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Spain vs Italy, KO: 7:45pm Sunday


Leppard

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1489554547.png vs 401536091.png

Venue: Olimpiyskiy Stadium, Kiev

Referee: Pedro Proença

Team News

[i'll add when available]

Possible Line-ups

Spain: Casillas; Arbeloa, Piqué, Ramos, Alba; Alonso, Xavi, Busquets; Silva, Fabregas, Iniesta

Italy: Buffon; Abate, Barzagli, Bonucci, Chiellini; De Rossi, Marchisio, Pirlo, Montolivo; Cassano, Balotelli

Previous Meeting

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Spain 1 - 1 Italy

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Was disappointed not to see a thread already. Making me put some effort in.

Expecting a fairly cagey game but hoping for a Spain win. Will be interesting to see if Spain can keep the ball in this game as they looked pretty uncomfortable against Portugal. Looking forward to seeing Xavi vs Pirlo, Casillas vs Buffon, and Balotelli vs ...er Fabregas :/

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I agree with everything the guy says tbh. But then I like Spain and their style, and don't think they're boring or anything like that.

There's two ways of looking at it - people who don't like Spain will say they are the ones who are boring and make the games crap by aimless passing. The rest, including the writer of that article, will say it's the other teams that the games boring by parking the bus.

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There's two ways of looking at it - people who don't like Spain will say they are the ones who are boring and make the games crap by aimless passing. The rest, including the writer of that article, will say it's the other teams that the games boring by parking the bus.

well that's not true, is it? portugal were quite attacking and positive for a good portion of their game, yet spain stifled the life out of it. the one spain corner which made it back to the keeper within 10 seconds is particularly memorable with regards to their negative style. it happened in the france game as well after spain had scored initially. they were clearly content with the 1-0 and didn't really show any desire to kill off the game despite france going forward, attacking, and leaving space.

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I agree with everything the guy says tbh. But then I like Spain and their style, and don't think they're boring or anything like that.

There's two ways of looking at it - people who don't like Spain will say they are the ones who are boring and make the games crap by aimless passing. The rest, including the writer of that article, will say it's the other teams that the games boring by parking the bus.

Everybody parks the bus against Barcelona but they manage to be entertaining because they use their possession to keep finding scoring opportunities. Spain keep the ball just so the opposition can't have it, they effectively move the bus from their own goal line and park it in front of the opposition penalty area. On a technical level it's incredible and there's no doubt they've been the best team in the world for the last few years but watching them just shut down every game once they go 1-0 up can really suck the life out of you.

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well that's not true, is it? portugal were quite attacking and positive for a good portion of their game, yet spain stifled the life out of it. the one spain corner which made it back to the keeper within 10 seconds is particularly memorable with regards to their negative style. it happened in the france game as well after spain had scored initially. they were clearly content with the 1-0 and didn't really show any desire to kill off the game despite france going forward, attacking, and leaving space.

Most of that is rubbish, but the bit in bold is more rubbish than the rest. As that article says, France didn't attack at all, even when they were losing. I can't even remember a clear chance on goal that they had in that game.

And Portugal just ran out of steam because they pressed hard. You can't do it for 90 minutes, as they found to their cost.

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Most of that is rubbish, but the bit in bold is more rubbish than the rest. As that article says, France didn't attack at all, even when they were losing. I can't even remember a clear chance on goal that they had in that game.

And Portugal just ran out of steam because they pressed hard. You can't do it for 90 minutes, as they found to their cost.

how about you actually refute my points instead of calling them rubbish? france still attacked, despite sucking at attacking. a lack of clear cut opportunities is more indicative of a lack of creativity. i can quite clearly remember france at least attempting to score in the second half, and perhaps they weren't able to do so given spain's negative play.

i don't even know what you're trying to say about the portugal game. yeah, they pressed hard, attacked, and had more opportunities than spain before extra time.

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Everybody parks the bus against Barcelona but they manage to be entertaining because they use their possession to keep finding scoring opportunities. Spain keep the ball just so the opposition can't have it, they effectively move the bus from their own goal line and park it in front of the opposition penalty area. On a technical level it's incredible and there's no doubt they've been the best team in the world for the last few years but watching them just shut down every game once they go 1-0 up can really suck the life out of you.

Barca have Messi. Changes the whole dynamic of the team.

I agree with that article. Spain with Villa and Puyol would've been a different team.

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well that's not true, is it? portugal were quite attacking and positive for a good portion of their game, yet spain stifled the life out of it. the one spain corner which made it back to the keeper within 10 seconds is particularly memorable with regards to their negative style. it happened in the france game as well after spain had scored initially. they were clearly content with the 1-0 and didn't really show any desire to kill off the game despite france going forward, attacking, and leaving space.

That happened only towards the end of the game, and when did Spain score their second?

At 1-0, Spain don't need to take any risks. They're winning. They wait for the opposition to come out of their shells and try to score. Of course, the opposition rarely does, so it's all blamed on Spain's 'negative' style.

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That happened only towards the end of the game, and when did Spain score their second?

At 1-0, Spain don't need to take any risks. They're winning. They wait for the opposition to come out of their shells and try to score. Of course, the opposition rarely does, so it's all blamed on Spain's 'negative' style.

err, no. france started attacking at the beginning of the second half. yes, it's quite nice that spain did venture forward and get that second through the penalty, but at the same time, they were trying to kill the game off. they showed no real indication of attacking intent up until that point in the game iirc.

why would the opposition not come out of their defensive shells if they're 1-0 down, and in this instance in the euro 2012 knockout stages? it makes no sense. no, they opposition do attack, but spain is willing to settle for the 1-0 scorelines, which is very effective but boring at the same time.

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Barca have Messi. Changes the whole dynamic of the team.

I agree with that article. Spain with Villa and Puyol would've been a different team.

Yeah, it does highlight how immense Messi is but that doesn't disguise the lack of intent shown by Spain.

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err, no. france started attacking at the beginning of the second half. yes, it's quite nice that spain did venture forward and get that second through the penalty, but at the same time, they were trying to kill the game off. they showed no real indication of attacking intent up until that point in the game iirc.

why would the opposition not come out of their defensive shells if they're 1-0 down, and in this instance in the euro 2012 knockout stages? it makes no sense. no, they opposition do attack, but spain is willing to settle for the 1-0 scorelines, which is very effective but boring at the same time.

If by attacking you mean send a couple of players forward to pretend to support Benzema and Ribery, then yeah, France attacked in the second half.

And the opposition don't come out of their shells even when they're 1-0 down. In fact, they rarely come out of their shells against Spain at all. Putting 9 or 10 men behind the ball and hoping for a quick break is what most teams do against Spain. So, Spain should take risks and try to force a goal when the opposition is defending with pretty much everyone?

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If by attacking you mean send a couple of players forward to pretend to support Benzema and Ribery, then yeah, France attacked in the second half.

The way Benzema and Ribery were passing the ball in the final third I don't think it would have made much difference if all 9 other players ran up to support the attack tbf :D

And the opposition don't come out of their shells even when they're 1-0 down. In fact, they rarely come out of their shells against Spain at all. Putting 9 or 10 men behind the ball and hoping for a quick break is what most teams do against Spain. So, Spain should take risks and try to force a goal when the opposition is defending with pretty much everyone?

Of course not, they're afraid of the opposition having the ball so they keep it away from them for as long as possible. It always works and they always win. But they're also boring. They also don't give a **** about being called boring, because A) They know they're boring and B) They keep winning. Nobody would care about this if it wasn't for the pseudo-intellectual apologists who try and convince themselves and the wider world that Spain are something they're not.

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If by attacking you mean send a couple of players forward to pretend to support Benzema and Ribery, then yeah, France attacked in the second half.

And the opposition don't come out of their shells even when they're 1-0 down. In fact, they rarely come out of their shells against Spain at all. Putting 9 or 10 men behind the ball and hoping for a quick break is what most teams do against Spain. So, Spain should take risks and try to force a goal when the opposition is defending with pretty much everyone?

what i means is that france attacked far more in the second half than they did in the first half. if spain were able to score against the deep-defending france in the first 45 minutes, then they should have been able to do so in the second 45 with france leaving even more gaps in their defense as they tried to find the equalizer.

and the opposition do come out of their shells when they're 1-0 down. france initiated attacks during that game while they were 1-0 down; they just sucked at it due to a complete lack of creativity and competence in their attack. additionally, i wonder what you thought those attacking substitutions were for, then, as nasri and giroud are hardly the fastest players in the world (which is what you want when you're playing on the counter). when you're 1-0 up, there are several options for how you go about the game and hold onto your win. you could go for the second goal in order secure the victory, which is a valid tactic, or you could focus on not conceding, and in spain's case hold onto possession in order to prevent the opposition from having the chance to equalize, which is also a valid tactic. however, one of these is much more boring than the other, which is what i'm arguing here.

edit: or what zvonimir said really

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The way Benzema and Ribery were passing the ball in the final third I don't think it would have made much difference if all 9 other players ran up to support the attack tbf :D

Of course not, they're afraid of the opposition having the ball so they keep it away from them for as long as possible. It always works and they always win. But they're also boring. They also don't give a **** about being called boring, because A) They know they're boring and B) They keep winning. Nobody would care about this if it wasn't for the pseudo-intellectual apologists who try and convince themselves and the wider world that Spain are something they're not.

Well, I don't find it boring at all. Boring is how England played. How Greece played against Germany. On a scale of how entertaining something is, boring would be 0-3. Spain would be at 7 for me. Spain of 2008 would be at 10. England would be at 2. Greece at 1. There's a difference between boring and 'not as entertaining as they could be'.

what i means is that france attacked far more in the second half than they did in the first half. if spain were able to score against the deep-defending france in the first 45 minutes, then they should have been able to do so in the second 45 with france leaving even more gaps in their defense as they tried to find the equalizer.

and the opposition do come out of their shells when they're 1-0 down. france initiated attacks during that game while they were 1-0 down; they just sucked at it due to a complete lack of creativity and competence in their attack. additionally, i wonder what you thought those attacking substitutions were for, then, as nasri and giroud are hardly the fastest players in the world (which is what you want when you're playing on the counter). when you're 1-0 up, there are several options for how you go about the game and hold onto your win. you could go for the second goal in order secure the victory, which is a valid tactic, or you could focus on not conceding, and in spain's case hold onto possession in order to prevent the opposition from having the chance to equalize, which is also a valid tactic. however, one of these is much more boring than the other, which is what i'm arguing here.

edit: or what zvonimir said really

France did initiate attacks but do they really count as an attack if it dies by the time the ball crosses the halfway line? (might be being a little harsh towards France :D.) Spain's first goal was through some great dribbling from Alba coupled with some horrific defending from France. It was individual skill that opened up that French defense, so it wasn't something that Spain could rely on to score again. France didn't really push on to score a winner until towards the latter stages of the second half. Like really really late in that half. And once they did, you saw Spain hitting France on the counter. I remember hoping like hell that Spain screwed their chances up because I'd predicted a 1-0 win.

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Well, I don't find it boring at all. Boring is how England played. How Greece played against Germany.

No, Spain are boring, England are depressing and Greece are simultaneously worthy of both understanding and pity because they're a bit rubbish really.

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I find Spain boring to watch. They are effective, they are technically very good, they have a very successful way of playing. But they are still boring. Yes, some teams park the bus. This is by no means a new approach to playing a very good team, it happens in many leagues and against many countries, and many teams find ways to counter it. Italy were not playing especially defensively against Spain, yet Spain created very few chances until they had conceded, and then changing their style they opened up Italy more. So Spain can play more attack-minded, and not be incredibly weak offensively, they just choose not to. This doesn't make their success any less valid, but it does make their matches boring.

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What do you reckon, will Italy play 3-5-2 as they did in the first game, or will they stick with the 4-4-2 diamond as they played in the knockout stage?

I prefer the 4-4-2 as I find it way more attractive and balanced.

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I hope Spain win but I feel that Italy might pinch it. Either 1-0 or it will go to penalties.

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I really can't pick a favorite. As in: I have no clue who will win this, both teams are strong. And as in: I don't know which team I like to win.

I actually am deeply impressed by this Italy team. Attractive football, fair football. Kudos to Prandelli for creating this team. What a difference a few years can make - I've always disliked Italy with a vengeance, but this version of the Azurri have vaporised that completely.

Of course I still like Spain, I regard the way they play as the pinnacle of football and the haters can go watch 'exciting' kick'n'rush down the leagues somewhere if they want. It would be fully deserved if they won a third title in a row.

So I'm a true neutal today. Hope it'll be cracking match

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Guest avine

It is a multitasking to win a tournament like this, for Italy this is to concentrate in their teamplay and team and perform in the same level during all match

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Back on topic - can't wait for this. Gonna be a very interesting game, can't back against Spain really but you never know. Hope Torres gets a chance to come on and have an impact.

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I really can't pick a favorite. As in: I have no clue who will win this, both teams are strong. And as in: I don't know which team I like to win.

I actually am deeply impressed by this Italy team. Attractive football, fair football. Kudos to Prandelli for creating this team. What a difference a few years can make - I've always disliked Italy with a vengeance, but this version of the Azurri have vaporised that completely.

Of course I still like Spain, I regard the way they play as the pinnacle of football and the haters can go watch 'exciting' kick'n'rush down the leagues somewhere if they want. It would be fully deserved if they won a third title in a row.

So I'm a true neutal today. Hope it'll be cracking match

This pretty much sums up my feelings towards the match.

I admire the way Spain play to win and would like to see them make history, but I've also been impressed by Italy and would like to see them win as underdogs. I also hope Mario has an impact on the result, either way.

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I've found Spain very boring and I agree that it's the intent. It's frustrating as they really do have the players to still have a tight defence but attack so much more, a much better team when Pedro plays.

Yeh, this.

Playing Fabregas as the false 9 has been hard to watch, despite being a world class centre mid he just doesn't have the movement or pace for playing higher up. Spain have been incredible on a tactical level but they've really lacked the incision Villa and Pedro can give them, which I think Barca missed at times last season too. Pedro needs to be starting imo, not coming on as a substitute late on.

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haha it wouldn't surprise me, Geoff Shreeves on his way out there to interview the losers

Should start out "did ya know that you won't shake Platini's hand"

Or ask Xavi/Pirlo about retirement

Heartbreaking

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I've found Spain very boring and I agree that it's the intent. It's frustrating as they really do have the players to still have a tight defence but attack so much more, a much better team when Pedro plays.

I don't find them as boring as most people seem to, but I definitely agree with that part. If not better, more exciting.

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