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4 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:

It's that time which comes around every couple of years in a save where I have too many options but also nothing which quite fits so end up getting a bit creative.


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:lol:

Oh lord.. what next :lol:.

 

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36 minutes ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:


Nah, I did what I do every time and played one friendly and that was enough to remind me not to try to be too smart :lol:

Too much then? I love how you tinker with dominant formula and end up with something even better. Hats off to you mate.:applause:

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Yea. Trial and error is part of the process. Sometimes just laying out your best 11 in the tactics creator in whatever weird shape they make up and then playing around until you find something you're happy with. Invariably, you'll come up with something innovative which 'may change the way football is played forever' then play a friendly and quickly realise it won't, then revert to something more balanced. The secret is to get as much of the experimentation done in the pre-season as possible and not to do anything irreversible.. like sell your only right back like I did 4 years ago :lol:

 

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The 4-2-4 you shared has been a revelation in my United save. At the end of October, unbeaten, top scorers in the league and 2 draws (Real Madrid, West Brom). I only started it out of curiosity, but I have really enjoyed it.

I love how it works, it does have its weaknesses, but it has really made me appreciate having 2 quality strikers on the pitch being supplied by quality wide men.

Its made me question some of my role choices now, also the formations I use so thanks!

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14 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:

It's that time which comes around every couple of years in a save where I have too many options but also nothing which quite fits so end up getting a bit creative.


image.png.e05e6573b9189dd4ad91e8d9bea1a303.png


:lol:

Shame this didn't click, would have been interesting I'm sure. Out of interest, I noticed you shared a few variations of back 3 formations earlier in the thread when the team was very young, have you used any of them regularly going forward? 

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Posted (edited)
11 hours ago, Garrlor said:

The 4-2-4 you shared has been a revelation in my United save. At the end of October, unbeaten, top scorers in the league and 2 draws (Real Madrid, West Brom). I only started it out of curiosity, but I have really enjoyed it.

I love how it works, it does have its weaknesses, but it has really made me appreciate having 2 quality strikers on the pitch being supplied by quality wide men.

Its made me question some of my role choices now, also the formations I use so thanks!


You're welcome. Thank you for sharing. Glad to hear the success is translates elsewhere! :applause:

 

7 hours ago, ElJefe4 said:

Shame this didn't click, would have been interesting I'm sure. Out of interest, I noticed you shared a few variations of back 3 formations earlier in the thread when the team was very young, have you used any of them regularly going forward? 


Actually not much in this save. The 4-2-4 shifting to 3-1-6 has dominated for a number of years now. Most seasons I have at least considered some variant of the 3-4-2-1 or 3-1-4-2 but have actually never quite got them working the way I'd like.

Edited by Ö-zil to the Arsenal!
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  • 3 weeks later...
28 minutes ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:

Does anyone know how to get an old match report (just the main summary page) when I've gone on too far and it's no longer in my inbox?

I know there's a way to do it, but cannot find it for the life of me.

Is it not in the Analysis page of the Team Report?  Not sure how far you can go back as I'm not in the game at present...?

 

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11 minutes ago, Lordluap said:

Is it not in the Analysis page of the Team Report?  Not sure how far you can go back as I'm not in the game at present...?

 


I thought so too but, if it is, I can't see it. It's not that far, it's just slightly longer than the Inbox keeps the news for. Less than a month.

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23 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:


I thought so too but, if it is, I can't see it. It's not that far, it's just slightly longer than the Inbox keeps the news for. Less than a month.

Can you click on the scoreline in your results view?

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 10/04/2021 at 16:07, Konrad_Box2Box said:

First of all, even though I never commented, I enjoyed reading this thread multiple times, so hats off to @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! for the contribution! 

I actually came here to say that cult hero Tiago Dantas is currently playing in his first start for Bayern Munich, let's see how it goes! 


Thank you for sharing? How did he get on? I am in a remote location right now on satelite wifi so might have to wait a few weeks to catch up.

Always interested to follow how my FM prodigies go on in real life.

Crazy he's just making his first start. Could have won a couple of Champions Leagues by now if they'd all stayed at Benfica :lol:

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28 minutes ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:


Thank you for sharing? How did he get on? I am in a remote location right now on satelite wifi so might have to wait a few weeks to catch up.

Always interested to follow how my FM prodigies go on in real life.

Crazy he's just making his first start. Could have won a couple of Champions Leagues by now if they'd all stayed at Benfica :lol:

You need to be Benfica's manager for that to happen!

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  • 2 weeks later...
Posted (edited)
On 12/04/2021 at 22:01, woodyy2r said:

Out of interest @Ö-zil to the Arsenal! are you still going on with this save? I'm not sure what you've got left to achieve tbh, but this is an amazing read!


At the moment I am a little more pre-occupied with my FC United save but this is still going. I'm in a very remote corner of East Africa for work at the moment. Although I'm having a fair amount of time to play, the internet isn't strong enough to load a screenshot let alone a GIF :lol:

I'm open to ideas about how (/whether to) to progress the save. My objectives right now are:

  1. Overtake Real Madrid's 13 Champions League wins to become the most successful in Europe (on 12 right now).
  2. See the club into the new 100,000+ seater stadium (complete end of 2032 season).
  3. Play long enough to see out the career of Tiago Dantas (he's 30 now).

I have realised I never stick with a save long enough to see out someone's full career. As the youngest of the initial Golden Generation, Dantas' eventual retirement will also likely mean Joao Felix, Jota, Embalo, Luis, Fernandes, Pinto will be finishing their careers too so it will be nice to see how they all finish up.

We actually have another really good generation coming through so it would be nice to send the side out into their new stadium with a 3rd great side and then think about either new challenges within the save or starting somewhere new.

Edited by Ö-zil to the Arsenal!
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Honestly? You have already started the save over a second time, so why not play through until you are the truly dominant team in world football with no one ever having a hope of catching you. See if the new stadium and next generation are good enough to get you there, or press on for even more and a bigger stadium etc.

Just edited to add I was just browsing through this thread the other day and saw how much rubbish I have written in here, alongisde so many good ideas from yourself! I looked at the Guardiola style "free 8's" again and it made me take a look at another Portugese team - Sporting. They start the game with some good wingers, not inside forwards, have a couple of useful strikers and some good options for the free 8 roles. Hell, Fernandes starts off as a backup! I also really like the first team structure, with there being a core first team alongside everyone else being a back up player. Some good players in the B and youth sides and an area to work on with the defence... yeah I think they might just work well when I get the time to play. I wonder if I could ever overtake the master :lol:.

Edited by Garrlor
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image.png.a80b5dc7758f726408e9ef25ae742a20.png


:applause:
 

15 hours ago, Garrlor said:

Honestly? You have already started the save over a second time, so why not play through until you are the truly dominant team in world football with no one ever having a hope of catching you. See if the new stadium and next generation are good enough to get you there, or press on for even more and a bigger stadium etc.

Just edited to add I was just browsing through this thread the other day and saw how much rubbish I have written in here, alongisde so many good ideas from yourself! I looked at the Guardiola style "free 8's" again and it made me take a look at another Portugese team - Sporting. They start the game with some good wingers, not inside forwards, have a couple of useful strikers and some good options for the free 8 roles. Hell, Fernandes starts off as a backup! I also really like the first team structure, with there being a core first team alongside everyone else being a back up player. Some good players in the B and youth sides and an area to work on with the defence... yeah I think they might just work well when I get the time to play. I wonder if I could ever overtake the master :lol:.


Thank you for the comments :thup: I've now played one further season. Wifi connection isn't strong enough to provide an update so I will not give away any spoilers for those following. Dantas turns 31 this year - with no sign of deterioration - and the new stadium is one more year from completion.

One thing that is interesting me somewhat is almost the opposite of the original premise of this thread. It's maintaining the ability of older players into their mid-30s. This is something I have never done before and actually failed quite badly with Cristiano Ronaldo at Paris Saint-Germain. I actually think Dantas has the potential to find another gear. Dantas' physical attributes are high, particularly pace which I understand is quite expensive in terms of Current Ability. When his physical attributes deteriorate over time I am interested to see if we can keep his Current Ability high enough to see them redistributed into mental attributes. We are not far from 20s across the board for Anticipation (currently 17), Decisions (18) and Vision (19) etc. We can easily adapt the side tactically to mitigate any decrease in physical attributes.

Elsewhere in Europe, there have been a few developments:

  • Manchester United appear to have regained dominance over English football under Unai Emery. Instead of going to Arsenal, Emery won a few titles with PSG before a few La Ligas with Barcelona, a few Bundesligas with Bayern and now multiple Premier Leagues with Manchester United :lol:
  • Barcelona have a very strong team under Marcelino and just won their 6th consecutive title. Real Madrid look an utter mess.
  • PSG still dominate France under Jose Mourinho although Neymar has gone and Mbappe is 32.
  • Bayern wrestled the title back of Dortmund after 3 in a row.
  • Napoli won Serie A after Milan and Juventus have exchanged titles for the past few seasons. Juventus are ageing (for a change).

Most squads almost entirely consist of newgens now.

Regarding your comment on Sporting - I agree entirely. Sporting and Porto have two of the best squads in the game for this type of save, with academies to match. I'd be interested to hear how you go :thup:

 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 23/02/2021 at 14:54, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:


Sponsorship

I am putting this out there, in case of anybody has any insight on increasing Sponsorship revenue, or even simply how it works.

In the 2028/29 season - as the most reputable club in the world, winning every trophy and a side with multiple World Cup winners and the Balon d'Or holder - Benfica generated £46m in sponsorship revenue.


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This has not increased since 2021.


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In comparison, in 2018/19 at PSG we generated £405m in sponsorship revenue.


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Admittedly this was having won the Champions League and playing a Messi, Cristiano Ronaldo, Neymar, Mbappe front line :lol: but still, nearly 10x more than Benfica seems off. Even before these signings, PSG generated £225m, and another £282m the year after.

At PSG I get a lot of messages like this:


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It seems to be that major transfers are a far bigger driver of Sponsorship, Merchandising and TV deals than on the field success.

 

Club Debt

We also still have this club debt which it looks like we will be paying interest on until the end of time :D


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Let me know if anyone's got any ideas, particularly about the Sponsorship/Merchandising revenue :thup:

On FM19 so potentially irrelevant to anyone actually keeping up with the latest versions of FM, but I notice a similar issue with sponsorship. A year after winning a League and Champions League double with Man Utd we took €288m in sponsors. At Roma with 7 consecutive Serie A, 6 Champions League (5 consecutive), and basically everything else every year for the period 2019-2025 we took a mere €81m. Serie A is ranked 3rd in the world, Luka Jovic just had 49-goal season and I'm not not making big transfers (only 3 over €40m as the academy is strong, but one of those was €82m on Dayot Upamecano). €210,000/week is our highest salary (well, I'm on €325k/week!) yet we're still projected to make a loss every year until I sell a bunch of 22-year olds and take in around €100m prize money per season.

Then again, maybe that's realistic? By all accounts Ed Woodward at United is considered to be a genius at selling advertising, like an analogue version of Google / Facebook, City and PSG are blatantly fraudulent and every other club involved in the ESL plot is making absurd losses (in a just world, Barcelona would get to enjoy the rest of Messi's career before having to drastically downsize to pay off those €1bn debts, but most likely the Champions League reforms and making the Qatar branding on the shirt bigger will see them become too big to fail). Bayern are the exception in that they've apparently got a commercial operation that at the very least is on the same scale as United's, without selling out to despots or rentier capitalists.

As an aside your goalscoring numbers are insane. My saves' success would look like cheating to some people yet my record is 199 goals in all competitions with Ajax (admittedly that's exceptional, as it was first season with no transfers), with 49 goals in a season my record for an individual player (although I usually pursue a very heavy rotation policy).

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11 hours ago, zlatanera said:

On FM19 so potentially irrelevant to anyone actually keeping up with the latest versions of FM, but I notice a similar issue with sponsorship. A year after winning a League and Champions League double with Man Utd we took €288m in sponsors. At Roma with 7 consecutive Serie A, 6 Champions League (5 consecutive), and basically everything else every year for the period 2019-2025 we took a mere €81m. Serie A is ranked 3rd in the world, Luka Jovic just had 49-goal season and I'm not not making big transfers (only 3 over €40m as the academy is strong, but one of those was €82m on Dayot Upamecano). €210,000/week is our highest salary (well, I'm on €325k/week!) yet we're still projected to make a loss every year until I sell a bunch of 22-year olds and take in around €100m prize money per season.

Then again, maybe that's realistic? By all accounts Ed Woodward at United is considered to be a genius at selling advertising, like an analogue version of Google / Facebook, City and PSG are blatantly fraudulent and every other club involved in the ESL plot is making absurd losses (in a just world, Barcelona would get to enjoy the rest of Messi's career before having to drastically downsize to pay off those €1bn debts, but most likely the Champions League reforms and making the Qatar branding on the shirt bigger will see them become too big to fail). Bayern are the exception in that they've apparently got a commercial operation that at the very least is on the same scale as United's, without selling out to despots or rentier capitalists.

As an aside your goalscoring numbers are insane. My saves' success would look like cheating to some people yet my record is 199 goals in all competitions with Ajax (admittedly that's exceptional, as it was first season with no transfers), with 49 goals in a season my record for an individual player (although I usually pursue a very heavy rotation policy).


Interesting. Thank you for sharing :thup:

It's more difficult than I thought to organically create a self-sustaining 'super club'. Even without major transfer fees, with (reasonably) modest wages and a massive stadium it's difficult not to rely on player sales in order to operate at a profit.

It's very fun, but after a few seasons with PSG following the 'galactico' signings of Cristiano Ronaldo and Messi that I don't think it would benefit my Benfica approach.

The benefits are clear:

  • The entertainment/sentimental value of playing Cristiano Ronaldo and Messi alongside each other and simply enjoying their talent before they retire.
    • Personally I also enjoyed the tactical element of accommodating aging superstars.
  • Massive amounts of sponsorship and commercial revenue they bring in.

The main negatives are:

  • There is no resale value due to their age.
  • In the context of Benfica they would absolutely abolish our wage structure.

I initially thought it may be more workable to look at players around 23-24 years old to essentially:

  • Offset the transfer fee against a resale value
  • Offset wages against increased commercial revenue

However the issue I could not get over was my wage structure. I identified a suitable target at Barcelona, had an world-record breaking offer accepted however would have to pay more than twice the wages of current top earner, Tiago Dantas. Not to mention then needing to increase the wages of the rest of my top earners quite considerably.

It would be a tighter call if the academy stops producing but right now we have another really talented batch coming through. Interesting you mention Bayern, as they seem to be a great example of a club operating on a middle ground. I've always admired their approach to the transfer market.

Ultimately I think the commercial revenue is largely out of my control. One thing I have thought of is signing commercial partnerships with Feeder Clubs in US/China/Japan as I have exhausted the options for youth intakes. Not sure that'll have a huge impact though. Will obviously have another go at the stadium but that's now years away.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:

Ultimately I think the commercial revenue is largely out of my control. One thing I have thought of is signing commercial partnerships with Feeder Clubs in US/China/Japan as I have exhausted the options for youth intakes. Not sure that'll have a huge impact though. Will obviously have another go at the stadium but that's now years away.

That might be worth a shot, actually. I left it out of my initial post but in terms of merchandising my Roma side, after that prolonged and ongoing period of success, brought in €154m and €170m in consecutive seasons. Man Utd on the other hand were around €30m. Creating my own superstars is certainly an element in that, but I also have a commercial affiliate in the Chinese top flight, and multiple partnerships in the US whereas at United I had 0 affiliates full stop. 

A problem exclusive to Roma though is that we’re nowhere near close to filling the Olimpico and FM(19, at least) doesn’t offer the chance to “do a Juventus” and build a smaller, better one. 

Edited by zlatanera
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On 04/05/2021 at 14:11, zlatanera said:

That might be worth a shot, actually. I left it out of my initial post but in terms of merchandising my Roma side, after that prolonged and ongoing period of success, brought in €154m and €170m in consecutive seasons. Man Utd on the other hand were around €30m. Creating my own superstars is certainly an element in that, but I also have a commercial affiliate in the Chinese top flight, and multiple partnerships in the US whereas at United I had 0 affiliates full stop. 

A problem exclusive to Roma though is that we’re nowhere near close to filling the Olimpico and FM(19, at least) doesn’t offer the chance to “do a Juventus” and build a smaller, better one. 


I've played a little way ahead and can confirm that commercial partnerships with feeder clubs does seem to have a fairly noticeable effect on merchandising income.

I have signed partnerships with:

  • FC Tokyo
  • New York Cosmos
  • LAFC
  • Shanghai

After around a year we are recording higher merchandising revenues in February/March than we have in earlier seasons after winning the Champions League.

We have signed a new TV deal which is around £64m per year (up from 50something before) however no progress on sponsorships.

I'll keep an eye on it and post some screenshots when I get to a reliable internet connection if you're interested :thup:

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12 hours ago, Ö-zil to the Arsenal! said:


I've played a little way ahead and can confirm that commercial partnerships with feeder clubs does seem to have a fairly noticeable effect on merchandising income.

I have signed partnerships with:

  • FC Tokyo
  • New York Cosmos
  • LAFC
  • Shanghai

After around a year we are recording higher merchandising revenues in February/March than we have in earlier seasons after winning the Champions League.

We have signed a new TV deal which is around £64m per year (up from 50something before) however no progress on sponsorships.

I'll keep an eye on it and post some screenshots when I get to a reliable internet connection if you're interested :thup:

I am!

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@Ö-zil to the Arsenal! Yeah I'd definitely be interested to see how it progresses. I didn't really pay attention to this stuff until after I paused the save (FM19 Roma's €300m debt is a lot more manageable than FM18 Benfica's appears to have been, and I made over €1bn in player sales so never needed to concern myself). When I look now in the save the only commercial affiliates I have are with a bunch of minor U.S. teams and one Australian one, yours are theoretically much better for the purpose. I'm not far from your levels of success so a comparison would be interesting.

I've just noticed I have a €600m balance which earned us around €5m over the past season too - barely 2 weeks of wages, but not insignificant. Owed €338m though monthly instalment transfer clauses on sales too.

(Insert well-respected footballing executive here) eat your heart out! :)

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