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Marilyn Manson abuses women (allegedly)


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1 hour ago, Confused Clarity said:

His track record suggests so. Yes.

a 36 year old he should know better 

but as a Rockstar he lives a life where young people idolise him and in turn throw themselves at him

so if he is smacked off his tits all the time, him knowing better will quickly go out the window

not defending him, he might have been sober and noncey for all I know

but I can see how this could easily happen without him having to go out of his way to find young girls interested in him given his status.

 

I feel like im downgrading him from dangerous predator to highly immoral or something idk.

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The abuse is bad enough, we don’t need to speculate and make false claims of grooming and him being a predator to be able to call him a bad person. He married Dita Von Teese when she was 33, he’s hardly a pedo ffs.

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Just now, Weezer said:

The abuse is bad enough, we don’t need to speculate and make false claims of grooming and him being a predator to be able to call him a bad person. He married Dita Von Teese when she was 33, he’s hardly a pedo ffs.

Many pedo's are married with wife of very adult age?

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1 minute ago, Weezer said:

The abuse is bad enough, we don’t need to speculate and make false claims of grooming and him being a predator to be able to call him a bad person. He married Dita Von Teese when she was 33, he’s hardly a pedo ffs.

Tbf one of the things she's mentioned is he groomed her

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She may have been impressionable and naive, and 'groomed' in that sense, but she was actually an adult when they started dating. He's an abuser and a gaslighter. Let's not stretch and minimise the word grooming.

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2 minutes ago, Haguey said:

She may have been impressionable and naive, and 'groomed' in that sense, but she was actually an adult when they started dating. He's an abuser and a gaslighter. Let's not stretch and minimise the word grooming.

Just using what she said, she said "groomed since a teenager." I'd agree simply dating her isn't grooming, however we obviously don't know the full details of that side of it. If he's been talking to her since 15 or something then that could be grooming. It's difficult to say without us knowing the full details, but if she's saying she's been groomed then I don't see an issue with saying that she's been groomed and don't think it minimises the word.

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That is fair. My brain didn't even think of the possibility that he may have been in contact for years already...

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21 minutes ago, Haguey said:

That is fair. My brain didn't even think of the possibility that he may have been in contact for years already...

I don't think it's a particularly uncommon tactic for abusive people to groom young and vulnerable people for months/years before beginning a relationship. It's the kind of thing the victim doesn't even realise.

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1 hour ago, Confused Clarity said:

If it takes a man confirming the allegations for him to be "done", rather than believing the countless women making the allegations, then that's clearly a problem in itself.

 

I don't know how to interpret that.   I agree with it, but it seems obvious.  I'm just saying, when band members come forward so adamantly, it's a pretty damning sign for the guy.

 

Edited by Analog
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Quote

Reznor‘s new comments regarding Manson pertain to a anecdote published in Manson‘s 1998 autobiography, ‘The Long Hard Road Out Of Hell‘. That passage seemed to imply that Manson and Reznor sexually assaulted an intoxicated woman together. Reznor has been adamant that the tale was a falsehood since it was originally published.

Spoiler

 

 

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16 hours ago, Analog said:

I don't know how to interpret that.   I agree with it, but it seems obvious.  I'm just saying, when band members come forward so adamantly, it's a pretty damning sign for the guy.

 

Was Borland really playing in the Marylin Manson band? I can´t find anything that proves that?

Anyway, you are right about that.

Reading these excerpts makes me sick

Edited by Carambau
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20 minutes ago, Carambau said:

Was Borland really playing in the Marylin Manson band? I can´t find anything that proves that?

 

Have you tried his wikipedia page?

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4 minutes ago, Rafalution said:

 

Have you tried his wikipedia page?

 

Ok, there is ONE brief sentence about him joining MM in 2008 for a short time. But if you check MMs wikipedia page, there is no mention of him under "former band members"..

Edited by Carambau
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1 hour ago, Carambau said:

 

Ok, there is ONE brief sentence about him joining MM in 2008 for a short time. But if you check MMs wikipedia page, there is no mention of him under "former band members"..

Borland has literally said "I was in the band for nine months".

You think Wikipedia is more reliable than words from his own mouth?

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10 minutes ago, Confused Clarity said:

Borland has literally said "I was in the band for nine months".

You think Wikipedia is more reliable than words from his own mouth?

Surely not. But I hadnt read the Borland article in detail before, so that explains my wikipedia search.

Edited by Carambau
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On 03/02/2021 at 19:30, decapitated said:

Seems like this was an open secret in Nu Metal circles.

I feel like at this point Borland would rather be called "Limp Bizkit guitarist Wes Borland"

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It’s like Weinstein all over again on a smaller scale. Seems everyone knew about a lot of stuff and just kept quiet.

Makes you wonder how many other open secrets are out there that we don’t know about. Yet. 

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Why do they stay quiet? Especially someone like Borland who seems rather willing to spill now.

Reznor and Manson haven't been relevant for a long, long time now so speaking out against them earlier wouldn't have affected him in any way.

(I include Reznor because he was basically joined at the hip to Manson for years so if Manson's done stuff, so has Reznor).

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30 minutes ago, Ackter said:

Why do they stay quiet? Especially someone like Borland who seems rather willing to spill now.

Reznor and Manson haven't been relevant for a long, long time now so speaking out against them earlier wouldn't have affected him in any way.

(I include Reznor because he was basically joined at the hip to Manson for years so if Manson's done stuff, so has Reznor).

Reznor has spoken out criticising him and denied any involvement, so until there are credible allegations against him too,  it seems unfair just to name him like that?

 

As for why they don't speak out? Assuming you mean the witnesses rather than the victims. Who knows the full reasons, but many have said they feared he'd make it difficult for their careers. Some have gone as far as saying they were directly afraid of him. Those things mesh with what has happened with other cases too.

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A lot of the Reznor stuff comes from a Manson autobiography, and he's already denied it. Whether it's actually true or not, who knows.

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14 minutes ago, Confused Clarity said:

Reznor has spoken out criticising him and denied any involvement, so until there are credible allegations against him too,  it seems unfair just to name him like that?

Thought he'd already been named as being involved with some of the weirder ****?

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43 minutes ago, Ackter said:

Thought he'd already been named as being involved with some of the weirder ****?

See Haguey's post. The only thing linking him so far has been Manson's own autobiography, which Reznor denied at the time and has maintained that stance since.

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3 hours ago, Ackter said:

Why do they stay quiet? Especially someone like Borland who seems rather willing to spill now.

Reznor and Manson haven't been relevant for a long, long time now so speaking out against them earlier wouldn't have affected him in any way.

(I include Reznor because he was basically joined at the hip to Manson for years so if Manson's done stuff, so has Reznor).

I would imagine the fear of being sued, by Manson's army of lawyers (no doubt) and having their careers destroyed. Same as Wienstien.

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But then I dated a woman who was friends with his current wife Lyndsay (and her twin sister – who’s married to James Iha of A Perfect Circle) and Lyndsay used to call our house In the early hours & I was told she was hysterical bcz he was on another drug binge, threatening her life, throwing knives at her that stuck in the wall & verbally assaulting her. We offered many times to have her come to mine bcz he would NEVER come face ME with that ******** (believe it) but sadly she wouldn’t leave him. So, my ex would be calm and talk her down until Manson realized she was on the phone and he whoa’d down.

But then he started calling in the early hours. I was told he was paranoid, gacked out of his mind, and accusing his wife of cheating with an imaginary person who had blonde hair with a blonde mustache named “Don” who he, I’m told, saw on his security cameras and was “****ing his wife”.

Look. This is heartbreaking for all the women he’s hurt but also for all the fans who always had his back – like ME.

BUT — He’s not the Luciferian evil everyone thinks he is. He’s just a violent junkie who chooses to bully and, according to reports, physically & sexually attacks women who he thinks are weaker than he is. I say …may he rot

 

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'kinell Jibby, that's grim. No one should have to go through that.

It's a point that gets missed in our circles - convicting people of any crime is hard, but with rape and sexual assault it's an extremely personal attack that affects people for life and yet in the UK it's approaching a 2% conviction rate of complaints made to the police.

 

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1 hour ago, Jibby123 said:

And shame. I was raped and sexually assaulted from 13-14 and even now I still feel ashamed by my actions back then and will until I die no matter what anyone says. It took me 9 years to tell anyone, my best friend when we were smashed (which unknowingly helped my case in the later criminal case decades later) and 35 years to report it to the police (who were brilliant tbf, far better than was expecting/hoping). 

I was dreading court, it would have gone to crown court, because my shame would have been x100 in front of a court. The guy is an old man now and long moved to another part of the country and if he'd denied it I'd probably have been stuffed, but for whatever reasons of his own he coughed and admitted to everything at the "invite to interview" stage with the police. I attended his sentencing and he got 4 years 8 months, never enough but he couldn't be charged with rape because it wasn't a classed as rape at the time of the offences. It is now. 

I got lucky with his plea. Many don't and many don't even get to court, so what's the point of reporting it? A whole world of stress and trauma and even if by lucky chance you do get a conviction and sentence it's never enough or any real closure, it can't change anything. There's never winners in these kind of cases is there? 

That was just me who nobody knows. How the victims of celebrities must feel in terms of becoming public knowledge I can't imagine and must be horrifying for them. Though I could legally never be identified I struggled with the process of it making the local newspaper and local facebook page (he was once a fairly well-known member of the community) and reading comments about the case from random strangers all with an opinion threw me and this was post-conviction, how it must be reading pre or during conviction god knows.

These victims of the real international public figures must have shuddering levels of reasons not to come forward when it comes to feeling humiliated, disbelieved or doubted and dissected by any random hack around the world with an opinion.

Well done for being brave enough to share that. I am sorry you went through it. 

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4 minutes ago, Rafalution said:

Sometimes giving an upvote feels really weird

I know what you mean, it was horrible to read, the upvote was more for the courage in actually posting it.

Horrid story jibby, I hope you have had support and counselling since reporting it.

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22 hours ago, Rafalution said:

Sometimes giving an upvote feels really weird

I think making that post go blue so everyone reads it and hears jibbys perspective is probably a good reason to do it.

another story on the BBC site today ref Manson. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-55978474

It seems pretty certain Manson is a bad man, hopefully all these allegations can be evidenced so he can be dealt with accordingly.

 

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On 05/02/2021 at 08:21, Ackter said:

Why do they stay quiet? Especially someone like Borland who seems rather willing to spill now.

Reznor and Manson haven't been relevant for a long, long time now so speaking out against them earlier wouldn't have affected him in any way.

(I include Reznor because he was basically joined at the hip to Manson for years so if Manson's done stuff, so has Reznor).

Because its usually a case of he says, she says and rich people can afford an army of lawyers and PR firms to help sway puiblic opinion and make legal cases a nightmare, unless theres some hard evidence, its probably not worth the hassle

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1 hour ago, cms186 said:

Because its usually a case of he says, she says and rich people can afford an army of lawyers and PR firms to help sway puiblic opinion and make legal cases a nightmare, unless theres some hard evidence, its probably not worth the hassle

It's well established Wes doesn't have much money nowadays either cos he's talked about agents and financial advisers ripping him off while Limp Bizkit were big, so he had almost nothing when he left in 2001. He wouldn't be able to afford the legal fees if he got sued.

Edited by Heartwork
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