: 7.76

 

Edited by danielclouston1
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13 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

Just before that match, in a 6 - 0 win, my AMC only had a 6.8.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think in older FM's when you won a match by a lot (like your case) it felt like the team was overall dragged up with ratings. But in FM21 I feel like ratings became as it should be, more 'individual', so if someone is lazy ass and the team somehow win by huge margin they can still get relatively low rating if they didn't contribute.

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On 17/03/2021 at 02:46, Toshevbgg said:

Honestly what the hell is wrong? I cant get a player to average above 7.00 no matter what he does.

Premier League 

My star AML last season 33 games 12 goals 12 assists - He finished with 6.70
My striker who score 31 goals in championship in 40 games finsihed with 7.01


 

32AE0C4865E7812EB6F8DBB74A3429F5CFE82B5A

Mine are normal. As you can see the last 5 games there is 14 players on decent ratings and when you go to the AVG Rating column for the full season the scores are even higher some just under 7.5 one is even above it.

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Just to add ... since 21.4 my players ratings have rocketed. I’ve moved clubs in the summer window (when 21.4 dropped for me) from Arbroath (finished 3rd in the Scottish Prem first season up, some sort of miracle with the quality of players I had, on paper) to Aberdeen (much better quality of player, on paper). 

Playing the exact same tactic (Aberdeen already had a great base for my tactic) and the difference in player ratings is massive. Everyone bar a couple are playing above a 7. About 12 games in.

Better quality of player, that can action my tactic more comprehensively? 21.4 tweaks to player ratings? I don’t know.

It’s actually made spotting who is playing poorly quite difficult 😁

Edited by Tyburn
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I don't have an issue with them modifying the ratings to match the "below average, average and above average" stereo type but the fact that a slight drop below the 6.8 "average" rating is too detrimental to the rest of the game. Player has an average of say 6.4 is looked as being poor form when a difference of only 0.4 isn't really that much. If a player had say 5.8 average then yes that is poor. Just widen the bandwidth a little and give managers the scope to play the way they want to play and not punish players so harshly.

Think they have to look at the bigger picture when making such changes rather than just the match itself.

The match engine plays so well when you have the tactic that suits your team and it gets rid of the whole "plug n play" scenario we have seen since Championship Manager days. 

All I can ask is please just look at what needs done to fix what's already there well before what you think would be a good gimmick to add next time ie xG and covid transfer market.

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Ill be honest, I dont think I have had any real issues since the latest update either, which is weird as I dont think they touched the ME.

Sure I get the occasional game where a player will be on a 6.4 or lower but at the moment when I am winning I am getting good ratings. When I lose its a completely different matter of course but you would expect that.

I think player consistency seems to have a bigger effect this year.

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Deep-lying playmakers seem to struggle a lot to get decent ratings. In early versions of FM21 it was the other way around and they were almost always the highest rated players on the pitch. Looks to me like some sort of over-correction was performed to downgrade playmaker ratings in the more recent patches.

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Since 21.4 Update I am not seeing a single rating above 6.5 for either of my centre backs, extremely frustrating as we keep clean sheets regularly and keep opposition xG's low, and pre-update they would comfortably get anywhere from 7-7.8. The answer to ratings issues is always the same though "Oh it must be your tactics"

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On 22/03/2021 at 16:54, KeegBCFC said:

The answer to ratings issues is always the same though "Oh it must be your tactics"

Well because tactics is a big factor on how your players behave on the pitch. Their rating in FM21 seems to be more of their individual performance focused on certain stats rather than overall team performance.

To give you an example. You can have clean sheet but every offensive move from your opponents it stopped in your midfield already. In terms of your team performance it's great because you're dominating opposition. But that also means that your defenders won't have chance to prove themselves. On the other hand you can lose a game but opposition is putting long passes and your physical dominant CBs are winning a lot of headers against opposition forwards. This will lead to increase their 'headers won' in post match stats resulting in higher rating. Also if you retain possession and have ball playing defenders even thou they have 'More risky passes' in their role instructions they will overall put a lot of passes and have very high numbers of completed passes which can result in improving their rating as the game sees 'well this lad puts a lot of completed passes - he must be good then'.

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Ratings for strikers are too low - if you look at the top performers in the league you play there are hardly any strikers and the ones that do score a lot do not have an appropriate rating. 
 

I’m sure it’ll be addressed for fm22 but it’s frustrating. 

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Ratings are so inconsistent this year, so hard depending on the player and role combination, that you cannot really use Them like in the past... A good AP can get 6.8, while someone Else in the same position and tactic can get a 7.4 with less goals and assists, but behind the scenes Does 3% better in his dribbles and gave 2 better passes because he takes less risks... And sigames rates that more now

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20 minutes ago, Weller1980 said:

For the people saying match ratings aren't broke show us a screen shot of strikers in your division with avg ratings above 7.00 I bet there is no more than 4 to 6 players. 

Harry Kane did 7.15 in mine. He scored 30 goals in 35 games 😂😂. Meanwhile 39  years old Cristiano was rocking a cool 7.9 with 12 goals in 36 games 

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10 hours ago, Weller1980 said:

For the people saying match ratings aren't broke show us a screen shot of strikers in your division with avg ratings above 7.00 I bet there is no more than 4 to 6 players. 

I'm still early in my season, but these are the stats so far when selected strikers only.

HBBN0dw.png

 

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These are all the Ligue 1 strikers with average ratings above 7.00 my Rennes save (pre-winter update).

Ben Belgacem, Nketiah, Guirassy and Gouiri are all my players, but AI forwards still seem to be doing fine.

ratings2.thumb.png.8718b3291f9276c0a2a7d06fd3bef95a.png

And this is from my journeyman save (started after the first winter update).

This search includes players from both the Cymru North and the Cymru South. The players I've highlighted in purple are in the Cymru South, which is the division I'm managing in.

ratings1.thumb.png.aa90fab927912fcc7a22bb5db4f64412.png

Also, of the top 20 average ratings in the Cymru South, eight are from strikers.

ratings3.png.9efe525312c4416feb5a6cb2bd0ad7c1.png

So yeah... looks fine to me. Just because you've seen something 'broken' in your save doesn't mean that it's happening for everyone else.

Edited by CFuller
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1 hour ago, CFuller said:

These are all the Ligue 1 strikers with average ratings above 7.00 my Rennes save (pre-winter update).

Ben Belgacem, Nketiah, Guirassy and Gouiri are all my players, but AI forwards still seem to be doing fine.

ratings2.thumb.png.8718b3291f9276c0a2a7d06fd3bef95a.png

And this is from my journeyman save (started after the first winter update).

This search includes players from both the Cymru North and the Cymru South. The players I've highlighted in purple are in the Cymru South, which is the division I'm managing in.

ratings1.thumb.png.aa90fab927912fcc7a22bb5db4f64412.png

Also, of the top 20 average ratings in the Cymru South, eight are from strikers.

ratings3.png.9efe525312c4416feb5a6cb2bd0ad7c1.png

So yeah... looks fine to me. Just because you've seen something 'broken' in your save doesn't mean that it's happening for everyone else.

My testing shows full detail leagues fair far worse than simulated leagues. Its a fact that I've run multiple seasons in League One, League Two and Championship and every single time leagues in full detail don't produce enough player with avg ratings over 7.00, especially strikers

Try yourself, but ensure you don't get sacked because I think the League will revert to simulated matches rather than full detail and skew the outcome.

 

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3 hours ago, Weller1980 said:

My testing shows full detail leagues fair far worse than simulated leagues. Its a fact that I've run multiple seasons in League One, League Two and Championship and every single time leagues in full detail don't produce enough player with avg ratings over 7.00, especially strikers

Try yourself, but ensure you don't get sacked because I think the League will revert to simulated matches rather than full detail and skew the outcome.

How many players with average ratings above 7.00 is "enough", in your opinion? 10? 20? 50? 100?

I don't know. I just find it a bit odd that people are getting so hung up about arbitrary ratings when everyone will have different opinions on what constitutes a good/bad/meh rating.

Edited by CFuller
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7 hours ago, CFuller said:

How many players with average ratings above 7.00 is "enough", in your opinion? 10? 20? 50? 100?

I don't know. I just find it a bit odd that people are getting so hung up about arbitrary ratings when everyone will have different opinions on what constitutes a good/bad/meh rating.

I'm firmly in the camp of the ratings being bugged/broken. In an earlier version there was a clear and obvious issue with left backs. It then got fixed on an update. Now it seems it's left wingers and central midfielders that have the issues. I just sold my left winger, Richarlison, despite 12 goals and 10 assists because his average rating was 6.3. It kind of dawned on me that there is probably an issue like there was with left backs, but it just feels wrong continuing to select a player averaging that low. I've replaced him with Neymar, who is on 6.4 despite two goals in three games. Central midfielders are the same, doesn't matter how good the player is, the average rating is always below 7. When watching the game they are doing fine, providing assists and quality passes forward to create goals and breaking up play, but only goals will ever see them get over the 7 rating hurdle.

The idea with ratings is that they have always been the central performance matrix the game has used to feedback performance to people playing the game. I know there are articles and threads on here where people will say to use other stats to decide it, but when a player gets a 6.2 and the other players are over 7 as you've won heavily, you feel like he's done poorly. When you lose you also get interview questions about why you didn't take those players off despite them having terrible games, so the game itself still clearly uses the rating to judge performance. I've always used 6.5 as the baseline. 6.5 to 7 is a decent, solid game. Over 7 and they've played well. Below 6.5 they've not done well and below 6 they've had a mare. It seems 6.8 is actually the benchmark as a mod posted that. The game has always had this central to how the game is played and it's very odd if they've moved away from that.

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On 18/03/2021 at 05:46, danielclouston1 said:

After 10 games (6 leagues wins 1 leage draw & 2 CL wins and 1 CL loss) here are my ratings with Ajax

 

GK - 7.12

 

RB: 7.20

CB: 7.06

CB: 7.04

LB: 7.84

 

MCR: 7.53

MCL: 7.74

 

AMR: 7.24

AMC: 7.60

AML: 7.22

 

ST: 7.84

 

In my experience the ratings are not broken. I don't know why yours are so low but it's not a problem of the core game otherwise we'd all experience it.

I think the issue with left backs earlier in the game's release was felt by everyone. I suspect the left winger and central midfield issue on the latest patch also is, given several have pointed it out on here and it's a topic of debate on other platforms as well. If the glaring issue and resulting fix with left backs hadn't happened I might be more inclined to believe it's not a bug/error in the engine. Do you have screenshots of the above as I've never seen anything like those on the latest patch, particularly for central midfielders? Are yours taking penalties, free kicks and corners to get them that high?

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15 hours ago, busngabb said:

I think the issue with left backs earlier in the game's release was felt by everyone. I suspect the left winger and central midfield issue on the latest patch also is, given several have pointed it out on here and it's a topic of debate on other platforms as well. If the glaring issue and resulting fix with left backs hadn't happened I might be more inclined to believe it's not a bug/error in the engine. Do you have screenshots of the above as I've never seen anything like those on the latest patch, particularly for central midfielders? Are yours taking penalties, free kicks and corners to get them that high?

I don't have a screenshot from the time I posted the original ratings but here is a screenshot from now. It is close season hence no appearances etc but I haven't played any friendlies yet, the last 5 games are competitive from last season. Don't bother with Donnarumma because I only just signed him, my keeper was Scherpen (S1).

image001.png

Edited by danielclouston1
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I believe wildly differing player ratings are firmly to do with what tactic is being played. I don’t know the correct formulas but it seems certain roles in certain tactics just don’t get the ratings the play merits.

That said, if the play is good, players are playing as you would hope and expect, they are contributing to your team vision, then, for me, the rating is not so important.

Average ratings are just one metric to determine how a player is doing. It’s a simple catch all. A bit like the star system. Easy to gauge at a glance.

Average ratings don’t tell the whole story.

For someone who strives for more vagueness in the game, personally, having bizarre overall ratings just adds another layer of complication that is not wholly awful.

It makes me have to think.

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I don't think I've ever paid major attention to ratings in FM as a tool to spot check my players. An entirely arbitrary number without much context as to how they are generated. Ultimately I need my players to do the things that make my tactics work. Whatever rating they get from that is secondary, especially since it's difficult to directly influence it. 

My left winger has been often my highest rated player this FM cycle (often a ballon d'Or winner), that's because his entire job is to score goals. My central mid on defend role often middling but statistically does his tidy but boring job making sure the left wing is covered to get the goals. Doesn't necessarily get the ratings, but the setup is compromised if he is poor in his screening and passing. And ultimately since I do know how that rates nor can I control that, I just crack on. Ratings feel too much of a black box to me tbh

Might have to annoy @Seb Wassell for some ratings details :D

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On 28/03/2021 at 00:03, themadsheep2001 said:

I don't think I've ever paid major attention to ratings in FM as a tool to spot check my players. An entirely arbitrary number without much context as to how they are generated. Ultimately I need my players to do the things that make my tactics work. Whatever rating they get from that is secondary, especially since it's difficult to directly influence it. 

My left winger has been often my highest rated player this FM cycle (often a ballon d'Or winner), that's because his entire job is to score goals. My central mid on defend role often middling but statistically does his tidy but boring job making sure the left wing is covered to get the goals. Doesn't necessarily get the ratings, but the setup is compromised if he is poor in his screening and passing. And ultimately since I do know how that rates nor can I control that, I just crack on. Ratings feel too much of a black box to me tbh

Might have to annoy @Seb Wassell for some ratings details :D

The problem is match ratings effect so many mechanics, such as morale, player value, player development and so on........

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You only need to look at AI playing squads at the top of the league to notice very few players achieve avg. ratings above 7.00.

On average top performing teams have around 3 - 4 players with avg. ratings above 7.00

The exception to this is when the leagues are not fully simulated then you'll notice lots of plyers with higher avg ratings.

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3 hours ago, Weller1980 said:

The problem is match ratings effect so many mechanics, such as morale, player value, player development and so on........

I really haven't found them to impact any of that particularly hard tbh. 

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1 hour ago, themadsheep2001 said:

I really haven't found them to impact any of that particularly hard tbh. 

My DLP getting a rating of 6.5 when he plays well allows me to fine him for bad performance after every game. Has done wonders to his work rate and determination.

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3 minutes ago, Weller1980 said:

Do you not use match ratings as part of your research when buying players?

If you see a perfect fit to your team with exactly the attributes and prefered moves you're looking for, do you really care how he played in another system under another manager controlled by a hapless AI? I sure dont.

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10 minutes ago, zindrinho said:

Fining players increases work rate...? I really dont think so.

It does in FM, either Work Rate or Determination depending on how the player reacts.

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3 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

It does in FM, either Work Rate or Determination depending on how the player reacts.

Wow, really? Do you remember ca which version this was implemented? 

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22 minutes ago, zindrinho said:

If you see a perfect fit to your team with exactly the attributes and prefered moves you're looking for, do you really care how he played in another system under another manager controlled by a hapless AI? I sure dont.

And for these reasons. I only just about care about my own match ratings let alone any other teams

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