FM20 - Playing Time

[Guest]

Hi there,

On FM20 as we know, there 9 categories for playing time when you deal with contracts:

- Star Player
- Important Player
- Regular Starter
- Squad Player
- Fringe Player
- Emergency Backup
- Breakthrough Prospect
- Future Prospect
- Youngster

My question is: With how many matches is the player happy according to "playing time" in his contract? For "Star", "Future Prospect", "Breakthrough Prospect" and "Youngsters" is pretty obvious, but what about "Squad" or "Fringe" situation?

Thanks

[Claret and Blue]

squad players should play maybe a third of the games in a season, coming in when your preffered options are injured or need a rest. Fringe players dont expect to play often and if you gave them a run during the odd cup game they would be satisfied. I played someone (fringe player) 4 games in a season and they didnt complain but their personality might have played a part there so i cant say for certain.

[Heywood JaBlowme]

Does the number of games include players being used as subs?

[FrazT]

2 hours ago, Heywood JaBlowme said:

Does the number of games include players being used as subs?

Not to my knowledge- only starts are counted.

[XaW]

Here is my general rule of thumb:

Star Player - Every match they are fit for (condition >95), except low priority cups. I keep the number of players of this type to a minimum, 1-2 max.
Important Player - Almost the same as Star player, but I will rotate a bit more. Still will play in most games.
Regular Starter - First choices in their position. Will be my preferred starter, but will be rotated a bit. Will play around 75% of matches if not injured.
Squad Player - Rotational option and the one to step in for any injury. Will play about 35-60% based on role (a central defender will often play more than a winger, simply because there are two positions he can step in for. The same for versatile players).
Fringe Player - Will play in low priority cups, unless I have an exciting youngster ahead of them, and as backups for the more important role. Most players with this role will be up for sale as I'd rather play a youngster I have hopes for rather than an old backup (personal preference).
Emergency Backup - Will only play if there is an injury crisis. I've had older mentor types in this status for several years without playing a game without complaint.
Breakthrough Prospect - The most important youngsters I want to give a game or two if I can. Some late subs, or just have on the bench in low risk matches. Also plays in low priority cups.
Future Prospect - Youngsters I don't expect to get any games.
Youngster - Youngsters I doubt will make the cut.

I'm quite a stern manager and I will refuse a contract if the player tried to bully his way into a better role than I expect or would be able to provide as much game time as he would expect. I also go through the roles at least once per season (usually during the off-season) and make sure they have the role I expect them to have. If they get annoyed with the change of roles I always say the role reflect their game time, and if they want to leave, then sure, they wouldn't be an important player anyway.

[Prepper_Jack]

14 hours ago, FrazT said:

Not to my knowledge- only starts are counted.

This is one of the things that aggravates me, as the game explicitly lies to you. Right now I have some scrub who would normally qualify as a future prospect, but I have him listed as an "impact sub". For him, I thought that was generally appropriate as he's an attacking fullback, and I needed someone to frequently sub my actual star player a little after half-time. Hectic season, and a demanding role. Now, out of 15 matches, he's started 2 matches, and subbed in 12, so he's getting virtually as much playing time on the pitch as the regular starter. Could be more if I tabulate the minutes. The "Impact sub" definition in game is someone who expects to substitute with some regularity. Nowhere in that description is anything about starting matches. But, since I have him listed as an impact sub, even if his expectation is that of "future prospect", he's getting nutty about his playing time. Also have a "squad player" striker who is breakthrough prospect level, getting regular starter playing time, and he's also upset.

This part of the system just seems fairly broken, and like a great many things in the game offers little in the way of real guidance or transparency and only serves to inflict needless drama.

[HUNT3R]

Yeah, tbf, if his playing time is impact sub, the player really should be quite happy with sub appearances.

[fivetwelvepony]

The playing time happiness thing seems to be buggy. Here is my playing time happiness from my roster page, and the playing time happiness from the happiness page. I think I believe the first. Hopefully it doesn't cause problems at some point, because i am planning on a fair bit of squad rotation this season.

     

[fivetwelvepony]

I have a separate question, though. I have 23 first team players. On the squad screen, for 11 of them their expected playing time over the next five matches is different from the agreed playing time. Two of them actually expected less time, but the other nine expect more. Does anyone understand why? Is this me playing them a lot in the previous season and raising their playing time expectations? Or is it because they have not played enough recently, and need more future time to balance it out?

[HUNT3R]

7 hours ago, fivetwelvepony said:

The playing time happiness thing seems to be buggy. Here is my playing time happiness from my roster page, and the playing time happiness from the happiness page. I think I believe the first. Hopefully it doesn't cause problems at some point, because i am planning on a fair bit of squad rotation this season.

I haven't paid too much attention to this, but I do notice the 'concerned' orange icon when we're still in pre-season. This sorts itself out as the season starts. Is that where you are in your save right now?

[HUNT3R]

6 hours ago, fivetwelvepony said:

I have a separate question, though. I have 23 first team players. On the squad screen, for 11 of them their expected playing time over the next five matches is different from the agreed playing time. Two of them actually expected less time, but the other nine expect more. Does anyone understand why? Is this me playing them a lot in the previous season and raising their playing time expectations? Or is it because they have not played enough recently, and need more future time to balance it out?

Players have their own view of their ability and their ability vs others in the squad.

What they expect with regards to playing time, isn't something I care about, personally. I rotate a fair amount, having a domestic cup where I have deep runs, and also the CL where I usually get to the 1st knockout round, so there's plenty of chance for everyone to play. I start making more of an effort to play someone if I see that 'concerned' playing happiness.

It can be a little more tricky when your manager attributes are low (so players complain quicker) or if you have unprofessional players, but that's what works for me atm.

[Hovis Dexter]

In addition to fitness I’ve recently started using the player time happiness to help me rotate efficiently. At the beginning of the season pretty much everybody is concerned about their playing time which I guess is reasonable ... new season, new start. After a couple of games when all my first choice starts are happy I start to rotate more and give starts to those who are concerned. If I want to give somebody a start and there’s a choice as to who I drop I’m now tending to drop the person whose happiest with their playing time. As I see it there’s never a problem in dropping anybody whose delighted and this is a good way to maintain a balanced happiness level throughout the team.

[nully29]

Promoting player makes him support you more. 

[nully29]

12 hours ago, fivetwelvepony said:

The playing time happiness thing seems to be buggy. Here is my playing time happiness from my roster page, and the playing time happiness from the happiness page. I think I believe the first. Hopefully it doesn't cause problems at some point, because i am planning on a fair bit of squad rotation this season.

     o

I noticed that too. My best guess is that first one means to say how happy a player is, based strictly on expectations and matches started, and second one is how likely he is to complain about it, based on his personality, your manager reputation and all. SI is clearly using two different formulas here, but comes short in explaining what they are trying to say. 

[fivetwelvepony]

10 hours ago, HUNT3R said:

I haven't paid too much attention to this, but I do notice the 'concerned' orange icon when we're still in pre-season. This sorts itself out as the season starts. Is that where you are in your save right now?

It was early in the season, but not preseason -- about 5 or 6 competitive matches played. Now after 8 competitive matches, everyone is happy. A couple of the guys who are now happy have barely played. So it still seems buggy.

 

 

Edited August 5, 2020 by fivetwelvepony
Taking out screenshot

[fat mole]

On 24/06/2020 at 03:56, FrazT said:

Not to my knowledge- only starts are counted.

Well that's interesting to know and makes what I've been doing pointless.  When picking the subs and deciding for example whether to have my second best left winger or second best right winger on the bench I often go on who has had the least appearances in the last 5 games from a player's form tab. Always thought that at least if they come on then it will make them semi-happy.

Obviously expectations and player personality are a part of it too, but intuitively I'd have thought that if you had 2 players with everything else equal  then the one who came on for half an hour would be happier about that than the player who was told to watch from the stands and not even put his kit on. He's getting more game time, would feel more important and is getting an appearance fee. He also has a chance to get a goal or assist bonus etc. He'd get to hear the teamtalks, be a part of all the dressing room camaraderie and could even be the hero if he scores the winner. The player sitting in the stands in his suit doesn't have any of that.

Edited August 6, 2020 by fat mole

[Spanner]

I have never had an issue with playing time versus expectations. So far, I see no signs that it is buggy.

There is a way to check what your player expects over the next couple of matches, if they are happy with their playing time and if a player is concerned it can be managed over the season.

The only area i have noticed that something is critical for players is if you have 'Star-players'. They will demand starts and hate being subbed-on. Paul Pogba even had a meeting with me about it and that became a promise from me to start him in more games. 

 

[fivetwelvepony]

On 05/08/2020 at 03:15, nully29 said:

I noticed that too. My best guess is that first one means to say how happy a player is, based strictly on expectations and matches started, and second one is how likely he is to complain about it, based on his personality, your manager reputation and all. SI is clearly using two different formulas here, but comes short in explaining what they are trying to say. 

If my assistant manager had a tagline, this would be it.