Football Manager 2021 - New Headline Features

[Rashidi]

11 hours ago, Samurai Cake said:

People with high spec machines, expect no such trade off.

There is a whole bunch of people with me on Baldur's Gate's EA and Ashes of Creations alpa, who can't run both games on the super high spec machines that some of us have.  Secondly thats a beta video, its not uncommon to see such things. You  should have seen some of the artifacts on the BG gameplay video that I was getting. Promos of some of these games include cutscenes that are produced and rendered a lot earlier. Gameplay footage is different. This gets improved over time, because lighting effects for one thing can sometimes reproduce differently on different cards. The new RTX 3080 cards, some studios had to release games that can't be played on these new cards optimally, because they don't have the cards. How about all the mac machines. My MacBook pro is having issues even starting some of these games on EA.  SI want to show you some gameplay footage and to suggest that the developers are going to sit there and accept poor standards of work is just not kosher.

I am one of those that like to sit back and wait. I do accept graphics not to be perfect on the first roll out of an alpha version which is exactly what the game is at the moment. Lighting effects, texture effects and the like take a tonne of work to do. Considering the dire situation worldwide and the extent to which companies need to adapt, expecting them to roll out a perfectly visual promo now is ... well...

Guys give them a chance, if you want to expect the worst by all means do so, but consider the environment a lot of these lads are working in.  And before people start calling me a fanboy, consider again my public vitriolic reaction to FM17. Once the retail game was in my hands I was one of the most critical guys out there, but I waited before I had the retail version in my hand. Not the beta, the retail version. During beta's I still believe a chance exists to still extract the best production value you can out of a game. Doing so during an alpa is well just a tad bit early.

[Exius]

6 minutes ago, Rashidi said:

I do accept graphics not to be perfect on the first roll out of an alpha version which is exactly what the game is at the moment. Lighting effects, texture effects and the like take a tonne of work to do.

What about FM 2018, 2019, 2020 - are they still in alpha stage as well? Nobody says that FM 2021 alpha graphics are bad - the problem is that they are bad in the three latest released iterations. An they are not just "bad", they are worse than in the 10-year old FM 2011. I agree that we should wait for the release and see the final build. But what would you say if nothing changes there? Several latest iterations of FM show that SI don't pay much attention to this problem. What makes you think that something will be different this year?

[PassIntoSpace]

Rashidi, sir, first, I love all your work and content that you've put out for FM and its community. I've followed you for many years.

But surely at some point even you need to say enough is enough. I understand you probably have ambitions to work with SI, or if you already do but surely you also notice a pattern? I give them a pass once in 2017, pass in 2018, 2019, 2020, but now? Each year the features presented are decreasing in quality. I'm glad to see improvement in some areas. However, what's more concerning is neglecting existing issues for years without paying any attention to criticism or implementing the things the fans actually do want. We've gone backwards in many areas. How is this acceptable?  At what point would you demand more, if ever?

[DementedHammer]

8 hours ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

I'm old enough to remember the days when on a ZX Spectrum cassette inlay, the screenshots would generally be of the Commodore 64 version of the game as that had a far better colour pallette. Numerous times I felt annoyed loading the game up (25 minutes later, ask yer dad) to see it looked nothing like what it showed on the box. Mind you, I was about 12 then, so maybe a bit more gullible than I am now. 

 

I fondly remember those days — I used to rush home from school, load up my football management game, and wait for 30 minutes while it loaded up. This is the 3D match engine that I grew up with playing The Double on C64. 

[alian62]

15 hours ago, forameuss said:

Simply, yes.  I'd imagine that will look different depending on whatever settings or setup you have.  Does it look great?  Not really.  But I could think of a long, long list of things I'd find more important than what shade of green the pitch is, in a game where visual presentation is already low.

Ok, so you don't like the company, or the direction they go in.  But I presume you still buy the product?  And this isn't just a flippant "don't buy it then", by the way.  At the end of the day, SI want the product to be a certain way.  Obviously they hope that users have the same opinions and are going to like that direction.  You clearly don't, and you're expressing that.  And that is absolutely fine.  But what do you do as a company that is, at the end of the day, a business?  You look at your profits, and your sales, and they're (probably) largely unchanged.  So do you move away from your own roadmap and plans because of people's posts on the forum, or do you just continue getting the sales?

If people really don't like the direction the game is going, or the decisions SI have made, then buying the product at the same time has to be one of the most backward things you could do.  Will you not buying it make a difference?  Maybe, maybe not.  You'll be 30 quid richer, certainly, and won't be using a product you think is inferior at least.

A good movie with a bad ending doesn't make it a good movie . And since 2017 the graphics have become worse . The settings are irrelevant as that is there for lower spec machines but FM19 , 19 and 20 on full spec have no comparison to FM17 or before . Maybe they have done it for Specification reasons so it runs better im not sure . The upside making Kits are a lot easier and present really well in 3D . I know the heart of the game is the ME and the Stats etc but as i said before..  A good movie with a bad ending doesn't make it a good movie .. If you get my meaning . All i can say is thankfully we have excellent modders out there  

[cherryman71]

6 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

We've asked for you all to be respectful. If you can't do so, we'll stop you posting. We shouldn't have to speak to you like children. The game hasn't even dropped yet. And if people have issues, use the report button. Don't use the thread to settle issues. Thanks

"we shouldn't have to speak to you like children" Have you not done exactly like that in your post? This is an expensive game not some free download. People are entitled to say exactly what they think. SI are not above or beyond criticism. To me 50 euro is approx half of what I get to live on each week, thats not taking into account my rent, my electric bill and my internet bill. Quit with your patronising manner

[Novem9]

2 часа назад, cherryman71 сказал:

This is an expensive game not some free download. People are entitled to say exactly what they think

I never was a SI protector and I'm waiting for bigger changes but actually people don't. Your rhetoric could be true for a government tax or mandatory payment. But FM is product which you buy or don't in your decision. I was angry for SI because I bought FM20 which was changed in next patch and I couldn't refund so I never will buy FM until last patch at least if I have a doubts. It's difficult because I'm addicted but only one thing I can do - share bugs, write wishes and wait. Or just wait - my new line if I will not buy FM21. And I agree for people who said about bad graphics, strange flagman of features and no attention in important things (objectively - because FM about management and matches at first), etc. but you're confused if you believe that you have a reason to demand something because this is expensive. Again I can agree this is AAA price especially in compare other steam games and no regional prices for FM , but even if this true you can buy, wait for % or don't buy at all. 

Difference between healthy criticism and child behaviour is pay attention for some issues without demand and insult. And in this moderators really patient. I say this despite I was in conflict with some of them and some ignored my questions in DM before.

My post is long already so I'm finished, have a nice day

 

Edited October 17, 2020 by Novem9

[FrazT]

3 hours ago, cherryman71 said:

"we shouldn't have to speak to you like children" Have you not done exactly like that in your post? This is an expensive game not some free download. People are entitled to say exactly what they think. SI are not above or beyond criticism. To me 50 euro is approx half of what I get to live on each week, thats not taking into account my rent, my electric bill and my internet bill. Quit with your patronising manner

The Moderator's task on these forums is simple.  To ensure that all users have the right to their opinion and can express it on the forums as long as it sticks to the forum rules.  Criticism in itself is not frowned upon, but it needs to be constructive and not personal or abusive, particularly to the developers.  If in any thread the users are resorting to bickering and disrupting the thread then the Mods will post and request that it stops before further action is taken.  So, posting on the forums is not an entitlement to say exactly what you think, but as long as you abide by the rules and are civil, there will be no issues with criticism.  If users want to be treated with respect, then they need also to show that respect to other users.

[SebastianRO]

Me - "Looks like FM21 is going to be another purple press conference fest with a cherry on top of it and it's ME its going to give me headaches and then I'll drop it after 50 hrs of playing "

FM17 - " I've got you buddy, I've got you !! I've got yur back when FM19 came out and it was a big dissapointment and then when FM20 was even worse. We, together have over 3000 hrs of gameplay. But this time, don't even waste your money on this year's itteration "

This is just a conversation I've had with my friend, FM17 after I have seen the "new headline video" for FM21

[alian62]

People are complaining about the pitch etc i do remember the same conversations last year and people were saying that its just the alpha stage and it will be better on release . Well it wasnt ? In my opinion SI make an OK game but its the modders who make it great . Saying that its SI who make it ok for the modders to make the game greater . All through the series of games modders have made better pitches , ball , kits , skins and now even a match engine . Now a stadium Mod is what is really missing that would be awesome . What i feel though is that SI just go on their merry way and never listen to the players of the game . Its quite evident just looking on this forum about the pitch texture . Ive complained before and offered solutions but you just give up . The bugs forum is littered with problems that stretch back to when god was a boy and still exist in todays game . This is what SI dont seem to get . We all have wonderful ideas but alas they fall on deaf ears . Governments get overthrown when they dont listen and SI are lucky there isnt another Football Game like this to give it competition because it really needs it .FM games were going forward in leaps and bounds when FiFA Manager was around which i think ended in 2014 . Most agree SI have gone backwards since FM17 especially in the 3D presentation . Seems FM17 is a benchmark of this series of games and i as a marketing decision would be asking why ? One thing we all agree on is we love and play this game with passion and hence all the opinions and frustrations    

[themadsheep2001]

1 hour ago, FrazT said:

The Moderator's task on these forums is simple.  To ensure that all users have the right to their opinion and can express it on the forums as long as it sticks to the forum rules.  Criticism in itself is not frowned upon, but it needs to be constructive and not personal or abusive, particularly to the developers.  If in any thread the users are resorting to bickering and disrupting the thread then the Mods will post and request that it stops before further action is taken.  So, posting on the forums is not an entitlement to say exactly what you think, but as long as you abide by the rules and are civil, there will be no issues with criticism.  If users want to be treated with respect, then they need also to show that respect to other users.

Absolutely, considering this isn't even the first request on this thread, we have started removing people from the thread. If you have issues use the report button, do not use this thread to settle vendettas (equally, don't take pops at someone here and then report them after, there's a few of you doing that, we take a dim view on that as well). I suggest everyone takes the time to go back to page 4 and read Neil's post. If everyone does and bears it in mind in their own posting style the less issues there are in the thread and the dialogue we can have

[DMaster2]

19 ore fa, HUNT3R ha scritto:

So SI show this on full detail and HD quality. The Joe Blogs comes with his min spec laptop and it's not close to that. What now? That's why SI usually showcase things on a low resolution though sometimes they show a bit of both too.

We are in 2020... people are used by now to have realistic expectations in terms of graphics depending on their own system. I have a GTX 980 and i'm not expecting to run Cyberpunk 2077 on ultra 4k graphic, i'd be estatic to run it at all on minimum settings...

If anyone on a potato is disappointed they don't get the same performance as someone running FM on a 3080... it's honestly on them at this point.

 

This argument isn't holding water anymore...

[Federico]

I'm not a big fan of FM20 but honestly all this mess after 1 single, fast and short video where the main complain about seems to be the quality of the pitch and the 3D in general is *a little bit* exaggerated and absolutely out of context.

I mean the infos given are so few you don't even have a valid point to complain about. The graphic is? Yeah probably, is it so valid to drag it through 7/8 pages? Definitely not.

For me, yes I'd like to have a better graphic quality during the 3D experience but it's not on the top of my personal "priority list to enjoy FM21". I'm not excited by interactions and scouting, but I always wanted to feel more involved and celebrated when winning trophies so the end season recap and the scene with players cheering is a nice addition for me. That's all I can say for what I've seen so far. I expect for some good news about the ME instead.

The 24th of November is still far away, but a lot of people seem to abandon the boat well before it's sinking. Maybe they will be right, maybe not, we can't say yet. But their post look like whims rather than proper disappointments.

[HUNT3R]

8 minutes ago, DMaster2 said:

We are in 2020... people are used by now to have realistic expectations in terms of graphics depending on their own system. I have a GTX 980 and i'm not expecting to run Cyberpunk 2077 on ultra 4k graphic, i'd be estatic to run it at all on minimum settings...

If anyone on a potato is disappointed they don't get the same performance as someone running FM on a 3080... it's honestly on them at this point.

 

This argument isn't holding water anymore...

Watch the video? They're showing BOTH in it. I replied a few posts later that you can see the differences, but you didn't quote that. In some, there's a lack of pitch detail and the player models look worse and less sharp. It's not completely scaled down as you can still see the crowd in both, so it's not on completely low-end settings.

[Arvid04]

I am one of the FM players who has learned to wait (here: until early access) and the last teaser shows great new features to me. I have loved FM for years!

But why doesn't an SI employee make an official statement about the last teaser to relax the users, who of course have their concerns when seeing these 3D images for the FM2? Many comments would be obsolete here.

I hear here several times that the developers do indeed consult the opinions here in the forum, but why do they leave the loyal buyers and players standing in the rain like that. - Unintelligible to me or are many critical buyers not taken so seriously after all?  -  Silence is a bad advisor in this case.

 

[themadsheep2001]

1 minute ago, Arvid04 said:

I am one of the FM players who has learned to wait (here: until early access) and the last teaser shows great new features to me. I have loved FM for years!

But why doesn't an SI employee make an official statement about the last teaser to relax the users, who of course have their concerns when seeing these 3D images for the FM2? Many comments would be obsolete here.

I hear here several times that the developers do indeed consult the opinions here in the forum, but why do they leave the loyal buyers and players standing in the rain like that. - Unintelligible to me or are many critical buyers not taken so seriously after all?  -  Silence is a bad advisor in this case.

 

They are quite busy working on the game itself. Neil did pop into and leave some information as well so keep an eye on his posts. But if some people are going to take pops at the devs you'll find they have less and less inclination to post here

[JamieTC13]

It's really shocking though that the same answers in the interaction side of things are still in the game that we have had for years it just looks different in 2021, i thought we would of had a load of new answer to be fair that is a bit lame. I'm still looking forward to the game though

Edited October 17, 2020 by jckc221013jamie

[santy001]

It's well worth remembering that a large degree of improvements that are made aren't going to feature in a video. Further work on the ME to better emulate the full scope of football is a given, and yet at the same time, its never going to be finished. New styles of play, tactical set ups and so on will evolve in the game just as they've always done.

Videos like this do nothing for me personally, but at the same time that generally speaks to the industry more broadly. I think the last time I got excited and felt positive about games was Shadow of Mordor with its trumpeted Nemesis system and The Division. Both ended up being enormous disappointments because they didn't live up even remotely close to what was being shown.

There is a severe limit, in my mind at least, what SI can even do to bring about massive changes because there isn't an enormous remit in creating a game based on football. Maybe that's just a failing of my imagination. But it's important to showcase what is new. 

Which brings me onto my point.

If you dislike something about the game you can simply state what you dislike, and why.

You don't need to prescribe what it ought to be/has to be but it can sometimes be useful if you can give an example of what may feel better about that aspect. You don't need to try and uncover some conspiracy as to why its been done that way. You don't need to get abusive/rude/aggressive towards people either. When you start going down these routes it immediately devalues most of what you say and in truth results in it being more likely it will be removed.

There's no argument which grants you an exemption or free pass to cross the line, whether FM is proportionally more expensive for you, whether you've played it for 894 years, whether you've actually been involved in professional football, whether you spoke to an angel in a dream who told you to say these things... its inconsequential.

-----

If you want to see what contributions have been made to the forums from developers there is a dedicated section that tracks all posts from SI. It is under the Developer Posts tab at the top, or you can find them here:

https://community.sigames.com/discover/235/

[akm.91]

7 minutes ago, Federico said:

I'm not a big fan of FM20 but honestly all this mess after 1 single, fast and short video where the main complain about seems to be the quality of the pitch and the 3D in general is *a little bit* exaggerated and absolutely out of context.

I mean the infos given are so few you don't even have a valid point to complain about. The graphic is? Yeah probably, is it so valid to drag it through 7/8 pages? Definitely not.

For me, yes I'd like to have a better graphic quality during the 3D experience but it's not on the top of my personal "priority list to enjoy FM21". I'm not excited by interactions and scouting, but I always wanted to feel more involved and celebrated when winning trophies so the end season recap and the scene with players cheering is a nice addition for me. That's all I can say for what I've seen so far. I expect for some good news about the ME instead.

The 24th of November is still far away, but a lot of people seem to abandon the boat well before it's sinking. Maybe they will be right, maybe not, we can't say yet. But their post look like whims rather than proper disappointments.

It’s not one video though, is it? People are commenting based on the last 3 or 4 releases too...where nothing has changed. Nothing will change in terms of graphics/ME in the final release from what they have shown in that clip. 

[mmitch19]

I agree with all the people saying some of the comments are hugely jumping the gun.  
 

I struggled with the FM20 match engine and found it hard to influence as I wanted.   I see some significant hope in the fact that the match day UI revamp, which is clearly supposed to focus us back onto what we see happening on the pitch, suggests there have been significant under the hood improvements.

[Federico]

4 minuti fa, akm.91 ha scritto:

It’s not one video though, is it? People are commenting based on the last 3 or 4 releases too...where nothing has changed. Nothing will change in terms of graphics/ME in the final release from what they have shown in that clip. 

Yeah, and as long as they're (hopefully!) capable to reproduce a good representation of football, it's alright for me

[Nikopol]

Perhaps i'm the fanboy here but i actually believe FM made more progress in the last 3 years than it did for a few years before that. Squad Dynamics, Scouting, tactics and the new Training system were pretty big leaps from all that went before. What are the great changes that occured from fm 2010 to fm 17? I played them, but i'd really like to know what people think was the great difference here.

 

[Mars_Blackmon]

29 minutes ago, akm.91 said:

It’s not one video though, is it? People are commenting based on the last 3 or 4 releases too...where nothing has changed. Nothing will change in terms of graphics/ME in the final release from what they have shown in that clip. 

Weird energy considering what was announced months ago when they said it was going to be a FM21 despite what’s currently going on. Kind of weird everyone is all of a sudden up in arms about these specific things when I can even skip to a few pages on the forums and don’t see these specific things talked about as a community. Let’s be constructive...

[Smurf]

I've avoided this thread to let it build and I've read a lot of comments. 

I hope SI take away from it the disappointment, no matter how unconstructive a lot of it was, but I hope they take away the points made by people who are not happy. 

 

I am one of them.. sorry to say, but if these are headline features... it's worrying. 

=================

A little button to point finger, throw a bottle, .... give a player a hug.... open your arms.... really.

I'm sure there's a roadmap for interactions - but this wasn't implemented well when it was first introduced (player interactions) and it's steadily got worse year-in year-out. 

Interactions are terribly integrated into the game, and the influence it can have on players who behave like babies at times makes it a 'feature' I don't even bother with. 

==================

Match Engine/Graphics side of it - looks good, year on year improvements as expected. 

THumbs up

=================

More graphs.........booooring - never be used and don't want to ploughing through graphs. 

Won't use them at all. 

It's a game, I don't want to see graphs - what's the point of that?

My point is, it's boring, this is a football game!

=============

Scouts

Fire them all - never use them.

Takes too much time and interacting with scouts - meetings - sorry, but it's boring!

Find players easily myself. It's easy. Scouting is boring.

==============

End of season review

I hope that this can be an option! 

The worst part of the game is End of Season already.

All the contract renewals, and it takes sooooo long to get from end of season to start of new season.

Again, it's boooring, takes me about an hour to get from May to August!

========================

I don't know about other people but my typical style of play is to take over a team, I get rid of deadwood, and buy/loan players to fit my tactic (I've had the same tactic since FM 2010).

I fire/hire coaches.

Set my tactics (same as it's been for 10 years)

It's then full on to get to matches, play matches and win titles. 

 

At no point do I stop to have quick chats, or to talk to a player, or do anything with the media - never do and never will.

 

You might notice all the boring comments, yes it's boring part of the game. It's a game! It's a football management game. I'm sure there's a roadmap of enhancing features. I do think that this roadmap by SI needs to be severely looked at.  It's getting to the boring stage and has been for a few versions (to the point I've stopped buying the game since FM15!).

And boring is not good. 

Please SI - and mods - don't take it the wrong way - hopefully my scathing review of the features is taken in the spirit of the forum, and as constructive.

Stay safe.

 

Edited October 17, 2020 by Smurf

[Samurai Cake]

7 hours ago, Rashidi said:

There is a whole bunch of people with me on Baldur's Gate's EA and Ashes of Creations alpa, who can't run both games on the super high spec machines that some of us have.  Secondly thats a beta video, its not uncommon to see such things. You  should have seen some of the artifacts on the BG gameplay video that I was getting. Promos of some of these games include cutscenes that are produced and rendered a lot earlier. Gameplay footage is different. This gets improved over time, because lighting effects for one thing can sometimes reproduce differently on different cards. The new RTX 3080 cards, some studios had to release games that can't be played on these new cards optimally, because they don't have the cards. How about all the mac machines. My MacBook pro is having issues even starting some of these games on EA.  SI want to show you some gameplay footage and to suggest that the developers are going to sit there and accept poor standards of work is just not kosher.

I am one of those that like to sit back and wait. I do accept graphics not to be perfect on the first roll out of an alpha version which is exactly what the game is at the moment. Lighting effects, texture effects and the like take a tonne of work to do. Considering the dire situation worldwide and the extent to which companies need to adapt, expecting them to roll out a perfectly visual promo now is ... well...

Guys give them a chance, if you want to expect the worst by all means do so, but consider the environment a lot of these lads are working in.  And before people start calling me a fanboy, consider again my public vitriolic reaction to FM17. Once the retail game was in my hands I was one of the most critical guys out there, but I waited before I had the retail version in my hand. Not the beta, the retail version. During beta's I still believe a chance exists to still extract the best production value you can out of a game. Doing so during an alpa is well just a tad bit early.

This is a nice post, and I understand your sentiment of waiting to see, as you say things can improve, and while I am critical, I am still annoyingly optimistic as it's a series we all love and want the best for.

But, seriously, seriously. Don't even try and compare BG3 to this graphically. They're not in the same ballpark in fact, they are generations apart. Not a couple years, generations. We're talking AAA modern as all hell games, versus something that hasn't gotten past ps2 era graphics. It's not acceptable no matter how much hope you give them that some polish will be achieved during beta and up to the final release. And again, the game is on xbox series x, this is what we're getting, it's might look a little better, it won't look good and it won't look anything close to acceptable in 2021. I don't buy the idea that they need to develop the game for low end machines. Because for years and years, the ability on PC to be able to adjust graphical settings to suit your audience has existed. With a lil graphical setting you could play this on MAC, there is also a 2D mode for people with low spec machines, that doesn't mean people with high spec machines need to miss out, but they have done, for years, and years. 

The problem is, we have years and years and games to learn from, this isn't a one of right. This is even something that has happened the past couple of releases, it's a pattern we're all aware of stretching back for more than a decade. In fact, the visual fidelity of the game appears to have gotten worse than a 10 year old version of the same game. It looks worse than a PS2 LMA manager from 2007. A PS2 has 32 MB of RAM and a measly 294mhz processor and 4mb of vram. 

I know it's not the same, but I also work for a software company, that has transitioned without much if any trouble to working from home. As have so, so many others. I know COVID would have stopped things like Motion Capture, but for anything else...

 

I've gone from playing 1000 hours of FM14 to only managing 53 in FM20. it saddens me, I've played since CM3, 98/99. I love the series, but it has issues, it's stale, its regressing. It's nowhere near what you expect of the industry these days.

I hope this iteration is a great version and I find enjoyment again, but heres the problem. Everything I say here falls on deaf ears, because my money has gone down, as there are no other options, this is it, it's all we got. So from a consumer point of view, I feel milked, insulted and taken advantage of. 

 

 

[akm.91]

7 minutes ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

Weird energy considering what was announced months ago when they said it was going to be a FM21 despite what’s currently going on. Kind of weird everyone is all of a sudden up in arms about these specific things when I can even skip to a few pages on the forums and don’t these things talked about as a community. Let’s be constructive...

As far as I know SI didnt furlough anyone and they were working on the game throughout, although part of it was from home from about March, which does makes it harder granted. But they’ve more than likely been working on the new edition for about a year.  Just think reskins and being able to hug your players are terrible “headline features”. 

[Mars_Blackmon]

14 minutes ago, Smurf said:

I've avoided this thread to let it build and I've read a lot of comments. 

I hope SI take away from it the disappointment, no matter how unconstructive a lot of it was, but I hope they take away the points made by people who are not happy. 

 

I am one of them.. sorry to say, but if these are headline features... it's worrying. 

=================

A little button to point finger, throw a bottle, .... give a player a hug.... open your arms.... really.

I'm sure there's a roadmap for interactions - but this wasn't implemented well when it was first introduced (player interactions) and it's steadily got worse year-in year-out. 

Interactions are terribly integrated into the game, and the influence it can have on players who behave like babies at times makes it a 'feature' I don't even bother with. 

==================

Match Engine/Graphics side of it - looks good, year on year improvements as expected. 

THumbs up

=================

More graphs.........booooring - never be used and don't want to ploughing through graphs. 

Won't use them at all. 

It's a game, I don't want to see graphs - what's the point of that?

My point is, it's boring, this is a football game!

=============

Scouts

Fire them all - never use them.

Takes too much time and interacting with scouts - meetings - sorry, but it's boring!

Find players easily myself. It's easy. Scouting is boring.

==============

End of season review

I hope that this can be an option! 

The worst part of the game is End of Season already.

All the contract renewals, and it takes sooooo long to get from end of season to start of new season.

Again, it's boooring, takes me about an hour to get from May to August!

========================

I don't know about other people but my typical style of play is to take over a team, I get rid of deadwood, and buy/loan players to fit my tactic (I've had the same tactic since FM 2010).

I fire/hire coaches.

Set my tactics (same as it's been for 10 years)

It's then full on to get to matches, play matches and win titles. 

 

At no point do I stop to have quick chats, or to talk to a player, or do anything with the media - never do and never will.

 

You might notice all the boring comments, yes it's boring part of the game. It's a game! It's a football management game. I'm sure there's a roadmap of enhancing features. I do think that this roadmap by SI needs to be severely looked at.  It's getting to the boring stage and has been for a few versions (to the point I've stopped buying the game since FM15!).

And boring is not good. 

Please SI - and mods - don't take it the wrong way - hopefully my scathing review of the features is taken in the spirit of the forum, and as constructive.

Stay safe.

 

Yes, SI should just scrape everything and all we should be able to do is play matches and set tactics. 

/...

[Smurf]

2 minutes ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

Yes, SI should just scrape everything and all we should be able to do is play matches and set tactics. 

/...

Not what I said, was it?

[Mars_Blackmon]

11 minutes ago, akm.91 said:

As far as I know SI didnt furlough anyone and they were working on the game throughout, although part of it was from home from about March, which does makes it harder granted. But they’ve more than likely been working on the new edition for about a year.  Just think reskins and being able to hug your players are terrible “headline features”. 

In fact they hired more people. But still, not being able to work collectively isn’t going to result in a major rework of a match engine and graphics. Optimistically, more staff could result in a lot of fine tuning and tweaks in many different areas of the game.

[Pav_Makarov]

2 hours ago, SebastianRO said:

FM17 - " I've got you buddy, I've got you !! I've got yur back when FM19 came out and it was a big dissapointment and then when FM20 was even worse. We, together have over 3000 hrs of gameplay. But this time, don't even waste your money on this year's itteration

And then there is me, have lost my previous steam account with all my FMs. Now I can't even go back and have to stick with 20.

[Lvpool]

I love how people in this thread act like the game is given out for free. It's not...SI charge £50 for it every year & make nice fat profit margins on it, every single year.

Given COVID, this year would have been the perfect time for SI to take a step back & properly work on the multiple issues/gripes the community have been raising for 3yrs. 

 

They should have released a patch + a data update for FM20 & come back in November 2021 w/ a properly fixed up FM22 release that included a reworked ME, improved graphics & proper value-add new features. Alas, they stuck with the yearly release because why not generate another year of healthy fat profits? The game is stagnating but with no other competition, who cares?

 

I personally will not be buying FM21 unless the feedback on the ME is that it's exceptional...that is the least we should have in the game every year. I for one do not care about being able to hug my players

Edited October 17, 2020 by Lvpool

[Smurf]

5 minutes ago, Lvpool said:

Given COVID, this year would have been the perfect time for SI to take a step back & properly work on the multiple issues/gripes the community have been raising for 3yrs. 

<snip>

 

I for one do not care about being able to hug my players

1st part - what makes you think they haven't or aren't as on going development? Not everything can be done in a year.

And 2nd part, 100% agree.

[Mars_Blackmon]

9 minutes ago, Lvpool said:

I love how people in this thread act live the game is given out for free. It's not, SI charge £50 for it ever year & make nice fat profit margins on it, every year.

Given COVID, this year would have been the perfect time for SI to take a step back & properly work on the multiple issues/gripes the community have been raising for 3yrs. 

 

They should have released a patch + a data update for FM20 & come back in November 2021 w/ a properly fixed up FM22 release that included a reworked ME, improved graphics & proper value-add new features. Alas, they stuck with the yearly release because why not generate another year of healthy fat profits? The game is stagnating but with no other competition, who cares?

 

I personally will not be buying FM21 unless the feedback on the ME is that it's exceptional...that is the least we should have in the game every year. I for one do not care about being able to hug my players

The people who like what they see will buy the game. No need for a non release. There is a misconception that companies have more time in development when they skip a year. That’s not true at all...

[davehanson]

10 minutes ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

The people who like what they see will buy the game. No need for a non release. There is a misconception that companies have more time in development when they skip a year. That’s not true at all...

Please explain how it is a misconception then. 

[Lvpool]

15 minutes ago, Smurf said:

Not everything can be done in a year.

Exactly...that is why I am saying they should have given themselves more than a year to develop a better release

13 minutes ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

There is a misconception that companies have more time in development when they skip a year. That’s not true at all...

LOL come on man. If they decided when COVID hit (say April/May) they were only going to release a new game in Nov-21 + patch/update (summer + winter) fm20 in meantime, then that would give them a lot of extra time to work on the Nov-21 release. You cannot tell me otherwise

[themadsheep2001]

SI rely on a yearly release, not releasing for a year would have a big negative impact on them, so that's a nonstarter. 

Also I think people need to be aware that different people want different things from the game, and some of these things might contradict each other. And that's before we even get onto what SI want to make as a game. So saying for example SI should just launch a data update, might not work for other players, and might not work for SI either. 

[davehanson]

4 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

SI rely on a yearly release, not releasing for a year would have a big negative impact on them, so that's a nonstarter. 

Also I think people need to be aware that different people want different things from the game, and some of these things might contradict each other. And that's before we even get onto what SI want to make as a game. So saying for example SI should just launch a data update, might not work for other players, and might not work for SI either. 

That wasn't what @Mars_Blackmon said though. I fully understand the needs of the business require a yearly release. But the point was that a year off would not mean more development time and that it was a misconception. I would like to know how it is a misconception.

[themadsheep2001]

10 minutes ago, davehanson said:

That wasn't what @Mars_Blackmon said though. I fully understand the needs of the business require a yearly release. But the point was that a year off would not mean more development time and that it was a misconception. I would like to know how it is a misconception.

I wasn't referencing what he said. Just making an observation

[Svenc]

9 hours ago, Rashidi said:

There is a whole bunch of people with me on Baldur's Gate's EA and Ashes of Creations alpa, who can't run both games on the super high spec machines that some of us have.  

Upvoted simply for the mentioning of Baldur's Gate *highfive*. (Having a mostly good time playing the EA personally, btw, and I'm just on a GTX 1050ti).  

Edited October 17, 2020 by Svenc

[Deisler26]

I've had time to think about this release video and on the whole, it's a realistic refinement. We have no idea if these new interactions are stronger than in 20 (For example, throwing a water bottle at someone should result in certain personality types demanding a transfer, where as in 20, you could just ignore those demands), but this adds more to the world-building aspect of FM. You can now be a Harry Redknapp or Sir Alex Ferguson in your interactions with players. Is it core football? No, but it does add to people's imaginations. (I would kill to see a John Sitton button, but can't see that haha!!)

The ME itself was very fun and enjoyable to me. So I have no particular need to see the ME improvements, because 20 was that good for me.

What I'm looking forward to is the refinement of the Club Vision and 5 Year Plan implementations which I hope have been softened and tweaked.

[Rashidi]

37 minutes ago, Svenc said:

Upvoted simply for the mentioning of Baldur's Gate *highfive*. (Having a mostly good time playing the EA personally, btw, and I'm just on a GTX 1050ti).  

Multiplayer mate?!:-)

[angelo994]

I think the biggest thing for me isn’t necessarily the graphics, but the animations. Players fazing through each other. Awkward turns etc. I can accept that they don’t have to look realistic, but when they don’t move realistically. It just takes me out of the game so much.

[Mars_Blackmon]

1 hour ago, davehanson said:

That wasn't what @Mars_Blackmon said though. I fully understand the needs of the business require a yearly release. But the point was that a year off would not mean more development time and that it was a misconception. I would like to know how it is a misconception.

Well for one, where do you think the money for development comes from?

[davehanson]

1 minute ago, Mars_Blackmon said:

Well for one, where do you think the money for development comes from?

In your post you say more time off doesn't mean more development time. I think you are clutching at straws as you have no idea how to quantify what you wrote in your original sentence. 

[Karnack]

4 minutes ago, davehanson said:

In your post you say more time off doesn't mean more development time. I think you are clutching at straws as you have no idea how to quantify what you wrote in your original sentence. 

Running costs. Let's say 2021 will be their only income source for two years because they want to release 2023 next and skip 2022. The sales of 2021 have to be sufficient to cover their running costs for a full extra year.

If we assume their staff is scaled to their income every year this would probably mean a lot of staff would have to be let go. 

This is of course broad generalizations based on very little information regarding how they operate and what their profit margins are, where that profit is invested and so on. But this would be a reason that development time doesn't increase, it increases for those still in the company, but if they have to let go of half their staff then it really hasn't increased.

[davehanson]

1 minute ago, Karnack said:

Running costs. Let's say 2021 will be their only income source for two years because they want to release 2023 next and skip 2022. The sales of 2021 have to be sufficient to cover their running costs for a full extra year.

If we assume their staff is scaled to their income every year this would probably mean a lot of staff would have to be let go. 

This is of course broad generalizations based on very little information regarding how they operate and what their profit margins are, where that profit is invested and so on. But this would be a reason that development time doesn't increase, it increases for those still in the company, but if they have to let go of half their staff then it really hasn't increased.

Okay, I'm going to leave it now otherwise it is going too far off topic. 

[alian62]

3 hours ago, Nikopol said:

Perhaps i'm the fanboy here but i actually believe FM made more progress in the last 3 years than it did for a few years before that. Squad Dynamics, Scouting, tactics and the new Training system were pretty big leaps from all that went before. What are the great changes that occured from fm 2010 to fm 17? I played them, but i'd really like to know what people think was the great difference here.

 

Your opinion of course and in those aspects they probably have except the sound ? The sound is shocking ? No matter if your stadium is full or half empty or empty the sound of the crowds are the same . Away goals scored sound just as intense as the home goals scored . There is no point of difference in sound levels at all .   

[alian62]

2 hours ago, davehanson said:

Please explain how it is a misconception then. 

As far as i am aware and i could be wrong , is that games are in a 3 year cycle as a development . So this means that FM21 was being developed as far back as 2018 and in 2020 they are developing FM23 as well as FM22 and FM21 . I read this somewhere ?  

[kingking]

I hope A.I are more intelligent, take more risks and manage there squad better

[Akasha]

It's too late for this FM21, but you can post it in this section : 

 

https://community.sigames.com/forum/680-football-manager-feature-requests/