Struggling with 4-2-3-1

[mhalse87]

hey folks dobt currently have a screen shot so ill do my best ...... since being on fm 17 iv not won that much on this version older versions i have dominated using a 424 or a 4231 but as times change i have to change and its something iv struggled with .......

current save with arsenal now i no the board want attacking possesion football so thats what im aiming for 

ok so gk on def

both wingbacks on support

center def on def both

center mid is DLP - D

center mid is CM - S ( I THINK )

AMC - AP - A

AMR/L inside forwards - s

striker - AF

 

now for my TI iv got 

tempo - lower

tighter marking

exploit the middle

play out of defence

shorter passing

retain possesion

be more diciplined 

work ball into box

dribble less

then mentalities are fluid and control 

iv currently no PI as im not sure what to give them but so far im winning the possesion battle but im struggle to put games away last game was 2-2 at west ham conceding 2 in the second half 

watched moat of a game only sort of fault i see is the link at the top defence is doing moderately well having troubles with strikers scoring but i think its because im working the ball into the box 

 

normally im quite attack minded and like to play direct and through balls but iv failed badly trying to implement my older ways 

 

any help would be grand as in first season finished 3rd with lukaku having scored 28 in season but its second season 4 games to go and hes on 14 .......

[summatsupeer]

Have a read of Cleons Possession Guide: https://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/445500-The-Art-of-Possession-Football

I think you've limited your players a bit too much with: Retain Possession, Shorter Passing, Play Out Of Defence, Lower Tempo, Dribble Less, Work Ball Into Box and Be More Disciplined, your probably going to have really good possession but not much penetration or chances created due to such focus on keeping the ball.  Cleons guide explains this in more detail.

Tighter Marking I really dislike with formations with lots of advanced players like the 4231, its a very risky instruction basically saying your players are man for man better than the opponents.  Whilst not "man marking" they are staying closer to opponent players which could leave passing lanes open and if you don't have enough players to cover all of your opponents its a recipe for disaster.  I would prefer to use Opposition Instructions to target specific players or PI's to get the front players to press more to win the ball back sooner.

Your attack is very narrow, AP + 2xIF + CM will all be working in front of the box whilst the AF looks for runs behind, that's at least 5 players in that area with width being offered later in moves by the 2xWB-S.  Having the AP on attack will make him more urgent and take more risks, but your instructions are all reducing the risks.  Plus your playing Fluid so the team will stick together as a group, but you already have 3D-6S-1A duty split so should have a lot players to link play, do you need to be so compact plus narrow?

I personally like to have each flank offer something different so you don't have everyone running into the same area, loosen the reigns a little bit and try and spread out a bit more (depth+width) to create more space when the ball does come inside.

[Overmars]

Have you tried using a defensive or counter mentality? Once I have built a really good team in FM, I find I win more consistently when using defensive or counter. Using aggressive mentalities with a team like Arsenal will probably result in FM results similar to the current real-life Arsenal.

[mhalse87]

thanks sommatsupeer like i said normally id prefer to be more direct but the game has changed since i used a direct style of play and my older tactics which i took screen shots of really dont work so id thought id go along with the board but maybe ur right im probably being too possesion based so maybe playing wider and loosing work ball into box and maybe shorter passing should help mix things up for the team therefore allowing more creativity in the final third maybe and also having similar wide players iv always done since like fm 07 lol but again maybe giving players different roles can help mix things up so im not crowed up front .... just from fm 16 to now iv had a serious struggle with tactics and have not win anything with my average leage pos about 6th - 4th and overmars thanks for your input i could trail counter in pre season see how things go but its a mentality im unfamiliar with but thats only because iv stuck with the same stuff since fm 07 and its worked greatly just these recent versions iv struggled with the change in systems 

[Overmars]

I think it is worth the experiment. Even on defensive, if you have the more talented team then you will probably dominate possession, avoid "mistakes leading to goals," and win matches. I really think the mentality is inappropriately named in FM because you can have the top scoring team while playing "defensive." The attack just ends up being more probing than brute force, which sounds very much like what you are trying to do.

[Egecann]

7 hours ago, Overmars said:

I think it is worth the experiment. Even on defensive, if you have the more talented team then you will probably dominate possession, avoid "mistakes leading to goals," and win matches. I really think the mentality is inappropriately named in FM because you can have the top scoring team while playing "defensive." The attack just ends up being more probing than brute force, which sounds very much like what you are trying to do.

I agree. Defensive means less risky passes etc.. Attacking can win matches but defensive can win championships :))