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Bad ratings for Advanced Playmaker in 433 DM (even though he provides and scores)


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I've been trying this 433 DM formation with an Advanced Playmaker on attack.

I've tried this with a few teams (and tested a few seasons) and came up with the same result, the avg rating of the AP(A) is very low

  • Leicester with Tielemans in the AP(A) slot
  • Club Brugge with Vanaken in the AP(A) slot

The team performs well (we overachieve) and the AP (A) is in the top 3 of both Assists and goals.
However he is by far the lowest rated starting player on my squad (averaging 6.80)

When I look at what may be causing this is that a lot of matches the AP gets a 6.0 to 6.3 rating for having a pass completion of 75% or below.
In FM Touch (I don't know if it's the case in FM full fat as well) I can not see the missed passes in the analysis view.

In the player rating it shows: Total 40, completed 75% but in the anlysis view I can only see the 30 completed ones, I see 1 intercepted, but no out of play, no woodwork passes, ... no sign of the other 9 passes that didn't count as completed....

On the one hand you can say: "just keep using your tactic, it obviously works", but I cannot get around the fact that my playmaker gets such a low rating.
The only time I've been able to have a good rating was when simulating a season with Real Madrid and I've put Kroos in that spot.

I've gone back and loaded up FM20, choose leicester, put Tielemans in the squad with exactly the same tactic... after Vardy he is the highest rated player on my team...
Surely something must be of in FM21?, no matter what I do with leicester in a 433 DM and Tielemans in the AP spot I cannot get more than a 6.8 out of him on season average...

Is there something wrong with the pass completion thing? or Is my player really behaving this bad, and why can't I see those missed passes in the analysis data? (I don't have time or ambition to go and watch full games to identify this)

FormationIssue.png

Edited by DavyDepuydt1
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Well, why do you insist on using an AP on an attack duty in the first place? It doesn't really suit the style of football you're trying to play with shorter passing, higher LoE, and aggressive pressing. Ideally, an AP-A fits counter attacking systems, and it doesn't look like that's what you're trying to achieve, so this might be part of your problem.

Plus, an AP-A is hard coded to dribble more, but Tielemans is a pretty average dribbler I think, so just use him as a DLP instead or maybe even as a customized CM-Su with more risky passing ticked.

Edited by Hartplatz
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1 hour ago, DavyDepuydt1 said:

I've been trying this 433 DM formation with an Advanced Playmaker on attack.

I've tried this with a few teams (and tested a few seasons) and came up with the same result, the avg rating of the AP(A) is very low

  • Leicester with Tielemans in the AP(A) slot
  • Club Brugge with Vanaken in the AP(A) slot

The team performs well (we overachieve) and the AP (A) is in the top 3 of both Assists and goals.
However he is by far the lowest rated starting player on my squad (averaging 6.80)

When I look at what may be causing this is that a lot of matches the AP gets a 6.0 to 6.3 rating for having a pass completion of 75% or below.
In FM Touch (I don't know if it's the case in FM full fat as well) I can not see the missed passes in the analysis view.

In the player rating it shows: Total 40, completed 75% but in the anlysis view I can only see the 30 completed ones, I see 1 intercepted, but no out of play, no woodwork passes, ... no sign of the other 9 passes that didn't count as completed....

On the one hand you can say: "just keep using your tactic, it obviously works", but I cannot get around the fact that my playmaker gets such a low rating.
The only time I've been able to have a good rating was when simulating a season with Real Madrid and I've put Kroos in that spot.

I've gone back and loaded up FM20, choose leicester, put Tielemans in the squad with exactly the same tactic... after Vardy he is the highest rated player on my team...
Surely something must be of in FM21?, no matter what I do with leicester in a 433 DM and Tielemans in the AP spot I cannot get more than a 6.8 out of him on season average...

Is there something wrong with the pass completion thing? or Is my player really behaving this bad, and why can't I see those missed passes in the analysis data? (I don't have time or ambition to go and watch full games to identify this)

FormationIssue.png

There are known issues with some of the analytics and internal stat collection in FM21- tackles and pass maps, crosses displayed etc. The advice of 'ignore the ratings' would be fair enough if the ratings were independent of game play and merely offered a way to quickly judge performances. But because player morale/value/success is partially dependent on the rating that they get it is a little annoying. I don't really have any advice beyond sucking it up, or start using a different tactic :/ 

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2 hours ago, Flußkrebs said:

There are known issues with some of the analytics and internal stat collection in FM21- tackles and pass maps, crosses displayed etc. The advice of 'ignore the ratings' would be fair enough if the ratings were independent of game play and merely offered a way to quickly judge performances. But because player morale/value/success is partially dependent on the rating that they get it is a little annoying. I don't really have any advice beyond sucking it up, or start using a different tactic :/ 

Thanks for this, I thought the latest patch fixed all player ratings issue, but apparantly stats & ratings are still not 100% correct

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3 hours ago, Flußkrebs said:

There are known issues with some of the analytics and internal stat collection in FM21- tackles and pass maps, crosses displayed etc. The advice of 'ignore the ratings' would be fair enough if the ratings were independent of game play and merely offered a way to quickly judge performances. But because player morale/value/success is partially dependent on the rating that they get it is a little annoying. I don't really have any advice beyond sucking it up, or start using a different tactic :/ 

I don't deny that's still an issue of course and it might well be part of what the OP is seeing. But as I said, it might be worth having another look at his tactic, I'm not conviced an AP-A suits his setup, even if Tielemans has lots of goals and assists. The playmaker role should not be looked on in isolation and this might very well contribute to the OP's rating problems, stat collection aside.

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1 hour ago, DavyDepuydt1 said:

Thanks for this, I thought the latest patch fixed all player ratings issue, but apparantly stats & ratings are still not 100% correct

The last patch fixed some of the issues related to stats, but others like key tackles are still MIA, making judgement of CDs pretty difficult i.e.

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I play a pretty similar tactic to yours, my IF is in attack and my RB in FB-Su.

I get pretty decent ratings from my AP-At but I have him Roaming the field to get him more involved in the game. That might help.

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if player ratings are broken, it really does not matter what role or PI you give your players, he will never actually achieve the rating you're looking for because the system itself is completely broken.

as others have suggested, the only answer is to suck it up. at least you know in your mind that your AP working as intended and that the game itself is the problem, not so much your tactic. 

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9 hours ago, Hartplatz said:

Well, why do you insist on using an AP on an attack duty in the first place? It doesn't really suit the style of football you're trying to play with shorter passing, higher LoE, and aggressive pressing. Ideally, an AP-A fits counter attacking systems, and it doesn't look like that's what you're trying to achieve, so this might be part of your problem.

Plus, an AP-A is hard coded to dribble more, but Tielemans is a pretty average dribbler I think, so just use him as a DLP instead or maybe even as a customized CM-Su with more risky passing ticked.

What exactly is that based on? I'm not sure how you've read the OP and come away with this advice tbh, by all accounts the AP is working fine but the game isn't reflecting that with the player ratings. 

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Look, I know ratings were flawed before the recent hotfix, but in this case, I don't think we can draw any conclusions. Not yet anyway. We simply don't know if the AP works fine or not. An AP-At is all about swift attacks, whereas the OP is set up for possession oriented football. Plus, Tielemans is an average dribbler by Premier League Standards, so he might concede possession (AP-At has dribble more). And playmakers are not just about assists, the second to last pass is equally important, and he might struggle to deliver in that particular setup.

So even if the AP has plenty of assists and goals, he might still struggle, in particular in those 6.0-6.3 matches the OP mentioned. I just think we need a little more information.

Edited by Hartplatz
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