Jump to content

Are we ever going to see Pep-like wingers FM?


Recommended Posts

I've always been a massive fan of Pep Guardiola. I've tried to adopt some of his philosophies in any tactical style I create. 

I've never been able to replicate how his wingers play for Manchester City. You see them holding the width as wide as possible, stretching the opposition. They make runs in behind and create space for the midfielders. 

In FM, wingers in the AMR/L rarely hold the width in the final third. They move very narrowly as they get into the opposition's half. 

Do you think they'll work on this in the next version of the game? Some of us are actually not fans of letting the fullbacks push up so high. 

IMG_20210218_092652.jpg

Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Belmont said:

I've always been a massive fan of Pep Guardiola. I've tried to adopt some of his philosophies in any tactical style I create. 

I've never been able to replicate how his wingers play for Manchester City. You see them holding the width as wide as possible, stretching the opposition. They make runs in behind and create space for the midfielders. 

In FM, wingers in the AMR/L rarely hold the width in the final third. They move very narrowly as they get into the opposition's half. 

Do you think they'll work on this in the next version of the game? Some of us are actually not fans of letting the fullbacks push up so high. 

IMG_20210218_092652.jpg

It is the same as inverted wingers in FM. Inverted wingers in FM is modeled based on this role. And I disagree that they rarely hold the width in the final third. Their movement is similar to what you will see in real life other than a few ME limitations.

Edited by zyfon5
Link to post
Share on other sites

People need to use IW without the goes forward PI. That's what makes IWs narrow play because they are asked to bomb forward earlier, and that means they will be close to the box even if they have stay wide PI.

Link to post
Share on other sites

To get chalk on boots, attacking width needs to be maximal with focus down the flanks. Wingers need to hold position, run wise with ball, cross from byline...in effect this creates more a Fergie Kanchelskis than Pep Raheem. The latter‘s preference is for inverted runs deep in the final third with next to no crossing from the wingers/inside forwards. 

The inside forward is the closest one can get and falls far from the mark, the wider the attack, the more outside becomes the inside. And what’s an inside when it’s outside...
 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

The game treats wide players in the AM strata as forwards, so, naturally when the ball is in the final third, they attack the box. It's what forwards do. If you have them in the CM strata, it's more likely that they keep the width all the way. But, as always, it all depends on the role, duty, the player, and most importantly, the system around him.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I watched City U21s against lower league senior opposition in the Checkatrade 2 years ago and was fascinated by it. They played a more extreme version of Pep's system as they weren't exactly playing to win, more for practice and experience. So the two wide players hugged the touchline and stayed as high and wide as possible, pushing the full backs back. The striker dropped deep and roamed (F9), the central midfielders made runs into the vacant space (Mezzalas), the 16 year old DM pushed forward, pressed and  looked to feed in the midfielders ahead of him (regista perhaps) and the full backs tucked into the vacant DM strata (IWB). It was like watching a perfect FM recreation except there isn't really a generic wide attacking midfielder role that doesn't cut inside towards the box.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Nyron said:

I watched City U21s against lower league senior opposition in the Checkatrade 2 years ago and was fascinated by it. They played a more extreme version of Pep's system as they weren't exactly playing to win, more for practice and experience. So the two wide players hugged the touchline and stayed as high and wide as possible, pushing the full backs back. The striker dropped deep and roamed (F9), the central midfielders made runs into the vacant space (Mezzalas), the 16 year old DM pushed forward, pressed and  looked to feed in the midfielders ahead of him (regista perhaps) and the full backs tucked into the vacant DM strata (IWB). It was like watching a perfect FM recreation except there isn't really a generic wide attacking midfielder role that doesn't cut inside towards the box.

The wide attacking midfielder in Pep system do cut into the box once the ball is progressed into the final third. They just stay wide during the initial phase of the build up. Just look at their touches in the box, their shots per 90, and their offensive statistics. Sterling's attacking numbers last season and this season is similar to a striker which indicates that he is very active at areas much closer to the goal. I am using inverted wingers in my current tactic and the position of the inverted winger in this position is exactly the same where my inverted wingers usually receive the ball initially. The only difference between the inverted wingers in real life and in FM is the inverted wingers in FM start cutting inside much earlier. While in real life they will hold the ball wait for other players to get into positions before they start their next move.

Edited by zyfon5
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, zyfon5 said:

The wide attacking midfielder in Pep system do cut into the box once the ball is progressed into the final third. They just stay wide during the initial phase of the build up

Absolutely :thup:

Link to post
Share on other sites

Or use the Winger, support role with right footed player on the left and left footed player on the right - both with "cuts inside" trait. Behind them play IWB on either support or defend duty with Overlap TI on both sides. 

The overlap instruction will reduce the individual mentality of the wingers, they are hardcoded to stay wide and will still cut inside due to trait and footedness. Also, the IWBs will play a nice hybrid role between playing narrow next to the DM and going on the outside of the Wingers. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the ideas in here. 

@yonko have you felt traits with the full backs make a significant difference? In my testing having full backs with get forward whenever possible and " run with ball down left/right" makes them overlap a lot more than is desired and once they start this process the wide players move inside.

@themadsheep2001 I never considered hold position in my set up due to me trying to create scenarios where they leave their designated role and another player roaming could then occupy their role. But if this isn't easily possible in the match engine maybe this would be a better option. I found myself getting frustrated with lots of the roles, they either have stay wide or narrow pre selected or run wide with ball or cut inside with ball pre selected. I ended up with Roles that allowed me to select as much as possible.

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Cult of Football Manager said:

I like the ideas in here. 

@yonko have you felt traits with the full backs make a significant difference? In my testing having full backs with get forward whenever possible and " run with ball down left/right" makes them overlap a lot more than is desired and once they start this process the wide players move inside.

@themadsheep2001 I never considered hold position in my set up due to me trying to create scenarios where they leave their designated role and another player roaming could then occupy their role. But if this isn't easily possible in the match engine maybe this would be a better option. I found myself getting frustrated with lots of the roles, they either have stay wide or narrow pre selected or run wide with ball or cut inside with ball pre selected. I ended up with Roles that allowed me to select as much as possible.

City wingers tend to be really disciplined in the first two thirds of build up off the ball, staying as wide as possible and being relative deep. Support roles will give you the relatively deep. Stay wider and hold position will give you that discipline, making sure that the half space can be flooded. But they will still narrow in the final on the ball getting you those touches in the box 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

City wingers tend to be really disciplined in the first two thirds of build up off the ball, staying as wide as possible and being relative deep. Support roles will give you the relatively deep. Stay wider and hold position will give you that discipline, making sure that the half space can be flooded. But they will still narrow in the final on the ball getting you those touches in the box 

Thanks for the reply. I will look at support duties again. I got away from them as I felt the WInger - S dribbled too much even when other options were there, and I wanted to make sure they were both a bigger goal threat when entering the final third. Good to know.

Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Cult of Football Manager said:

Thanks for the reply. I will look at support duties again. I got away from them as I felt the WInger - S dribbled too much even when other options were there, and I wanted to make sure they were both a bigger goal threat when entering the final third. Good to know.

Defensive Wingers on Support (in the Midfield line) with Stay Wider (cant recall if that's a preset or not) stay really wide, and contribute a lot in the final third and would fit the mould of being hard working when out of possession.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Lordluap said:

Defensive Wingers on Support (in the Midfield line) with Stay Wider (cant recall if that's a preset or not) stay really wide, and contribute a lot in the final third and would fit the mould of being hard working when out of possession.

I don't think a DW would work since they share all the same PI's as a normal W(plus 2 more) 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, HurkaDurk69 said:

I don't think a DW would work since they share all the same PI's as a normal W(plus 2 more) 

My experience is that they do sit a small amount wider and for longer in build up

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...