VAR sucks

[TopKent]

Every single var decision is an overturned decision for offside. Never see it go to var and get awarded. Had the occasionally penalty over turned which is good but every time a goal is checked for offside it's always offside. Super annoying. 

[Harper]

53 minutes ago, TopKent said:

Every single var decision is an overturned decision for offside. Never see it go to var and get awarded. Had the occasionally penalty over turned which is good but every time a goal is checked for offside it's always offside. Super annoying. 

It's difficult to create subjectivity (VAR and offsides) in binary system (computer programs).

Edited December 4, 2020 by Harper

[goranm]

VAR definitely needs improving. As of now it's just a gimmick that doesn't add anything to the game. There's zero suspense because 99.9% of the time a goal is going to be disallowed. I've had that 0.01% event earlier today when a goal was allowed (it wasn't an offside check) and it was the first VAR decision that didn't disallow a goal in some 150 matches.

[SmurfDude]

Yes if VAR is going to decide 100% of offside goals are indeed offside, then the VAR implementation in FM is 100% pointless as you already know the outcome. 10 seconds spent waiting for an outcome you already know is a waste of the players time. Code in a degree of randomness. I don't know what unit of measurement the programmers use in the ME, however it all comes down to a simple operation, whether it's less than/equal to or greater than. Add an arbitrary value, I don't know, maybe the ME's equivalent of 10cm, something that would be tricky to get 100% spot on when watching a replay back, then randomize the true/false result. It'd add in a bit of a realistic human element to VAR instead of the pointless implementation it currently is 

Edited December 4, 2020 by SmurfDude

[Smurf]

Everyone seems to think it's just a matter of putting in 

If
VAR required
Sub-Routine - 99.9%

End VAR

It's far more complex to code in something like this. 

First of all the original code for offside needs to be tweaked to allow an opposing player to be in an offside position. 

Then you have to code another routine that either objects or accepts the decisions.

[goranm]

1 hour ago, Smurf said:

It's far more complex to code in something like this. 

To make in-game VAR less annoying you really don't have to do anything complex. Just tell the game to once in a while trigger the VAR animation on a goal that the ME has already decided to be legit, with the end result of the goal being approved. So far it works in the opposite end, it's almost always triggered only on the goals that the ME has decided to be offside goals. The game doesn't actually have to have a subroutine for VAR for it to be included in a way that's not annoying and unexciting.

Edited December 4, 2020 by goranm

[TioPatinhax]

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but VAR actually worked properly in FM19, but then in 20 and 21 stopped working as it should.

 

 

[Smurf]

3 hours ago, goranm said:

To make in-game VAR less annoying you really don't have to do anything complex. Just tell the game to once in a while trigger the VAR animation on a goal that the ME has already decided to be legit, with the end result of the goal being approved. So far it works in the opposite end, it's almost always triggered only on the goals that the ME has decided to be offside goals. The game doesn't actually have to have a subroutine for VAR for it to be included in a way that's not annoying and unexciting.

I'm not going to pretend to know how the game is coded - but I imagine it's difficult, else they would have done it. Perhaps it's something they are working on, I don't know, and they wouldn't tell you either way.

Besides, I'm playing FM12 here and the offside lines come up VAR style on this version, and that was 8 years ago. Offside is always offisde - and it's just the replay that confirms it. 

What is needed is a system where it's called offside - and the VAR reverses the decision. 
But then wouldn't the offside have to be changed to not flag immediately and let play run on?
And if it does run on - how long for?

 

• You almost need an invisible linesman. 
• The visible linesman has an error ratio
• The invisible linesman (VAR) has an accurate account.
• But then there are times VAR is wrong. So VAR needs to be inaccurate too.
• Or more to the point it checks with the REF who checks pitchside monitor and either rules for or against.

There's a lot of variables. 

If you were to add them up there's probably about 6 different scenrios for each. 

In just my quick analysis of what can happen there's about 3125 permuations. 

I'm probably wrong. 

But someone has to code all that.

 

[mozza79]

3 hours ago, TioPatinhax said:

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but VAR actually worked properly in FM19, but then in 20 and 21 stopped working as it should.

 

 

i seem to recall it worked better at first too with decisions overturned regularly.

i would rather have VAR if it had the jeopardy of real life but as it works now its just a waste of my time knowing the decision pretty much every time. the only time i see decisions over turned is whether a foul is in the box or outside, the offsides are just 100 percent no goal it seems every time. 

[goranm]

I agree with you @Smurf that coding a simulation of VAR is not easy. What I am saying is that currently VAR feels as just a cosmetic add-on, at least when it comes to goals disallowed for offside. It feels like faux VAR where the animation is triggered after the ME has already decided that the goal is offside, and only then (here I'm talking about offside goals only, for penalties it works better). Because there is no action in the other way, that is VAR triggering when the ME decided that the goal is lawful, it just becomes dull and predictable.

When it comes to goals, I've only ever had 1 goal allowed by VAR, and this wasn't for an offside check, but a supposed foul in the box.

There is a more realistic variation when a penalty foul is decided by VAR, so it's puzzling to me how it works well in this situation but not in others.

 

[Smurf]

47 minutes ago, goranm said:

I agree with you @Smurf that coding a simulation of VAR is not easy. What I am saying is that currently VAR feels as just a cosmetic add-on, at least when it comes to goals disallowed for offside. It feels like faux VAR where the animation is triggered after the ME has already decided that the goal is offside, and only then (here I'm talking about offside goals only, for penalties it works better). Because there is no action in the other way, that is VAR triggering when the ME decided that the goal is lawful, it just becomes dull and predictable.

When it comes to goals, I've only ever had 1 goal allowed by VAR, and this wasn't for an offside check, but a supposed foul in the box.

There is a more realistic variation when a penalty foul is decided by VAR, so it's puzzling to me how it works well in this situation but not in others.

 

Maybe because they haven't figured it out fully to be a workable solution to release in public. Just a guess.

[TopKent]

10 hours ago, goranm said:

To make in-game VAR less annoying you really don't have to do anything complex. Just tell the game to once in a while trigger the VAR animation on a goal that the ME has already decided to be legit, with the end result of the goal being approved. So far it works in the opposite end, it's almost always triggered only on the goals that the ME has decided to be offside goals. The game doesn't actually have to have a subroutine for VAR for it to be included in a way that's not annoying and unexciting.

100% agree here, just have them do a var check on ones that are considered goals as well, that way atleast you don't already know the outcome. It's annoying as **** when they do the var check now because they could just flag offside and save everyone time. 

 

[goranm]

After 261 games played it happened: a goal suspected for offside was given after a VAR check. However, there was no VAR animation like there is when goals are disallowed or when penalties are called. That the ref was doing a VAR check was mentioned only in the commentary.

I suspect that VAR on offside is not working properly, and it seems like there are two instances of VAR in the ME, one that's triggered on an offside goal and comes with the animation, and the other much rarer that approves a goal and appears in commentary only.

If anyone wants to take a look at this, it's the final goal in the attached match.

Sassuolo v Milan.pkm

Edited December 8, 2020 by goranm