Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread

[Cegidog]

7 minutes ago, szp said:

These analysis have nothing to do with reality. I gave here an example of my stats which were showing that the number of my converted CCCs was bigger than total goals scored by my team 

I went back and checked game by game and they added up. So I think they're right. My last 10 games CCC - 1,6,5,2,3,2,1,2,2,3

[Pasonen]

If the ME is fine then someone should make db where st's got dec and passing 15-20, dc's all got anticipation and marking 20, gk one-ones 1 and handling 10 at most! Oh yeah and everyone heading at least 15.

[fidelitywars]

1 minute ago, Johnny Ace said:

It's all under player stats, the same as last year, I think. There's Defending, Attacking, General & the like 

But the stats available in each have changed; attacking doesn't seem to have shots...

[Johnny Ace]

Just now, fidelitywars said:

But the stats available in each have changed; attacking doesn't seem to have shots...

 Whaaaa... ? For real? How odd 

[fidelitywars]

Just now, Johnny Ace said:

 Whaaaa... ? For real? How odd 

Massively questioning myself now but am pretty sure i'm not making this up! Will check tonight...

[Costanino Hummels]

18 hours ago, enricoix said:

Antes que nada déjenme decir: con la introducción de cada parche, el juego llega a un mejor estado. Incluso con un ritmo lento, estás tratando de llegar allí. Pero, ¿por qué es así?

Quiero decir, hiciste 2019 jugable después de numerosos parches y este año tuvimos 2020 lleno de errores en el lanzamiento. (y desafortunadamente aún así)
Para mí, los juegos que lanzaste recientemente (especialmente las dos últimas versiones) fueron realmente muy defectuosos. Y estoy hablando de errores que cambian el juego aquí.
Problemas como los huelguistas que no anotan o atacan problemas de movimiento de 2019 / disparos de ángulo absurdos o 1 contra 1 de 2020.

Francamente, me resulta difícil creer que no haya detectado ese tipo de problemas claros durante las pruebas.
Entonces mi respuesta es: o bien no los ha detectado genuinamente (¡lo que sería una verdadera preocupación!) O lo detectó pero no tuvo tiempo de eliminarlo hasta su lanzamiento.
En cualquier caso, me parece que definitivamente hay algo mal con su equipo de prueba o el proceso de prueba. (que debe ser mucho más eficiente)

Como consumidor, te pido algo muy simple: liberar un juego sin errores (o al menos como mínimo). Personalmente, prefiero esperar más que obtener el juego en un estado defectuoso.

Permítanme hacer una pequeña lista de cuestiones en las que puedo pensar: (estas son solo mis opiniones y observaciones)

- Primero y ante todo, creo que el juego es MUY fácil
- La proporción de puntaje 1v1 es extremadamente baja
- Las oportunidades 1v1 son muy frecuentes
- Hay muchos movimientos de pelota tipo pinball que golpean a los jugadores una y otra vez (¿hay algún problema con respecto a la pelota versus ¿
Volumen de jugadores?) - Demasiados pases largos exitosos de regreso a la defensa (lo que lleva a frecuentes 1v1 y termina con una muy baja proporción de puntaje 1v1 aparentemente)
- Cuando dos jugadores terminan en la portería, el jugador con el balón casi nunca pasa a un compañero de equipo más abierto, pero disparar
- Demasiadas penalizaciones fallidas
- El juego parece más generoso para el equipo que tiene menos disparos para mantener el partido emocionante(muchos ejemplos como: tiros 37 en el blanco 13 / tiros 6 en el blanco 2. Puntaje final 1-1)
- Como gerente, termino como persona favorita muy rápido

Bueno, mirando el panorama general: arriba dije que el juego mejora con cada parche, pero no puedo evitar pensar "¿en qué medida?"
Este es un juego que juego desde hace más de 20 años (como una buena cantidad de ustedes por ahí)
. Revisé mis horas de juego en Steam a partir de 2012. Son principalmente superiores a 350 hy algunos cerca del margen de 450 h. Veo que he jugado 2020 durante 132h. Y ya tengo frío. (generalmente solía enfriarme de FM en febrero)

FM es un juego que compro por adelantado todos los años. Incluso con los defectos, este es un gran juego, pero estoy considerando no comprarlo el próximo año (al menos no hasta el parche n. ° 9)

Aquí hay algunas sugerencias de un compañero fanático:
no tengo idea sobre su agenda, pero creo que debe tomar algunas medidas drásticas. Cuando solo echas un vistazo a la voz de la comunidad aquí, detrás de cada discusión y argumento, verías que hay un consenso sobre una cosa (durante mucho tiempo). Pobre de mí.
Entonces, comience a trabajar en un nuevo ME desde cero, mejore los gráficos (no nos engañemos, el 3D no está en el nivel de 2020), cree una nueva interfaz si es necesario.
Debe haber mentes brillantes por ahí. Use la innovación y la ambición para que esto suceda. Ustedes fueron los pioneros del género. Ya habías aumentado la barra antes, haz que vuelva a suceder.

Finalmente, como consumidor fiel y fanático de la serie, le pregunto sinceramente: no me pierda, no pierda a los consumidores y fanáticos de mucho tiempo como yo ... porque es a donde se dirige. 

TOUCHÉ

[Novem9]

7 минут назад, fidelitywars сказал:

Ah so it's moved into the analysis menu? Used to be available under 'stats' as did shots/shots on target which also isn't available. Would be great to have passes/key passes/dribbles/shots/shots on target available from 1 view like it was previously.

Analysis -> Player and check drop menu in left. Probably you will need a time but I think this is very useful. Also you can combinate few of them to watch in field in the same time

[hickuain]

18 hours ago, JakeLeeYes said:

Really disappointed And absolutely shocked by this statement. 
 

You’ve taken £40 from every single one of us and then said you can’t fix the faults anytime soon because “it’s not that simplistic.” 
 

Can you imagine paying a plumber to install a new boiler and when it’s not heating up as much as it should he says “Ah well it’s just not that simplistic.” 
 

FM19 was really good for me so I spent £40 on the next game in the series expecting to get, at the very least, the same level of game. It is honestly, for me and many others, unplayable it’s current state and there seems to be no urgency to get it fixed. It’s also the most expensive PC game that I own.

If you’re going to charge £40 for a game, the very least you can do is fix it as soon as faults arise. It may not be straight forward but for £40 you should offer a certain level of service. This is not a £5 indie early alpha game.

The fault with one on ones is such a huge element of the game that directly affects the user experience. It’s not just something little and aesthetic. It’s also something that should have been picked up on long before the game was even released in Beta. You only need to play one or two games with a lone striker to see that it’s an issue. 
 

It is extremely disappointing to be in this situation with any game, let alone one from a company we all have such an affinity for. 

 

Absolutely agree, this isn't some indie company or cut price release. The very least they should do is test it properly before release so they can release it without the major faults, the worst thing for me is the 'beta' period doesn't end with the release of the full game - it just rolls on until the new year when they fix the issues. I'd rather the game stay in development an extra couple of weeks and release in a stable and tuned state.

[KUBI]

Gerade eben schrieb Costanino Hummels:

TOUCHÉ

Welcome to the forums. There is an upvote button for this kind of response. (arrow up).

[Costanino Hummels]

1 minute ago, KUBI said:

Welcome to the forums. There is an upvote button for this kind of response. (arrow up).

OK

[Novem9]

2 минуты назад, Costanino Hummels сказал:

OK

The most ironic thing that could have been use upvote in this time too  

[gpassosbh]

Just a quick question. Why jumped from 20.2.1 to 20.2.3?

[bahrami]

4 hours ago, Neil Brock said:

We don't feel the match engine is broken, unplayable or needs 'fixing'. We'd like to improve it and that's what we're working on.

I don't feel the need to ever buy Football Manager again, I'd like to improve my time spent and that's what I'm working on.

[saiyaman]

Being a Software Dev myself I can relate to the difficult situation SI are in.

But do not take me wrong for blindly supporting them when they release a complicated piece of software and many customers feel like their feedback wasn't taken into account. I do agree with some of the posts which have raised concerns over the module which is the Match Engine.

Perhaps I think the beta duration should be increased to allow SI more breathing time to give out a better fix. I kind of thought that the beta idea when it was first started was a brilliant idea. It has helped resolve thousands of issues not because users are being made into testers but feedback from users is the most critical thing next to the QA asking the devs to fix something.

In a way, I think SI have done a good job of not overloading the game with more features just for the sake of features this year at least. They've attempted to fine tune and increase visibility of features which weren't implemented to their full potential in previous versions which is something which people have asked for. I know some do not want to pay full price for something like that but from what I remember many people were delighted that SI was trying to improve meaningful things instead of blindly releasing new features just to make it look new.

I dunno folks at SI. What do you think? A more improved and longer beta duration to collect feedback?

EDIT: I think a beta along with a "Patch Test Server" as it's present in MMos like World of Warcraft would go a long way to help the devs and the users too.

Edited December 19, 2019 by saiyaman

[campos08]

Does anyone can confirm one thing?

Does Opposition Instructions work?  I set them up in tactics screen and tick apply to all players play in this position so this way they should be set permanently. But in a match screen they are blank.

[f.zaarour]

About the 1on1's!... Im glad the 1 on 1's is onder review. I think its not about the attackers missing them, but the GK's who are just way to good. Also with penalties, they stop way more than it goes in. Its like in Fifa (dunno which year it was) where the Gk's where overpowered. So you get the chances to score, but the GK's is hard to defeat. So you could say, i cant score, its weird and attackers are weak, but the fact could be also that the Gk's are too strong. 

Edited December 19, 2019 by f.zaarour

[Neil Brock]

55 minutes ago, gpassosbh said:

Just a quick question. Why jumped from 20.2.1 to 20.2.3?

We released a 20.2.2 for FM Touch on Tablet, this update has made that they're all back onto 20.2.3. 

[gpassosbh]

18 minutes ago, Neil Brock said:

We released a 20.2.2 for FM Touch on Tablet, this update has made that they're all back onto 20.2.3. 

Thanks Neil.

[Alannnnn]

On 12/18/2019 at 12:02 PM, Neil Brock said:

We can't take steps forward without taking risks. As we've said a number of times there's always going to be balancing of the ME. Just look at the last couple of years and we've seen VAR and a change for how goal kicks are taken. I can't remember how many years exactly ago it was, but we added collision detection. There will always be a risk when we're trying to improve the Match Engine but we always feel those improvements are worth it.

In regards to your post, I asked about showing respect. Whilst you're entitled to express your opinion about the game, labelling it 'a horrendous mess' and that we 'sell some garbage' are comments which aren't unhelpful and offensive to the development team. Please bear this in mind when posting in the future.   

Yes, you can't do that, I agree. But you can also have a decent system which would remove these obvious flaws from the games before release. Some of them weren't even little things, they were really big issues. And I don't see how the current new implementation of VAR and goal kicks would change how a winger would try and shoot at every opportunity instead of crossing / strikers underperforming, 1v1s, penalty misses/ set piece goals etc. How wasn't these issues picked up? Either it's lazy on your end, people aren't good at their job or you just don't care as you expect the customers to pick things up.

 

Some of it really isn't good enough. You wouldn't sell a new house without a door would you? You wouldn't sell a brand new car with a big scratch down it and some of the engine missing? So why would you sell a game with big issues in the match engine?

Edited December 19, 2019 by Alannnnn

[herne79]

3 minutes ago, Alannnnn said:

Either it's lazy on your end, people aren't good at their job or you just don't care as you expect the customers to pick things up.

Appreciate you're frustrated but passing poor comments like this about the hard working and passionate staff at SI isn't acceptable.  Comment about the game, not people please.

[Alannnnn]

Just now, herne79 said:

Appreciate you're frustrated but passing poor comments like this about the hard working and passionate staff at SI isn't acceptable. Comment about the game, not people please.

I'm sorry, but no.

 

If I mess things up in work, I get blamed and I have issues to fix it. People pay me good money to do a job and if I fail to meet their standards, I will fully accept their criticism apologise and fix the issues accordingly. 

 

 You're a multi million pound company with actual paying customers for your service. You're not a couple of lads in the basement making games for free. 

[Eschaba]

Funny how know MODS etc, never replied to my post:

So what if you played the demo and thought this isn't too bad actually, and was enjoying it etc, and decided to purchase the full game, and not long after, an update (or several!) came out and made the game worse, play-wise and possibly started crashing, and it was too late for a refund?? Technically speaking, it's a different ME/game than the one the demo represented, and surely that's false advertising?

According to the features of FM20, it's the most realistic and immersive ME to date! Lol. Why I can't stand that Miles Jacobson. Bloke's a fraud. Comes across as so abrupt on his Twitter when people dare question him. Has the cheek to say if there are any bugs, to report to the development team, etc. What's his job then? Just a figure head who represents the company and counts the money! Has the audacity to state how happy he is of the ME and how great it is.

Edited December 19, 2019 by Eschaba

[herne79]

3 minutes ago, Alannnnn said:

If I mess things up in work, I get blamed and I have issues to fix it.

And you would like to be accused of being lazy, uncaring or just plain bad at your job?

2 minutes ago, Eschaba said:

Bloke's a fraud.

One final time for the pair of you, comment about the game as much as you like but I urge you not to make derogatory comments at SI staff's expense.

[Eschaba]

Like I have always said. The game is virtually the same every single year. It's in forever 'beta' mode. Anything decent about the ME in past versions, somehow gets eradicated and made worse! I guess the one thing about the major issues with the game, is that it attempts to look like a new game from previous MEs! Lol. SI should be developing a quality ME, and if achieved. Keep it the same for a few years, and focus on other little or big features. Maybe cinematic press conferences or celebrations etc. Better graphics. Little things go a big way. FIFA is the same crap each year. But at least they introduce a UEFA format and stuff like that and press conferences. Same as FM has the same boring match-day sounds and effects for well over a decade at least. Just lazy.

[Alannnnn]

3 minutes ago, herne79 said:

And you would like to be accused of being lazy, uncaring or just plain bad at your job?

One final time for the pair of you, comment about the game as much as you like but I urge you not to make derogatory comments at SI staff's expense.

I don't care what they accuse me of. If they wish to do that, then feel free. I just fix my mess and make it as best as I can so they're satisfied. I won't dictate to them what they can and can't say about my work.

[srvngrc]

1 saat önce, campos08 said:

Does anyone can confirm one thing?

Does Opposition Instructions work?  I set them up in tactics screen and tick apply to all players play in this position so this way they should be set permanently. But in a match screen they are blank.

How dare you???

Of course everything in FM work properly. If something looks like broken there must be a problem with you. Maybe it’s your tactics

[herne79]

2 minutes ago, Eschaba said:

Just lazy.

What did I just say?

2 minutes ago, Alannnnn said:

I won't dictate to them what they can and can't say about my work.

I haven't said what you can and can't say about their work.  I said don't make derogatory comments about them.

I'm really trying hard here not to make this a more formal warning but both of you are not making it easy.  Comment about the game not people.  I can't be any more clear than that.

[KUBI]

vor 7 Minuten schrieb Eschaba:

Maybe cinematic press conferences or celebrations etc. 

 I don't think a lot of people would say, great, wow, cinematic press conferences. 

People always think their own opinion is what everyone is thinking, but it's not.  Therefore there is a feature request forum with a lot of ideas how to improve the game and as the bugs forum, it does help to make the game better, because a lot of new features started in the feature request forum. 

 

[HUNT3R]

Just now, srvngrc said:

How dare you???

Of course everything in FM work properly. If something looks like broken there must be a problem with you. Maybe it’s your tactics

Don't troll. People have legitimate questions.

[roykela]

5 minutes ago, Alannnnn said:

I don't care what they accuse me of. If they wish to do that, then feel free. I just fix my mess and make it as best as I can so they're satisfied. I won't dictate to them what they can and can't say about my work.

So basically you're saying that they shouldn't care about what you say here?
If we reverse the roles then you're essentially saying that they shouldn't care at all about what you're saying.

Second part is exactly what they're trying to do.

Third part goes both ways.

[HUNT3R]

We are posting this every page at this point. 

Quote

 

Realistically the match engine is not an easy area of the game to improve and given the amount of work and testing required to make sure any changes do as we expect and don't have any knock-ons, we're going to need time. Whilst the old adage of never say never, with the holidays approaching it's unlikely we'll be able to release any further changes to the match engine until the New Year. We really do appreciate anyone who takes the time to raise any issue or add additional examples via the match engine bug forums. We'll still be adding to and logging new issues into our bugs database to make sure everything is recorded and can be investigated by our match team. Appreciate those who take the time to read these types of messages from us. We are busy so don't always have the time to respond to every post, but we do try to make sure as much as possible is read.

Also would appreciate at this time of year remember the Mods on these forums are volunteers. They're not paid for helping out, they do so as they just want people to try and enjoy the game and when on these forums, be able to engage with each other in the best way possible. Whilst you don't always have to agree with them (or us for that matter) please try to respect their opinions. Likewise everyone at SI and within the Mod team tries to respect your opinions, even if they're critical of us. All we'd ask is if you are criticising please try and keep it constructive. We don't want to be in a position where we're restricting anyone's access to these forums, but direct attacks on other users, moderators or the development team won't be tolerated. 

 

Constructive criticism is fine, but attacks and insults against users, mods and/or SI aren't going to be tolerated.

[Novem9]

1 час назад, campos08 сказал:

Does anyone can confirm one thing?

Does Opposition Instructions work?  I set them up in tactics screen and tick apply to all players play in this position so this way they should be set permanently. But in a match screen they are blank.

There are two different interface. In tactics screen is pernament and in-match is for current opposite team only. So first is working pernamently, but second you can use individually. You dont need to worry about unvisible of this if shortly.\

At least as I remember my experience in prev editions. If I'm wrong please correct me

Edited December 19, 2019 by Novem9

[JordanMilly]

6 hours ago, prot651 said:

Well somethings weird as im hearing all about these 1 V 1 misses yet im not experiencing them at all ? Am I the only one 

Nope, I'm scoring about one in three 1v1s, which seems relatively realistic to me.

[JordanMilly]

4 hours ago, GOODNAME said:

Damm I hoped for ME changes  I was so hyped lol

 

Just curious, but why? Devs had already posted, in this same thread, saying that ME fixes would be very unlikely to be out before Christmas. I doubt very much that they'd suddenly change their mind within 24-48 hours.

[Guest]

19 hours ago, Tiger666 said:

I think my pc would be out the window if that was me.

We lost the group stage of Champions League because of this draw. That would be the first time of club history into Cham. League.
6 mil euros debt. So, it's heart a lot.
 

[JordanMilly]

2 hours ago, Pasonen said:

If the ME is fine then someone should make db where st's got dec and passing 15-20, dc's all got anticipation and marking 20, gk one-ones 1 and handling 10 at most! Oh yeah and everyone heading at least 15.

This is where differences in players, tactics, etc, all then starts influencing things too, because in my Dortmund game, in the latest season, Paco Alcacer has about 14 goals in 16 matches as a DLF(s), left IF(a), right IW(s), and Reus as AM AP(s), and the rest of my players are getting decent numbers of goals as well. Hell, with how Paco has been playing this season IRL, he's probably scoring too often.

[Novem9]

Guys is it looks like ME has some changes? I know about placebo, but its not about better/worse. I mean a changes about I used very specific tactic and for now I can see that it works different in moves of this. Direction of attacks, algorhytm of phases, etc.
And no see any other reasons for so quick changes, update only. I confused because me version the same

[HUNT3R]

Just now, Novem9 said:

Guys is it looks like ME has some changes? I know about placebo, but its not about better/worse. I mean a changes about I used very specific tactic and for now I can see that it works different in moves of this. Direction of attacks, algorhytm of phases, etc.
And no see any other reasons for so quick changes, update only. I confused because me version the same

No. There's no change. SI said it's very unlikely that we'll see changes now and it's the same ME version. For any ME change, the ME version would change.

[99]

I really don't envy the mods work.

But I congratulate you (the mods).

Edited December 19, 2019 by 99

[regainer]

11 minutes ago, 99 said:

I really don't envy the mods work.

But I congratulate you (the mods).

?

[Guest]

32 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

No. There's no change. SI said it's very unlikely that we'll see changes now and it's the same ME version. For any ME change, the ME version would change.

The previous hotfix was 300 MB, the new one is also 300 MB; but way much less changes according to changelist.

[darthlemon]

This game felt like a pretty good representation of where we're at right now. 

I'm Stuttgart and this was a big game against Bayern who've dominated the league for years.

We were the better team and I missed about 5 one on ones (par for the course I know)... before conceding this in the last minute to lose 1-0. 

Not really trying to pile on. I know things are being worked on... just hoping someone finds some amusement in this. 

[HUNT3R]

Just now, Cadoni said:

The previous hotfix was 300 MB, the new one is also 300 MB; but way much less changes according to changelist.

Regardless of the size, the changes are listed.

[haffaz77]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb darthlemon:

This game felt like a pretty good representation of where we're at right now. 

I'm Stuttgart and this was a big game against Bayern who've dominated the league for years.

We were the better team and I missed about 5 one on ones (par for the course I know)... before conceding this in the last minute to lose 1-0. 

Not really trying to pile on. I know things are being worked on... just hoping someone finds some amusement in this. 

Pure Realism 

[Novem9]

5 минут назад, Cadoni сказал:

The previous hotfix was 300 MB, the new one is also 300 MB; but way much less changes according to changelist.

Despite size of update and default answers of mod which probably even not checked ME after update I noticed some changes in my game and just ask for members anyone noticed the same or not. No speculation, just simple question

 

4 минуты назад, HUNT3R сказал:

Regardless of the size, the changes are listed.

Neil Brock: This hotfix includes but is not limited to the changes listed below.

[HUNT3R]

Just now, Novem9 said:

espite size of update and default answers of mod which probably even not checked ME

Actually, this mod did check. The ME is unchanged. Thanks.

[saihtam]

9 minutes ago, Cadoni said:

The previous hotfix was 300 MB, the new one is also 300 MB; but way much less changes according to changelist.

Size does not always = number changes. One small change somewhere could mean part of something must be uploaded together, patching does not mean that they are adding things to game files.

There have been games where 5-10gb patches have been and change log is very small.

[nikolaMo]

Still a horrible boring ME, don't worry the update didn't change it. 

[Kev Gee]

I'm trying to find a tactic that will defeat the 1 on 1 issue.

Would probably require:-

Crosses into box

Long shots

Pass rather than shoot

I'm trying to find some of these options/individual instructions but I'm struggling.

I've got pass down the flanks, try more long shots. But it doesn't seem to make much difference.

 

I played some more matches earlier were there was also some 3 on 1 situations and the player shot straight at the keeper when the other 2 were in space and 6 yards out.

Sigh.... 

[LordAEM]

On 18/12/2019 at 06:32, prot651 said:

2 or 3 years they would go broke . Turnover is the key every year to release just enough new stuff to keep people interested 

yeah but NEW stuff isnt what keeps people interested. A working game does that. The Match Engine has been the problem child year in, year out. Why not have a dedicated team

to REBUILD/REVAMP the Match-Engine or just build a complete new one. Everyone acts like the 1vs1's are new, 1v1s have been horrendous for several years. The 1 thing SI sadly never

did is try to go a different way. I dont need FIFA graphics, I dont need a manager on the sideline. What i would love to see is a solid game of football when i play the game, without animation errors

(I would have thought 6 years of that excuse was enough), but they are still there. Defenders stopping to chase a ball when the attacker gets passed to, the player overrunning the ball on the side- and byline,

the GKs going over the byline after a save.

 

BUT all that being said, I still think this years FM is better then several FMs before it. I miss 1v1s but i have done so for many FMs. I actually love the fact i score some now. GKs are actually a tat bit better then the last

3-4 editions. So yeah it is annoying that SI doesnt do more, but maybe this is just it, maybe SI are just not capable of fixing the long standing issues. Why otherwise would issues still be there?? Is that the question we should ask 

ourselves?