Haven't played in years, should I buy FM13 on patch 1 or FM12 finished product?

[GoTeamGo]

Hey all, I haven't played FM since FM10, but my experience back then was that the game was always broken out of the box, and it usually took until the 2nd or 3rd patch of the game for the issues to be fixed, and for the balance of the game, particularly the match engine, to be fixed and playable so that headers were not way more powerful than shooting with the foot, or through balls and passing never worked but crossing was spectacular, or some other big imbalance that affected the way you built a team.

So now Im looking to get back into FM, and theoretically I would prefer to buy the newest version, but only if FM13 out of the box is superior in terms of the gameplay, match engine, and the entire game than FM12 on patch 3 is, rosters be damned.

So which is better? Thank you!

[GeshEmpty]

FM12 in my opinion...

[GoTeamGo]

Just realized FM13 isnt even out yet despite it appearing available for download off amazon. With that said, question still holds, FM13 as it plays in the demo version, or FM12 fully patched?

[Fabregas_04]

FM12 is a very, very, very good game. Until we get the release day update for FM13 we can't really say how it compares, though at a guess I'd imagine FM12 will be the stronger game until at least xmas time.

[GoTeamGo]

So is the consensus then that FM12 is the pinnacle of FM? That they finally nailed it? And that if I liked FM10 (before hitting the wall where I had a great team and every other team never signed good players anymore and none of their homegrown talent ever came out any good, as was the problem with EVERY FM game where it just doesn't evolve along with your team?), I will blown away by FM12? By the way did they ever fix that issue in parenthesis?

[rbcuk]

FM12 till someone releases a new skin, as the current skin gives me headaches, so im playing FM12 till then

[GoTeamGo]

FM12 till someone releases a new skin, as the current skin gives me headaches, so im playing FM12 till then

Skin aside... what about the game?

[Kriss]

By the way did they ever fix that issue in parenthesis?

Yeh, in FM13

[GoTeamGo]

Yeh, in FM13

But not 12? Are you saying I should get 13 and not 12?

[GoTeamGo]

Still welcoming more opinions, but for now I am downloading the FM 12 demo and will probably buy the full game shortly.

However, question, will the FM 12 demo itself come fully patched, or will I have to manually patch the demo? Is that even possible to manually patch the demo without having the full game?

[Kriss]

I'd always say that, latest version = best version for me.

[rbcuk]

Skin aside... what about the game?

Yeh its an improvement on FM12 esp with the new patch, as before was always scoring from a cross

[Kriss]

Still welcoming more opinions, but for now I am downloading the FM 12 demo and will probably buy the full game shortly.

However, question, will the FM 12 demo itself come fully patched, or will I have to manually patch the demo? Is that even possible to manually patch the demo without having the full game?

Demo is just the demo from the original gold version, to get the full version you have to buy then authenticate through Steam which fully updates it.

[GoTeamGo]

I'd always say that, latest version = best version for me.

Yes because its new and you've already played the hell out of the older version I'd suspect. But to me they are both new, so what Im asking is which one is the better game overall, not just better because its new and has the new rosters etc.

[Kriss]

Yes because its new and you've already played the hell out of the older version I'd suspect. But to me they are both new, so what Im asking is which one is the better game overall, not just better because its new and has the new rosters etc.

I still say 13 by a country mile, the ME will cause apoplexy amongst the impatient but it's very much updated and needs a lot of TLC before eventually it will far surpass any previous ME's

[GoTeamGo]

Demo is just the demo from the original gold version, to get the full version you have to buy then authenticate through Steam which fully updates it.

So there is no way to sample the game fully patched before buying it? I can't download the demo and then download patch 3?

[Steve1977beyond]

I'v become very pessimistic with regards to the state of FM due to it becoming more and more bloated with scant regard for how it all makes it so confusing to look at. But FM13? Wow. This game is light years away from previous FM's and if you have a HD laptop/screen then dont worry anymore about needing a 'hd' skin as everything is now filled in but it doesent give you a headache. The visuals have been given a much needed spring clean, the 3d match graphics are now better yet more smoother and some great touches. In the Manchester Derby at Old Trafford, Man City scored and the score (Tevez) immediately signalled something with his hands causing some man utd fans to give him stick back lol.

Absolute quality product!

[GoTeamGo]

What's TLC?

[Kriss]

So there is no way to sample the game fully patched before buying it? I can't download the demo and then download patch 3?

Sorry no you can't.

[Kriss]

What's TLC?

Tender loving care

[GoTeamGo]

I'v become very pessimistic with regards to the state of FM due to it becoming more and more bloated with scant regard for how it all makes it so confusing to look at. But FM13? Wow. This game is light years away from previous FM's and if you have a HD laptop/screen then dont worry anymore about needing a 'hd' skin as everything is now filled in but it doesent give you a headache. The visuals have been given a much needed spring clean, the 3d match graphics are now better yet more smoother and some great touches. In the Manchester Derby at Old Trafford, Man City scored and the score (Tevez) immediately signalled something with his hands causing some man utd fans to give him stick back lol.

Absolute quality product!

So Steve are you saying you disagree with the first responses here and you think FM12 is bloated and too confusing and that I should just wait for FM13?

PS. Is there an FM13 demo for mac?

EDIT. Found the mac demo, nevermind. But I cant play it unless I update my operating system.

[Jibby123]

I'd definitely go for 13. Far better GUI, more in depth, new staff roles, looks and feels better to play.

But then I'm not so hung up on the Match Engine issues some don't like (which is a bit of a work in progress tbh). Am sure it will become much more silky smooth, already seen improvement from Beta to Beta patch in 7 days, so I'd go FM13 myself.

[GoTeamGo]

I'd definitely go for 13. Far better GUI, more in depth, new staff roles, looks and feels better to play.

But then I'm not so hung up on the Match Engine issues some don't like (which is a bit of a work in progress tbh). Am sure it will become much more silky smooth, already seen improvement from Beta to Beta patch in 7 days, so I'd go FM13 myself.

Im thinking, since FM games always hit a wall for me where they are fun up until a point, but eventually I'm just signing the same great young players with high PA with every new game, building a super team, and having no other team improve, they all just get worse while I get better, and it's pointless. So I always hit a wall with each FM game when that happens, and then I need a new one with new good young players and a new match engine that always seems to work differently and different tactics work and the same tactics dont work anymore (which is extremely unrealistic, shows the match engine does not replicate real football tactically, since in real life a great tactic last year is still for the most part going to be a great tactic this year). But for the sake of providing a new egg to crack, basically, and creating a new challenge to be met, it works in that sense.

So Im thinking I should just play the hell out of FM12 until I hit that wall, and then I will have FM13 to go to next. Is that a bad plan? It seemed pretty obvious to me after the first few posts that were saying FM12 was amazing fully patched... I immediately thought it was a no-brainer then. But now, are you saying FM12 actually isnt very good? Or that it's great but you think FM13 will be even greater?

And just to let everyone know, an imbalanced match engine is a huge issue for me, I care about that a lot.

[Bradley21]

FM13, easily.

Now that the match engine has been patched it plays pretty well, it isn't perfect but it will easily surpass FM12's engine after subsequent patches.

The only reason to buy FM12 over FM13 is if you're really poor, in which case you probably shouldn't be buying either copy.

[Jibby123]

Im thinking, since FM games always hit a wall for me where they are fun up until a point, but eventually I'm just signing the same great young players with high PA with every new game, building a super team, and having no other team improve, they all just get worse while I get better, and it's pointless. So I always hit a wall with each FM game when that happens, and then I need a new one with new good young players and a new match engine that always seems to work differently and different tactics work and the same tactics dont work anymore (which is extremely unrealistic, shows the match engine does not replicate real football tactically, since in real life a great tactic last year is still for the most part going to be a great tactic this year). But for the sake of providing a new egg to crack, basically, and creating a new challenge to be met, it works in that sense.

So Im thinking I should just play the hell out of FM12 until I hit that wall, and then I will have FM13 to go to next. Is that a bad plan? It seemed pretty obvious to me after the first few posts that were saying FM12 was amazing fully patched... I immediately thought it was a no-brainer then. But now, are you saying FM12 actually isnt very good? Or that it's great but you think FM13 will be even greater?

And just to let everyone know, an imbalanced match engine is a huge issue for me, I care about that a lot.

This. In bold. I liked FM12, but think FM13 will be far greater. I don't really find the match engine that unbalanced, I really don't, but it is imperfect in it's current state so if it's a huge issue to you (without knowing how long it will take to be polished up to be acceptable for you....bearing in mind in 7 days I've seen improvement on new patch) then maybe give 12 a go. Or if you can afford it smash 12 until xmas then if you still have the bug jump to 13 early next year. Choices choices.

A lot of the problems in the 13 feedback thread people raise I don't really see, or even if I do it's only very occasionally....but maybe that's because ME is not such a biggie to me and I'm not expecting or fussed about Sky Sports HD type reality. Horses for courses though.

[GoTeamGo]

This. In bold. I liked FM12, but think FM13 will be far greater. I don't really find the match engine that unbalanced, I really don't, but it is imperfect in it's current state so if it's a huge issue to you (without knowing how long it will take to be polished up to be acceptable for you....bearing in mind in 7 days I've seen improvement on new patch) then maybe give 12 a go. Or if you can afford it smash 12 until xmas then if you still have the bug jump to 13 early next year. Choices choices.

A lot of the problems in the 13 feedback thread people raise I don't really see, or even if I do it's only very occasionally....but maybe that's because ME is not such a biggie to me and I'm not expecting or fussed about Sky Sports HD type reality. Horses for courses though.

Thanks for the thoughts. So how do you feel about FM12 then more specifically? I mean what issues did you have with it or where do you think it was weak that you're excited about FM13 not being weak in that area? Or is it just a scenario where FM12 had no issues to you but you just think FM13 will be even better?

[Steve1977beyond]

So Steve are you saying you disagree with the first responses here and you think FM12 is bloated and too confusing and that I should just wait for FM13?

PS. Is there an FM13 demo for mac?

EDIT. Found the mac demo, nevermind. But I cant play it unless I update my operating system.

I can only speak for myself, but FM started to go downhill for me because firstly, it gave me an headache due to the small text size on a HD display and also it was taking forever longer to do a season. FM13 resolves these two major issues for me with a stunning 3D enhanced skin and with FMC.

Id recommend you download the demo and give it a try.

[sebasm]

FM12. Unless you have the patience to stick with 13 for months, until the match engine gets fixed.

[Jibby123]

Put it this way, if I went back to FM12 now the GUI would frustrate me and I'd find it clunky without the new features I'm getting used to and liking, lots of little things in GUI and depth coming together. The ME looks more like a computer simulation to me on FM12, ignoring the not pretty on the eye I occasionally see some goals being scored on 13 and defending. The FM13 ME looks better to me when it works, which to my (easily pleased? ) eye it's working on 90/95% of the goals I score and concede and am fairly confident that within a few months that 90% figure will push out closer to 100%.

Others will argue that, but can only say what I see. Am the world's biggest cynic so sometimes thought new FMs have been not been much more than a polish and update of database, but really feel this version has made a bigger jump than it has in a lot of years previously.

That said, FM12 was very good and the finished article was tip top....and a lot cheaper if you're buying it now, and unsure whether you're get any addiction back so less risk if you find it just doesn't do it for you anymore.

[GoTeamGo]

I can only speak for myself, but FM started to go downhill for me because firstly, it gave me an headache due to the small text size on a HD display and also it was taking forever longer to do a season. FM13 resolves these two major issues for me with a stunning 3D enhanced skin and with FMC.

Id recommend you download the demo and give it a try.

You mean it just took way longer to load or why did seasons take too long?

What's FMC? They have like a drop in drop out just play the games mode or something that goes faster? Personally I always liked doing the tactics and the in depth stuff. It doesnt mean I liked having to re-offer and re-offer-to-teams players and my players over and over again like literally 500 times every transfer window in order to get offers on my players and to get good prices for them and everyone I wanted to buy. But that's busy work, just poor game-making by whoever is in charge of that area of the transfer system. In terms of everything that actually had to do with the management of the football team and the tactics, that's where the game shines and it's the only reason anyone would ever go through the awfulness of having to offer your players 500 teams every transfer window going to the same menus.

[GoTeamGo]

Put it this way, if I went back to FM12 now the GUI would frustrate me and I'd find it clunky without the new features I'm getting used to and liking, lots of little things in GUI and depth coming together. The ME looks more like a computer simulation to me on FM12, ignoring the not pretty on the eye I occasionally see some goals being scored on 13 and defending. The FM13 ME looks better to me when it works, which to my (easily pleased? ) eye it's working on 90/95% of the goals I score and concede and am fairly confident that within a few months that 90% figure will push out closer to 100%.

Others will argue that, but can only say what I see. Am the world's biggest cynic so sometimes thought new FMs have been not been much more than a polish and update of database, but really feel this version has made a bigger jump than it has in a lot of years previously.

That said, FM12 was very good and the finished article was tip top....and a lot cheaper if you're buying it now, and unsure whether you're get any addiction back so less risk if you find it just doesn't do it for you anymore.

it appears to be 30$ on steam as opposed to FM13 being 40$. Or are is there a cheaper place to get fM12?

I think Im going to start with 12 and go from there. You mentioned the finished article... I assume I was right then in assuming that the latest patch for FM12 (presumably patch 3? They usually do 3) is the best version of the game? Or what patch should I play FM12 on?

[Jibby123]

Steam will update it to the last patch when you download it, so you'll get it as the version that it was after patch 3. Not sure about the demo FM12 though. Assume that will be the demo as it was over a year ago?

[GoTeamGo]

Steam will update it to the last patch when you download it, so you'll get it as the version that it was after patch 3.

Okay, well I downloaded the FM12 demo, and was told that would only be the base version, and then to buy it I had to authenticate it... but I dont understand how authenticating it will automatically change the base demo with patch 1 into the patch 3 version of the game... so will I then have to manually download patch 3? How does this work?

[Jibby123]

Am guessing once authenticated it will update to the full fat final version and you're ready to go as it was post patch 3.

[Neil Brock]

If you look you'd probably find FM13 cheaper or around the same price as FM12. For me, from a playing perspective, there's no contest. Especially as a lapsed gamer, you have the extra option of FMC to ease you back in.

[GoTeamGo]

Am guessing once authenticated it will update to the full fat final version and you're ready to go as it was post patch 3.

Ok thanks for the clarification.

[GoTeamGo]

If you look you'd probably find FM13 cheaper or around the same price as FM12. For me, from a playing perspective, there's no contest. Especially as a lapsed gamer, you have the extra option of FMC to ease you back in.

Dont know what FMC is. Also I was asking if FM12 was cheaper than 30$ anywhere since he said it was much cheaper than FM13, where I was only seeing 10$ cheaper, or if you're right and FM13 can be found for closer to 30$, then FM12 isnt even chaeper at all on steam. Also what do you mean a lapsed gamer?

Are you perhaps saying that FM12 did not fix all the busy work problems I talked about, where you have to offer your players 50,000 times before you get an offer, and all of that, which makes it take forever to get through a sesaon, where FM13 has fixed that? Where when you offer your player, you get the top offer for him immediately, or at least you only have to offer him to clubs once, and then throughout the transfer window teams make offers for him, instead of in FM10 where you offered him once, usually got no offer from the team/s interested, or if you got an offer, you got one, and if it sucked you rejected it, and then you mostly never got another offer... you would have to offer him out again.

So are you saying this is still a problem in FM12, but not FM13? Or is that not what you mean? Is that fixed in 12, or even 13? Both? Neither? Would love an answer to this specifically for both games.

[Neil Brock]

Lapsed gamer = someone who hasn't played in a while.

FMC = Football Manager Classic - www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/news/a419886/football-manager-2013-classic-mode-detailed-in-video-blogs-watch.html

Sounds like with your issues (seasons taking years to finish) that FMC would be for you. Also I'd say the majority of your issues have been improved for FM12 and then improved further for FM13. The offer to clubs is dependent on too many things to say if you offer a player out you'll be guaranteed to get a good offer, or a number of teams will go in for him. If they have the budget and the player matches the shortlist of a player they're trying to sign they'll approach. If you offer an expensive LB out when no teams have the budget or need for him, teams won't bid just for the sake of it.

[Fabio MVP]

Hey all, I haven't played FM since FM10, but my experience back then was that the game was always broken out of the box, and it usually took until the 2nd or 3rd patch of the game for the issues to be fixed, and for the balance of the game, particularly the match engine, to be fixed and playable so that headers were not way more powerful than shooting with the foot, or through balls and passing never worked but crossing was spectacular, or some other big imbalance that affected the way you built a team.

So now Im looking to get back into FM, and theoretically I would prefer to buy the newest version, but only if FM13 out of the box is superior in terms of the gameplay, match engine, and the entire game than FM12 on patch 3 is, rosters be damned.

So which is better? Thank you!

I would go for Football Manager 2013 as if it already isn't then it will be better after couple of fixes.

[Keyzer Soze]

Compare a beta version (FM13) with a 3 time patched game (FM2012) it's a really unfair comparison.

As is stands i think you have 2 options:

a) if you want to play a "complete game" rigtht now go with FM2012. Less features, but the one they have work great. Good ME.

b) if you want to play a better game in a couple of weeks then go with FM13. Right now it's far from perfect, but in a couple of weeks it will be so much better when compare with FM2012.

[GoTeamGo]

Compare a beta version (FM13) with a 3 time patched game (FM2012) it's a really unfair comparison.

As is stands i think you have 2 options:

a) if you want to play a "complete game" rigtht now go with FM2012. Less features, but the one they have work great. Good ME.

b) if you want to play a better game in a couple of weeks then go with FM13. Right now it's far from perfect, but in a couple of weeks it will be so much better when compare with FM2012.

Thanks Keyzer and everyone. Neil Brock, that actually wasn't my post, it was someone else complaining about seasons taking too long. In general they do not take too long for me, that's not the issue, BESIDES the busy work. its not the overall length of seasons, in fact my computer was loading them in FM10 pretty damn fast, seasons flew by outside of the transfer window, especially compared to playing like FM1999 or 2000 or whenever it was on an older PC, took forever. So that's not my issue in terms of the time it takes. It's more just busy work, I dont want to have to go to the same menus over and over and scrolling down the money amounts again and again and clicking offer to clubs and doing it over and over. It's just so tedious.

But time was, that wasn't my concern, someone else's. I just want the best game, which speaks to Keyzer Soze. Keyzer, that's exactly what I want, the best game right now. Im not trying to make an unfair comparison or say bad about the developers on FM13 vs FM12. I just want to know what the better game is. It would not be an unfair comparison if FM13 was actually finished, and SI finished these games before releasing them. But because Im a long time FM fan I know they're unique in that they dont usually finish their games until patch 3.

So my question was just as much about whether that trend had continued, because for all I knew, maybe they finally changed that and what if FM13 was actually a finished and fully polished product at launch this time, with no patches coming? Then FM13 would be the way to go.

Anyway it sounds like right this moment FM12 is the way to go, and then I can get FM13 a few months down the line, hopefully it will be less expensive.

[Cerritos]

When I give advice, I try to figure out what the person already wants, and then I tell them to go with that. Based on this thread, I think GoTeamGo wants to play FM 12. You sound more enthusiastic about it, you've already gotten the demo, and when people say they prefer FM13, you further question them. You're right to question them ... I'm just noting that you're more critical of the FM13 fans than you are of the FM12 fans, which to me means you'd prefer FM12. So do it. You'll like it, it's a great game!

Me, I haven't touched FM12 since the FM13 beta arrived, I've pre-ordered, and I'm glad I did. But I'd recommend FM 12 to you.

[toon army 06]

So is the consensus then that FM12 is the pinnacle of FM? That they finally nailed it? And that if I liked FM10 (before hitting the wall where I had a great team and every other team never signed good players anymore and none of their homegrown talent ever came out any good, as was the problem with EVERY FM game where it just doesn't evolve along with your team?), I will blown away by FM12? By the way did they ever fix that issue in parenthesis?

Fm 13 is better imo the game play is smoother and there's some nice new features.

Yea theres a few bugs but there sorting them for release. Thats why we got the beta

version early to see for bugs.

The fm13 demo is out you should try it, you seem stuck between playing fm12 or fm13.

Play both demos that way you get to see.

[davidbowie]

FM12.

FM13 has no features worth paying the extra price unless you are a casual game who is okay with giving the AI control over everything (DOF) or you are happy playing a cut-down version of the full game (FM Casual).

[WizbaII]

GoTeamGo, first of all, let me address that issue of games that are not finished upon release. I have to say that FM 12 did not follow this trend. From my perspective, it was great from the very beginning. Unfortunately, it seems that FM 13 will be not following this trend, after introducing a list of so many new features this year that a part of me wondered how it was possible. Well, it wasn't quite possible, but they tried anyway.

Bottom line: If you want a more playable game, you might want FM 12. As most people will tell you, however, it's worth going for FM 13 right now. FM 13 may not be the better option in the short term, but it's certainly not going to be an unplayable game (SI has gotten better at avoiding that). FM 13 is the better investment, especially if you plan on waiting so many years before buying again.

[Erimus1876]

FM13. Even in its current beta state you'll see how far advanced from previous FM's it has come. And like a fine wine, it'll get better with age as SI continue to iron out the issues.

[teodoro]

Fm2012, till the new match engine will be properly addressed (March-April 2013??).

Now it's just unplayable and embarrassing.

Only for kids.

[Kriss]

I think the OP has had all the advice he needs I'm getting that deja vu feeling.