Tactical Theorems and Frameworks '07

mal9ball · October 26, 2006

Awesome tactical advice WWFan, I find the whole process of tinkering with tactics very interesting, but sometimes I just wish you could blast 4-4-2 into the game and have a chance of doing well!

Do you always have to tinker with instructions to such a deep level in order to be successful?

RedefiningForm · October 26, 2006

Heh, rather surprised to see my brainchild of RoT still holding sway amongst many in these parts, I'd have expected it to die a long time ago with its early failures in '06.

I haven't read the thread in it's entirety, just some quick comments:

I approach tactics from an extremely logical and common point of view. I'd probably never do things like CA with a slow tempo or high time wasting, given that the entire premise of CA is to get the balls up the field as fast as possible without undue delay so as to capitalise on defenders getting caught out of position, etc.

Would just like to understand how stuff like creative freedom and closing down are connected, the way I understand CF is that it's almost entirely independent from all the other sliders. It's a bit obvious given the name, simply put a high CF would allow a player to disregard any other slider positions to a very large extent, and vice versa.

Other than that, it's a fantastic attempt at tactics building that avoids mere prescribing and forces people to look at the backbone behind tactics, wwfan deserves kudos.

Stephanie McMahon's Secret Lover · October 26, 2006

For keepeing possesion I employ THREE strategies.

1) Short passing (as short as possible)

2) Slow Tempo (as slow as possible)

3) GK distribution set on defender collect.

With these settings you keep the ball an awful lot however, it's always what you do with the ball that counts.

Cleon · October 26, 2006

Originally posted by Stephanie McMahon's Secret Lover:
For keepeing possesion I employ THREE strategies.

1) Short passing (as short as possible)

2) Slow Tempo (as slow as possible)

3) GK distribution set on defender collect.

With these settings you keep the ball an awful lot however, it's always what you do with the ball that counts.

Thats how I keep possesion too

Brellier · October 26, 2006

interesting stuff, few questions if i may be so bold?

1) Long Shots - not seen them mentioned, i assume you set on a player by player basis depending on his rating in this area? I have low for anyone with Long Shots stat under 15, medium id its over 15 and the player is FB,DMC or AML/R. Often if its over 15 and player is AMC, FC,ST. Is this too much do you think?

2) Set pieces. More i think about/play the game, more i see these as being key. How often are r/l matches decided by set pieces? often is the answer. I think a good set piece set up is vital for success and can make the difference betweem your tactic looking good or bad. I have some initial thoughts that im trying out, but interested to here others systems.

3)Symetry (sp!) - Anyone played around with non-symetrical formations? I created my 442 diamond based on RoT, and initial have it set up with Long FARROWS on wingers and short FARROWS on FB. reading the test with roma above, im a little put off. A thought popped into mind which was to set up one side as above, and the other with short FARROW for winger and no FARROW for FB. I cant visualise how this will work in practice, but willing to give it a try.

4) Matchups - On the "Focus Passing" setting, has anyone tryed focussing it entire to one flank? Im thinking where you start a match and you have a matchup down one side heavily in your favour (your AML has supperior stats to the AI team MR/DR). Might it be worth experiment with using this in short burst to confuse the AI. eg focus it down the left for 15 mins (possible add a SARROW to your left sided FC), then switch to the right?

5)Switch position - Anyone use this option at all? I guess the most popular would be to have an attacking FB and a winger who can tackle, and have them switch from time to time (possibly work with Riise and Aurelio at liverpool). Also wondered about using it on my wingers (ala Mourinho with Duff and Robben last year). To be honest tho, im not sure i trust the game engine to impliment this properly.

ANy thoughts?

awhec · October 26, 2006

Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucccccccccccccccccckkkkkkkkk!

I just don't know what is wrong with my Real Madrid side, we've drawn like 18 in a row now! I can't take it anymore, I know for the fact that in every game, we dominate possession, its just that, after we score, they score in the last few mins, I've tried everything I can.

****ing hell, this game is ****ing **** ****ing frustrating.

Sorry guys, had to let that out.

Pipson · October 26, 2006

awhec calm down m8

awhec · October 26, 2006

I am now, I apologised if that previous comment did harm anything/anyone.

It's just that, previous CM/FM games, I have never face such frustration, I dunno, I have no anger problems or anything for all those years playing games but FM 2007 just pushes it and its over the edge just now.

Broke my mouse and am replacing it with my bro's now as I type.

Aaaaaah, rant off. Anyway, what I've found that, in this game, there's so much variables you have to take in to ensure that 3 points is possible.

I'm happy that my Real Madrid team in its first season, am dominating possesion with Slow, Short passing, I even saw glimpse of beautiful one touches but when its coming to the final product, my team squanders.

nic9394 · October 26, 2006

Awesome guide, the part i treasure most is how to break down the 33211 and 4141.

Worked very well using the tactic u said, it took the AI about 20 min game time to realise they need to switch back to their normal 442

crazy gra · October 26, 2006

Originally posted by wwfan:
It's interesting to see that a long-time RoTer (crazy gra) is having a similar degree of success in '07 as '06

i know you posted that a few days ago wwfan, but i haven't been able to get online for a couple of days.

i don't actually play a RoT system, i think. i've started in 07 by continuing my tactics which i had for 06, which i think were developed from a RoT system. but as 06 progressed, i continued to tweak the tactic to be more defensively solid and to create more chances in short. by the end of 06 i had a tactic where winning was mainly down to if i took some of the numerous chances i had.

my tactic was a 4-1-2-2-1 (DM, 2 MCs, AMR, AML, lone ST), but i changed this to a flat 4-4-2 for 07 as at the start i didn't have a big, quick and strong ST to play upfront (which i need for this tactic). i changed the instructions of the midfielders and strikers a little to adapt to the 4-4-2 and did ok with it. when you started this thread, i changed to the instructions for the RoT but didn't have good results at all like i was before i changed.

i then changed back to my 4-1-2-2-1 from 06 as i had smith and toni i could rotate upfront, and this bought me very good results in the 5 games i had remaining in the demo. i most quite easily, but i lost at home to sheff utd (although this might have been different if i changed to the 3-3-2-1-1 counterer when they scored). i did the target man testing with this 4-1-2-2-1 tactic, but the results weren't too conclusive. i'll have another go in the next few days i hope and test it over about 5 games twice.

i actually think my system is more like the 5x5, in terms that the 4 defenders and the DM are more defensive and the 2 MCs, the wingers and ST are more attacking. it still follows a RoT system to effect though, with a direct style of passing and quick tempo, with changes for the away tactic of course. when you get FM07 up and running where you are, i'll send you the tactics to have a look at, but it's working well in 07 so far.

crazy gra · October 26, 2006

also, i saw the hint about how time wasting is effective for running down the clock at the end of games (obviously), but is there another one on how it's not a good idea throughout most of the game, as someone has mentioned this before?

i did see a hint yesterday though, which i haven't seen anyone mention, that states that a slow tempo is more suited to a slow passing game and that a quicker tempo is best used with direct passing. i hope i've got that the right way round (it seems sensible), i might tweak my tactics a little to see if having the passing style and tempo on the same number of notches helps.

mr.rooney · October 26, 2006

Warning, this is a very long post!

I've created tactical templates for player instructions for anyone wishing to implement the ROT tactics. I have made templates for both the home and 4-2-3-1 away tactic. Simply copy these into your Sports Interactive > Data Tactics > Tactical Templates (open with notepad), copy these into it, and then in FM, go to the tactics screen and go to set to > and you'll be able to choose which one who want.

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The lone forward in the 4-2-3-1 has a free role because I wanted this player to be Wayne Rooney. You may wish to remove this, however.

Hope this helps.

FourThreeThree · October 26, 2006

I just feel in love with width and fast tempo but against a team that is attacking me.

wwfan · October 26, 2006

Originally posted by RedefiningForm:
Heh, rather surprised to see my brainchild of RoT still holding sway amongst many in these parts, I'd have expected it to die a long time ago with its early failures in '06.

I haven't read the thread in it's entirety, just some quick comments:

I approach tactics from an extremely logical and common point of view. I'd probably never do things like CA with a slow tempo or high time wasting, given that the entire premise of CA is to get the balls up the field as fast as possible without undue delay so as to capitalise on defenders getting caught out of position, etc.

Would just like to understand how stuff like creative freedom and closing down are connected, the way I understand CF is that it's almost entirely independent from all the other sliders. It's a bit obvious given the name, simply put a high CF would allow a player to disregard any other slider positions to a very large extent, and vice versa.

Other than that, it's a fantastic attempt at tactics building that avoids mere prescribing and forces people to look at the backbone behind tactics, wwfan deserves kudos.

RoT is probably the best tactic building framework out there and you deserve huge credit for such an inspirational idea. It didn't fail in '06, although you may never have had it working the way you wished. I built a series of tactics for '06 that were all RoT in structure, and each one ruled. In my opinion, RoT has transformed the logic of tactical design.

Originally posted by Stephanie McMahon's Secret Lover

For keepeing possesion I employ THREE strategies.

1) Short passing (as short as possible)

2) Slow Tempo (as slow as possible)

3) GK distribution set on defender collect.

That works, but in 06 I found the structured passing approach worked fine too, with circa 55-60% possession against bottom of the table sides. Slow tempo is a must though.

Originally posted by Brellier
1) Long Shots - not seen them mentioned, i assume you set on a player by player basis depending on his rating in this area? I have low for anyone with Long Shots stat under 15, medium id its over 15 and the player is FB,DMC or AML/R. Often if its over 15 and player is AMC, FC,ST. Is this too much do you think?

2) Set pieces. More i think about/play the game, more i see these as being key. How often are r/l matches decided by set pieces? often is the answer. I think a good set piece set up is vital for success and can make the difference betweem your tactic looking good or bad. I have some initial thoughts that im trying out, but interested to here others systems.

3)Symetry (sp!) - Anyone played around with non-symetrical formations? I created my 442 diamond based on RoT, and initial have it set up with Long FARROWS on wingers and short FARROWS on FB. reading the test with roma above, im a little put off. A thought popped into mind which was to set up one side as above, and the other with short FARROW for winger and no FARROW for FB. I cant visualise how this will work in practice, but willing to give it a try.

4) Matchups - On the "Focus Passing" setting, has anyone tryed focussing it entire to one flank? Im thinking where you start a match and you have a matchup down one side heavily in your favour (your AML has supperior stats to the AI team MR/DR). Might it be worth experiment with using this in short burst to confuse the AI. eg focus it down the left for 15 mins (possible add a SARROW to your left sided FC), then switch to the right?

5)Switch position - Anyone use this option at all? I guess the most popular would be to have an attacking FB and a winger who can tackle, and have them switch from time to time (possibly work with Riise and Aurelio at liverpool). Also wondered about using it on my wingers (ala Mourinho with Duff and Robben last year). To be honest tho, im not sure i trust the game engine to impliment this properly.

1) Pretty much how I would set things up

2) If you can design a set piece system that doesn't make use of a glitch in the Ai it would be very welcome.

3) I know that non-symetrical formations have worked in the past and there is no reason they shopuldn't in the future.

4) As for focussing down one flank, I usually switch to that if I have a player sent off, and sarrow one FC to a flank which I pass down. I remember going 2-1 down against Lazio with a player sent off from the penalty decision, switching to the one flank mode, and winning 7-2, so it can be very effective. Haven't tried it 11 on 11 though.

5) It does work, but you need the right players to make decent use of it. In 06 it was more of a nice touch than something useful, but if can hurt the AI by swapping tall and quick strikers.

@ mr.rooney That must have taken some time. Are things going well in the game?

@ crazy gra Interesting you are using a variation of the 5x5, as Asmo swears it doesn't work anymore. It may be worth releasing it in a specific thread for further testing.

Intaru Moondi · October 26, 2006

why have u used every awkward and annoying way to word this so the people who need lamens terms cannot understand it at all. this game is for everyone not just people who play it 24/7 some people want quick hints and guides to play on it after work or school etc, not go into full scale degree worded tactics, this guide is 2/10 for helpfulness,

El Padre · October 26, 2006

The guys not here to serve you, if you don't understand the guide (and it's a good guide) it isn't his fault.

FM isn't exactly a pick up and play game, it takes time to work out.

nic9394 · October 26, 2006

jus applied the new tweaks suggested by rashidi and wwfan above. seem to be rocking when playing at home now. jus gotta keep an eye on opponents formation and adjust all the arrows.

nic9394 · October 26, 2006

3-0 v barcelona at home, using man utd. had to keep dropping into sarrow forwards coz of some weird formation changes by AI. At the end of the day they had only 2 shots on goal. both misses

RedefiningForm · October 26, 2006

Originally posted by Intaru Moondi:
why have u used every awkward and annoying way to word this so the people who need lamens terms cannot understand it at all. this game is for everyone not just people who play it 24/7 some people want quick hints and guides to play on it after work or school etc, not go into full scale degree worded tactics, this guide is 2/10 for helpfulness,

I don't dispute the fact that tactics are hard, they're a part of a game that's a bitch to master. However, the most crucial thing of all, away from the detailed tactics is for you to know that most tactics are extremely logical. Just think of an ideal way you want your team to play, and set up sliders so as to ensure they complement that style of play and make sure slider instructions don't contradict each other.

Good luck

crazy gra · October 26, 2006

Originally posted by wwfan:
@ crazy gra Interesting you are using a variation of the 5x5, as Asmo swears it doesn't work anymore. It may be worth releasing it in a specific thread for further testing.

I'm not sure what system my tactic follows to be honest, but as i said you can take a look at it when you get set up. I'll continue to tweak it according to how 07 has changed, mainly due to the hints that i've seen in the game and report back.

Asmodeus · October 26, 2006

I think it depends on the discrepancies between each 5's mentality. I had quite a big difference in the two when I tried it originally, which is possibly why it didn't work.

Not sure of anything as yet, but am sticking with RoT for now.

Mighty Red · October 27, 2006

I just don't understand - after going 48-50 games without conceding more than 1 goal (averaging 0.4 against), all of a sudden my last 8 games include 4 1-1 draws, one 4-2 defeat, one 2-0 defeat, a 2-1 win and a 3-2 win.

Aaargh - my players must have got nervous about winning the title. Anyone have similar experience - I approached these games in my normal way (e.g appropriate home/away tactics, switching tactics according to score etc).

Benoit2 · October 27, 2006

Originally posted by Mighty Red:
Anyone have similar experience

When Terry was injured and not playing, my defense looked shaky and conceded goals. I lost 6-4 away to Dinamo Kiev in the first knockout stage of the CL. (won 4-1 at home, after two late goals after Lampard got sent off).

Kiev putting 6 past my Chelsea defence... if not for those four goals of ours and the fact we eventually won, I dont know how I would've taken it..

Asmodeus · October 27, 2006

Originally posted by Mighty Red:
I just don't understand - after going 48-50 games without conceding more than 1 goal (averaging 0.4 against), all of a sudden my last 8 games include 4 1-1 draws, one 4-2 defeat, one 2-0 defeat, a 2-1 win and a 3-2 win.

Aaargh - my players must have got nervous about winning the title. Anyone have similar experience - I approached these games in my normal way (e.g appropriate home/away tactics, switching tactics according to score etc).

Any large morale changes?

Don't react and stay positive with team talks- you can tell if your players are nervous in their "general happiness."

Mighty Red · October 27, 2006

Any large morale changes?

Only after the 4-2 defeat to Arsenal (FA Cup semi), everyone went from superb to Okay. I checked all their profiles for nervousness, but other than Luis Garcia reacting to Carra's "battle cry" - there wasn't anything. I don't think it helped that injuries to Alonso, Kewell and Onuoha for the last 3 months meant that my rotation policy got grounded. No-one was particularly unfit - but it meant I could rarely drop someone if their form was poor - led to complacency????

Asmodeus · October 27, 2006

Morale changes can have a really profound influence.

Keep plugging away. Concentrate on trying to get morale back up via team talks and media manipulation (praising players' form, confident pre-match statements etc). If you have any fringe players pushing for a place with high morale, perhaps draft them in.

With your previous defensive record it seems your tactics are strong, so if I would you I'd just focus on getting morale back up.

Pete S · October 27, 2006

This is the best fan post I have seen in any of the forums over the 10 years I have been playing CM/FM. It is particularly well researched and clearly written - thank you and well done!

I was already employing some of these ideas in a more limited way in FM06 but have now started to use your rule of 2 in FM07.

I have found the tactic to be highly effective but there are a few changes in FM07 (down to slider sensitivity I believe)that need to be considered. These are:

1. You need to amend the defensive line for each game based on the pace and attacking line of the opposition. This becomes particularly apparent after any 're-ranking' of your team's abilitytherwise you may find the opposition constantly beating your defence and getting into frequent one-on-one situations with your GK.

Therefore, it is important to listen to scout reports on the next opposition (in FM07 they provide advice on defending deep or using fast defenders) and use your eyes during the game, to determine how effective your defensive line is (just like in real football) and amend it accordingly. I found that amending my defensive line up or down the pitch when the opposition were controling the game and creating chances, allowed my team to get a foothold back in the game.

2. Timewasting. I have not had too much trouble sticking to the away tactic of 5/15 on the sliders for width/timewasting but you need to be careful not to employ these too early.Starting with a 10/10 slider approach may work better for some (not properly tested in my game yet).

3. Your approach to playing ultra-defensive systems still works well but again, you need to adjust the defensive sliders to counter the opposition's pace and line, as these vary from team to team. Sticking strictly to the ROT formula does not necessarily work for me otherwise.

Anyone else got any results on testing ROT in FM07 yet?

IV · October 27, 2006

One Team Instruction you don't mention anywhere is Offside Traps, wwfan. What's the Frameworks take on Offside Traps?

I'd guess that if the option is at all used, it's for tactics that play with low closing down but with a pushed up defensive line? The thinking here is that the lower closing down allows the back five to keep formation and therefore be less likely to break the trap, and the further up the pitch, the more time they have to catch up?

Oh, and definitely seconding Pete S's take on defensive line, although I've had some trouble with getting tight marking defenders to actually play deep (however, that might be because of mentalities, I didn't really test this as the defense was solid enough anyway).

nic9394 · October 27, 2006

reranking means allot, im almost in my third season and there's more and more matches that use or end up being the dreaded, flat 442, 33211 4141 or 4411. I've devised a tactic for these thanks to what wwfan mentioned in the initial post. and it does work. U cant "win" every match if u dont change the way u play. This is achieved by;

U-attack Long arrows ML/MR, Shrt arrows FBs

Attack: Long Arrows ML, MR

Possesssion: Short arrow ML/MR, Short barrow AMC

Defend: Sarrow FCs

Applying that helps allot depending on how much action the opposition is throwing at u down the flanks.

Mighty Red · October 27, 2006

Morale changes can have a really profound influence.

Looks like it!

Only 1 game to end of season now though - and winning the title (eventually) has boosted morale nicely.

Asmo - was it you or Rash that was interested in creating a 3 at the back tactic??? If you want, I can mail you mine to have a look at and, no doubt, improve on!

jonnycyclone · October 27, 2006

I have only read a few bits, but sounds good wwfan. I have implemented the use of team talks to good effect, and have been really impressed with ways of breaking down 3-3-2-1-1, twice winning 3-2 from being 2-0 down.

I'm usually a firm believer in Asmo's slider apathy theory which i'm tryong to implement at the moment, but will read the rest and may give the RoT a try out!

Asmodeus · October 27, 2006

Let me know how you go with that Jonny- I've given up on it already!

Super Bladesman · October 27, 2006

I've been avidly reading these more 'serious' threads for tips, and the advice given has really turned my season around, so thanks to everyone!

I got relegated in my first season with the Blades, which was shameful. I think part of the problem was the excitement at finally having the game and rushing through things a bit too much. I never really had much luck either... Though I came to realise that you make your own through the tactics you use!!

The problem I am having now though is I think in terms of possession and midfield control.

Following many of the threads and ideas on here - influenced by WWFan, Rashidi and Cleon, most I guess - was to play quite a direct, relatively fast tempo, wide game (so all the team sliders for those set to around 14-15, off the top of my head). Fairly attacking, and counter attack ticked. It's a 4-4-2 diamond with a DMC and AMC, and then MR/Ls short farrowed. The two strikers are side arrowed out to the wings. You could essentially work out my tactics from reading this thread and Rashidi's big one iirc.

What I've been finding is that I am ALWAYS trailing in possession - usually by 2% but often a bit more. I'm also getting decimated in midfield - I just get completely overrun, and I see some really nice one touch football where my team is completely bypassed in four passes; some lovely triangles there from the AI teams! I generally trail in the midfield %s by at least 26 to 20 ish. But the results were initially good, playing weaker sides in the Championship and winning either 2-1 or 3-1 (always!). But against better teams obviosuly they are capable of really making those %s work against me.

My solution was to drop the AMC back and have him as a farrowed MC, but this makes no difference. At the end of the day, I seem incapable of retaining possession, and certainly can't play the sort of football that Cleon mentioned he had the Blades playing...

Cleon said in one post though that he played quite direct, but then more recently that he played short - anyway, he has the Blades still in the Premiership and playing a lot better than me.

I've got into one of those ruts where I start completely dismantling the tactic, and forget why I set things up the way I did! I'd like advice on how to retain possession more within the vague style of play I've outlined, if someone could spare me the time. I have a good variety of players that should be able to make most systems work though...

nic9394 · October 27, 2006

any idea how to break down a 442 with short farrows on the ML/MR; whilst playing away? The way they play it is very aggressive and i ended up being forced into my own half getting a yellow card on every player almost. I tried the breaking down 33211 method, but lost the ball before i reach their half.

This was against west ham btw which are suprisingly good in the air (at the back).

mikiz · October 27, 2006

any idea how to break down a 442 with short farrows on the ML/MR; whilst playing away? The way they play it is very aggressive and i ended up being forced into my own half getting a yellow card on every player almost.

i experienced this against Spurs, and i used the narrow formation.

i generally used 4-5-1 with 5x5 method by wwfan, and away to a team that plays 4-4-2 with farrows i used the tactic which is narrow and counter attacking.

FourThreeThree · October 27, 2006

Some stuff before I leave for the wilderness.

Closing down. Close down high on teams that are defensive as most of thier players would be on the lower half on thier side of the pitch. As mensioned before this will force them to make long passes that are of lower quality. It is not neccessary to close down high on weaker teams. Closing down high on attacking teams playing wide and quick tempo is pointless, weak or strong. Bring down your central midfielder(more defensive positions or mentality) to control the axes center of passes. I also discover that when teams play wide they are also planning at attack.

On attacks, use low closing down on a high tempo, these two are meant for each other but make sure you are using this on teams that are attacking you. The low closing down will allow your players to recover from a heavy attack before it becomes too severe. It is good to leave quick and good dribbles on the receiving end.

I continuesly play with the closing down slide which controls one of my MC, wingers, AMC and FC in a 4-2-3-1 arrangement. I control it completely depending on how the opposition is playing against me. The effects are there.

It seems that closing down on areas where the opposition is passing the ball around naturally means our closing down settings are on the right track and not highly closing down on the wrong areas.

nic9394 · October 27, 2006

i dont know wot it is, but the 442 with short farrows on ML MR, played by west ham seems tough to break down when away.

I can deal with the Long farrow 442 easily. i assume they are playing very wide and focusing down flanks and crossing the ball before my fullbacks kick in to close them down; or something.

nic9394 · October 27, 2006

about the 442 with short farrows won ML MR. I notice they whip the ball near the box and create a box structure with the 2 MCs outside the area in front of goal waiting to pounce on anything.

mr.rooney · October 27, 2006

Originally posted by wwfan:
@ mr.rooney That must have taken some time. Are things going well in the game?

Things are really going well FM wise at the moment. Actually getting on my PC is an achievment these days, as my sister plays the Sims 2 for hours every day, doing the same things over and over again, and she has been doing so for the last year. How can that game be so addictive?

Really though, I've got what FM Britain call "FM Fatigue" - I'm bored at the moment. The sheer volume of what you've written makes sense to me and is very logical, but it's making a while for me to fully get my head around what you've written, the differences between home and away, what sort of tactics to employ and when etc.

When I do actually load up FM and start a game, I play about the first premiership game, get a boring goaless draw (or something similar) with very few chances, and I just quit the game. I don't know if I've not applied the theories correctly or something, because I'm just not getting the results that everyone else is getting.

It did take me a while, but I thought it would be useful for anyone who wanted to apply the theories of TT&F. These means that they don't have to fiddle with the sliders as much, or wonder whether or not they've got the slider in the right place.

In short, I'm not having a lot of fun with FM at the moment, not getting the results I should, don't know whether I'm implement the theories correctly or not, not quite getting my head around what you've written (which is very very good by the way), frustrated, and have got FM fatigue. I'm not sure what I can do to rekindle that spark again.

I think about trying to implement the tactics again, but then I'm not sure what tactics to implement and when I get the same old issue of not beating teams I shouldn't, I just switch off again.

Hope you enjoy FM 07 if and when you get a working PC.

mr.rooney · October 27, 2006

Originally posted by mr.rooney:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by wwfan:

@ mr.rooney That must have taken some time. Are things going well in the game?

Things are really going well FM wise at the moment. Actually getting on my PC is an achievment these days, as my sister plays the Sims 2 for hours every day, doing the same things over and over again, and she has been doing so for the last year. How can that game be so addictive?

Really though, I've got what FM Britain call "FM Fatigue" - I'm bored at the moment. The sheer volume of what you've written makes sense to me and is very logical, but it's making a while for me to fully get my head around what you've written, the differences between home and away, what sort of tactics to employ and when etc.

When I do actually load up FM and start a game, I play about the first premiership game, get a boring goaless draw (or something similar) with very few chances, and I just quit the game. I don't know if I've not applied the theories correctly or something, because I'm just not getting the results that everyone else is getting.

It did take me a while, but I thought it would be useful for anyone who wanted to apply the theories of TT&F. These means that they don't have to fiddle with the sliders as much, or wonder whether or not they've got the slider in the right place.

In short, I'm not having a lot of fun with FM at the moment, not getting the results I should, don't know whether I'm implement the theories correctly or not, not quite getting my head around what you've written (which is very very good by the way), frustrated, and have got FM fatigue. I'm not sure what I can do to rekindle that spark again.

I think about trying to implement the tactics again, but then I'm not sure what tactics to implement and when I get the same old issue of not beating teams I shouldn't, I just switch off again.

Hope you enjoy FM 07 if and when you get a working PC. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry, I meant to say not going well at the moment. Why can't I edit my posts anymore?

Azmodai · October 27, 2006

Very interesting read. I am going to try and adopt the principles mentioned here into my Barcelona Side for our Multiplayer game. I'll keep you guys posted on how it turns out etc.

Azmodai · October 27, 2006

oh and it'll be a 5-3-2 not a 4-4-2 variant

Rashidi · October 27, 2006

Originally posted by Azmodai:
oh and it'll be a 5-3-2 not a 4-4-2 variant

Are you related to Asmodeus?

ambi · October 27, 2006

Originally posted by FourThreeThree:
Some stuff before I leave for the wilderness.

Closing down. Close down high on teams that are defensive as most of thier players would be on the lower half on thier side of the pitch. As mensioned before this will force them to make long passes that are of lower quality. It is not neccessary to close down high on weaker teams. Closing down high on attacking teams playing wide and quick tempo is pointless, weak or strong. Bring down your central midfielder(more defensive positions or mentality) to control the axes center of passes. I also discover that when teams play wide they are also planning at attack.

On attacks, use low closing down on a high tempo, these two are meant for each other but make sure you are using this on teams that are attacking you. The low closing down will allow your players to recover from a heavy attack before it becomes too severe. It is good to leave quick and good dribbles on the receiving end.

I continuesly play with the closing down slide which controls one of my MC, wingers, AMC and FC in a 4-2-3-1 arrangement. I control it completely depending on how the opposition is playing against me. The effects are there.

It seems that closing down on areas where the opposition is passing the ball around naturally means our closing down settings are on the right track and not highly closing down on the wrong areas.

Concering this post I have a question for wwfan.

In FM 2006 I played a regular RoT 44-2 with Tottenham. After my team was reranked I faced the 3-3-2-1-1 a lot. I chnaged to a tactic with high CD in these games. My CD's played with a Cd of 17 my fullbacks with a CD of 15- as opposed to the 'normal' CD 3 for DC's and 5 for the fullbacks.

In FM2007 the players are downgraded statswise. Do you think this means I cannot use such a HQ set-up anymore? Should CD 10 for DC's and CD 12 for fullbacks be considered high closing down here? FOr example my newcastle defenders have average decision making stats of around 11-12.

crazy gra · October 28, 2006

Originally posted by mr.rooney:
Sorry, I meant to say not going well at the moment. Why can't I edit my posts anymore?

probably because people were changing too much in a post instead of just one word. i've not even tried to use it until yesterday when i found out that i couldn't, i thought it was just me though.

Kamitsukenu · October 28, 2006

Really though, I've got what FM Britain call "FM Fatigue" - I'm bored at the moment. The sheer volume of what you've written makes sense to me and is very logical, but it's making a while for me to fully get my head around what you've written, the differences between home and away, what sort of tactics to employ and when etc.
When I do actually load up FM and start a game, I play about the first premiership game, get a boring goaless draw (or something similar) with very few chances, and I just quit the game. I don't know if I've not applied the theories correctly or something, because I'm just not getting the results that everyone else is getting.

It did take me a while, but I thought it would be useful for anyone who wanted to apply the theories of TT&F. These means that they don't have to fiddle with the sliders as much, or wonder whether or not they've got the slider in the right place.

In short, I'm not having a lot of fun with FM at the moment, not getting the results I should, don't know whether I'm implement the theories correctly or not, not quite getting my head around what you've written (which is very very good by the way), frustrated, and have got FM fatigue. I'm not sure what I can do to rekindle that spark again.

I think about trying to implement the tactics again, but then I'm not sure what tactics to implement and when I get the same old issue of not beating teams I shouldn't, I just switch off again.

Hope you enjoy FM 07 if and when you get a working PC. Thumbs Up

I'm with Rooney on this, playing FM07, although I've just got it, I'm at the end of my first season in charge of Venezia, and having a really bad time of it (i'm 16th). It's a little irritating, as I'm just not 'getting' the game at the moment, even though I've read the whole of this topic.

LichR · October 28, 2006

Question for wwfan.

when you play 2 FCs, one small / one big combination, which one should be given the more attacking role? (FCa) and which one should be given the less attacking role? (FCd)?

AlexisManson · October 28, 2006

Big FC should be more defensive

drunkrob · October 28, 2006

Anyone else finding a low mentality with a high defensive line seems to work really well?

Oktober · October 28, 2006

Originally posted by Kamitsukenu:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Really though, I've got what FM Britain call "FM Fatigue" - I'm bored at the moment. The sheer volume of what you've written makes sense to me and is very logical, but it's making a while for me to fully get my head around what you've written, the differences between home and away, what sort of tactics to employ and when etc.

When I do actually load up FM and start a game, I play about the first premiership game, get a boring goaless draw (or something similar) with very few chances, and I just quit the game. I don't know if I've not applied the theories correctly or something, because I'm just not getting the results that everyone else is getting.

It did take me a while, but I thought it would be useful for anyone who wanted to apply the theories of TT&F. These means that they don't have to fiddle with the sliders as much, or wonder whether or not they've got the slider in the right place.

In short, I'm not having a lot of fun with FM at the moment, not getting the results I should, don't know whether I'm implement the theories correctly or not, not quite getting my head around what you've written (which is very very good by the way), frustrated, and have got FM fatigue. I'm not sure what I can do to rekindle that spark again.

I think about trying to implement the tactics again, but then I'm not sure what tactics to implement and when I get the same old issue of not beating teams I shouldn't, I just switch off again.

Hope you enjoy FM 07 if and when you get a working PC. Thumbs Up

I'm with Rooney on this, playing FM07, although I've just got it, I'm at the end of my first season in charge of Venezia, and having a really bad time of it (i'm 16th). It's a little irritating, as I'm just not 'getting' the game at the moment, even though I've read the whole of this topic.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I've been feeling the exact same way... I'm just not enjoying anything on the field at the moment. Making transfers, all the new scouting and the like are fun, but despite everything that I knew from the last one, and all the discussion on here, I'm quite often at a complete loss over what to do to change things. In 06, I barely ever drew games - I could literally go seasons at a time with only ever one draw, since I'd either take the lead and hold it well, come back from being down, or lose horribly. Now though, I'm drawing about 80% of my games with very low scores, and really struggling to get anything out of my team, and finding very little difference in the types of chances I'm creating whether I win 1-0 or get hammered 6-1.

If I remember right though, I think that before 6.03 came out I was very down on the game and having no fun at all, so hopefully the new patch will tweak something very simple and make things more logical and fun again. Until then though, I'm just at a loss...

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