Tactic building help?

[jamesh123]

Hi all. I'm currently trying to improve my tactic for my Derby County side and was wondering If anyone could help me out please? My ideal style is to build out from the back but look to play a more of a direct passing style as I would rather us look to play the ball forward rather than tap it about sideways all game. I also have instructions on my attackers and MEZ to press more so I'm not overcommitting on the press by asking everyone to do that job. Many thanks if someone can help.

[frukox]

6 hours ago, jamesh123 said:

Hi all. I'm currently trying to improve my tactic for my Derby County side and was wondering If anyone could help me out please? My ideal style is to build out from the back but look to play a more of a direct passing style as I would rather us look to play the ball forward rather than tap it about sideways all game. I also have instructions on my attackers and MEZ to press more so I'm not overcommitting on the press by asking everyone to do that job. Many thanks if someone can help.

Let me give a couple of tips:) Your left side is shaky. IFA doesn't track back reliably, MEZ will roam from position and drifts wide and CWB will also roam from position,dribbles with the ball-it's a really aggressive role. This means there is no reliable cover or backwards passing option on that flank. If you lose the ball there, you are going to be in trouble.

For fast transitions, I'd prefer a playmaker on support or attack rather than a DLPD because he may not be involved in the game as much as you want. He will just attract balls when you build play from your CDs. Then, the ball will just go forward with urgency.

You need more penetration from your midfield. BBM or MEZ will only arrive late in the area unless he has the trait of Gets Forward or Gets Into Opp Area. Your striker lacks proper support from there.

When you press high in the opposition half you'd better change it to Stay on Feet not to get too many cards or not get caught when the opposition manages to play through your press. 

More Direct Passing + Higher Tempo may see your team lose possession more often than you'd like so I'd be wary of those instructions because Positive mentality already does that to an extent.

You can also add Hit Early Crosses if you add one more player into the penalty area to catch the opposition defence off guard.

Edited January 13, 2021 by frukox

[Experienced Defender]

17 hours ago, jamesh123 said:

wondering If anyone could help me out please?

I can give you some tips based on my personal tactical approach (which seems to be helpful for most people here):

- an attack-minded fullback role (CWB) paired with an also attack-minded CM role (mezzala) means your left flank could be overly exposed defensively (and even more so given that both CWB and mezzala are roaming roles as well)

- no need to use a role such as CWB in a non-narrow formation anyway, because CWB is the most effective when he has no wide partner on his flank

- given that both CM roles are roaming runners (BBM and MEZ), such partnership can also have a negative impact on defensive solidity (especially if you are not a top team)

- up front, a partnership of a simple runner/scorer role (PF on attack) and a similar type of wide forward role (IF on attack) is usually not an optimal combo (the easiest tweak would be to change the IF on attack into IW on attack) 

17 hours ago, jamesh123 said:

I also have instructions on my attackers and MEZ to press more so I'm not overcommitting on the press by asking everyone to do that job

If you want to use a split block, then it's advisable to improve your defensive compactness, i.e. bring it to the optimal level. In this particular case, the easiest way to do that is to drop the LOE just one notch (to standard instead of higher).

Get stuck in is also an instruction I would avoid in a tactic like yours, simply because you play with a high D-line (plus under a high team mentality), which means that hard tackling can easily cause trouble for your defense. 

These are the most pressing issues in your tactic IMHO.

[jamesh123]

12 hours ago, frukox said:

Let me give a couple of tips:) Your left side is shaky. IFA doesn't track back reliably, MEZ will roam from position and drifts wide and CWB will also roam from position,dribbles with the ball-it's a really aggressive role. This means there is no reliable cover or backwards passing option on that flank. If you lose the ball there, you are going to be in trouble.

For fast transitions, I'd prefer a playmaker on support or attack rather than a DLPD because he may not be involved in the game as much as you want. He will just attract balls when you build play from your CDs. Then, the ball will just go forward with urgency.

You need more penetration from your midfield. BBM or MEZ will only arrive late in the area unless he has the trait of Gets Forward or Gets Into Opp Area. Your striker lacks proper support from there.

When you press high in the opposition half you'd better change it to Stay on Feet not to get too many cards or not get caught when the opposition manages to play through your press. 

More Direct Passing + Higher Tempo may see your team lose possession more often than you'd like so I'd be wary of those instructions because Positive mentality already does that to an extent.

You can also add Hit Early Crosses if you add one more player into the penalty area to catch the opposition defence off guard.

So change the LB to a FB? But unsure if on support or attack. And then to aid with the transitions replace the MEZ with an AP on support and change the DLP to a DM/Anchor? Only had it as DLP to utilise Max Bird as he has decent attributed for that role. How would you suggest adding more penetration from midfield? And take off the higher tempo and keep the direct passing?

[jamesh123]

19 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

I can give you some tips based on my personal tactical approach (which seems to be helpful for most people here):

- an attack-minded fullback role (CWB) paired with an also attack-minded CM role (mezzala) means your left flank could be overly exposed defensively (and even more so given that both CWB and mezzala are roaming roles as well)

- no need to use a role such as CWB in a non-narrow formation anyway, because CWB is the most effective when he has no wide partner on his flank

- given that both CM roles are roaming runners (BBM and MEZ), such partnership can also have a negative impact on defensive solidity (especially if you are not a top team)

- up front, a partnership of a simple runner/scorer role (PF on attack) and a similar type of wide forward role (IF on attack) is usually not an optimal combo (the easiest tweak would be to change the IF on attack into IW on attack) 

If you want to use a split block, then it's advisable to improve your defensive compactness, i.e. bring it to the optimal level. In this particular case, the easiest way to do that is to drop the LOE just one notch (to standard instead of higher).

Get stuck in is also an instruction I would avoid in a tactic like yours, simply because you play with a high D-line (plus under a high team mentality), which means that hard tackling can easily cause trouble for your defense. 

These are the most pressing issues in your tactic IMHO.

So I i change the left back to a FB on support or attacking, what role would you recommend using in the LCM position? AP maybe? Or could that still leave me a bit to exposed on that side?

Is there any roles you would recommend changing in the midfield? As I could change the DLP to a DM, and switch the MEZ to an AP, but unsure on what the best role would be to use as the RCM unless I use a BBM in that role? 

[Experienced Defender]

4 minutes ago, jamesh123 said:

So I i change the left back to a FB on support or attacking, what role would you recommend using in the LCM position?

I would not change the LB into FB on support, because that could lead to insufficient wide attacking support for the IF on that flank. Basically, these are role combinations I would consider for that side, assuming the rest of the setup remains unchanged:

Example 1 (moderately risky):

IFat

        APsu

WBsu

Example 2 (minimal risk, "perfect" balance):

IFat

       DLPsu

WBsu 

But given that you already have a DLP in DM, I would then change him into a non-playmaker holding role (DM on defend duty or anchor). Because there is no need to have 2 playmakers so close to each other, especially if you want to play a more direct and faster style of football. 

11 minutes ago, jamesh123 said:

Is there any roles you would recommend changing in the midfield? As I could change the DLP to a DM, and switch the MEZ to an AP, but unsure on what the best role would be to use as the RCM unless I use a BBM in that role?

There is no such thing as "best role(s)". There are only good (well-balanced) role partnerships and combinations. 

[jamesh123]

4 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

I would not change the LB into FB on support, because that could lead to insufficient wide attacking support for the IF on that flank. Basically, these are role combinations I would consider for that side, assuming the rest of the setup remains unchanged:

Example 1 (moderately risky):

IFat

        APsu

WBsu

Example 2 (minimal risk, "perfect" balance):

IFat

       DLPsu

WBsu 

But given that you already have a DLP in DM, I would then change him into a non-playmaker holding role (DM on defend duty or anchor). Because there is no need to have 2 playmakers so close to each other, especially if you want to play a more direct and faster style of football. 

There is no such thing as "best role(s)". There are only good (well-balanced) role partnerships and combinations. 

Ah okay thankyou, I'll give it a try

[frukox]

20 minutes ago, jamesh123 said:

So change the LB to a FB? But unsure if on support or attack. And then to aid with the transitions replace the MEZ with an AP on support and change the DLP to a DM/Anchor? Only had it as DLP to utilise Max Bird as he has decent attributed for that role. How would you suggest adding more penetration from midfield? And take off the higher tempo and keep the direct passing?

Changing it to LB isn't enough, I'm afraid. I think you want PFA to score so you can use both of them to support him in different ways like this trio:

                  PA

IWA                            WS

PA will occupy CBs. IWA and WS will support him with through balls and crosses in different phases of attacking transitions to support this trio, you can try this combination:

         DLPS          MEZA

                      A

MEZA will occupy right half space and go past WS frequently. DLPS will sit in the space between him and A. A will protect the central channel with taking minimal risks.

IWA

            DLPS

WBS

IWA cuts inside, WBS goes wide and forward while DLPS covers them.

            WS

MEZA

            IWBS/FBS(with Sit Narrower)

WS stretches game to maintain width, MEZA goes forward to the area between the winger and P while IWBS covers them.

Try removing more direct passes and/or higher tempo and please report back your findings.