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FM 21 - FM 20 Tactic List FM (Includes Man City Pep 20/21 High possession and Man U 98/99 Recreation ) 19 Recommended Tactic List


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FRENCH UNDERDOG TESTS BY TOMAKA

Max is maximum potential of tactic TOP 2 is trying to eliminate RNG (FMRTE is not being used)

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FINAL TABLE

Angers Beowulf p107 Toulouse OXFORD 4321 P103

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RECOMMENDED TRAINING SCHEDULES

Cadoni recommendations

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My journey with Maidstone:

I have to blame myself, not designing and playing from 1 match with 20.4.0 TEA FOR ONE VOL4 4411 P103 ALL CUPS.

I have designed my team to play with Black Echo 442.

If someone plays at Vanarama, they know that finding players is PITA.

Three defeats with 20.4.0 TEA FOR ONE.

Rest defeats with Black Echo.

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Breaking wins for the team

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What about goals? We have it.

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My goal machine (this is a joke Knap, congrats)

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Regarding for yellow and red cards and fouls

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Now.

The more serious things about the game.

I am taking responsibility of training.

I am using 2 Match from FM Korea and Chance Creation & Score More Goals from Passion4FM.

https://www.passion4fm.com/football-manager-training-schedules-megapack/

I am also using training sche. for youths from Passion4FM.

Not so much for comment about those, I have started to use it 8 months (in game) now.

Chance Creation & Score More Goals sche. really helps. I haven't checked Youths.

SHOTS

Demand More when we are winning by 1 goal.

Show Some Passion when we are back at score.

Praise when winning 2 or more goals.

--

FA Trophy and if we make League 2 promotion, who knows.

 

MRr Hough recommended shouts

Use shouts Show Some Passion and Demand More. Also concentrate if leading by a few goals

Edited 5 minutes ago by knap

Edited by knap
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37 minutes ago, jonnysnipe said:

I switched to the 4411 this season from a 23221.

Crossers are excellent 16 on RM and 18 on LM.

Pulling my hair out here - never had such a good team but cant do anything.

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i'm using the black echo 4411 and changed the crossing to whipped cross as all my wide men have good decent crossing, vision, anticipation and technique. Coleman doesn't have good vision stats but the rest do. ST also has good movement off the ball. my ST scored 4 goals from crosses. Digne created 3 chances, Coleman created 1 chance, Iwobi has 2 assists, Bernard created 1 chance and 1 assist.

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4 minutes ago, miangelo said:

@RDF Tactics,

Do you make any changes in the black echo 4411 tactic when you play outside games?

Nope. I was reading into some blogs and guides and stumbled across crossing. So just trying to use my head on when the right time to choose different types of crossing. So just using this Everton save as a test.

Whipped crosses will require technique, crossing, vision. Strikers should have good anticipation, of the ball and first touch

Float crosses I would use when my wide players are poor at crossing, vision and strikers have good physical presence and bravery, teamwork

Low crosses I would use when my wide players are poor at crossing, vision and strikers have good acceleration, off the ball and anticipation. 

Wide players include full backs, specially if you are using overlaps

This in not facts, just my view on it

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46 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

Nope. I was reading into some blogs and guides and stumbled across crossing. So just trying to use my head on when the right time to choose different types of crossing. So just using this Everton save as a test.

Whipped crosses will require technique, crossing, vision. Strikers should have good anticipation, of the ball and first touch

Float crosses I would use when my wide players are poor at crossing, vision and strikers have good physical presence and bravery, teamwork

Low crosses I would use when my wide players are poor at crossing, vision and strikers have good acceleration, off the ball and anticipation. 

Wide players include full backs, specially if you are using overlaps

This in not facts, just my view on it

 

Hi RDF you would give me a cross, I will give you the attributes of my wide players and strikes.

 

Zaldua - crossing 12, technique 13, vision 12

Monreal - crossing 12, technique 13, vision 10

Munoz - crossing 13, technique 13, vision 12

Montoya - crossing 13, technique 12, vision 11

Barrenetxea - crossing 13, technique 15, vision 12

Oyarzabal - crossing 12, technique 16, vision 16

Januzaj - crossing 13, technique 17, vision 16

Odeegard - crossing 13, technique 16, vision 16

And my strikes

Isak - bravery 10, teamwork 12,acceleration 16, off the ball 13 ,anticipation 15,first touch 14

Openda - bravery 14, teamwork 14,acceleration 15, off the ball 6 ,anticipation 12,first touch 13

Angel - bravery 13, teamwork 10,acceleration 15, off the ball 17 ,anticipation 14,first touch 13

Edited by adlyd90
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Hi Knap, so it's a good idea to choose a tactic from 'top' teams when i'm favourite in a match even if I'm only a Championship team? And one from 'sub top' when it's evens and one from 'underdog' when I'm the underdog?

Also, on the FM Base testing list I noticed blackecho4411 is listed as the best for poor teams but not as underdog on your list. Which list is better to use if i'm looking for an underdog tactic?

thanks for your help and great work!

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@tmsinclair

The FM Base test is not what it appears to be at first sight. Poor relates to reputation and not under dog, same with other categories. I have therefore removed references to these tests.

The categories top sub top and under relate to any league

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4 minutes ago, adlyd90 said:

 

Hi RDF you would give me a cross, I will give you the attributes of my wide players and strikes.

 

Zaldua - crossing 12, technique 13, vision 12

Monreal - crossing 12, technique 13, vision 10

Munoz - crossing 13, technique 13, vision 12

Montoya - crossing 13, technique 12, vision 11

Barrenetxea - crossing 13, technique 15, vision 12

Oyarzabal - crossing 12, technique 16, vision 16

Januzaj - crossing 13, technique 17, vision 16

Odeegard - crossing 13, technique 16, vision 16

And my strikes

Isak - bravery 10, teamwork 12,acceleration 16, off the ball 13 ,anticipation 15,first touch 14

Openda - bravery 14, teamwork 14,acceleration 15, off the ball 6 ,anticipation 12,first touch 13

Angel - bravery 13, teamwork 10,acceleration 15, off the ball 17 ,anticipation 14,first touch 13

Depending on your tactics but...

I'd have Zaluda RB, Monreal LB, Odegaard RM, Januzaj LM and Isak as ST (not sure who angel is) with whipped or mixed crossing 

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5 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

Depending on your tactics but...

I'd have Zaluda RB, Monreal LB, Odegaard RM, Januzaj LM and Isak as ST (not sure who angel is) with whipped or mixed crossing 

I forgot to add that Isak is injured :(

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using black echo 4411 with whipped crosses

also along with micro management. if opponents defence/midfield are faster than mine then i removed "pass into space"...if my centre mids are good at dribbling and balance and opponent has good midfield i remove "run at defence". against UTD and LFC, i dropped my DL to higher as they use their pacey strikers 

20200414120121_1.thumb.jpg.a717f206ec412516ce4298835ab9c1e8.jpg

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4 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

using black echo 4411 with whipped crosses

also along with micro management. if opponents defence/midfield are faster than mine then i removed "pass into space"...if my centre mids are good at dribbling and balance and opponent has good midfield i remove "run at defence". against UTD and LFC, i dropped my DL to higher as they use their pacey strikers 

20200414120121_1.thumb.jpg.a717f206ec412516ce4298835ab9c1e8.jpg

Would you show on the screen when you change the pass into space and run in defense?

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27 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

using black echo 4411 with whipped crosses

also along with micro management. if opponents defence/midfield are faster than mine then i removed "pass into space"...if my centre mids are good at dribbling and balance and opponent has good midfield i remove "run at defence". against UTD and LFC, i dropped my DL to higher as they use their pacey strikers 

20200414120121_1.thumb.jpg.a717f206ec412516ce4298835ab9c1e8.jpg

 

Interesting.

Tactics have always came 2nd to squad building for me so never thought about those small micro manage points.

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6 minutes ago, adlyd90 said:

Well, just show your screen and your opponent's screen and show what it depends on that you change the pass into space and run in defense.

these were my instructions for these games. Against Arsenal i dropped the DL line to Higher as they have Auba and good creators who can pass to him.

i removed "pass into space" as my players on ATT duty are not the fastest players, as good opponents have good pacey defence and midfield. i didnt want my team trying to pass into space to Sigurdsson and Gomes (who has get further forward) I also removed "run at defence" my midfield and attackers don't have the best dribbling and balance stats, and good opponents have good tacklers in defence and midfield

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6 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

these were my instructions for these games. Against Arsenal i dropped the DL line to Higher as they have Auba and good creators who can pass to him.

i removed "pass into space" as my players on ATT duty are not the fastest players, as good opponents have good pacey defence and midfield. i didnt want my team trying to pass into space to Sigurdsson and Gomes (who has get further forward) I also removed "run at defence" my midfield and attackers don't have the best dribbling and balance stats, and good opponents have good tacklers in defence and midfield

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And what would you say if you just completely removed the pass into space and run in defense?

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As someone who has used 4411's religiously, I wouldn't recommend black echo 4411 unless you have some really decent players or willing to do as RDF does and tweak along the way, I've found it to be an unforgiving tactic on my saves. Of course you can always go on a winning run and you'll steam roll your way through the next 10-15 games.

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9 minutes ago, duque said:

Can you please send a picture of your tactics, and how do you play Almada? @RDF Tactics

Its Knaps 4411 black echo...and i don't really play him, i let him play all u23 games and letting him develop for future seasons. i don't really rotate, i usually always play my strongest team and play youths in the cups. 

HINT!!! Both Thaigo Almada and Naoh Katterbach, you can sign them on loans with optional fee of 2.5mil. VERY cheap deals, specially for teams with low budgets. i do this with every save lol 

20200414125114_1.thumb.jpg.f4346c1df2c063505dc260b9801dba4f.jpg

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10 minutes ago, adlyd90 said:

And what would you say if you just completely removed the pass into space and run in defense?

you would lose lots of attacking threats and possibilities. i have lots of 1-0 victories, and i think may be on a different save, some of these could have be draws. so its key to have the correct players. like @8BuggieNights15 said, this can be unforgiven, so you will need good technical players because its lots of short passing, and also strong dribblers and players with high anticipation as you have lots of players on ATT duty

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23 minutes ago, jonnysnipe said:

 

Interesting.

Tactics have always came 2nd to squad building for me so never thought about those small micro manage points.

they can make small differences that turn into a big difference. if i can turn just 2 draws in to 2 wins, that could be very important 4 points at the end of the season.

asking players to do things they can't might just be too much to ask. also it could change your tactic...having 30+ doesn't always mean your tactic is working, you may be dominant in possesion but not creating good chances because players making wrong/different decisions. i noticed in one of my games (i use instant result but play back matches with extended highlights), Sigurdsson is slow and my midfielders have good decisions, but they would shoot or play different pass in situations instead of playing into space as Sigurdsson would be too slow to make the pass. so my midfielders may have good decisions and the good decision is to not play the pass thats impossible for Sigurdsson, but that changes the way we attack. 

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5 hours ago, RDF Tactics said:

excellent stuff! i was actually considering doing the same thing but on the forum sites to save people asking the same questions (probably would still ask the same questions lol) 

but great guide and if people are new/struggling then should AT LEAST give this a read. as well as already reading the tips in Knaps op

Thanks for that, was a bit unsure as to it's importance you know, since its been "normal" for so long.
But I do believe in it, and I don't feel good playing a game without it.

After a few looks around at other users games and so on I found the main difference between those who had results and lacked to be instant result and not. And there in teamtalks. If you don't do them right, you are not gonna get the same results as a 20 motivation, 19 man management, 20 mental coaching assistant manager named Laux :)

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12 minutes ago, Rober82 said:

Thanks for that, was a bit unsure as to it's importance you know, since its been "normal" for so long.
But I do believe in it, and I don't feel good playing a game without it.

After a few looks around at other users games and so on I found the main difference between those who had results and lacked to be instant result and not. And there in teamtalks. If you don't do them right, you are not gonna get the same results as a 20 motivation, 19 man management, 20 mental coaching assistant manager named Laux :)

well same goes for me, but for years now people have been searching for that Plug n Play style, which is slowly dying in football manager it seems.

haha i love Laux! but when i managed English teams, i get him to manage the youth teams, and usually get Bryan Klug, mainly because he's english and won't accept managing youth teams...its just every day running of the club too, thats why for me i always hire coaches and assts with high motivational and man management skills to keep players happy and the ability to not let them get too low after a big defeat, which will happen in the Prem lol.

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21 hours ago, arthmael said:

I have been using !FM20.2.4WULF424IFKnapP98ECFA across multiple saves and teams (big and small). Here are the latest results with a new save.

Started unemployed and took the job at the end of the first season, second season expectations were to finish mid table (9th).

So if anyone is looking for a great 424 formation I recommend this one...

Pieršaja Liha_ Profile.png

Just to update my results with this tactic.

After the promotion to the first league the tactic keeps doing great.
 

I made a few transfers, but I am far from the quality that's needed to finish 5th in the league. (20.4.1 DB)

Vyšejšaja Liha_ Profile.png

Edited by arthmael
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6 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

just posting this now to let you guys know how close i was to winning the league! haha, i'm dreading my last 3 games, with City a game in had too.

so far, 35P and only lost 1 in the league

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Do you play IR as well?

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this game gave me a damn HEART ATTACK! i was focussing on Man City all season, i lost to Chelsea then realised LFC were only 1 point away! luckily i won 3-0

1st season with Everton using 4411 black echo and whipped crosses. 

BUT look at the stats from my wide men. Both full backs created most chances in the league. my LM and RM were 7th/8th in most chances created. and no, most were not corners as we only scored 9 from corners

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Edited by RDF Tactics
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1 hour ago, Rober82 said:

Thanks for that, was a bit unsure as to it's importance you know, since its been "normal" for so long.
But I do believe in it, and I don't feel good playing a game without it.

After a few looks around at other users games and so on I found the main difference between those who had results and lacked to be instant result and not. And there in teamtalks. If you don't do them right, you are not gonna get the same results as a 20 motivation, 19 man management, 20 mental coaching assistant manager named Laux :)

with the individual training do you just keep intensity level at normal through out the season ?

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1 minute ago, hilmz88 said:

with the individual training do you just keep intensity level at normal through out the season ?

Well, mostly yes. But I do vary with players who are not in the first team and lack fitness. They might as well train hard! But then more risk for injuries... So it's a thin line, be safe rather than sorry.

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50 minutes ago, RDF Tactics said:

this game gave me a damn HEART ATTACK! i was focussing on Man City all season, i lost to Chelsea then realised LFC were only 1 point away! luckily i won 3-0

1st season with Everton using 4411 black echo and whipped crosses. 

BUT look at the stats from my wide men. Both full backs created most chances in the league. my LM and RM were 7th/8th in most chances created. and no, most were not corners as we only scored 9 from corners

20200414135826_1.thumb.jpg.cfcda31f877a44d3ac9fef2e1a9f8d78.jpg20200414135821_1.thumb.jpg.02c2ce6c24d16fa3b17580cf5eaf926d.jpg20200414135925_1.thumb.jpg.6544d4d3710dae33fab7f3ba50f74f2a.jpg20200414135948_1.thumb.jpg.e917f72da083632964fbd85c36c8dd19.jpg

 

Did you use this plug and play? also what kind of possessions stats did you have?

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22 hours ago, arthmael said:

I have been using !FM20.2.4WULF424IFKnapP98ECFA across multiple saves and teams (big and small). Here are the latest results with a new save.

Started unemployed and took the job at the end of the first season, second season expectations were to finish mid table (9th).

So if anyone is looking for a great 424 formation I recommend this one...

Pieršaja Liha_ Profile.png

Is there an updated version of this for 20.4 ? would really like to use this on my current save with Birmingham first season in the EPL after promotion, but would think on the latest match engine that it wouldn't be defensively stable enough?

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I tried a lot of tactics 4-2-3-1 formation(teo for one, black echo paris)  but none showed good football. i dont want fantastic results. i just want a realistic football with 4-2-3-1 formation. i manage dortmund, do you have any advice for me? thank you

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33 minutes ago, hilmz88 said:

do you ever go half intensity ? i got a couple players my physio is recommending they do half intensity. ive usually left this part to the assistant but im gonna give it i go this season

Yeah, follow their reccomendations!

 

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4 minutes ago, Rober82 said:

Yeah, follow their reccomendations!

 

hi mate I tried a lot of tactics 4-2-3-1 formation(teo for one, black echo paris)  but none showed good football. i dont want fantastic results. i just want a realistic football with 4-2-3-1 formation. i manage dortmund, do you have any advice for me? thank you.

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25 minutes ago, gooders11 said:

I'm really enjoying Kashmir 433 103pts but struggle away from home against better teams. Do you drop the mentality for tough away games?

No, have not tried that. At Crystal Palace i have loaded this one and is using that for the hard games, to test how it works. It does :)
But that means you need to have squad for both.

FM20.4.1KnapKashmir23221VOL5P101ECCC.fmf

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1 hour ago, hilmz88 said:

what do you do then check it every week or something ?

Yeah this is called micromanagement as RDF was talking about. Think of it as your early monday meeting as a manager, and you have a list of things to check! :)

 

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  • knap changed the title to FM 21 - FM 20 Tactic List FM (Includes Man City Pep 20/21 High possession and Man U 98/99 Recreation ) 19 Recommended Tactic List

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