My Development thread for FM15 - Let's get to work.....

[Pipson]

imo u should try ur tactics with a weak team. anyone can win with man city even with default tatics.

[Mr U Rosler]

imo u should try ur tactics with a weak team. anyone can win with man city even with default tatics.

The post directly above this says I will be testing with West Brom as does the first post.

If you must jump in please at least read the thread so you know what's going on,

[Andy J 82]

imo u should try ur tactics with a weak team. anyone can win with man city even with default tatics.

Just like in real life?

[dubaidan1985]

Can you shed more light on the 4231 DM tactic, like I said had massive success with the silk & steel tactic made millwall the biggest club on the game in 15 seasons

But looking for a fresh new formation

[welshiespursboy]

This is working pretty well for me at the moment Mr Rosler! Thanks! Unbeaten so far, and playing decent football.

[Mr U Rosler]

As someone pointed out, it should go well with City, but it still needs testing and a benchmark needs putting down.

I'll be looking for 85 - 90 points which is a pretty high benchmark. The City team is excellent but it's not ideally suited to this tactic season 1 and can be easily improved.

[Mr U Rosler]

Can you shed more light on the 4231 DM tactic, like I said had massive success with the silk & steel tactic made millwall the biggest club on the game in 15 seasons

But looking for a fresh new formation

Trying to be methodical here and not jump around the tactics but the 4231 will look something like this. A few roles may change.

[MaddogBaxter]

Can you shed more light on the 4231 DM tactic, like I said had massive success with the silk & steel tactic made millwall the biggest club on the game in 15 seasons

But looking for a fresh new formation

It's all well and good trying a new formation but you need the right players to fit it. Make sure it does or else it probably won't work.

I've just taken over Villa and their wide players aren't good enough so I'm not playing with wide midfielders.

[Scully11]

I have a quick question i used a few of your formations on FM14 MR U Rosler but i never asked how you came up with them is there something i can read about creating tactics to gain a better understanding or is it just a lot of experimenting. I will be using Newcastle who have a fairly strong squad midfield wise but apart from that they dont have much i want to create myself a tactic to maybe get the best out of what i have to start with then evolve it when i have money to spend on the right sort of players for a formation i will work on

[Mr U Rosler]

I have a quick question i used a few of your formations on FM14 MR U Rosler but i never asked how you came up with them is there something i can read about creating tactics to gain a better understanding or is it just a lot of experimenting. I will be using Newcastle who have a fairly strong squad midfield wise but apart from that they dont have much i want to create myself a tactic to maybe get the best out of what i have to start with then evolve it when i have money to spend on the right sort of players for a formation i will work on

There 4 sticky's in the tactics forum.

Twelve step guide - wwfan

Creating a tactic - cleon

Pairs & Combination - llama3

Tricking the wizard - jpcote09

Some of these are pretty full on.

I've distilled a lot of this into a basic framework which i use for all my tactics.

Its taken 100's of hours of testing to get to this point and a hell of a lot of trial & error.

But its rewarding so go for it.

[Mr U Rosler]

Ok, that's me done for the day.

10 games to go and I have a slight advantage. Suffered 2 league defeats now and got beat by Man U in the League Cup. Going well in Champions League.

Had some weird morale issues which i've highlighted in the main feedback thread, team meetings being called as i tried to persuade Kolarov not to leave.

Lots of silly player morale issues are being raised and i hope they sort it out for the full release.

Still, were moving towards a good points total and hopefully the title although Man U are not going away.

Not a prolific goalscoring tactic, just over 2 per game. But conceding well under 1 goal a game. I think the 4132 is inherently a defensive formation but you cant argue with 20 wins, 6 draws and 2 defeats.

Will finish the season tomorrow and then try the Control/Away version with City for a few games before running a season with West Brom.

[Scully11]

Do you think these stickys will be relevant to this game engine or do you think this is a whole new game engine because ive watched pretty much all of my games and think just seem a bit different

[Joaquimorais]

first season

[BradzleyB]

Joaquimorais can you upload your tactic so i can test it out?

[Pipson]

Just like in real life?

because fm is real life right? its a game. and most of the results i saw here were by man city, you dont really learn anything about tactics using a team with world class players.

[jep]

because fm is real life right? its a game. and most of the results i saw here were by man city, you dont really learn anything about tactics using a team with world class players.

I would argue that it's better to test first with a top club because if you start testing with poor players then it's much more difficult to know if a set up failed because it's rubbish or because it had poor players using it. If you get a tactic working with City then try it with a weaker team, as Mr Rosler is doing. Then if it works with that team too then happy days.

If you start testing with a poor team then you could be trying things out forever and getting poor results, but it's down to having rubbish players rather than a poor tactical set up.

[isignedupfornorealreason]

I would argue that it's better to test first with a top club because if you start testing with poor players then it's much more difficult to know if a set up failed because it's rubbish or because it had poor players using it. If you get a tactic working with City then try it with a weaker team, as Mr Rosler is doing. Then if it works with that team too then happy days.

If you start testing with a poor team then you could be trying things out forever and getting poor results, but it's down to having rubbish players rather than a poor tactical set up.

This, somewhat.

But, testing with a poor team first is almost a surefire way to learn how to shore up the defensive side of things. Which can be a great boon as you begin to modify the attacking side of things. There's merits for both methods I think.

[Soviet]

Can't wait for the 4-4-2. I tried to make my own for Blue Square South, but the defenders are incapable of doing anything remotely useful and all the goalkeepers are blind in this beta, which lead me to some difficulties . I could use some pointers.

[Mr U Rosler]

Season finished. Not good enough.

Only lost 3 league games, won FA Cup, unlucky to lose in Champions League Final.

Not enough goals scored.

Aguero had fun though, 46 goals.

Tactic overview.

Ended up being a counter attacking tactic which was not what i was after.

Aguero was isolated as the rest of the team couldn't keep up with him.

Not sure about the high tempo. Going to change the tactic to one more possession based, patient with attacks building in our opponents half rather than countering.

Will likely change the DM role to something more expansive.

I can do a lot better than this, but not a bad start and a worthwhile test.

[Pipson]

I would argue that it's better to test first with a top club because if you start testing with poor players then it's much more difficult to know if a set up failed because it's rubbish or because it had poor players using it. If you get a tactic working with City then try it with a weaker team, as Mr Rosler is doing. Then if it works with that team too then happy days.

If you start testing with a poor team then you could be trying things out forever and getting poor results, but it's down to having rubbish players rather than a poor tactical set up.

otherway around mate... you make a tactic with a average team *not really that poor* something like west ham, newcastle, everton and the likes if you dominated with that, you know for sure your going to dominate with a stronger team...

btw 3rd place with city lol?

[swansongs]

The team you use also affects how teams set up against you. A successful tactic for Man City would be one that is effective at breaking defensive teams down more often than not, and perhaps needn't be as concerned with its own defensive side of things.

[Mr U Rosler]

otherway around mate... you make a tactic with a average team *not really that poor* something like west ham, newcastle, everton and the likes if you dominated with that, you know for sure your going to dominate with a stronger team...

btw 3rd place with city lol?

Pipson, you put some good tactics out last year so i don't understand your reasons for hanging around here 'trolling'.

Maybe start your own thread.

I'm also not afraid to show my failures, i got sacked in last years thread and put that up as well and would do so again.

How i play the game is up to me.

It doesn't always happen first time but i always get there in the end.

I stay well out of other tactic makers threads, its good etiquette, dropping in and 'sneering' shows a real lack of class.

You're completely missing the point of the thread anyway.

[isignedupfornorealreason]

3rd isn't that bad, actually having looked at the stats, it seems defensively the tactic does the job, 27 conceded is just above average (I usually get it to 15-20 if, and only if, I get a perfect season going).

Like you said, just needs more goals and less draws. Were they 0-0 draws or score-draws? Weak opposition or strong? Might find some patterns there.

Good for a first go though.

[Mr U Rosler]

3rd isn't that bad, actually having looked at the stats, it seems defensively the tactic does the job, 27 conceded is just above average (I usually get it to 15-20 if, and only if, I get a perfect season going).

Like you said, just needs more goals and less draws. Were they 0-0 draws or score-draws? Weak opposition or strong? Might find some patterns there.

Good for a first go though.

Had three 0-0 score's in a row in the league which cost me the title. Knew at that point i would have to change things up.

[Wlv]

Considering a CM on defensive duties plays quite deep, would it be worth moving the anchorman up and moving the cm (a) to an AM position?

[Mr U Rosler]

Considering a CM on defensive duties plays quite deep, would it be worth moving the anchorman up and moving the cm (a) to an AM position?

Was just thinking about that.

[santy001]

In the 4-1-3-2 formation what really makes an effective DLF? Not so much in attributes, but in terms of performance and such in a match. It seems to be the one position in the team that is a sort of void of notable performance. The complete forward and CM-Attack get the majority of goals, the assists coming from the fullbacks or midfield. It's not a weakness in the formation and the player will do the basics incredibly well - a bit of pressing on the opposition, simple passes to team mates, but whichever player is put in that position sort of becomes anonymous.

[Wlv]

With an AM I'm guessing the DLF can change to a complete forward?

[Mr U Rosler]

In the 4-1-3-2 formation what really makes an effective DLF? Not so much in attributes, but in terms of performance and such in a match. It seems to be the one position in the team that is a sort of void of notable performance. The complete forward and CM-Attack get the majority of goals, the assists coming from the fullbacks or midfield. It's not a weakness in the formation and the player will do the basics incredibly well - a bit of pressing on the opposition, simple passes to team mates, but whichever player is put in that position sort of becomes anonymous.

I would like to retain the 4-1-3-2 and i agree the DLF does not 'star' in most games. Its a question how much does he link play. I agree could have a role with more box presence here.

[Mr U Rosler]

Dont really want 2 strikers on attack duty, the most advanced of the 'support' striking roles is the Complete Forward/Support.

I will trial changing the DLF to that role.

[dubaidan1985]

I am starting a save with Millwall again and they have more DMC's and wingers than they did last year, I built the side into the Silk and Steel tactic but seemed to get promising wingers in through the Youth which I ending up selling as they would not convert into MC's (box to Box)

Would like to go for a different style this season

Rosler any idea's on the 4-2-3-1 team instructions?

[Pipson]

Pipson, you put some good tactics out last year so i don't understand your reasons for hanging around here 'trolling'.

Maybe start your own thread.

I'm also not afraid to show my failures, i got sacked in last years thread and put that up as well and would do so again.

How i play the game is up to me.

It doesn't always happen first time but i always get there in the end.

I stay well out of other tactic makers threads, its good etiquette, dropping in and 'sneering' shows a real lack of class.

You're completely missing the point of the thread anyway.

i didnt mean to troll if i did. I always like reading what people find out about the ME as it is something i myself like exploring but i feel at this point it is a bit pointless as this is beta. And i didnt mean no offence by the 3rd place city, i honestly believe that a 4231 with attacking strategy and good players role and duties no team intructions or player instructions could win you the title but i dont have the time to prove such a thing.

[Mr U Rosler]

i didnt mean to troll if i did. I always like reading what people find out about the ME as it is something i myself like exploring but i feel at this point it is a bit pointless as this is beta. And i didnt mean no offence by the 3rd place city, i honestly believe that a 4231 with attacking strategy and good players role and duties no team intructions or player instructions could win you the title but i dont have the time to prove such a thing.

No worries

Yeah, things could change after the beta...... but what you gonna do....... play FM14..... i couldn't face that now....

[Mr U Rosler]

I am starting a save with Millwall again and they have more DMC's and wingers than they did last year, I built the side into the Silk and Steel tactic but seemed to get promising wingers in through the Youth which I ending up selling as they would not convert into MC's (box to Box)

Would like to go for a different style this season

Rosler any idea's on the 4-2-3-1 team instructions?

Not settled on this.

Currently leaving things as neutral as possible i.e default tempo, defensive line. Only got 5, short passing, look for overlap, tight marking, get stuck in and work ball into box as a lot of long shots.

These might change though.

[dubaidan1985]

Thanks Rosler, i'll test these out and keep you posted

[isignedupfornorealreason]

With the anchor, maybe the CM/D could be switched to a DLP/S - holds position, so maintains some defensive solidity for a bit more creativity from a deep position. Then CM/A could be played alongside with the CM/S another playmaker, a box to box or even a roaming playmaker.

Means four players get forward, one holds back and yet still six in defence, seven if its a dynamic role?

[spaced33]

Tried this tactic and so far (after 2 games) I'm finding that the main outlet for starting attacks seems to be through my left back. Im also finding that he seems to be quite isolated with the cmd holding too deep and the CFA too advanced. Despite this the results have been very good - I especially like the speed of the transition from defense to attack.

[Mr U Rosler]

Even with 'work ball into box' if just had 9 long shots out of 19 shots.

Won the game but still excessive.

[Mr U Rosler]

With the anchor, maybe the CM/D could be switched to a DLP/S - holds position, so maintains some defensive solidity for a bit more creativity from a deep position. Then CM/A could be played alongside with the CM/S another playmaker, a box to box or even a roaming playmaker.

Means four players get forward, one holds back and yet still six in defence, seven if its a dynamic role?

Got the DM working as DLP/s now. Also thinking about the cm/d role as he's getting low ratings, but that doesn't neccessarily mean hes doing a bad job.

[isignedupfornorealreason]

Got the DM working as DLP/s now. Also thinking about the cm/d role as he's getting low ratings, but that doesn't neccessarily mean hes doing a bad job.

Agreed, I'm not sure about the ratings being nailed on yet. I had De Gea pull of 22 saves in a match and he came away with a 6.2 rating. I checked for mistakes and he did make one but it didn't lead to goal, so I was a bit baffled by that one. Passing probably counted a lot there.

Re: Long shots, I'm having a ton of those with work ball in the box on as well. In my set up they come very centrally, usually if the striker drops back, he just smashes it at goal on the turn. Irritating, but I don't want to activate 'shoot less often' and there are passing options around him.. =/

[Joaquimorais]

[aderow]

Yup. I've never cared about ratings for my defensive mid because in FM, as in real life, they rarely get the credit they deserve. As long as there aren't gaping holes appearing where that defensive mid should be, I pay no attention to them.

[rywilson]

image

Could you upload the tactic?

[Mr U Rosler]

Could you upload the tactic?

not here please.

[Wlv]

Got the DM working as DLP/s now. Also thinking about the cm/d role as he's getting low ratings, but that doesn't neccessarily mean hes doing a bad job.

Hi U, I've set mine to DLP - instant improvement - he's banged a few assists already and we still look as strong defensively.

[Str0aK]

Great thread. Enjoying it thoroughly so far. I'm not playing with any of your formations but figured here would be a fine place to ask for some feedback.

4-1-2-2-1 Control/Flexible

GK-d (distribute to full backs)

CWB-a

DC-d

DC-d

FB-s

A-d

CM-a

AP-s

IF-s (roam from position)

W-a

CF-s

Play Out Of Defence

Work Ball Into Box

Drop Deeper

Higher Tempo

I'm playing as Southampton. I think the squad is good enough to play on control against most teams (I have a counter tactic for the big teams) but we're lacking pace in central defense hence why I've gone for Drop Deeper. Not too sure about higher tempo but I'll leave it for now. Any suggestions? Any glaring problems?

[Wlv]

How's your striker performing in that formation as it seems as if he might get isolated and seemingly only the IF is near him when you have the ball.

[Mr U Rosler]

Great thread. Enjoying it thoroughly so far. I'm not playing with any of your formations but figured here would be a fine place to ask for some feedback.

4-1-2-2-1 Control/Flexible

GK-d (distribute to full backs)

CWB-a

DC-d

DC-d

FB-s

A-d

CM-a

AP-s

IF-s (roam from position)

W-a

CF-s

Play Out Of Defence

Work Ball Into Box

Drop Deeper

Higher Tempo

I'm playing as Southampton. I think the squad is good enough to play on control against most teams (I have a counter tactic for the big teams) but we're lacking pace in central defense hence why I've gone for Drop Deeper. Not too sure about higher tempo but I'll leave it for now. Any suggestions? Any glaring problems?

Its hard to visualise without a screenshot.

We're all a bit in the dark at the moment, looks like a good balance of duties and roles though, would expect it to go well. keep us posted!

[Mr U Rosler]

All right, ripped up the rule book, thrown away the script and started again.

Man City are a top team, we're just gonna av 'it, impose ourselves on teams and attack 'em flat out.

NEW SET UP

TEAM INSTRUCTIONS

LOWER TEMPO

BE MORE EXPRESSIVE

GET STUCK IN

TIGHTER MARKING

LOOK FOR OVERLAP

PLAY WIDER

SHORTER PASSING

GK - distribute to full backs

CB's - Short passing

CWB's - Run wide with ball

Half Back - Short passing

CM/A'S - Move into channels/close down much more/pass shorter

DLP - direct passing, close down more.

Comp Forwards - nothing

Both Fb's are pushing on, we now have the 2 wider Central Midfielders on attack duty and a DLP in the middle. the wide CM/a's run into channels to give us a wide front with the 2 strikers.

To stop the strikers getting isolated and reduce the amount of long shots we now have both of them on Complete Forward/Support.

Now Attacking/Very Fluid.

Thought we would score more and concede more but as it happens we just score more, nearly an extra goal again over our previous tactic.

Table after 10 games along with our performance against our nearest rivals.

Drew 1 game in the Champions League, rest are wins.

Looking forward to seeing how the rest of the season goes then testing with West Brom.

[Str0aK]

How's your striker performing in that formation as it seems as if he might get isolated and seemingly only the IF is near him when you have the ball.

The CM(a) gets up in support of him but that's the main position I'm monitoring. I'll consider switching to DLF if results with the CF aren't what I want.