Match Engine Update 13.2.1 - ME 1325 Constructive feedback here please

[stevereay]

I kmow what you're saying but do you seriously think they would actually stop working on things?

No I don't think they would stop improving the game. I'm saying communication is a two way thing. Just hearing from SI a bit more often than we do even just to say we are still working but no dates breeds a lot more support for then and less frustration for us customers than weeks of silence.

I've put my point across I have nothing different to say as I'm sure you don't either. Hopefully they may take it on board. If not at least I've raised it.

[ajw10]

So apparently my DM playing a suicidal backpass to my goalkeeper and costing me a goal doesn't count as a mistake, so he doesnt get a low rating, meaning I can't have a go at him.

Just the buggiest game I've ever played this.

Also, why does the ref blow for full time at the most stupid times? Like when my team are on a counter attack and are one on one with the goalkeeper? Why does the ref always blow exactly on the time allocated?

[crocop]

Why not have a sticky then, that just lists them at the top, nothing fancy, just 'READ FIRST: Reported Bugs' or something? Then link to that specific post in the bugs forum for people to add their own examples to the one bug post. This way everything is in one place.

A Known Issues sticky would certainly be beneficial.

This is exactly what I had in mind... This way, we can sum everything reported in one place so everyone will see that they are not alone with their problems and then they can discuss their similar problems in this thread...

for example:

1) too few through balls

2) too many goals from super wingers or poor FB winger defending

3) ...

[ajw10]

[video=youtube;K4MG3S-7fFM]

This is the goal I was talking about. Schneiderlin ended up getting a 7.4, no mention of a mistake anywhere.

[MacZidane]

Also, why does the ref blow for full time at the most stupid times? Like when my team are on a counter attack and are one on one with the goalkeeper? Why does the ref always blow exactly on the time allocated?

Ref blew at 94.03 in my last game. There were 3 added minutes at the end of the game. Stop looking for issues where none exist, it does no-one any favours.

[ajw10]

I have honestly never seen that happen. Ever.

Do you know what doesn't do anyone any favours? Your constant sniping and refusal to accept any criticism of the game.

3 reds in my last three games btw. In all three that player was the only one to have been booked. Bit odd no?

[Ackter]

I have honestly never seen that happen. Ever.

Do you know what doesn't do anyone any favours? Your constant sniping and refusal to accept any criticism of the game.

3 reds in my last three games btw. In all three that player was the only one to have been booked. Bit odd no?

For the final whistle problem, please upload a few pkms if you wouldn't mind.

The 3 red cards is bizarre, but I don't think it's a problem unless it happens regularly. It's probably some mixture of tactical and attributal which is making him behave much more riskily. Is he often caught out of position and having to make loads of last ditch attempts to cover the space etc?

[MacZidane]

I have honestly never seen that happen. Ever.

Do you know what doesn't do anyone any favours? Your constant sniping and refusal to accept any criticism of the game.

3 reds in my last three games btw. In all three that player was the only one to have been booked. Bit odd no?

I accept plenty criticism of the game. There have been many fantastic, constructive posts on this thread highlighting some of the issues still affecting the game, most of which I've agreed with, or put my own take on it.

However, when someone posts about a perceived fault in the game because the referee blows the final whistle at a point which is inconvenient to one of their attacks, it leads me to believe that that isn't a fault with the game at all.

As for your other scenario, it is quite odd, yes, but it's also very plausible.

The thing is, the faults that are still in the game don't stop me from playing it, and enjoying it. We've seen first hand what a rushed hotfix has caused, and this was directly due to the volume of complaints within this forum. I'd much rather they took their time and got the next one spot on. So, if I see someone posting a frankly ludicrous example of what they see as a fault, I'll counter it with evidence to the contrary. This way, there's less chance of them trying to fix something that isn't broken, which could easily have a detrimental knock-on effect.

You'll all thank me in the long-run, just wait.

[ajw10]

For the final whistle problem, please upload a few pkms if you wouldn't mind.

The 3 red cards is bizarre, but I don't think it's a problem unless it happens regularly. It's probably some mixture of tactical and attributal which is making him behave much more riskily. Is he often caught out of position and having to make loads of last ditch attempts to cover the space etc?

Sure no problem, I'll look through and sort it out tomorrow.

It's not the same player fwiw. It has been my left back twice though, which to me I think is down to how superpowered dribbling is.

the other player who got sent off is a CM. He got booked twice for the only two fouls he made all game, both of which were fairly innocuous.

[Ackter]

Yeah I wouldn't be surprised if the super dribbling would make fullbacks more likely to be sent off.

[scott MUFC]

yea, the super dribbling is crazy

[video=youtube;-qHWD1GG7dQ]

[video=youtube;vhdbEobAWzg]

both playing as left and right midfielders

[kazm]

You could say this is bad decisionmaking. But it is not. Bad decisionmaking leaves the possibility open that the idiot (Brozovic, awesome name btw) would actually pass to the number 10. I am pretty sure that is almost impossible and in the 1% of the cases that he would make the right (and obvious. and easy. and ONLY) decision he would hit it so hard it would bounce once at the back of their pitch and go out for a goalkick. Sad but true. Saying this is due to bad decisionmaking or tactic is like saying someone made the right 'decision' because he tapped the ball in the goal from 1 meter. Thats NOT a decision, neither is this, or at least it should not be.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[tcoleman1]

Sorry if it's been mentioned before but it seems like there are a lot of shots being taken in my games. Have played 9 or 10 games since the patch, have dominated all the games but quite a few have ended up 30+ shots for me. Obviously it's not a real problem for me as I am winning but the amount of shots does seem a bit crazy. Looked at some of the AI teams who dominate games e.g. City and they have a couple of 30+ games too. Is this a known bug or is it just a result of dominating a game that much?

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

'Tis probably true. Someone posted yesterday (I think) about the possibility of having a ME feedback thread where posts were only viewable by mods.

It is a great idea, as it would eliminate the domino effect herein, or at least, eliminate the endless spiral of arguments.

I too thought that was a great idea, then I realised that the likelihood would be that dozens would post pretty much identical posts complaining about issues as they couldnt see what went before

......but wait.......!

[Welshace]

A mod read only thread, I can see why it was suggested, but we do actually want discussion on the game, there just seems to be an issue differentiating between what to post or not.

1) constructive feedback -everyone wants this, it's what it's about, constructive discussion about the features of the game.

2) non constructive feedback -this is all the 'this game is rubbish! blah blah' posts that plague the thread everyday, which offer nothing close to an explanation of what the issue is, and when offered a possible solution or advice, the poster goes into a tirade of anger or refusal to work on it.

3) blatant bugs - people posting glaring errors which should be posted to the bug reporting forum to be logged and looked at and hopefully solved, posting them here serves literally no purpose at all. I tried to think of a reason to post here, and I came up with nothing.

Everyone can clearly see that the first one is wanted/needed and yet 90% of what is in here includes the last 2 categories unfortunately.

A sticky at the top stating already found issues.

Again I can see why people would suggest it. But the more occurances of actual bugs posted in the correct place means more data for the testing team to work with and get the issue solved, it's all about being able to reproduce the issue, and stamp it out, so clearly, we just need people to post genuine errors in the correct place.

[MacZidane]

Sorry if it's been mentioned before but it seems like there are a lot of shots being taken in my games. Have played 9 or 10 games since the patch, have dominated all the games but quite a few have ended up 30+ shots for me. Obviously it's not a real problem for me as I am winning but the amount of shots does seem a bit crazy. Looked at some of the AI teams who dominate games e.g. City and they have a couple of 30+ games too. Is this a known bug or is it just a result of dominating a game that much?

Aye, it's a known issue. The difficulty they have is that it doesn't happen at every level, eg for the lower leagues, the shot ratio is pretty much spot on (going on my saves, and the testimonies from others). So, they have to be careful that if they tone down the amount of shots, it doesn't mean there will be hardly any shots in other leagues. It's a tricky one. Which is why I'd much rather they take as much time as they need.

[OnZa]

I dont think it is just problem with this latest 13.2.1 (started playing around xmas and it was 13.2.0 then I think) update but I am getting scored against A LOT from what seem like "one timer" crossers high or low to the area. Also some really early crosses from halfway of the pitch to the area, usually defender looses the battle and attacker scores.

After struggling with couple of other sides I'm currently playing Scottish 1st Div with Morton. I've got a decent team and the tactics are so that it pressures the opposition to build the play to flanks and they score unrealistically from there.

I think this years match engine could be the most flawed ever. Obviously it is most complex too, so some flaws need to be understood but it needs to be understood that people play this game (these games) for fun and if they cant succeed no matter what then they will stop playing.

Not expecting to win everything with a midtable side but at least some realistic results would be appreciated.

[MichaelBrown]

I accept plenty criticism of the game. There have been many fantastic, constructive posts on this thread highlighting some of the issues still affecting the game, most of which I've agreed with, or put my own take on it.

However, when someone posts about a perceived fault in the game because the referee blows the final whistle at a point which is inconvenient to one of their attacks, it leads me to believe that that isn't a fault with the game at all.

As for your other scenario, it is quite odd, yes, but it's also very plausible.

The thing is, the faults that are still in the game don't stop me from playing it, and enjoying it. We've seen first hand what a rushed hotfix has caused, and this was directly due to the volume of complaints within this forum. I'd much rather they took their time and got the next one spot on. So, if I see someone posting a frankly ludicrous example of what they see as a fault, I'll counter it with evidence to the contrary. This way, there's less chance of them trying to fix something that isn't broken, which could easily have a detrimental knock-on effect.

You'll all thank me in the long-run, just wait.

MacZidane says it's a ludicrous example.

Ackter asks for PKM's.

Just who do we trust?

[kazm]

MacZidane says it's a ludicrous example.

Ackter asks for PKM's.

Just who do we trust?

The hero we deserve, not the hero we need right now.

[Kriss]

MacZidane says it's a ludicrous example.

Ackter asks for PKM's.

Just who do we trust?

Always go with your own instincts, if you think it even might be a bug report it and produce PKM's, better a hundred false alarms than one critical bug going unreported.

[Kriss]

The hero we deserve, not the hero we need right now.

I like that, very prosaic

[kazm]

I like that, very prosaic

its a quote from Batman

[Kriss]

its a quote from Batman

There's me thinking it must be a JFK or Churchillian quote at very least

[Mr.Rantbox]

In future version of FM, SI should implement a new option in the game called "Run beta match engine". This would be a little like the dev channels that some apps (web browsers) have, where the latest version of the app can be used, which the latest known stable release is still in place.

This should not be a substitute for testing but could really help avoid this sort of shambles... there's plenty of people out there who'll be happy to run the latest ME, but there should be a fallback.

[Welshace]

At the end of the day, every update released has been an improvement on the last on the whole... you will always get people who prefer the previous one or the update before that... but as long as SI stay the course and improve, they are onto a winner.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

MacZidane says it's a ludicrous example.

Ackter asks for PKM's.

Just who do we trust?

It clearly is an issue to gameplay if not technically "realistically wrong", I have noticed this in real life recently also (refs blowing when they really shouldnt if they applied a combination of rules and commonsense). Could be one of those "referee interpretation of the rules" issues (like holding at corners). No need for it to be in the game though, should join the taboo ranks alongside player heart attacks, pitch invasions & failing drugs tests. Then agian it may be a bug.

[velvetsky]

whats the latest on the patch? has there been any word?

[Kriss]

whats the latest on the patch? has there been any word?

No and there won't be until it's ready.

[bigman]

A Known Issues sticky would certainly be beneficial.

agree! makes it more clear and transparent

[Come Clarity]

There's little point in running a passing game in this build. Find a winger who can dribble and just make sure they always get the ball and watch them waltz through the defence like a warm knife to butter.

Just played Barcelona in the CL Final - not even a hint of being passed to death. Defenders have a seemingly irrational fear of tackling players running at them.

No one expects an accurate rendition of football; but it can't look as blatantly broken as it does right now. Incentives are too skewed to giving the ball to players with pace & dribbling.

[velvetsky]

No and there won't be until it's ready.

I appreciate that but what I meant was any hints from SI or Paul ? etc

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

whats the latest on the patch? has there been any word?

Kriss said (Post 1481):

The thing people just can't seem to get their heads round but which is the absolute truth is that .........it might be ten minutes away ............it is ..... complete at the moment ......... say yeh!!!

(Sorry Kriss)

;-)

[Kriss]

Kriss said (Post 1481):

(Sorry Kriss)

;-)

You have a way with (my) words

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

You have a way with (my) words

Thought that may lighten the mood (or get me an infraction!), I did of course realise that everyone woould fully read all the previous posts so there was no danger of your (my) words being taken on face value.

LOL

[LaytonBhoy]

Well, as much as I love the new features, as much as I see how close this engine is to being very good, I can't continue playing it until it's patched.

I just completed my second full season of a career. I have a central midfield of players who are vastly better than any other teams in the league, and I am winning games with carefree abandon.

Yet my central midfield has contributed 12 assists in the whole season. 12. The team scored 114 goals, and that was how many came from the middle of the park.

That, to me, renders the game unplayable. I hate saying it, but it's a simple statement of fact.

[kazm]

A different example of the flaw in decisionmaking. Believe me i do love the higher priority of attributes like decisions/agility/composure etc but this has nothing to do with decisionmaking. You ofcourse have the right to have your own opinion but if you disagree your opinion is wrong. ()

What happens. I(diot)bson decides to pass the ball to the player to his right because you know......why would he ever run into the box and score an easy goal?

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[Candre168]

When will SI address the fact you cannot play properly on this game? The ME is full of long balls, ping-pong midfield battles, fouls, throw ins and wild 40 yard shots. It's like the development team only watch League 2 football.

Even if you pick Barcelona and play SLOWLY, you will still find Xavi hoofing from 30 yards out despite having Messi open to the wing, Iniesta to the side to pass to, or his whole defence to pass back to. You will still find David Villa striking at goal despite having four teammates open. You will still find that even if you have 'through balls often' on all players, the amount of genuinely clever through balls = zero.

For some of us, 'winning' isn't fun if it's in an arcade ping pong style. Watch the FULL matches and tell me if it looks like a football game.

[nenshoua]

Cross to the far post...and it's a bingo !!!

[ktav]

I'm fully aware that there are too many long shots in the game right now but I can live with that until the next patch.

My question is that do you actually see any goals scored due to the long shots?

I cannot seem to score from long shots so I checked the goals scored from the other teams in my ligue. Ligue1.

I could practically see no goals scored from long shots.

Is that just fluke or is it that scoring from long shots nearly impossible with the current patch?

[MacZidane]

I'm fully aware that there are too many long shots in the game right now but I can live with that until the next patch.

My question is that do you actually see any goals scored due to the long shots?

I've had a few, including this nice one in the game I just played five minutes ago.

[video=youtube;TBXNVb7-8Oo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBXNVb7-8Oo

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Just tested the game again. Cannot believe how poor the ME plays, I have no new issues to report other than those covered tenfold but cannot believe that the ball & keeper sliding physics are so bad, worse than any other FM game - surely that is a basic that should be constant and good? Am leaving FM13 alone for a bit longer now

:-(

[Kriss]

People in SI HQ are like little robots... working 24/7.... with Miles, sitting on a chair controling everything!

A very big chair as it happens

[kazm]

People asking for more openness are right. I am not talking about an ETA.

Even if they only know when the patch is ready after its ready, its still no excuse for this lack off communication.

We can only see the symptoms, SI can see the disease. I would like to have more honesty and openness about this. And no I am not naive enough to expect anything.

[OnZa]

Cross to the far post...and it's a bingo !!!

Indeed!

And that would be ok'ish with top level players but happens in lower divisions too, people hit volleys like they are van Bastens!

[Ackter]

People asking for more openness are right. I am not talking about an ETA.

Even if they only know when the patch is ready after its ready, its still no excuse for this lack off communication.

We can only see the symptoms, SI can see the disease. I would like to have more honesty and openness about this. And no I am not naive enough to expect anything.

Paul C has already posted about the issues. Go back and look. It's not going to get any more open than that.

[Romanista.]

I'm fully aware that there are too many long shots in the game right now but I can live with that until the next patch.

My question is that do you actually see any goals scored due to the long shots?

I cannot seem to score from long shots so I checked the goals scored from the other teams in my ligue. Ligue1.

I could practically see no goals scored from long shots.

Is that just fluke or is it that scoring from long shots nearly impossible with the current patch?

goals from longshots are extremely rare. instead of fixing the ACCURACY of long shots they increased the NUMBER of longshots to ridiculous levels.

[Robert the Spud]

[video=youtube;K4MG3S-7fFM]

This is the goal I was talking about. Schneiderlin ended up getting a 7.4, no mention of a mistake anywhere.

Wowsers that's.....yeah that's pretty bad.

Very much looking forward to seeing/hearing what the hotfix is gonna do.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Wow, just played a match on FM12, OK the comparitively stick like men are not as fluid as in FM13 but the feel is 100% more "football". To be honest I am amazed anyone is playing FM13 anymore, when you compare the two. I know that sounds harsh but it is how I feel (and I am an FMC fan!). I do feel the "new" ME will be better than the FM12 version, in time, but suspect that may not be until FM14 - lets hope it is too many patches down the line.

[trotter13]

--double post below--

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

People asking for more openness are right. I am not talking about an ETA.

Even if they only know when the patch is ready after its ready, its still no excuse for this lack off communication.

We can only see the symptoms, SI can see the disease. I would like to have more honesty and openness about this. And no I am not naive enough to expect anything.

I feel the last patch was a rush job, probably well intentioned with its proximity to Xmas, and possibly rushed due to pressure from the forum complaining about the patch before. So do we want to try to force another overly-quick patch, or wait a little longer for a proper fix (which I still doubt will be far from perfect) but which will solve the major issues and move the ME forward?