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[England Premier Division] Data Issues


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28 minutes ago, LC15 said:

A few wolves players have caps for national teams not currently in the DB (some are fairly recent and with the international break coming up there may be more added to these and others, not sure when the cut off is for adding these in to the game?)

Daniel Podence (Portugal) currently has 1 cap not listed

Conor Coady (Eng) currently has 3 caps and 1 goal not listed

A side note on Conor Coady is that he doesn't seem to be picked for any England squads in my game so far but has recently broken in to the team and seems to have started well (kept his place in the squad for this break). I'm curious if this is to do with his CA compared to others and if there's any tweaks that may be helpful attribute wise to reflect his recent inclusions in the national squad in the game too? 

 

All of those international caps have been made since the start of the season so won't be included. I'll see what we can do on him being selected for the national team.

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United's squad rating was considerably below the top English clubs in the end of season review guidelines, much closer to top 6 competition like Leicester and Wolves than Man City and Liverpool.

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I got this response when trying to sign Ozil while managing Schalke. I posted it on twitter, and the official FM account replied and suggested I report it as a likely bug. I think it is possible he may or may not be willing to sign, but I believe Ozil has stated publicly that he still has great affinity for the city of Gelsenkirchen and the club where he first broke through as a professional. 

Screenshot (1).png

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On 10/11/2020 at 18:47, GSevensM75 said:

Hi, this isn't a data issue and my understanding is that because Davies didn't come through the youth ranks at Spurs, and isn't English, he isn't classified as homegrown for European competition.

 

You're right, sorry/thanks!

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On 11/11/2020 at 07:09, Blayne said:

Hello There

 

Should Newcastle have such low Training and Youth facilities?

Both are rated as "Average" whilst the rest of the league is much higher

i'm more surprised it's actually not lower. our facilities are considered actually even worse than some championship clubs in real life or maybe even league one club. definitely the worst in the premier league.
welcome to the world of Ashley.

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6 hours ago, swansongs said:

United's squad rating was considerably below the top English clubs in the end of season review guidelines, much closer to top 6 competition like Leicester and Wolves than Man City and Liverpool.

Well something isn't right in the game, because they are so ridiculously overrated. 

i will admit individually Man Utd have a lot of good players but they don't play as a team and massively lack consistency IRL yet in game they are walking the league on huge unbeaten runs. There is absolutely no way they should be as good as they are and they need to be nerfed before release day otherwise it's going to ruin the game. 

also whilst on the subject of Man Utd, how is it they seem to have infinite money, can pretty much buy any player in the game straight away (subject to finances) and seem to have ultimate pulling power for the top players, they are not really part of the so called big 4 anymore and like you say are more aligned with the likes of Arsenal, Spurs, Leicester & Wolves. 

somebody please sort this out as it is going to ruin the game. 

Edited by Dean Gripton
taking out the insults.
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13 minutes ago, swansongs said:

United's squad rating was considerably below the top English clubs in the end of season review guidelines, much closer to top 6 competition like Leicester and Wolves than Man City and Liverpool.

I can't tell you what is wrong.  I don't know enough about the game and how all the stats interact with each other and because of that I don't have the language to express it.  All I can tell you is what I see in the game and what I see is United either challenging for the league or winning it, their players topping goals, assists and average rating charts and them essentially being the Man United of the 2000s.

I'd be interested to see somebody sim the first season 100 times and find United's average position.  I don't know what that will be but I know that it will definitely not be fourth to sixth.

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6 hours ago, middlo82 said:

Well something isn't right in the game, because they are so ridiculously overrated.

i will admit individually Man Utd have a lot of good players but they don't play as a team and massively lack consistency IRL yet in game they are walking the league on huge unbeaten runs. There is absolutely no way they should be as good as they are and they need to be nerfed before release day otherwise it's going to ruin the game. 

also whilst on the subject of Man Utd, how is it they seem to have infinite money, can pretty much buy any player in the game straight away (subject to finances) and seem to have ultimate pulling power for the top players, they are not really part of the so called big 4 anymore and like you say are more aligned with the likes of Arsenal, Spurs, Leicester & Wolves. 

somebody please sort this out as it is going to ruin the game. 

Criticising the researcher isnt going to help. Put your evidence up using stats and figures then im sure they will look into it.

Edited by Dean Gripton
taking out the insults in the quoted comment.
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18 hours ago, nachos said:

As posted towards the end of last year's thread, Marvellous Nakamba of Aston Villa is definitely left footed: https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/marvelous-nakamba/profil/spieler/324882

From watching him all last season he is actually one of the most left only footed players I've seen. Hardly ever lets the ball touch his right.

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6 minutes ago, Nick OGS20 said:

Response to this and those following up on it - don’t want to give away too much as I know some don’t like to read CAs, but United are ranked fifth on average CA in the PL, 16th on average consistency and OGS is ranked joint 18th among PL managers. All of those ratings are a long way off the obvious top two. Everyone will have their view on underrated and overrated players but I don’t believe there’s anyone there with a CA that can’t be very easily justified. 

I do agree that we’re overperforming at the moment and we’re trying to get to the bottom of why that is. I think the above shows it’s not a case of ‘blinkered’ research or anything like that - they’re the ratings of a team with the talent to push for top 3/4 but major consistency issues and a manager a bit out of his depth. That seems fair to me - we did finish third last season after all (and most of the ratings will be based on that rather than early stages of a new season that has been plain weird so far - if you cite us being in 14th then you have to look at City, Arsenal etc as well).

We’ve made some changes to Cavani and Telles that will filter through when an update happens - usually no changes are made to players transferred in as we trust the prior researchers, but those two seem to be specifically overperforming so they have been revised. There have been some small changes to Pogba as well, even though his performances in tests have been generally pretty average. 

Feedback I’ve got this this morning is that there are issues with forward players at some of the bigger clubs (City, Liverpool, Chelsea) and those teams as a whole majorly underperforming in terms of goal/assist output and xG/chances created, whilst the equivalent numbers at United/Arsenal have been in line with what is expected (certainly tallies with my test games). No idea why this is but it’s being looked at and will hopefully be addressed. What we’re not going to do is ‘nerf’ player ratings across the board as some are demanding, given that they have been reviewed at several stages over the summer/autumn with no issues or complaints.

There’s no desire to overrate players (or pressure on me to do so, as someone suggested) - if anything I’d lean the other way as I’d rather have a challenge and the realism of a necessary rebuild than an easy time of it.

The other thing I’d say which is a persistent issue over the last few years is there is no real way of reflecting just how dysfunctional the Woodward/Judge approach to squad building is in the game and how big a part that plays on us underperforming in real life. Almost every summer you know where United need to strengthen and they fail to do it - you can’t really make that happen in FM. In my tests United almost always go out and get a quality CB or DM early on/in January - only way of stopping that happening would be to remove the transfer budget, but that wouldn’t be accurate and would cause uproar. 

Apologies for the long post anyway. I do agree there’s an issue, as do SI, but some of the comments about the issue are hugely inaccurate or plain ignorant to be honest, and there’s been very little in the way of useful or meaningful suggestions there, just rants about blinkered research. Hope this shows there’s more going on here.

Jesus!! I was typing a similar post about real life Man Utd stature financially and within football world but when I saw your post I stopped!!! You said it better than I was about to... Much respect to all of you the researchers doing the hard work. Don't let ignorant comments and/or persons affect what you do. Thank you.

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9 minutes ago, Nick OGS20 said:

Response to this and those following up on it - don’t want to give away too much as I know some don’t like to read CAs, but United are ranked fifth on average CA in the PL, 16th on average consistency and OGS is ranked joint 18th among PL managers. All of those ratings are a long way off the obvious top two. Everyone will have their view on underrated and overrated players but I don’t believe there’s anyone there with a CA that can’t be very easily justified. 

I do agree that we’re overperforming at the moment and we’re trying to get to the bottom of why that is. I think the above shows it’s not a case of ‘blinkered’ research or anything like that - they’re the ratings of a team with the talent to push for top 3/4 but major consistency issues and a manager a bit out of his depth. That seems fair to me - we did finish third last season after all (and most of the ratings will be based on that rather than early stages of a new season that has been plain weird so far - if you cite us being in 14th then you have to look at City, Arsenal etc as well).

We’ve made some changes to Cavani and Telles that will filter through when an update happens - usually no changes are made to players transferred in as we trust the prior researchers, but those two seem to be specifically overperforming so they have been revised. There have been some small changes to Pogba as well, even though his performances in tests have been generally pretty average. 

Feedback I’ve got this this morning is that there are issues with forward players at some of the bigger clubs (City, Liverpool, Chelsea) and those teams as a whole majorly underperforming in terms of goal/assist output and xG/chances created, whilst the equivalent numbers at United/Arsenal have been in line with what is expected (certainly tallies with my test games). No idea why this is but it’s being looked at and will hopefully be addressed. What we’re not going to do is ‘nerf’ player ratings across the board as some are demanding, given that they have been reviewed at several stages over the summer/autumn with no issues or complaints.

There’s no desire to overrate players (or pressure on me to do so, as someone suggested) - if anything I’d lean the other way as I’d rather have a challenge and the realism of a necessary rebuild than an easy time of it.

The other thing I’d say which is a persistent issue over the last few years is there is no real way of reflecting just how dysfunctional the Woodward/Judge approach to squad building is in the game and how big a part that plays on us underperforming in real life. Almost every summer you know where United need to strengthen and they fail to do it - you can’t really make that happen in FM. In my tests United almost always go out and get a quality CB or DM early on/in January - only way of stopping that happening would be to remove the transfer budget, but that wouldn’t be accurate and would cause uproar. 

Apologies for the long post anyway. I do agree there’s an issue, as do SI, but some of the comments about the issue are hugely inaccurate or plain ignorant to be honest. 

This is just a theory so if this is nonsense my apologies but perhaps the issue is the starting 11 CA is not 5th, but the overall squad is. A starting 11 of De Gea, AWB, Telles, McGuire, Lindelof, McTominay, Pogba, Fernandes, Rashford, Canvani, Martial seems otherworldly on the CA front.  Therefore if Man Utd do not get injury issues, they walk the league? 

Edited by Rags89
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1 minute ago, Rags89 said:

This is just a theory so if this is nonsense my apologies but perhaps the issue is the starting 11 CA is not 5th, but the overall squad is. A starting 11 of De Gea, AWB, Telles, McGuire, Lindelof, McTominay, Pogba, Fernandes, Rashford, Canvani, Martial seems otherworldly on the CA front.  Therefore if Man Utd do not get injury issues, they walk the league? 

The above CA/consistency ranks are for the top 16 players in each squad (that’s the standard we typically use). I’ll try and work values for first XIs when I’m on my lunch in a minute but can say without checking that City/Liverpool will still be way out in front.

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33 minutes ago, middlo82 said:

also whilst on the subject of Man Utd, how is it they seem to have infinite money, can pretty much buy any player in the game straight away (subject to finances) and seem to have ultimate pulling power for the top players, they are not really part of the so called big 4 anymore and like you say are more aligned with the likes of Arsenal, Spurs, Leicester & Wolves. 

They have strong finances because they are still a massive worldwide brand that generates huge sums in commercial revenue. The real life financial accounts are translated into the game to create that disparity - Leicester City generated about £28m from commercial revenue in 2018-19 for example, it is non-comparable. Add in the fact that the 'big six' even in poor seasons almost always qualify for European football (Arsenal finished 8th and are still in the Europa League group stage by virtue of the FA Cup), they also make massive amounts in prize money too.

Pulling power is still there too mostly, I would say. United would clearly struggle to attract the top players at Liverpool, Manchester City, Bayern, PSG at the moment but any other player in the world would probably view it as a step up, not just financially but in terms of their status in world football. As much as I hate to say it, there is still a massive draw for any player in the challenge of trying to bring a team like United back to their previous glory days.

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Just now, Nick OGS20 said:

The above CA/consistency ranks are for the top 16 players in each squad (that’s the standard we typically use). I’ll try and work values for first XIs when I’m on my lunch in a minute but can say without checking that City/Liverpool will still be way out in front.

Fair enough, I thought it would be the entire squad. Nerfs to Telles and Canvani might do the trick then. Still, it would be interesting to hear. Eating on lunch is important too however! 

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Is there a west ham researcher as i haven't seen any feedback or confirmation of any changes on the thread.. here are a few:

Fornals plays LW for us but in the game he is unconvincing there.

West hams minimum home attendance last season in the premier league was over 59k, however the game says limited to 57k for normal games. 

Diangana was sold for 12m, raising to 18m with a 20% sell on fee

In player dynamics the whole team see's Yarmolenko as a leader in the dressing room, even mark noble which definitely is not the case.

Mark Noble has better penalty ratio's than Kane, Bruno, Jorginho in real life but on the game he sits behind all of these. If Kane is 20 mark noble is easily 20. 

Declan Rice is one of the best technical holding midfielders in the premier league but he has 12 for first touch and 13 for passing. He should also have the traits 'looks for pass rather than attempting to score' and 'Comes deep to get the ball'. His in-game value is reflective of the poorer stats as he is as he is only worth 24m in-game but in real life his value is closer to 50m - https://www.transfermarkt.com/declan-rice/profil/spieler/357662

Let me know your thoughts

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17 minutes ago, Nick OGS20 said:

Response to this and those following up on it - don’t want to give away too much as I know some don’t like to read CAs, but United are ranked fifth on average CA in the PL, 16th on average consistency and OGS is ranked joint 18th among PL managers. All of those ratings are a long way off the obvious top two. Everyone will have their view on underrated and overrated players but I don’t believe there’s anyone there with a CA that can’t be very easily justified. 

I do agree that we’re overperforming at the moment and we’re trying to get to the bottom of why that is. I think the above shows it’s not a case of ‘blinkered’ research or anything like that - they’re the ratings of a team with the talent to push for top 3/4 but major consistency issues and a manager a bit out of his depth. That seems fair to me - we did finish third last season after all (and most of the ratings will be based on that rather than early stages of a new season that has been plain weird so far - if you cite us being in 14th then you have to look at City, Arsenal etc as well).

We’ve made some changes to Cavani and Telles that will filter through when an update happens - usually no changes are made to players transferred in as we trust the prior researchers, but those two seem to be specifically overperforming so they have been revised. There have been some small changes to Pogba as well, even though his performances in tests have been generally pretty average. 

Feedback I’ve got this this morning is that there are issues with forward players at some of the bigger clubs (City, Liverpool, Chelsea) and those teams as a whole majorly underperforming in terms of goal/assist output and xG/chances created, whilst the equivalent numbers at United/Arsenal have been in line with what is expected (certainly tallies with my test games). No idea why this is but it’s being looked at and will hopefully be addressed. What we’re not going to do is ‘nerf’ player ratings across the board as some are demanding, given that they have been reviewed at several stages over the summer/autumn with no issues or complaints.

There’s no desire to overrate players (or pressure on me to do so, as someone suggested) - if anything I’d lean the other way as I’d rather have a challenge and the realism of a necessary rebuild than an easy time of it.

The other thing I’d say which is a persistent issue over the last few years is there is no real way of reflecting just how dysfunctional the Woodward/Judge approach to squad building is in the game and how big a part that plays on us underperforming in real life. Almost every summer you know where United need to strengthen and they fail to do it - you can’t really make that happen in FM. In my tests United almost always go out and get a quality CB or DM early on/in January - only way of stopping that happening would be to remove the transfer budget, but that wouldn’t be accurate and would cause uproar. 

Apologies for the long post anyway. I do agree there’s an issue, as do SI, but some of the comments about the issue are hugely inaccurate or plain ignorant to be honest, and there’s been very little in the way of useful or meaningful suggestions there, just rants about blinkered research. Hope this shows there’s more going on here.

What useful or meaningful suggestions are there to the issue of "this club has consistently overperformed across various databases and match engines for years?".  We don't know how to fix it or what the cause of it is, which is why we post in these threads frustrated.  All we can see is the results and the results in the game do not reflect reality.  What other conclusions could we possibly come to?

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11 minutes ago, Rags89 said:

Fair enough, I thought it would be the entire squad. Nerfs to Telles and Canvani might do the trick then. Still, it would be interesting to hear. Eating on lunch is important too however! 

Mate, lunch break is about the only time I’m not eating since I started working from home :D

Quick maths on best starting XIs:

Liverpool - av.CA 166.8, av.consistency 15.7

City - av.CA 166.5, av.consistency 15.4

United - av.CA 154.1, av.consistency 12.5

That is with leaving some very high CA players out of both Liverpool/City teams, which isn’t a concern for United. I can look at Spurs/Chelsea etc later but I hope that shows there’s a big gap there in how they’re rated and it’s not a case of United being wildly overrated (not sure old middlo82 is interested in such nuance, granted).

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Only noticed one slight error with Sheff Utd; Chris Basham's currently set to prefer being on the left hand side of a CB pairing, or in the middle of a back three, but in real life he's almost exclusively played (and excelled) on the right hand side of a back three.

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28 minutes ago, Nick OGS20 said:

I do agree that we’re overperforming at the moment and we’re trying to get to the bottom of why that is. I think the above shows it’s not a case of ‘blinkered’ research or anything like that - they’re the ratings of a team with the talent to push for top 3/4 but major consistency issues and a manager a bit out of his depth. That seems fair to me - we did finish third last season after all (and most of the ratings will be based on that rather than early stages of a new season that has been plain weird so far - if you cite us being in 14th then you have to look at City, Arsenal etc as well).

 

Thanks for your reply, not meaning to cause offence (so all those jumping on the bandwagon to have a dig at my post jog on), but i have been playing this game since about 1994 when it was known as Championship Manager and i know certainly in the last few years Man Utd are always massive over achievers. 

I have no problem under the Ferguson era, but in the last 7 seasons united have been average at best & seriously lack consistency. I accept you finished 3rd last year but that wasn't through united being good, it was as a result of everyone else being terrible & you still only managed to achieve 66 points, recorded 8 losses & 10 draws. How that reflects in the game is not for me to decide, but if the game cannot replicate Uniteds inconsistency then perhaps the option is to downgrade players.

in the last 7 years uniteds average finish has been 5th place on 68 points, they have averaged 8 losses per year and a GD of around +23. 

no matter what you say for the last few years this has not been reflected in the game & as a long term fan of the game it is starting to really ruin the game. I'd expect  City & Liverpool to walk the league but i don't expect to see Man Utd top after 32 games on 82  points. if they continue this run not only do they do something even Liverpool couldn't do last year & go unbeaten but they potentially equal City's 100 points in a season record. 

lets face it this Man Utd squad is absolutely no match for city's 2017/2018 squad. 

all im saying is it spoils the realism of the game and something needs to be toned down massively on Man Utd's sqaud.

 

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24 minutes ago, Sam_SUFC said:

Only noticed one slight error with Sheff Utd; Chris Basham's currently set to prefer being on the left hand side of a CB pairing, or in the middle of a back three, but in real life he's almost exclusively played (and excelled) on the right hand side of a back three.

I noticed this, some more things for Sheffield united:

 

John Lundstram, he has rejected contract offers and wilder has admitted he will be leaving the club at the end of the season, is there anyway to reflect this?

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.skysports.com/amp/football/news/11683/12116930/john-lundstrams-sheffield-united-stay-set-to-end-after-contract-talks-break-down

Brewster buy back for Liverpool isn’t reflected in the game either. I understand why this isn’t in the game at the moment as it is just an estimate amount for the buy back  

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8781911/amp/Sheffield-United-bid-17m-Liverpools-Rhian-Brewster-40m-buy-clause.html

Jack O’Connell has a knee injury that is suspected to put him out of the season (reported 27th September so before the season start) 

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-8777805/amp/Its-really-bad-news-Sheffield-United-defender-Jack-OConnell-likely-miss-rest-season.html

Same with Mousset injury reported on 26th september

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.examinerlive.co.uk/sport/football/news/sheffield-united-mousset-injury-update-19003122.amp

“He might be earlier than expected but we’re possibly looking in and around the start of December for him to hopefully be available.” Wilder, October 2020

 Jan Van Winckel should only be a director at united as on his LinkedIn he is just stated as a board member but technical committee member of affiliate club Beerschot VA (as stated in the second article)

https://www.linkedin.com/in/jan-van-winckel-8418864

https://www.beerschot.be/en/node/579

the sufc owner also stated 

“He’s busy with Beerschot and I can’t think he can spend a lot of time in Sheffield, but he’ll be involved.”

Hopefully you will agree on some of the points. Loving the game! Thank you for your efforts and continued efforts

Edited by aaronwhitehead1995
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33 minutes ago, middlo82 said:

What a pointless comment!!! the premier league itself is a big enough indicator as to Man Utd's fall from grace since Ferguson retired in 2013 (BTW that year Man Utd were champions on 89 points AND THEY STILL LOST 7 GAMES). Since then they have had one  good season under Jose Mourinho when they finished second (and still lost 7 games)

Man Utd have been in a downward spiral since Ferguson left in 2013 and since then have averaged 68 points a season and have averaged 8 losses per year. with an average goal difference of 23.7 goals per season yet in my FM save they are on plus 56 after 32 games. 

Justification for comments below: -

Season 2013/14 - Position 7th - Lost 12 - Drawn 7 - 64 Points

Season 2014/15 - Position 4th - Lost 8 - Drawn 10 - 70 Points

Season 2015/16 - Position 5th - Lost 10 - Drawn 9 - 66 Points

Season 2016/17 - Position 6th - Lost 5  - Drawn 15 - 69 Points

Season 2017/18 - Position 2nd - Lost 7 - Drawn 6 - 81 Points

Season 2018/19 - Position 6th - Lost 10 - Drawn 9 - 66 Points

Season 2019/20 - Position 3rd - Lost 8 - Drawn 10 - Points 66

(Source - Premierleague.com) 

 they shouldn't be as good as they are in game, walking the league - as per my original post 32 game unbeaten what a joke, and this season alone they ahve already lost 3 games & drawn 1 (dropping 11 points) in 7 games. You can't honestly say you think im wrong & they aren't overrated in the game. 

 

 

 

It wasnt a pointless comment though, you criticised the researchers without showing any stats relevant to specific players that you think are over rated. You havent shown any meaningful reason why United should be worse than what they are in the game and instead of doing so after being questioned on it you chose to criticise my comment instead :thup:

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14 minutes ago, Nick OGS20 said:

Mate, lunch break is about the only time I’m not eating since I started working from home :D

Quick maths on best starting XIs:

Liverpool - av.CA 166.8, av.consistency 15.7

City - av.CA 166.5, av.consistency 15.4

United - av.CA 154.1, av. consistency 12.5

That is with leaving some very high CA players out of both Liverpool/City teams, which isn’t a concern for United. I can look at Spurs/Chelsea etc later but I hope that shows there’s a big gap there in how they’re rated and it’s not a case of United being wildly overrated (not sure old middlo82 is interested in such nuance, granted).

Say what you like about me if you wish to result to thinly veiled insults that's fine it shows your true mentality, but perhaps you'd like to explain to me why the AI allows Man Utd to be unbeaten after 32 games first season  & having a GD of 54 when they haven't brought in any additional players - clearly this does not reflect the last 7 seasons so something is either broken in the game or United are overrated. 

I cant be wrong facts are facts & at best over the last 7 years Man Utd have been average IRL, so the "most realistic football simulation" is wrong which can only mean either Man Utd or the players are overrated or more worryingly the game is broken and favours Man Utd's tactic, style of play or something else. 

either way this is unrealistic. 

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15 minutes ago, middlo82 said:

Thanks for your reply, not meaning to cause offence (so all those jumping on the bandwagon to have a dig at my post jog on), but i have been playing this game since about 1994 when it was known as Championship Manager and i know certainly in the last few years Man Utd are always massive over achievers. 

I have no problem under the Ferguson era, but in the last 7 seasons united have been average at best & seriously lack consistency. I accept you finished 3rd last year but that wasn't through united being good, it was as a result of everyone else being terrible & you still only managed to achieve 66 points, recorded 8 losses & 10 draws. How that reflects in the game is not for me to decide, but if the game cannot replicate Uniteds inconsistency then perhaps the option is to downgrade players.

in the last 7 years uniteds average finish has been 5th place on 68 points, they have averaged 8 losses per year and a GD of around +23. 

no matter what you say for the last few years this has not been reflected in the game & as a long term fan of the game it is starting to really ruin the game. I'd expect  City & Liverpool to walk the league but i don't expect to see Man Utd top after 32 games on 82  points. if they continue this run not only do they do something even Liverpool couldn't do last year & go unbeaten but they potentially equal City's 100 points in a season record. 

lets face it this Man Utd squad is absolutely no match for city's 2017/2018 squad. 

all im saying is it spoils the realism of the game and something needs to be toned down massively on Man Utd's sqaud.

 

Appreciate the more measured response - I do understand the concern but all I can do is point you to the post above showing that the stats reflect that this Man Utd squad is indeed absolutely no match for City’s two years ago (or now, and same for Liverpool). Massively downgrading the squad again on top of that isn’t a fair solution. We’ll keep trying to find out why this might be happening (hunch would be maybe 4231 is overpowered in the match engine, or pace is overpowered, or something like that), but you’re not going to see players’ CAs downgraded to the level of a squad like, say, Palace, which seems to be what’s being pushed for here. 

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5 hours ago, diddydaddydoddy said:

@ClarkKent1 Thank you for following the process highlighted from the first post of the thread.

Premier League winners in Achievements should be in the final iteration of the DB upon final release of game.

Allison Becker - although on first glance the data supplied is up to three years old, the stats are really interesting thank you. So I'd like to view current data - is that available please? It covers his time in Italy as opposed to England whereby the style of goalkeeping may differ too. For instance, punching is not a trait I've seen him perform at Liverpool and would seem more prevalent in Italy. Plus the dominance of Liverpool's play means that he is not easy to gauge as his 'goalkeeping' involvement is usually minimal during games (ie SOTs). Jumping Reach regards highest point for heading btw. Although it'd be great to increase attributes, apart from Reflexes being reduced, where else do you propose offsetting increases? Although a +1/-1 won't make any noticeable difference in game, I will look at reducing Reflexes and Increasing Positioning and Aerial Reach if possible.

VVD - 17 is very high for Natural Fitness but will look for a small increase thanks. 

Fabinho - in the DB his preferred position is DM.  In my save it is DM. That does sound like a bug, whereabouts in your save does this appear please?

TAA - don't appreciate grandiose comments (I'm not exactly sure why and how somebody on researchers teams decided...). I'm happy with his Acceleration, its his Pace I to and fro with - he seems alright when attacking but when tracking back he doesn't seem that fast. It has been documented that the top 4 fastest players for us are Mane, Salah, Gomez and VVD which in game is different to flat out racing. So the article is slightly misleading in that is has TAA faster than Mo and Mo and Bobby are the same. How do you differentiate Pace with Mo/Sadio fastest over a short distance and VVD/Joe better over longer distances? Neco used to be a fast out and out winger, I've seen him and he does have pace (I've not seen these reports you refer to). You've suggested Attribute increases but no offsetting decreases? Fair point on Natural Fitness though.

Alisson - I wish I had access to more of the current data but the best I could find in public domain is this. As you can see both Alisson and Donnarumma have won 0.2 of their aerial duels, except I'm not 100% positive that it refers to headers won or claims of the ball in the air. I wouldn't personally look at it as a proof my original claim. I believe reducing Reflexes and increasing Aerial Reach & Positioning is the way to go, however.

EEiMG1O.png

Fabinho - this is screen I get when clicking on his profile. Seeing as how I'm the only one on this thread who gets it, this must be a bug.

XimB3Ek.png

TAA - I believe him not tracking back as much as his counter-part on the other flank Andrew Robertson does is reflected very well by their differences in Work Rate & Stamina, as well as to some extent Marking & Positioning. 

Improving Trent's pace to 14 or 15, in that case, can be offset by decreasing his Work Rate from 15 to 14, since his Marking, Positioning & Stamina are already 14 or lower.

 

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6 minutes ago, ClarkKent1 said:

Alisson - I wish I had access to more of the current data but the best I could find in public domain is this. As you can see both Alisson and Donnarumma have won 0.2 of their aerial duels, except I'm not 100% positive that it refers to headers won or claims of the ball in the air. I wouldn't personally look at it as a proof my original claim. I believe reducing Reflexes and increasing Aerial Reach & Positioning is the way to go, however.

EEiMG1O.png

Fabinho - this is screen I get when clicking on his profile. Seeing as how I'm the only one on this thread who gets it, this must be a bug.

XimB3Ek.png

TAA - I believe him not tracking back as much as his counter-part on the other flank Andrew Robertson does is reflected very well by their differences in Work Rate & Stamina, as well as to some extent Marking & Positioning. 

Improving Trent's pace to 14 or 15, in that case, can be offset by decreasing his Work Rate from 15 to 14, since his Marking, Positioning & Stamina are already 14 or lower.

 

I get this too with quite a few players, it's not just Fabinho

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48 minutes ago, swordy9320 said:

What useful or meaningful suggestions are there to the issue of "this club has consistently overperformed across various databases and match engines for years?".  We don't know how to fix it or what the cause of it is, which is why we post in these threads frustrated.  All we can see is the results and the results in the game do not reflect reality.  What other conclusions could we possibly come to?

Well if you’re unable to provide any examples of players or staff that are overrated, maybe a conclusion that isn’t ‘the researcher is either super biased or has been pressured by someone’ - that’s all I’d ask. 

 

 

 

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@ClarkKent1

Allison - I do believe there could be differences of goalkeeping styles between English/Italian football that need to be taken into account (how many times does Alisson punch in the PL?), however earlier today I have reduced Reflexes and increased Aerial Reach/Positioning . Even though +1/-1 wont be a noticeable difference I'm all for reflecting reality.

Fabinho - the DM position is a brighter green on your display which indicates his more favoured role. So the issue is why does it show the FB role and not DM role when you click on his profile.

TAA - I may try to increase his Pace again but need to look closer at what can offset it.

Edited by diddydaddydoddy
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3 hours ago, Smallen said:

100x this. I don't understand how Man Utd continue to be rated as one of England's top clubs - they haven't been for many years. It's worthless going into specifics, but they need to be downgraded across the board as they are way too effective in the game.

Been the same for a few years now on the game... Utd too good, City really poor. As a Liverpool fan, it takes away the realism that it’s nearly always Utd chasing me.

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1 hour ago, middlo82 said:

What a pointless comment!!! the premier league itself is a big enough indicator as to Man Utd's fall from grace since Ferguson retired in 2013 (BTW that year Man Utd were champions on 89 points AND THEY STILL LOST 7 GAMES). Since then they have had one  good season under Jose Mourinho when they finished second (and still lost 7 games)

Man Utd have been in a downward spiral since Ferguson left in 2013 and since then have averaged 68 points a season and have averaged 8 losses per year. with an average goal difference of 23.7 goals per season yet in my FM save they are on plus 56 after 32 games. 

Justification for comments below: -

Season 2013/14 - Position 7th - Lost 12 - Drawn 7 - 64 Points

Season 2014/15 - Position 4th - Lost 8 - Drawn 10 - 70 Points

Season 2015/16 - Position 5th - Lost 10 - Drawn 9 - 66 Points

Season 2016/17 - Position 6th - Lost 5  - Drawn 15 - 69 Points

Season 2017/18 - Position 2nd - Lost 7 - Drawn 6 - 81 Points

Season 2018/19 - Position 6th - Lost 10 - Drawn 9 - 66 Points

Season 2019/20 - Position 3rd - Lost 8 - Drawn 10 - Points 66

(Source - Premierleague.com) 

 they shouldn't be as good as they are in game, walking the league - as per my original post 32 game unbeaten what a joke, and this season alone they ahve already lost 3 games & drawn 1 (dropping 11 points) in 7 games. You can't honestly say you think im wrong & they aren't overrated in the game. 

 

 

 

I think part of the problem is that certain tactics are Much more effective than others in the ME, so Utd's counter-attacking in the game covers the fact that certain players, like Maguire with his lack of pace, and OGS, with his lack of ability, are bottom half of the table standard.

As seen with human players, an average squad with certain tactics can win the league more often than not.

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1 hour ago, Nick OGS20 said:

Mate, lunch break is about the only time I’m not eating since I started working from home :D

Quick maths on best starting XIs:

Liverpool - av.CA 166.8, av.consistency 15.7

City - av.CA 166.5, av.consistency 15.4

United - av.CA 154.1, av.consistency 12.5

That is with leaving some very high CA players out of both Liverpool/City teams, which isn’t a concern for United. I can look at Spurs/Chelsea etc later but I hope that shows there’s a big gap there in how they’re rated and it’s not a case of United being wildly overrated (not sure old middlo82 is interested in such nuance, granted).

So if that is the case, why are United constantly performing well beyond how well they do IRL? I'd accept them being 4th in my game as them getting lucky with injuries, but I've been watching quite a few streamers on Twitch. Not one streamer has United performing at a level closer to RL.

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21 hours ago, Dan Ormsby said:

Tierney does have CB as a position he can play.  Please check these things before you post them.  I will be logging a feature request soon to try to improve the situation from both the research and match engine perspective in future editions of FM regarding players that are comfortable playing in a back three or a midfield three, but wouldn't be as comfortable in a back two or central midfield two.

That's a great idea. It would be great if they could make it work... Also, if I could chip in with an idea for their profile regarding that: maybe their CB could be coloured half green and half BRIGHT green - in order to represent a variable position attribute.

 

While we're on the subject of Tierney...  In FM20, I've been wondering why did his determination attribute have such a big decrease (19 -> 16) and this year it's gone one more step down. At first, I thought it happened as a part of a general setback in order to represent real life SQUAD character (back then, they really did seem as a group devoid of leadership, passion and grit). Torreira, Guendouzi, Sokratis, Ozil, Luiz (upon his arrival), etc, all had their determination decreased.

With all that in mind, I expected a similar change (at least a minor one) in the game to reflect the transformation in character inspired by Arteta and his team. There's a general sense of willingness to improve, to grind out results, to fight by all means - ''a commitment to succeed'', as the manuel says. Of course, we're not yet on a level of a team like Liverpool (full of players with 16+ determination) but there's surely been SOME movement in that direction.

Players like Xhaka, Aubameyang, Saka, Ceballos and Elneny are some of the examples deserving a +1 or +2 for that attribute but, FOR ME (sorry, it's really hard to provide ''proof'' when it comes to this attribute), TIERNEY encapsulated that attitude almost since day one. With Arteta, it's just more obvious and it's no wonder Tierney is so central to his plan - he's given him the most complicated role in his fluid system - a LCB switching to a LWB (his own variation of Cruyff's revolutionary idea).

To summarise, I think Kieran has shown an amazing willingness to learn from his coach (I think I read this in several coach/player reports in the media), to fit in the system and fight for his team, to drive the club towards better results (future captain, as some of us hope). I think his determination should at least equal that of Kolasinac (17). 

 

I hope you will consider this before the full release. 

 

By the way, great job in general, the squad looks as a very good representation of the current situation in terms of CAs and positions.

 

P.S. (not directed towards you) What up with all the fuss about Bellerin's quickness? Yes, he's a bit slower now than before the injury (hence the slight drop from 20) but if there's wasn't for his burst of pace in the opposition half and Tierney crosses, we would be creating even less chances this season...

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20 minutes ago, Lenzar said:

So if that is the case, why are United constantly performing well beyond how well they do IRL? I'd accept them being 4th in my game as them getting lucky with injuries, but I've been watching quite a few streamers on Twitch. Not one streamer has United performing at a level closer to RL.

That’s what we’re trying to work out. Like I said above, hunch would be that the match engine likes something about the way Ole’s tactics are set up or a particular attribute we might be strong in is overpowered in it (pace would be my instinct given pace of our forward players but they don’t seem to be overperforming individually). My plan for tonight is to try and run some tests with OGS having different tactics/formation settings and see if that changes anything.

Another slight hunch - because all of Pogba/Fernandes/Van de Beek *can* play MC, the game seems to play two of them there and the other at AMC a lot (which you’d never get away with IRL) without the team suffering defensively. Might have to play around with that and try and force the game to pick Matic/Fred/McT, although you’d think the game would severely punish a midfield that weak defensively.

Fwiw, I’m running tests on default settings while I work this afternoon there’s probably only been the one (out of four so far) where United had a record that raised eyebrows. City seem to be underperforming almost every time but again, looks more like something ME-related to me than anything research-related. Last one Liverpool were down in sixth and had lost seven by January. Very odd.

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4 minutes ago, josipk said:

That's a great idea. It would be great if they could make it work... Also, if I could chip in with an idea for their profile regarding that: maybe their CB could be coloured half green and half BRIGHT green - in order to represent a variable position attribute.

 

While we're on the subject of Tierney...  In FM20, I've been wondering why did his determination attribute have such a big decrease (19 -> 16) and this year it's gone one more step down. At first, I thought it happened as a part of a general setback in order to represent real life SQUAD character (back then, they really did seem as a group devoid of leadership, passion and grit). Torreira, Guendouzi, Sokratis, Ozil, Luiz (upon his arrival), etc, all had their determination decreased.

With all that in mind, I expected a similar change (at least a minor one) in the game to reflect the transformation in character inspired by Arteta and his team. There's a general sense of willingness to improve, to grind out results, to fight by all means - ''a commitment to succeed'', as the manuel says. Of course, we're not yet on a level of a team like Liverpool (full of players with 16+ determination) but there's surely been SOME movement in that direction.

Players like Xhaka, Aubameyang, Saka, Ceballos and Elneny are some of the examples deserving a +1 or +2 for that attribute but, FOR ME (sorry, it's really hard to provide ''proof'' when it comes to this attribute), TIERNEY encapsulated that attitude almost since day one. With Arteta, it's just more obvious and it's no wonder Tierney is so central to his plan - he's given him the most complicated role in his fluid system - a LCB switching to a LWB (his own variation of Cruyff's revolutionary idea).

To summarise, I think Kieran has shown an amazing willingness to learn from his coach (I think I read this in several coach/player reports in the media), to fit in the system and fight for his team, to drive the club towards better results (future captain, as some of us hope). I think his determination should at least equal that of Kolasinac (17). 

 

I hope you will consider this before the full release. 

 

By the way, great job in general, the squad looks as a very good representation of the current situation in terms of CAs and positions.

 

P.S. (not directed towards you) What up with all the fuss about Bellerin's quickness? Yes, he's a bit slower now than before the injury (hence the slight drop from 20) but if there's wasn't for his burst of pace in the opposition half and Tierney crosses, we would be creating even less chances this season...

Very busy with QA work so can't get into a protracted discussion, but Tierney's drop from 19 determination since he first joined (and some other attribute changes both up and down), is essentially just a difference in interpretation of how attributes should generally be rated between myself and whoever the previous responsible researcher was - Celtic or Scottish Premier League.  In terms of the wider determination discussion, there is a field in the DB for general squad morale, and I raised the score significantly in this research cycle.

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10 minutes ago, Dan Ormsby said:

Very busy with QA work so can't get into a protracted discussion, but Tierney's drop from 19 determination since he first joined (and some other attribute changes both up and down), is essentially just a difference in interpretation of how attributes should generally be rated between myself and whoever the previous responsible researcher was - Celtic or Scottish Premier League.  In terms of the wider determination discussion, there is a field in the DB for general squad morale, and I raised the score significantly in this research cycle.

@Dan Ormsby A few Arsenal fixes:

 

Pablo Mari and Calum Chambers aren't injured when they should be

Not sure if it comes from the DB but Kolasinac, Guendouzi and Torreira should probably be transfer listed, and Saliba possibly loan listed

Folarin Balogun, afaik, doesn't have an option to extend his contract IRL, but in game he does

Miguel Azeez has a contract until 2022 with an option for an additional year

Osei Tutu has a contract until 2023, also should be at least accomplished at AM(R) since he played there for a lot of last season

 

These ones are more based on opinion but still are valid imo:

 

Aubameyang should probably have the 'likes to beat offside trap' trait

Partey shouldn't have 'plays short simple passes'. He plays a lot of long balls

Elneny however probably should have 'plays short simple passes'

Lacazette should have 'Likes ball into feet'

 

Could maybe do with slightly upgrading Bellerin and Saka's weak foot and downgrading Pepe's 

Xhaka should probably have higher leadership, at least 13-14. Was Gladbach captain quite young, captains Switzerland and was Arsenal captain, and still sometimes is. Seems to be a vocal leader on / off the pitch. 

Maitland-Niles only has 7 penalties even though, although it's a small sample size, he has never missed a penatly and has finished all of the ones that he's taken very well. 

Seen others talk about other stats like Bellerin / Lacazette being too fast, Partey's dribbling / passing being too low etc so just gonna echo those on the off chance that it changes anybody's mind

 

Could probably put ASSE and maybe Arsenal as Saliba's preffered clubs, also maybe Fofana as favoured personnel 

Maybe have Arsenal as Partey's favourite club, and also Michael Essien as an idol

Torreira should have a preference to play in Italy / Spain

Arsenal in Auba's favoured clubs

Arsenal in Bellerin's favoured clubs, also maybe Gnabry as favoured personnel

Kola / Mustafi / Ozil could all be in each other's favoured personnel

Edited by jkadms
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3 hours ago, wep08a said:

I got this response when trying to sign Ozil while managing Schalke. I posted it on twitter, and the official FM account replied and suggested I report it as a likely bug. I think it is possible he may or may not be willing to sign, but I believe Ozil has stated publicly that he still has great affinity for the city of Gelsenkirchen and the club where he first broke through as a professional. 

Screenshot (1).png

@Pete Sottrel can you remove Schalke as a disliked club if this is set for Ozil in game.  This would have been something set a long time ago by a previous researcher and an oversight on my part to remove it.  If it isn't set this is likely to be a gameplay issue where it is choosing an inappropriate string to demonstrate a lack of interest in joining the club for a different reason.

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9 minutes ago, jkadms said:

@Dan Ormsby A few Arsenal fixes:

Folarin Balogun, afaik, doesn't have an option to extend his contract IRL, but in game he does

Miguel Azeez has a contract until 2022 with an option for an additional year

Osei Tutu has a contract until 2023, also should be at least accomplished at AM(R) since he played there for a lot of last season

 

Can you provide any links to sources on the issues I have included in the "quote" please?  Super busy and I don't have time to go into the more subjective stuff I'm afraid.  Chambers and Mari's injuries are included in the DB and they are injured at game start in our internal builds, so they should be appearing for the full game release.

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3 minutes ago, Dan Ormsby said:

@Pete Sottrel can you remove Schalke as a disliked club if this is set for Ozil in game.  This would have been something set a long time ago by a previous researcher and an oversight on my part to remove it.  If it isn't set this is likely to be a gameplay issue where it is choosing an inappropriate string to demonstrate a lack of interest in joining the club for a different reason.

Done, thanks.

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Outside centre half suitability in a back 3 should require a certain amount of both central defender and full back positional familiarity, with extra role emphasis on attributes used in defending wide and 1v1 (agility for example) to make defensive fullbacks more natural chocies without having the AI stick them in the middle or in a pairing.

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On 10/11/2020 at 22:12, WhiteRose74 said:

Southampton.

James Ward-Prowse - Free Kick Taking, 16 seems criminally low.

Danny Ings - Finishing 15, not based on last seasons stats and his start this season. Vardy is 18 for comparison in the game.

Ward-Prowse free kicks

Only Bale, De Bruyne and Maddison have higher than 16 in the Premier League in FM21. 16 is not a low rating. 

Ings vs Vardy

Vardy has been a top Premier League striker for the last 5 years. We have a large amount of evidence for him, Ings has had an amazing 12-18 months not 5 years. I gave Ings a big increase for FM21, if he has another season like last season I'll be able to justify him being even closer to Vardy.

15 is still a high rating for finishing. It is the same as...

- Sterling

- Bruno Fernandes

- Rashford

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Can the United researchers just please explain their motivation behind the rating of Brandon Williams, United's THIRD CHOICE right and left back and why his stats are far superior to the first, second choices he is currently behind and far superior to other teams' first choices? 15 tackling is just unreal considering his overall ability in game compared to real life, where he very often struggles positionally and failed to close down his man almost every game he played and conceded chances constantly. Nothing against him and wouldn't mind a high PA, but his CA is insane. 

Is he really a better player than Shaw? Because his stats suggest so. Right now Brandon Williams is, in game, legitimately a better player than Kyle Walker. 

Also; Mason Greenwood should get a professionalism nerf and his off the field issues should not be reflected as an elite professional with a resilient personality in game, but I'll reserve judgement until I have access to his hiddens ;)

Pogba should have been downgraded significantly on work rate and determination similar to how Özil was but at least his concentration is just 10. Overall United looks as good as they have in long time RELATIVE to real life so credit on that, not trying to complain. 

But Brandon Williams is about 10 times as good in the game as he is irl. He doesn't even make United's match day squad and is third choice at best for both his positions and he shouldn't be a CURRENTLY rated top 5 FB in the PL. It's absurd. Downgrade his positioning, decisions and tackling, marking and overall mentals please. 

 

Other than that I think the forums should provide a message for first time posters explaining how CA/PA works and why pacey players can't have 'fair' or completely accurate stats across the board since it would break the match engine. Although I understand the reluctance to be reactionary in improving ratings after a good spell or transfer, I'd slightly up his physicals since we can actually quantitatively see his physicals are underrated, while keeping his technical/mentals/pressures low. But no real complaints. 

Anyhow Arsenal researchers; Sokratis Papastathopolous' contract expires in 2021, according to most sources, is his '22 contract a mistake or where is this from? Also Balogun doesn't have an extention clause as suggested by the game. (https://theathletic.co.uk/1896994/2020/06/29/ornstein-nathan-ake-manchester-city-balogun-arsenal-liverpool-chris-morgan/)

 

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1 hour ago, Nick OGS20 said:

That’s what we’re trying to work out. Like I said above, hunch would be that the match engine likes something about the way Ole’s tactics are set up or a particular attribute we might be strong in is overpowered in it (pace would be my instinct given pace of our forward players but they don’t seem to be overperforming individually). My plan for tonight is to try and run some tests with OGS having different tactics/formation settings and see if that changes anything.

Another slight hunch - because all of Pogba/Fernandes/Van de Beek *can* play MC, the game seems to play two of them there and the other at AMC a lot (which you’d never get away with IRL) without the team suffering defensively. Might have to play around with that and try and force the game to pick Matic/Fred/McT, although you’d think the game would severely punish a midfield that weak defensively.

Fwiw, I’m running tests on default settings while I work this afternoon there’s probably only been the one (out of four so far) where United had a record that raised eyebrows. City seem to be underperforming almost every time but again, looks more like something ME-related to me than anything research-related. Last one Liverpool were down in sixth and had lost seven by January. Very odd.

I think the main reason Man United tend to ‘overperform’ is because OGS is actually able to sign top quality players in positions needed. In the test saves I’ve played I’ve seen man united go out and sign a top quality cb and then the following season sign Sancho. That alone will have them challenging. I haven’t seen man united ‘overperform’ like the guys above have mentioned but I have seen them regularly make top 4. 
the current squad is good enough to do that and with a few additions they really wouldn’t be far behind the top 2. Yes they have been inconsistent in the league but you have to remember that united played more than any team in Europe last season and they didn’t have a pre season. 
The quality is there but the fitness levels were not.  Utd haven’t been as poor as people are making out, if they win their game against Burnley they could jump to 7th only 5 points off the top..

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11 minutes ago, Karl_BD said:

Can the United researchers just please explain their motivation behind the rating of Brandon Williams, United's THIRD CHOICE right and left back and why his stats are far superior to the first, second choices he is currently behind and far superior to other teams' first choices? 15 tackling is just unreal considering his overall ability in game compared to real life, where he very often struggles positionally and failed to close down his man almost every game he played and conceded chances constantly. Nothing against him and wouldn't mind a high PA, but his CA is insane

Is he really a better player than Shaw? Because his stats suggest so. Right now Brandon Williams is, in game, legitimately a better player than Kyle Walker. 

Williams CA is significantly lower than Shaw's and nowhere near Walker's level. 

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21 minutes ago, Matthew Le God said:

Ward-Prowse free kicks

Only Bale, De Bruyne and Maddison have higher than 16 in the Premier League in FM21. 16 is not a low rating. 

Ings vs Vardy

Vardy has been a top Premier League striker for the last 5 years. We have a large amount of evidence for him, Ings has had an amazing 12-18 months not 5 years. I gave Ings a big increase for FM21, if he has another season like last season I'll be able to justify him being even closer to Vardy.

15 is still a high rating for finishing. It is the same as...

- Sterling

- Bruno Fernandes

- Rashford

No worries - thanks for the response on the ratings. 

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9 minutes ago, Karl_BD said:

Can the United researchers just please explain their motivation behind the rating of Brandon Williams, United's THIRD CHOICE right and left back and why his stats are far superior to the first, second choices he is currently behind and far superior to other teams' first choices? 15 tackling is just unreal considering his overall ability in game compared to real life, where he very often struggles positionally and failed to close down his man almost every game he played and conceded chances constantly. Nothing against him and wouldn't mind a high PA, but his CA is insane. 

Is he really a better player than Shaw? Because his stats suggest so. Right now Brandon Williams is, in game, legitimately a better player than Kyle Walker. 

Also; Mason Greenwood should get a professionalism nerf and his off the field issues should not be reflected as an elite professional with a resilient personality in game, but I'll reserve judgement until I have access to his hiddens ;)

Pogba should have been downgraded significantly on work rate and determination similar to how Özil was but at least his concentration is just 10. Overall United looks as good as they have in long time RELATIVE to real life so credit on that, not trying to complain. 

But Brandon Williams is about 10 times as good in the game as he is irl. He doesn't even make United's match day squad and is third choice at best for both his positions and he shouldn't be a CURRENTLY rated top 5 FB in the PL. It's absurd. Downgrade his positioning, decisions and tackling, marking and overall mentals please. 

 

Other than that I think the forums should provide a message for first time posters explaining how CA/PA works and why pacey players can't have 'fair' or completely accurate stats across the board since it would break the match engine. Although I understand the reluctance to be reactionary in improving ratings after a good spell or transfer, I'd slightly up his physicals since we can actually quantitatively see his physicals are underrated, while keeping his technical/mentals/pressures low. But no real complaints. 

Anyhow Arsenal researchers; Sokratis Papastathopolous' contract expires in 2021, according to most sources, is his '22 contract a mistake or where is this from? Also Balogun doesn't have an extention clause as suggested by the game. (https://theathletic.co.uk/1896994/2020/06/29/ornstein-nathan-ake-manchester-city-balogun-arsenal-liverpool-chris-morgan/)

 

I agree that Williams looks a bit too good. I'm not as passionate about it as you but I agree. 

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