When do you settle on a tactic?

[ashlfcowen]

I'm having a little mindset fart. 

I promised myself that on the release of the FM21 Beta - I would really take the time to get to understand how tactics and certain philosophies' within the game work. 

I have been analysing my tactics, watching matches in comprehensive mode, trying to understand what the flaws are, what needs work, what needs to be fixed, where I'm going wrong and I like to thank I have a decent understanding of roles and duties now. 

BUT...

If you are not playing as a top, top team … at what point do you personally settle on the tactic, and think, right, okay...all I need now are better players.

For context, I am playing as Atalanta and I am playing a 4-3-3 DM Wide and I am playing a controlled possession game. 

So, rather than seek tactical advice, I guess my question is - when are you happy enough with your tactic that you just STOP fiddling?

[Rashidi]

Once I see it do a transition from back to front successfully with a good chance created and once I see it transition safely back when it has to defend or when i see it break up the opposition attacks. Other things I look for.

I normally look for successful defensive line traps being triggered
Successful overloads either centrally or on the flanks
Assists generated from the golden zone, area just in front of the penalty area and slightly to the sides
Interceptions from triggering defensive line traps. (ie setting your LOE/DL and pressing in such a way that when your team presses the opposition clears the ball and you intercept)
Defending well on the transition from counters and set pieces
Ensuring any other pressing traps I have set up are working.
And finally, learning what OIs work well with what formations.
 

[ashlfcowen]

Rashidi, thank you. Big fan of the work you do for us FMers via your Youtube channel.

I think I am happy with some of the above you mentioned. 

One thing I noticed is that a 'split press', i.e. having my 5 forward players on 'press more' didn't work half as well as I would have liked. Since removing those OIs and using the 'More Urgent' TI my team players so much better - I was surprised at how well, actually. 

I guess I will slow some of the games down again and just double check I am happy with the above. 

One thing I do need to look at is defending well on the transition from counters and set pieces. 
 

[Rashidi]

Yeah what you have done is tell everyone to shift which can also work

[ashlfcowen]

You have thankfully made me dig a little deeper, and I know this only paints an overall pictures but so far after 14 games in the Serie A, we are:
 

• 6th, 7 points behind 1st.
• We have scored 25 and conceded 12
• We have an average possession % of 58 - 1st in the league, having completed 92% of our passes - again 1st in the league
• 17 of a total of 45 assists in the last 26 matches have come from the golden area.
• We have completed 81% of our tackles - 4th best in the league and we have 487 interceptions in total, putting us 2nd best.

I have posted my current line-up below.

My DLF, IF, AP, RPM and BBM all have roam more as an OI.

My IF is asked to get further forward and to sit narrower.

My backline are all asked to take less risks and my two full backs are asked to cross less often.

One observation is that my 5 players from top to middle all have average (13-14) attributes around the ones I deem to be quite important around possession play with intent, which, in my eyes are passing, technique, work rate decisions and off the ball.

[llama3]

I don't think it's ever "done" because sometimes players get injured, in and out of form, etc. and you need to switch things up a bit. Sometimes a new player can actually change the balance of the team and how you play. So, I've always got ideas on how to adapt. There's really nothing better than results and performances - how well are you outperforming your expectations and consistently generating good performances? On FM20 I had a 106 point unbeaten season and really I just left everything each week, because it worked, momentum was there etc., as I progressed on I found I was struggling in Europe in the late knockout matches and my approach switched a bit to try and find ways of overcoming those difficulties - we were a less dominant league side, but we finally put away the Champions League.

A long winded way of saying - if your eyes are telling you it's all working, balanced, and your side is settled - then leave it alone. If your eyes are telling you it's not right, got some clear weaknesses, keep making sensible tweaks based on what you're seeing, sound tactical logic and preferably backed up by data. Each change should be for a clear reason, rather than just trying it.

[ashlfcowen]

Agreed @llama3. I think my days of wanting to plug and play, and space-bash my way through the game are over - it's how I used to play and for that reason I quickly got bored. (Hence why I decided to manage Atalanta and not my usual team Liverpool)

Honestly? From what I can see, my team play nice football , especially when we have the ball.

I think sometimes we are toothless in attack, but then in the league we average 2 goals per game, so maybe not. 

 

[llama3]

19 minutes ago, ashlfcowen said:

Agreed @llama3. I think my days of wanting to plug and play, and space-bash my way through the game are over - it's how I used to play and for that reason I quickly got bored. (Hence why I decided to manage Atalanta and not my usual team Liverpool)

Honestly? From what I can see, my team play nice football , especially when we have the ball.

I think sometimes we are toothless in attack, but then in the league we average 2 goals per game, so maybe not. 

 

In fairness, my team's weakness is that sometimes we come up against a deep defence and don't always find a way of creating enough good quality chances to break them down. I think the changes to "focus left/centre/right" instructions has been really useful, it's allowed me to help channel the build up where I'm getting most joy. I've always found that sometimes I can go down a rabbit hole, and actually need to step back, survey the scene again and go back to my core philosophies.

I used the xG data to confirm what my eyes could see that we didn't get enough good chances. Used the xG match story to review how some in-game changes had worked, and it gave me a good basis to work from.

[ashlfcowen]

Honestly, I think the reason I started this thread is because I wasn't happy with what I was seeing.

Every time we lost the ball, I worried and it looked like the opposition would score. You only have to look at the general performance in the Serie A to see that there was a glaring weakness within the way we set up.



If you look back at my set-up from the 5th post, I think the issue for giving up so many chances to the AI was down to 3 things...

- We were too risk in our approach, and we didn't have the players to back it - and so I think this is the reason we were losing possession too easily in the middle, mostly. Therefore I have reduced the Mentality from Positive to Balanced.

- The higher defensive line and the higher line of engagement was alienating our top 5 from the bottom 5, meaning by the time the AI had transitioned into a counter, we were being overloaded. I have therefore moved the line of engagement down, but as a result, asked our team to press with more urgency.

- All of our team were trying to play through the middle, so, to introduce SOME with I have gone from playing an AP(S) on the right wing to a W(S) - I have no idea how this is going to play out yet but I'll be sure to keep an eye. To compensate for the AP now being on attack, I have asked the FB(s) to play more narrow and so he is now an IWB(S).

Just a few changes...and so now this is how my tactic looks: 

Now the question is....

ARE THESE CHANGES LOGICAL?! lol. We'll see...

[llama3]

@ashlfcowenthey're all sensible decisions though, based on exactly what I'd said above - data, solid tactical logic and using your eyes. Fingers crossed.

[ashlfcowen]

So far, so good. Inter at home was the last game before the changes. Slight blip against Verona but otherwise, positive changes.