[FM21] A Complete Guide to Quick Transitions and Counter Attacking Football

[daveb653]

17 hours ago, engamohd said:

Mind sharing what you did try?

I haven't as yet. I carried on with my 4411 that's similar to yours. I find when I try cautious my players tend to keep putting the ball into touch, so I'm guessing my roles and duties aren't right.

My original thought was an SV(a) and a dlp(d) as my 2 cdms but I find the SV(a) to be a little to gung-ho (though admittedly I haven't tried on cautious). 

I'm also debating starting a thread to help identify the playstyle i want

[Britrock]

Thanks for this thread. I used it to build a 4141 counter attacking system and despite being predicted to finish bottom by a mile, I'm currently 4 points above the relegation places with 8 games to go. The ST and LW and the main goal threats, with the LW and CMa the ball carriers. We sit at the bottom of the possession stats for the league (42%) but joint 10th for goals. My ST is on 20 goals from 32 games and some of the goals are tremendous to watch. The pass from space leads to some beautiful through balls splitting the defence

[Tsuru]

I came back to this topic to find some help. I have been playing on a counter attacking 4-1-4-1 DM Wide and we are doing good in general, but the team insists to hoof the ball foward, the only striker is carring the burden a little bit too much and we are very fragile defensively, specially when other teams press us too much. Sometimes it looks like we are not an attacking team neither a counter one.

I will test the two ball carriers on the advanced wings, that is, AP-AT at one side and IW-A at the other one, with a more conservative midfield and two WB-S giving support - which will benefit from a Half Back to create a back three. I am not sure if this will really work and I am still in doubt about the single striker, if DLF-S or AT, but I will test and let you know the results.

[CJ_Randell]

19 hours ago, Tsuru said:

I came back to this topic to find some help. I have been playing on a counter attacking 4-1-4-1 DM Wide and we are doing good in general, but the team insists to hoof the ball foward, the only striker is carring the burden a little bit too much and we are very fragile defensively, specially when other teams press us too much. Sometimes it looks like we are not an attacking team neither a counter one.

I will test the two ball carriers on the advanced wings, that is, AP-AT at one side and IW-A at the other one, with a more conservative midfield and two WB-S giving support - which will benefit from a Half Back to create a back three. I am not sure if this will really work and I am still in doubt about the single striker, if DLF-S or AT, but I will test and let you know the results.

I used a 433 with Wigan with good results. 

                   SK-De

WB-Su CD-De CD-De WB-Su

                  DM-De

           AP-At    BWM-Su

W-Su                              IW-At

                  DLF-Su

Using the Team Instructions from the OP, even managed a 3-0 win against a strong Spurs side in the first season. 

[Tsuru]

3 horas atrás, CJ_Randell disse:

I used a 433 with Wigan with good results. 

                   SK-De

WB-Su CD-De CD-De WB-Su

                  DM-De

           AP-At    BWM-Su

W-Su                              IW-At

                  DLF-Su

Using the Team Instructions from the OP, even managed a 3-0 win against a strong Spurs side in the first season. 

Thank you very much for your feedback. The roles/duties you presented are much similar to the ones I was already using, so I think I will follow it and change just the instructions, it will be easier than a bigger change of putting the two ball carriers on the wings, using a Half Back and so on.

[Sammie B]

Do you use any specific training schedules for your 1st and youth team?

[lilljons]

Hello... i play a defence first team. But since i got such a good team we often win the possession game by a lot. My issue is, that late game when i dont want to be hit with the counter - i want instead the opposition to have the ball and try to out play me. So my question is: How do i concede possession but still keep my teeth in defense? Dropping mentality dont seem to do it. Do i need to drop LoE and DL aswell?

[CARRERA]

2 hours ago, lilljons said:

How do i concede possession but still keep my teeth in defense?

The first thing to consider when going to defensive mode, is to naturally close gaps and exposed areas by your "main formation". Especially space behind the defense, in front of the defense and on the flanks should be closed. You literally only want the other team to cycle possession in front of the midfield. Every formation has some kind of space exposed, so you somehow need to pick your poison

 

 

Space behind your defense can be closed by lowering your defensive line. Also consider whether you need to lower your LOE to remain compact.

 

Spaced on the flanks can be closed by lowering the position of your Wide attackers to a wide midfielder role

 

Space in front of your defense / behind your midfield can be closed by using one or more DM's

 

So after switching to a more defensive shape, you can on top of that consider the following options. Going for all of them might make your team too passive, so choose carefully

• decrease pressing intensity. This is especially useful when playing in a low block so your players dont open up space behind your pressing defender. They will remain in position and try to intercept passing lanes or simply wait for a mistake of the attacker
• Stay on feet to not risk freekicks in a dangerous area
• norrow defending tobecome horizontally more compact and therefore give up space on the flanks. This could be usefull if your defenders have physical superiority over the other teams attackers. 
• regroup in transition to fall back into your defensive shape more quickly when loosing possession.
• pick a higher mentality if you still want to hit them on the break if chance accurs

Edited June 3, 2021 by CARRERA

[lilljons]

Thx, precisly the input i was looking for!

[smeagoltonez]

Thanks very much for this amazingly helpful thread! 
 

I currently only have a F9 who lacks height & strength & I don’t think I’ll be able to get a decent DLF anytime soon. How big a problem is this? Thanks again.

[HanziZoloman]

I‘d say a F9 could work well if he has TEC and BAL (?) and good ball carriers on his side and is not the main goal thread.

I try to implement this stuff into my relegation fighting side (Kaiserslautern) and it helps so much. Also I try to combine it with some of the early Thomas Tuchel (Mainz 05) who has mirrored other teams to shut them down defensively and play extremely flexible in Defense. I’m still in the development phase  but managed to climb the ladder above the line (15th place).

[HanziZoloman]

Am 18.2.2021 um 10:24 schrieb Britrock:

Thanks for this thread. I used it to build a 4141 counter attacking system and despite being predicted to finish bottom by a mile, I'm currently 4 points above the relegation places with 8 games to go. The ST and LW and the main goal threats, with the LW and CMa the ball carriers. We sit at the bottom of the possession stats for the league (42%) but joint 10th for goals. My ST is on 20 goals from 32 games and some of the goals are tremendous to watch. The pass from space leads to some beautiful through balls splitting the defence

Would you Tell is about your key Players and How Good they Are in certain areas please? 

Just avoided the drop with a beautiful 14th place. Battling the whole season. This quick transition approach is very flexible, simple and at times beautiful!

 

Edited December 17, 2021 by HanziZoloman

[Britrock]

On 17/12/2021 at 17:56, HanziZoloman said:

Would you Tell is about your key Players and How Good they Are in certain areas please? 

Just avoided the drop with a beautiful 14th place. Battling the whole season. This quick transition approach is very flexible, simple and at times beautiful!

 

Sadly not, that post is from 10 months ago and a previous FM version so any memory of it is long gone I'm afraid 

[Tsuru]

Does anybody still uses this approach?

I will migrate to FM 23 and I will probably test something like this in the new version.

[JackHornerFilms44]

6 hours ago, Tsuru said:

Does anybody still uses this approach?

I will migrate to FM 23 and I will probably test something like this in the new version.

I used a 442 on FM22 right before the beta came out, was quite effective. I haven’t tried anything with 23 though. 

[CharlieTZR]

Does anyone testing this in FM24? I tried but without much success.