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Total Football: Tic-Tac Magick (The return: Part 2)


Which tactic do you prefer?  

109 members have voted

  1. 1. Which tactic do you prefer?

    • Original (17/01/2012)
      23
    • Tweaked (23/01/2012)
      10
    • New (26/01/2012)
      77


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Total Football: Tic-Tac Magick FM12

12.1.1 244099(m.e. v993)

I decided to make a new thread for this tactic update, as it could get a bit confusing using the old thread. I'll repost how I make my tactics (for those who didn't follow last time) and I'll also post the link to the FM2011 version as there were lots of useful comments from community members.

Removed as it no longer applies

FM11 THREAD

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/259190-Total-Football-Tic-Tac-Magick

FINAL RELEASE (31/01/2012)

http://www.mediafire.com/?d291vf5z54wvmll

Playmaker = MCR (Foward Runs Rarely)

Brief Description

I just want to mention an FM Genius - SFraser. I stumbled across one of his threads and it was a moment of enlightenment with regards to Mentality and Creative Freedom. Lots of useful information - you can find the thread below:

http://community.sigames.com/showthread.php/265090-Meet-The-System

So thanks goes to SFraser who is sadly no longer here to guide us tactical newbs.

Ok. The biggest criticism of this tactic has been its lack of goals and goal scoring opportunities. I agree with this and have set out to make a more attacking tactic, whilst trying to maintain beautiful passing displays.

I've developed a new tactic which is more attacking, allows more creativity, increased width, less time wasting and a different shape. I'm currently giving the tactic a test and the results so far have been encouraging.

One certainty of the new tactic is that it's not for small teams and will only be effective with world class teams (This is an educated guess - I would be shocked if it did actually work with small teams). My goal is to create beautiful football - not a tactic which will take a team from the lowest division possible to the heights of Champions League football within 4 seasons :p

Screenshots

Managed to finish the season unbeaten in the league:

leaguetabled.jpg

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Top goalscorers:

1) Messi: 72 goals (56 games) - 44 League

2) Villa: 33 goals (52 games) - 26 League

3) Pedro: 25 goals (59 games) - 18 League

Top assists:

1) Messi: 37 assists (56 games)

2) Villa: 25 assists (52 games)

3) Iniesta: 21 assists (36 games + 18 sub appearances)

The team averaged 461 passes per game.

playerstatsk.jpg

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Ranges used for Final Release (31/01/2012)

Mentality (Mixed/High): (11-14-17)=[10-13-16]

Creative Freedom (High): (15-18-21)=[14-17-20]

Passing Style (Short): (1-4-7) = [0-3-6]

Closing Down (High): (15-18-21)=[14-17-20]

Width (Low-Mixed): (7) = [9]

Tempo (Low): (4) = [6]

Time Wasting (Low): (4) = [3]

Defensive Line (High): (17) = [16]

Archive Versions

Original (17/01/2012):

http://www.mediafire.com/?hil1e806b2ke4l1

Tweaked (23/01/2012):

http://www.mediafire.com/?nb7f4qeb7jbe6b0

New (26/01/2012)

http://www.mediafire.com/?dv4c64cc6d89c4u

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Introduction

Firstly, I prefer to build my tactics in the Classic view. I think it’s just a habit ingrained from the earlier versions of FM, when the Tactic Creator wasn’t available. I spent a long time trying to figure out what the sliders actually did and I now feel more comfortable using the Classic view as opposed to using the Tactic Creator.

I like to keep things simple when building my tactics, which may sound ironic when I’ve told you I like to use the Classic view. My basic philosophy is that real world football teams would have global settings. i.e. Fergie would tell his team to play attacking football, keep the passing short, press the opposition, etc. However, it is also true that certain players will be more defensive or attacking based on the position they play. i.e. Ferdinand is going to be playing less attacking than Scholes, with Ferdinand’s passing and closing down being slightly less. So my ambition was to find a balance of rigidity (try pronouncing this) within a global framework.

Slider Mechanics

Individual Sliders

The following sliders can be set individually:

- Mentality

- Creative Freedom

- Passing Style

- Closing Down

I’ll first focus on the Individual sliders then I’ll talk about the Global sliders. The Individual sliders have values from 1-21, where a value of 1 equates to 0 clicks and a value of 21 equates to 20 clicks.

*() = Slider value

*[] = Slider Clicks

Each Individual slider has three primary ranges; these being:

- Low: (1-7)= [0-6]

- Mixed: (8-14)= [7-13]

- High: (15-21)= [14-20]

Therefore, the mid-point of each of these ranges can be calculated as:

- Low: (4)=[3]

- Mixed: (11)=[10]

- High: (18)=[17]

These mid-point numbers constitute the base values of each range. Hence, 3 clicks up will give the upper value of that range, whilst 3 clicks down will give the lower value of that range.

So we now have the 3 basic ranges, but we now need to calculate the transitional ranges. i.e. those which link both the Low and High ranges to the Mixed range. The ranges are as follows:

- Low-Mixed: (5-11)=[4-10]

- High-Mixed: (11-17)=[10-16]

With the mid-point of these ranges being:

- Low-Mixed: (8)=[7]

- High-Mixed: (14)=[13]

To summarise, we now have 5 slider ranges for the Individual Sliders:

- Low: (1-4-7)=[0-3-6]

- Low-Mixed: (5-8-11)=[4-7-10]**

- Mixed: (8-11-14)=[7-10-13]

- Mixed-High: (11-14-17)=[10-13-16]**

- High: (15-18-21)=[14-17-20]

Global Sliders

The following sliders are set Globally:

- Width

- Tempo

- Time Wasting

- Closing Down

For some strange reason, the Global sliders have values from 1-20, or 0-19 clicks. As such, the Global values differ slightly compared to the Individual values. I split the slider into two halves; the “Lower Half” and the “Upper Half”.

The Lower Half consists of the following values:

- Extremely Low: (1) = [0]

- Low: (4) = [3]

- Low/Mixed: (7) = [6]

- Mixed: (10) = [9]

The Upper Half consists of the following values:

- Mixed: (11) = [10]

- Mixed/High: (14) = [13]

- High: (17) = [16]

- Extremely High: (20) = [19]

I then choose which Half I wish to use. i.e. I may decide I want to play a high Defensive Line, but I may not want to leave too much space in behind the back four; I therefore choose a value of 14.

The whole process of splitting the sliders into ranges is for simplicity. Using these ranges allows me to quickly transfer my ideas into slider values with relative accuracy.

**Modifications from previous FM11 post

These modifications have been made so that the slider values are within the neutral range.

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Awesome, I'm currently using the FM11 version with the tweaks posted by headcoat and it's working really, really well. Gonna start using your new version for the new season, team's already well-built for this style of play.

Heres my current squad and some fixtures:

http://i.imgur.com/Jhcbl.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/jbREY.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Dzlwo.jpg

please the link of fm 11 tweaked version please

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I've been using your tactic with my Atlético Clube de Portugal game for the start of my new season (now in to the 2017/18 season). It's good against most teams so far, but when i come up against the big three (Benfica, Sporting, Porto) i have more trouble maintaining possession of the ball than i did with tactics employed in previous seasons.

I don't concede a lot of goals, but also don't score too many despite a lot of the games giving me +70% possession and creating 21+ chances. I guess this could be down to using inferior players.

Overall, your tactic is working well for me even though i'm not playing with a club any where close to the stature of Barcelona. I'm hoping i can convert more chances once my club's stature is high enough for me to get some players closer to the standard of the ones you're using with Barcelona.

(I used your tactic in FM2011 too, and won lots of things as the mighty Carlisle United.)

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I've been using variants of this tactic for a couple of years now, still my favourite. It may not be the highest scoring, but its definitely the most stylish. Thanks again Magick.

drtrick - you have spotted the problem, you'll do better with more technically able players, especially the two central midfielders who touch the ball a lot and have to make lots of good decisions. However those players also have to be hard-working and decent defensively. Finding the right players for that is not always easy. Good pace and better finishing makes all three attacking players more and more deadly.

Until then the mentality change Magick suggests helps - your less able players start to just ping the ball around more and use the shape of the system to their advantage rather than dwelling on the ball and making decisions.

Hope you stick with it

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Great work, could we perhaps have a breakdown of what are the essential attributes and possibly ppm's for each position. That would be great.

***Player Filters***

http://www.mediafire.com/?160805y6mb1t9in

Gee_Simposon and Cragswfc came up with this idea. All the key attributes are listed in these filters, you just need to import them into the search filter. (Filters --> Manage Filters --> Import --> *Location of where you saved the files*)

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Hi Magick,

Your tactic was my favourite on FM11 and since you've posted this one have been desperate to see the same results again..

In my save I took over Bristol City in 2015 after they had finished 14th, 15th, 12th & 20th in the Championship in the first four years of my save.

Had £0 to spend but sold £5m worth of players then bought with what I had left and won the league using your tactic all season (screenshots below)

I would agree with everything that has been said so far, however if you are like me and struggle for money then just buying CMs who have a 16+ passing attribute is ideal.

I averaged around 60-65% possession every game with a team whose realistic position was probably around the playoff places

Dictate tempo is also a great thing to teach the playmaker at RCM :)

Screenies:

Season 1

Season 2

Season 3

Season 4

Season 5 - The season I took over!!

FA Cup run

League Cup run

Championship results - 1

Championship results - 2

Championship results - 3

Just a reminder.. I took over Bristol City with your tactic in 2015/16 season!!

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I created another tactic with the mentality changes for the bigger games, and it indeed worked well. Thanks very much. :)

I finished fourth this season and qualified for the Europa league which was the aim. I had a few odd results in the middle of the season - a run of three straight 0 - 0 draws and an unbelievable 4 - 1 loss to the team at the bottom of the league with no wins all season.

Overall though, your tactic is working great, i'm sure a lot of the odd results are because of my bad team talks. ;)

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Hello again,

Half-way through my first season in the Premier League with Bristol City and I'm glad to report that the excellent results are continuing.

On coming up I told my board I would achieve a mid-table finish and was given £20m as a result.

I invested heavily in my team but I certainly do not have a world class squad. I have even been forced to bring in a few fairly average loan players to boost my squad numbers.

So, to the screenies..

Table

Arsenal result

Chelsea result

Liverpool result

Man City result

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Hi Magick I used your tactics last year and was thinking of doing so again. I'm trying to remember if the CB's need to be good passers of the ball or could a player like Vidic work? What type of Striker does this use? As I remember it used a poacher type last year. Also, do the wingers take on their full backs? As I like to see that in a tactic.

Cheers.

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Defenders will pass it short, so they dont need to be Alderweireld. Decent pace helps though.

I've used this tactic with all kinds of centre forwards, but pacy finishers work best for me. Having said that I had Cardozo for a while and he had a 40 goal season for me.

The wide players will either attack the byline or cut inside, generally they do most damage for me when they cut inside.

I'm sure Magick will correct me if I'm wrong :)

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Defenders will pass it short, so they dont need to be Alderweireld. Decent pace helps though.

I've used this tactic with all kinds of centre forwards, but pacy finishers work best for me. Having said that I had Cardozo for a while and he had a 40 goal season for me.

The wide players will either attack the byline or cut inside, generally they do most damage for me when they cut inside.

I'm sure Magick will correct me if I'm wrong :)

That' what I wanted to hear :) especially the CB part as tbh I like using no nonsense CB's and I'm looking to bring in the wonderkid Papadopolous. I'm sure the CB's did need decent composure though for magick's tactic last year, if so I'll just have to put Papadopolous' on individual composure training if I manage to sign him.

I wonder if Rooney could be retrained to play in the MCL position effectively? I currently play him as a AMC in a tactic I'm using atm and I have managed to get his passing, creativity, flair and technique all up to 17 so I think he would work? I think his off the ball is 18.

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Had a disater. My laptop has had to be sent off for repair -- it keeps overheating! Probably my own fault for investing in a Toshiba :p I'm pretty sure it's an issue with dust in the fan, but unfortunately the fan in my A660 is buried deep inside the machine. I tried cleaning it with the good old-fashioned compressed air, but this didn't help. So I went on a mission to find the fan itself and do a manual clean...86,000 screws later with a detached keyboard and I decided to give up. I didn't want to make a wrong turn and invalidate the warranty; although I'm pretty sure taking the back off invalidates it, but I'm keeping that quiet. I'm guessing Toshiba is a great believer in Moore's law, so they are probably just expecting me to buy a new one after 18 months...gits. Anyway, I'm using my old Acer at the moment and I didn't transfer my save game over.

@drtrick: Nice. Thanks for the update. Where were you expected to finish at the start of the season? I'm not very knowledgeable about the Portuguese league :p

@Gee: Good to see you back. Yeah, I completely agree with McAvennie. Having 3 in midfield, with two set to forward runs rarely, and the fullbacks should offer plenty of passing options for the CBs so they don't have to dally on the ball.

@The One and Only: The mighty Bristol!! :D Is that FM11 or FM12? I was quite sad to see the FM11 tactic not having the same effect on FM12 as I didn't think the Match Engine had changed very much. It's such a complicated entity though that any small tweaks to general FM12 gameplay could have effeects on mtach performance. i.e. Team talks! - still not fully used to these.

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The mighty Bristol!! :D Is that FM11 or FM12? I was quite sad to see the FM11 tactic not having the same effect on FM12 as I didn't think the Match Engine had changed very much. It's such a complicated entity though that any small tweaks to general FM12 gameplay could have effeects on mtach performance. i.e. Team talks! - still not fully used to these.

My screenshots are from FM12 :) As a little mini update I am now in March with Bristol City and I am still 4th!!

Had some tricky games against good teams and form suffered a little but I am picking it back up. A champions league place would really be pretty amazing. I will post more screenshots once I have finished the season.

With regards to teamtalks, the method I use has proved to be fairly successful (as you've seen!)

Unless my assistant manager advises me that I am an underdog, I choose AGRESSIVE - EXPECT TO WIN

If I am underdog then my overall team talk is PASSIONATE - IMPRESS ME (SHOW ME WHAT YOU CAN DO)

After my main team talk is done, I use individual team talks. I use the buttons that let you tell your entire defence something, entire midfield etc..

Against teams who I'm even or better than (ie. if I've agressively told my team I expect to win) then I use; PASSIONATE - HAVE FAITH

If I am against a team who is better than me I use; ASSERTIVE - HAVE FAITH

If you've got no hope in hell of winning then use CALM - NO PRESSURE as an overall team talk. Then everyone is nice and relaxed and that can help.

At half time.. if drawing do the same team talk as before the game.

If losing against a team you should be winning be AGGRESSIVE again, if the team is better than you then ASSERTIVE - HAVE FAITH

If winning say ASSERTIVE - WARY OF COMPLACENCY

Hope this isn't too confusing!! Once you get into a routine it's easy :)

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Had a disater. My laptop has had to be sent off for repair -- it keeps overheating! Probably my own fault for investing in a Toshiba :p I'm pretty sure it's an issue with dust in the fan, but unfortunately the fan in my A660 is buried deep inside the machine. I tried cleaning it with the good old-fashioned compressed air, but this didn't help. So I went on a mission to find the fan itself and do a manual clean...86,000 screws later with a detached keyboard and I decided to give up. I didn't want to make a wrong turn and invalidate the warranty; although I'm pretty sure taking the back off invalidates it, but I'm keeping that quiet. I'm guessing Toshiba is a great believer in Moore's law, so they are probably just expecting me to buy a new one after 18 months...gits. Anyway, I'm using my old Acer at the moment and I didn't transfer my save game over.

@drtrick: Nice. Thanks for the update. Where were you expected to finish at the start of the season? I'm not very knowledgeable about the Portuguese league :p

@Gee: Good to see you back. Yeah, I completely agree with McAvennie. Having 3 in midfield, with two set to forward runs rarely, and the fullbacks should offer plenty of passing options for the CBs so they don't have to dally on the ball.

@The One and Only: The mighty Bristol!! :D Is that FM11 or FM12? I was quite sad to see the FM11 tactic not having the same effect on FM12 as I didn't think the Match Engine had changed very much. It's such a complicated entity though that any small tweaks to general FM12 gameplay could have effeects on mtach performance. i.e. Team talks! - still not fully used to these.

Ah not so good regarding your laptop :( Lets hope you get it back soon!

Regarding the part in bold, so you are practically saying the CB's don't need to be that good at passing then due to lots of support from team mates? If so then great :) I'm thinking of retraining Rooney to MCL but not sure if he would be effective there? As I've mentioned a few posts above, I got his passing, creativity, flair, technique and off the ball up to 17,17,17,17 and 18. His attributes seem quite well suited to that position now.

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@The One and Only: Nice...I'll give this method a go. I think sometimes I'm too nice to my players :p

@Gee: Yeah they don't have to be that good. I was playing last night with Chelsea using the tactic with the high Defensive Line and Counter Attacking tweeks -- it was nice to see the fullbacks unleashing the wide players if the opposition were pushed up high to close down our players.

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@Gee - i am playing with man utd as well start of second season. For me Rooney is ideal has the CF, droping deep and picking out the IF and MCL wih through balls. At MCL i usually play Cleverley or Pogba.

Will update how i get on with this tactic after playing a few more games. But like what i see so far.

MAGiCK: should that def line and CA tweak be used for the full 90 mins?

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I was using it for the full 90. It's up to you if you want to change it -- if you're doing well then I don't want to ruin your game :p

I changed to the +3 line and counter attack and honestly it's practically revolutionised the tactic! It was beginning to lose its effectiveness - maybe because of the AI.

However, after the tweaks i re-found my form and almost completed an incredible first season in the Premier League.. screenshots to follow in the next hour!!

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@adonis: I genuinely can't remember. I'm pretty sure he was averaging 1 goal a game -- I know for definite that he was leading goals and assists.

@The One and Only: Good to hear! I found the players move the ball to the forward players more quickly when space is created, but also maintain possession well when the opposition are deep. For me it added a new dimension to the tactic and I found the AI was less inclined to start pushing men forward in an attempt to win the ball. Looking forward to the screenshots :thup:

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Couldn't really have asked for a better first season in the Premier League with such an average squad. Lets just get straight to the screenshots!

Firstly, the cups. League Cup was a little disappointing. Only made the quarter final stage.

League Cup fixtures

Quarter Final knockout - I was robbed!!

Now, the FA Cup. I WON! Amazing really. I have reached Wembley in both by seasons so far as Bristol City manager, but to actually win was pretty great.

FA Cup fixtures

Semi Final vs Manchester United - Check the sending off before the match facts!

Final vs Manchester City

And finally, the league. I'll let the pictures do the talking...

Final table

Tottenham domination

Man City snatch and grab!

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@The One and Only: Wow! 2nd with Bristol City! Where were you predicted to finish?

Which player did you sacrifice in the Man Utd game when your player got sent off? I tend to sacrifice the striker, but I'm not sure how effective that is.

Time to prepare Bristol City for Champions League fixtures :thup:

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@The One and Only: Wow! 2nd with Bristol City! Where were you predicted to finish?

Which player did you sacrifice in the Man Utd game when your player got sent off? I tend to sacrifice the striker, but I'm not sure how effective that is.

Time to prepare Bristol City for Champions League fixtures :thup:

Well my predicted position was 19th, but like I said I did make some changes with the money that was given to me.

I told my board mid-table finish and that is where I was expecting. My reputation is still very low so I can't attract many players. Highest value on player search was £6m!

As for being down to 10 men, I always sacrifice the CM.. the MCL and MCR control the midfield whilst my CM plays DC because he's a DC/CDM/MC

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@drtrick: Nice. Thanks for the update. Where were you expected to finish at the start of the season? I'm not very knowledgeable about the Portuguese league :p

Ha, me either, i just took control of Atlético CP while they were in the Portuguese second tier because they were a Lisbon club so i figured i could (eventually) get huge crowds with them.

To put it into context, i took over and had four seasons in the second tier where i finished eighth, seventh and sixth before becoming champions, then i had two seasons in the top flight finishing eigth both times before i took up this tactic after which i finished fourth and then, after signing a couple of decent AMs i won the league.

In the championship season i was predicted to finish eigth. I don't put much stock in those though, as after winning the league they predicted i would finish fifth the season after.

Unfortunately, i've had to abandon my Atlético save in the 2019/2020 season as the game keeps crashing at a certain point, so i'll have to start again. Rather disappointed, but i guess these things happen. :/

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@Gee - i am playing with man utd as well start of second season. For me Rooney is ideal has the CF, droping deep and picking out the IF and MCL wih through balls. At MCL i usually play Cleverley or Pogba.

Will update how i get on with this tactic after playing a few more games. But like what i see so far.

MAGiCK: should that def line and CA tweak be used for the full 90 mins?

Thanks for the advice but I think I'm still going to retrain Rooney to MC as I'm a big fan of Hernández IRL so I really like using him in the starting 11 and plus he seems a goal machine in this game going by my 1st season in charge and by looking at other people's experiences with him.

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@The One and Only - Amazing results there! Inspiring me to start a new game on FM...

How d'you think you'll fare in the Champion's League?

Thank you, I wish Bristol City could do it for real.. haha

I'm not sure how I'll do in the Champions League. I will undoubtedly have an incredibly hard group so probably will be aiming for 3rd place and a Europa League spot.

Of course I will post the screenshots here when I finish my season. WATCH THIS SPACE!

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