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FM11.3 • • • MiNiMaL_FuSS Returns (Again) V0.4 || 4-4-2 • • •


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Hi Fuss,

Gonna give this a go. I've found the same thing with a few tactics on here, e.g. JP Woody's, Broms - is that they work really well for half a season or a season and then it all goes pear shaped. Only found this on 11.3. Used Lennons 5-2-3 set on 11.2 and that was fantastic.

Love playing a 442 - classic. So hope this works. Have you found longevity with this?

Couple of other quick points - only a couple of games in but How many goals do you get from corners? My guy keeps winning them but flicking them on to absolutely nobody.

Also, I assume you play home and away the same tactic?

Thanks.

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First few games look promising considering they need to blend and so on.

Last season I finished 4th with Cardiff, only second season in Prem using JP Woody's. I was loving it, the way the team played and everything. Really looking forward to this season, brought in 3 or 4 new players and it just all fell to pieces. No real explanation. And I'm not talking about just drawing games I should have been winning, I was conceding goals from everywhere getting honked 4-1 and the like at home! Unbelievably annoying.

I really am a plug-and-play merchant so I hope that this tactic can be used that way. I know you said you are a constant tweaker Fuss but I don't need something that will win 38 games out of 38. Just something that is reliable that I can build on year after year.

Still, so far so good, early doors and all that.

Edit: Ha! Well the good start just crashed and burned at Arsenal 5-1. And then Man U away, lost 2-0. Now, obviously these are tough games but in neither game did I manage a shot on target. In fact I only had 4 shots in total, two in each game. Despite having slightly more possession in both.

I'm not complaining, my squad cannot touch theirs - plus at the moment I'm playing with a squad that is not ideally fitted to the roles you've described. We'll see if I can get something going in January.

Third straight loss, away at Bolton 2-1.

Fourth straight loss, home to Everton 1-0. Ho-Hum.

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Interesting tactic. I tweaked a few things to fit my team and it seams to be working well. I'm going to give some feedback when I have played a few more games.

Hilarious though Donavon just scored a header while standing between Vidic and Ferdinand... Donvan has heading and jumping 6... LMAO.

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I'm sorry to hear your stuggling with the tactic TCS. I have the luxury in my current game of building my team around this tactic and even without world class players works extremely well, but you definetly need pace up front and I find having a quality attacking LB works miracles. Contraeo in my current team has been amazing in this role laying a goal on a game nearly. If your cardiff you might be able to ge Lucas Digne young good attacking fullback but does lack the defensive mind at times but the resst of your defence should cover his frailties.

Could never imagine palying this tactic Barça where do you play Messi?

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I'm sorry to hear your stuggling with the tactic TCS. I have the luxury in my current game of building my team around this tactic and even without world class players works extremely well, but you definetly need pace up front and I find having a quality attacking LB works miracles. Contraeo in my current team has been amazing in this role laying a goal on a game nearly. If your cardiff you might be able to ge Lucas Digne young good attacking fullback but does lack the defensive mind at times but the resst of your defence should cover his frailties.

Could never imagine palying this tactic Barça where do you play Messi?

I would play Messi at the STCr position, untick hold up ball and set him even more defensive so he will drop deeper then Villa who would be on the left and be the poacher.

Pedro on AMr and Iniesta or Afellay on AMl.

Then put Xavi into the MCr position and Mascherano or Busquets in the MCl spot.

The defense would be the only thing that would need some work in order to fit the role or the whole team setting needed to be reversed from left to right but I think it's easier to get a good defensive fullback for the right and use maxwell on the left as your offensive fullback.

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Working fine in my 2016 Barça.

In the AZ game i have 6 ccc,unlucky..

1305253571-clip-70kb.jpg

Thanks Fuss

Looking good early on! considering your team wont have the best match prep yet after a seaosn or so you should compete with my results!

Fuss didnt you say the season with 38 Wins is a tweaked version of the latest version mate? And if so, can you upload it please

I've answered this afew times - i made some slight tweaks to suit my players, I altered the SCR slightly and both fullbacks slightly, but thats what suit my needs. It's not difficult to match a tactic to your team....look at the LFB for an example - dont ahev the most attackign or speedy player there? Dial it back 2-3 notches. but you RFB is quite a good alrounder - dial him forward 2-3 notches. Easy.

Hi Fuss,

Gonna give this a go. I've found the same thing with a few tactics on here, e.g. JP Woody's, Broms - is that they work really well for half a season or a season and then it all goes pear shaped. Only found this on 11.3. Used Lennons 5-2-3 set on 11.2 and that was fantastic.

Love playing a 442 - classic. So hope this works. Have you found longevity with this?

Couple of other quick points - only a couple of games in but How many goals do you get from corners? My guy keeps winning them but flicking them on to absolutely nobody.

Also, I assume you play home and away the same tactic?

Thanks.

Likely more a cofidence issue after that thumpign by arsenal - I find the quick short passing teams with unusual formations toughest. But once you lose like that it gets really hard to get momentum back, you need to play more defensive and steal a couple of wins before going back really. Hopefully you get to the poitn where you never lose, and thus never lose momentum. I hope you gave your entire team individuals talks after that game and kicked their asses, I would have done!

Pitch size?

OI?

Match preparation?

Read the thread.

I would play Messi at the STCr position, untick hold up ball and set him even more defensive so he will drop deeper then Villa who would be on the left and be the poacher.

Pedro on AMr and Iniesta or Afellay on AMl.

Then put Xavi into the MCr position and Mascherano or Busquets in the MCl spot.

The defense would be the only thing that would need some work in order to fit the role or the whole team setting needed to be reversed from left to right but I think it's easier to get a good defensive fullback for the right and use maxwell on the left as your offensive fullback.

Interesting use of messi, my initial thought would be inside forward on the left - but he shoudl work quite nicely as the link man as you have him i guess.

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Interesting use of messi, my initial thought would be inside forward on the left - but he shoudl work quite nicely as the link man as you have him i guess.

Well I haven't tried it with Messi so far since I'm testing your tactic with my Man Utd. save where I can't buy players over 15 mio. € until the debt in 2017 is payed off as a self imposed transfer embargo.

But I'm playing Rooney with these settings and so far he has been ripping the league apart with 7 goals in 3 games and also a few assists. I play Chichrito as the poacher and the only player that I invested some money in is Sissoko and he is just perfect for that MCr role his "goes forward whenever possible" PPM is a real treat for that position.

Btw. while I'm writing this I'm leading 6:0 after thirty minutes against Tottenham at White Hart Lane. Seriously this tactic is insane. ^^

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Hi Fuss,

Gonna give this a go. I've found the same thing with a few tactics on here, e.g. JP Woody's, Broms - is that they work really well for half a season or a season and then it all goes pear shaped. Only found this on 11.3. Used Lennons 5-2-3 set on 11.2 and that was fantastic.

Love playing a 442 - classic. So hope this works. Have you found longevity with this?

Couple of other quick points - only a couple of games in but How many goals do you get from corners? My guy keeps winning them but flicking them on to absolutely nobody.

Also, I assume you play home and away the same tactic?

Thanks.

Try setting the stand on near post chap to attack near post! (goals will fly in)

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Hey Minimal Fuss as promised some feedback.

Well to say it short this tactic is totally amazing.

At least with a few tweaks and playing with Man Utd it is just insanely good.

League Table:

barclayspremierleaguein.jpg

Results:

manchesterunitedmanutdf.jpg

My Squad:

manchesterunitedsquad.jpg

Starting 11:

manchesterunitedstartin.jpg

Even though this is still a great squad it hasn't really improved since my first season but the football is 10x more enjoyable to watch and I score roughly double the amount of goals I scored the season before.

This is by far the most amazing tactic I enjoyed in FM11 so far awesome work Minimal_Fuss.

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Flohrinho can you put your tweaked tactic? looks pretty amazing

Well only if Minimal_Fuss is ok with it. The thing is I tried to fit the settings to the players of my team and unless you have the same players or similar players like me it might not really work all that well.

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Fuss - have you tried the tactic mirrored? i.e. because you had a better winger on the left, or your more attacking full back was on the right?

There's no reason it shouldn't work mirrored if you have a great FBR instead of a FBL - but make sure you mirror EVRYTHING, as the inside forward is set to be behind the poacher to fill the gap etc etc. Will take a little while, I dearly wish there was a tactic editor for this game that allowed you to open two tactics at once to compare them.

I tend to open the game on my comp and on my laptop, that way I can compare the tactics across two screens and get all the sliders exactly right, without constantly saving and flicking back.

Well only if Minimal_Fuss is ok with it. The thing is I tried to fit the settings to the players of my team and unless you have the same players or similar players like me it might not really work all that well.

Feel free mate, if you could list the details of your own tweaks it's always interesting too.

Also if you could drop me a pm with your email address I'd like you to have a look at my own current tweaks, trying to make it abit more universal.

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time for me to ask stupid questions (ah the irony), but how the hell do i get those?

EDIT:

Got it! Brilliant, thanks Dan, dont know how this passed me by!

Don't feel stupid I didn't know about it either so thanks Dan99 for making us look like idiots... no just kidding thanks for the info this will really help.

P.S. you got a PM Minimal_Fuss

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Alright since people asked me to put up my tweaks of Minimal_Fuss amazing tactic I will do it but let me say a few things first.

The Philosophy behind the changes:

This tactic is tweaked to fit the playstyle of Rooney and Chicharito and if you play any different setup of strikers it might not work. I consider a few PPMs to be vital for those positions as well, the left striker needs to have "comes deep to get the ball" so he drops down into an AMC position often enough to receive the ball. To make sure he gets the ball when he does that I did set him as a playmaker which in return means he also needs good passing, teamplay and other stats a creative playmaker usually needs. Even though Rooney isn't the very best in all those areas he is very well rounded striker and my settings for him reflect that. He has scored 12 goals and made 7 assists so far this season and the way he plays pretty much reflects the way he is playing at the moment in the real world for Manchester United.

Chicharito on the other hand is the classical poacher type of player for this type of player acceleration, pace, off the ball, composure and finishing are the most vital attributes and he should have "tries to beat off-side trap" as a PPM so he will be sitting on the shoulder of the defense and wait for Rooneys or Nanis through balls or Valencias and Evra crosses to poach a goal.

The central midfield consists mainly of Carrick and Sissoko while Sissoko has the PPM "Gets Forward Whenever Possible" I trained to "Stays Back At All Times" from the days when I mainly used him as the defensive midfielder in my last tactic. This way I have one player who is constantly going forward with every attack and one who sits deep and intercepts the ball as soon as we lose possession. Sissoko is also the only player in my squad to have a very good long range shot ability, well he and Pogba who I consider to be a even younger version of Sissoko, so they are the only players I allow to shoot from distance.

I also retrain Varane and Evans to be capable of playing as DR because you would want to have another CB in that position, preferably one that is quite fast. The DL I think goes without saying it's the Evra type of fullback fast, great stamina, good crossing who essentially runs down the left like a maniac and tries to exploit the space that appears on the left when Nani cuts inside.

At least the wingers. On the left I play the right footed Nani as an Inside forward, he has a great shot and still an eye for his team mates even though he will still get of some shots which want you make to scream "why didn't you pass god damn it" (just like the real Nani :p) he will probably produce the most amazing goals in the game, at least for me he does and he still gets a good amount of assists. And now to Valencia well where the AML should have the PPM "Cuts Inside" the AMR can benefit from PPMs like "Runs With Ball Down Right". He should be very fast so he can get past behind his opponents and have good crossing because that's what he will do run down the right, force a defender come out wide and then puts a killer cross into the middle where Chicharito, Rooney, Nani and even Sissoko will be waiting for it. He also has the most assists in my game so far.

And a list of the tweaks I did:

Team Instructions:

- Increased Tempo a notch but I don't think it had any major positive benefit I just like my team playing with the last notch of a normal tempo.

Strikers:

- Shifted the "Deep Lying Forward" to the left (reason for that is the fact that Carrick plays behind him and is usually sitting very deep so here is the best space for a forward to come deep in order to get the ball, it also provides the Inside Forward with the possibility to dart into the space that appears when Rooney drops deep.)

- I also set his mentality a bit lower in order to get him to be more involved in the build up paly (note: in addition I use this player as my playmaker so the other players will pass the ball to him more often when he comes deep thus letting the defender close in on him more frequently which opens up space in the defensive line)

- The "Poacher" role got shifted to the right. (He is also set to be the target man so Rooney will try to play a through ball to him most of the time)

- I lowered the "Poachers" creative freedom a bit so he will go straight for goal and not get distracted.

- I also set his runs from deep and runs with ball settings to sometimes. (since I felt his movement was somehow better this way which is a completely subjective feeling though.)

Wingers:

- Changed the Crossing of the AMR from "mixed" to "center". (Since the poacher changed form the left to the right striker position I felt it necessary to bring the crosses closer to him instead of going wide to Nani instead)

Midfield:

- Only changed the closing down of my MCl to be in line with my defenders. (I did this in hopes to avoid both midfielders getting dragged up the pitch and leaving to much space between midfield and defense for an AMC to exploit)

Defenders:

- Changed the closing down of the DR to be more in line with the stopper of the CBs.

- Changed the crossing of the DL form "mixed" to "far post" (same reason like with the AMR crossing change I try to get them to put as many crosses as possible into the reach of my poacher)

So with that being said here is the tweak.

Download

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OMFG this is complete insanity.

After 5 minutes when Vidic got injured and Rooney send of I thought "Just awesome now I have to make my first sub within the first 5 minutes of the game and Rooney got send of, just dandy." but I couldn't believe my eyes what I saw happening after that.

But look for yourself what happened. ;P

manutdvarsenalinformati.th.jpg

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Who was the targetman and the playmaker?

The left stirker is the playmaker and the right striker is the targetman.

But read the my post above in order to understand what players to use in order to get the tactic to work.

And before you ask miranda I don't use OIs, pitch size is "average" and match prep is "none".

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ARGGHHH unbeaten in my season thus far. Have 30 shots, 15 shots on target, and 0-0 draw against a terrible villa side. So unfair played well plenty of good chance the goalie was just insane played 2-4-4 for last 30 mins dominated just couldnt get it in the net :(

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ARGGHHH unbeaten in my season thus far. Have 30 shots, 15 shots on target, and 0-0 draw against a terrible villa side. So unfair played well plenty of good chance the goalie was just insane played 2-4-4 for last 30 mins dominated just couldnt get it in the net :(

A 0-0 draw means you're still unbeaten :confused:

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Minimal_Fuss............Just used your tweaked version and it worked an absolute treat........thanks alot mate

englishpremierdivisioni.png

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Ontop on winning the league and scoring for fun, i also won everything else.............Community Shield, Super Cup, Club World Championship, League Cup, FA Cup and Champions League

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The left stirker is the playmaker and the right striker is the targetman.

But read the my post above in order to understand what players to use in order to get the tactic to work.

And before you ask miranda I don't use OIs, pitch size is "average" and match prep is "none".

Hi Flohrinho, was wondering what you do for team talks and what your workload is setup as??

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what about matchpreperatiion and oi´s???? please someone??

I don't think anyone uses OI's anymore at least I haven't in FM11 the problem with them imo is that they tend to destroy the defensive shape of tactics. The only thing I consider is using hard tacklings on players where my ass. man. recommends doing so.

Match preparation is imo pretty much useless at least I have never had any noticable effect from it when I used defending corners for example it didn't stop my team from conceding 75% of the goals scored against them from corners though. I useually set it to team blend in the hope it will improve my team play and leave it at average workload once my tactics are fluid and that's about it. So far I have to see conclusive prove that setting your match prep to anything else actually has any effect at all.

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I don't think anyone uses OI's anymore at least I haven't in FM11 the problem with them imo is that they tend to destroy the defensive shape of tactics. The only thing I consider is using hard tacklings on players where my ass. man. recommends doing so.

Match preparation is imo pretty much useless at least I have never had any noticable effect from it when I used defending corners for example it didn't stop my team from conceding 75% of the goals scored against them from corners though. I useually set it to team blend in the hope it will improve my team play and leave it at average workload once my tactics are fluid and that's about it. So far I have to see conclusive prove that setting your match prep to anything else actually has any effect at all.

Okey.. thank you for your help =)

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I don't think anyone uses OI's anymore at least I haven't in FM11 the problem with them imo is that they tend to destroy the defensive shape of tactics. The only thing I consider is using hard tacklings on players where my ass. man. recommends doing so.

Match preparation is imo pretty much useless at least I have never had any noticable effect from it when I used defending corners for example it didn't stop my team from conceding 75% of the goals scored against them from corners though. I useually set it to team blend in the hope it will improve my team play and leave it at average workload once my tactics are fluid and that's about it. So far I have to see conclusive prove that setting your match prep to anything else actually has any effect at all.

I agree on OI's, I find it tends to ruin your tactic, if you've setup your players to close down and tackle how you want...then why change it. I will occasionally use them at half time if a particualr player if giving us alot of problem.

Training and match have been covered.

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On the whole it seems anyone with a big enough team to invest in the correct type of players becomes unbeatable with this tactic - I said from the beginning that this isn't a small team tactic and it seems I was right.

Although in fairness if you're a small tema that invests correctly (ala Norwich), then you can be world beaters pretty easily.

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On the whole it seems anyone with a big enough team to invest in the correct type of players becomes unbeatable with this tactic - I said from the beginning that this isn't a small team tactic and it seems I was right.

Although in fairness if you're a small tema that invests correctly (ala Norwich), then you can be world beaters pretty easily.

That's true for pretty much any tactic since the quality of your team pretty much determines how well your team will do over a season. The thing is Chicharito had a blast of a season for me with this tactic scoring almost 70 goals in all competitions in 53 matches or so but he is an absolute goal machine with finishing, composure, off the ball, acceleration and pace all above 17. Even though the tactic managed to create enough space for him to exploit it would have been useless if the lad wouldn't have been such a goal machine.

I know in FM10 it was pretty much possible to take Mr. Houghs total domination with a mid table team and win the PL by some distance without having to make any investments in your squad. In FM11 I haven't come across a tactic like this yet which is imo down to the fact that tactics have lost some significance towards the outcome of a game.

@Corky I don't know if it works I have made it into a 4-4-2 with flat midfield 4 by just pulling the wingers back and changing overall mentality to normal so I had a tactic to see out games but I guess you could also make a 4-2-3-1 out of it by pulling your deep lying striker back into AMC. But if you want to take a look at a 4-2-3-1 you might want to try my tweak of the SpecialOne 2.0 tactic which I now use in addition to the two Minimal_Fuss tweaks because I got offered Pastore in my third season for 34 mio. € and got him for 30 in the end, so I needed a good tactic with an AMC and so far he has been amazing with this tweak and Chicharito is even scoring more goals then before, so far he has scored 18 goals in 9 games for me this season.

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I think your being a bit harsh with regards to the effect this tactic has Florinho. Hernandez is a player of great quality but if you didn't utilise him correctly he wouldn't score the insane amount of goals he has. This formation works with specific players and hernandez is perfect for that role, but at lower leagues you could find a hernandez equivalent and still gain good results. If you choose the tactic your going to naturally look for players whom work within it. I agree that there is less emphasis on tactics in these latests itterations of the game but that does not detract from the quality of the tactic.

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I think your being a bit harsh with regards to the effect this tactic has Florinho. Hernandez is a player of great quality but if you didn't utilise him correctly he wouldn't score the insane amount of goals he has. This formation works with specific players and hernandez is perfect for that role, but at lower leagues you could find a hernandez equivalent and still gain good results. If you choose the tactic your going to naturally look for players whom work within it. I agree that there is less emphasis on tactics in these latests itterations of the game but that does not detract from the quality of the tactic.

Hey Craglyboy I think you misunderstood me I'm not slating the tactic in fact it's quite brilliant but only if the players fit those roles. The thing is I have tested quite a lot of tactics with my tactics test save game and non of the tactics could really convince me that they would decide a game on their own. But if you have the right players for this tactic it's absolutely brilliant if you do a good man management job and keep your players fresh. The thing is if you don't have a strong team your chances are bad no matter what tactic you use, if your teams moral is bad and your strikers lack confidence no tactic in the world will make them score.

This is imo the main reason why we so often see players struggling with tactics that give other tremendous success while it was different a year ago where practically everyone had massive success with Mr. Houghs total domination for example a success he has failed to achieve this year which is imo down to the fact that tactics have a much smaller impact on the outcome of a game then it used to have in FM10.

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