Implementing Tactics for FM09: The Final Version...

[footynut]

Game 35: Scunthrope - MKD. Slight underdogs on a narrow rainy pitch. Irretating but these are the circumstances so the Athletico(6) tactic and we will see how it goes from there. Scunthope are sitting in 2nd position in the league, so this will be tough. "We can win this", of course we can...

1-0 (2min),

2-0 (5min),

3-0 (9min), was changing to the Athletico(11) when they scored the third.

4-0 (20min),

4-1 (40min),

4-2 (45+2min),

Half time 4-2: Really "disappointed". I am selling some players due to the January transfer window and don't know if they are 'shaken'. My captain in defense is also out as a few other first choices, but we are still in control even though the score line isn't. Let's get on with it.

4-3 (76min), and then I went for the England'66 to try to grab that equaliser.

5-3 (86min), was pushing forward but got caught out.

Match Stats:http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/7404/game35su.jpg

Analysis: "Sympathise", I don't know what went wrong the first 20 minutes. Maybe the motivation factor was wrong and should have said "for the fans" instead of "we can win", not sure though. It was a top match so there might be some form of rivalry aspect in it. Hampered with some key players out injured and we had the game appart from the horrible start. I think also the keeper is showing signs of weaknesses, and I have other options.

Verdict: "We are only human after all"

Looking at the stats you conceded a lot of crosses in this game. Did any of the goals you conceded come from crosses?

[Loversleaper]

Looking at the stats you conceded a lot of crosses in this game. Did any of the goals you conceded come from crosses?

I'm not convinced that this is the case, here's why:

#1: a lot of goals come from lack of concentration. The one reason being that they are not quite settled in the club and tactics. It is only recently they starting blending in well together. The left back is Portuguese, the center back is a French guy next to my captain Hanlon (only english guy I have) and the right back is French as well. None of them speak English yet. They are also very young (maybe too young), defenders are more stable in the ages between 28-32.

#2: I have changed the Keeper at least 3 times. I started with a Spanish guy in goal and it went so so. I bought a young Hollander that had visually better stats, but he really flopped. I went back to the Spanish keeper (with worse stats) until the January transfer window and now I have just bought a very exciting young French keeper with very good stats, he just hasn't settled yet (of course), he's not match fit and down't speak the language.

#3: in the mentioned match I think it was also a motivation issue. I think my pre-match team talk made my team very nervous. I used "we can win this", but because it was a top league match I think there was more of a rivalry aspect in the game. I wish I had tried "for the fans", as this talk usually wont put pressure on the players (especially in a top match). Can't be sure about this, call it a hunch.

#4: my captain in defense was out injured plus another player or two that are regulars. I had now a full defense (and keeper) that couldn't speak the native language and the two center backs were left-footed. It was not clear cut chances they were getting at this point (first 20 mins), they hit a couple of long range as far as I can remember plus a couple of lapses in concentration from defenders.

I generally have the best defensive stats in the league but it requires that the defense is 'moulded' and have the right stats, age and experience. If it was the case that these tactics are vunerable from crosses I think I would have lost a lot more. I have the full backs running with ball and crossing from byline sometimes and I do admit that you can get caught out at times, but there are risks and rewards that a Gamer also has to take into consideration. It takes time to build up a good defense as illustrated below:

League Table:http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/5927/watfordleaguetable.jpg

[Loversleaper]

I think it is an interresting observation you have brought forth, Footynut, so I've just been looking more into the issue. I think it might be combination of things that might allow my opponent to get more crosses in at the present time. First I noticed that my jumping and heading stats are not that good on a team average, the next thing could also be that my Keeper is not very good in the air and low command of area stats. And the communication issue in defense might also contribute to this. I looked at other games to notice if any patterns emerged, but I think that when things are right you wont allow your opposition that much space.

[footynut]

I'm not convinced that this is the case, here's why:

#1: a lot of goals come from lack of concentration. The one reason being that they are not quite settled in the club and tactics. It is only recently they starting blending in well together. The left back is Portuguese, the center back is a French guy next to my captain Hanlon (only english guy I have) and the right back is French as well. None of them speak English yet. They are also very young (maybe too young), defenders are more stable in the ages between 28-32.

#2: I have changed the Keeper at least 3 times. I started with a Spanish guy in goal and it went so so. I bought a young Hollander that had visually better stats, but he really flopped. I went back to the Spanish keeper (with worse stats) until the January transfer window and now I have just bought a very exciting young French keeper with very good stats, he just hasn't settled yet (of course), he's not match fit and down't speak the language.

#3: in the mentioned match I think it was also a motivation issue. I think my pre-match team talk made my team very nervous. I used "we can win this", but because it was a top league match I think there was more of a rivalry aspect in the game. I wish I had tried "for the fans", as this talk usually wont put pressure on the players (especially in a top match). Can't be sure about this, call it a hunch.

#4: my captain in defense was out injured plus another player or two that are regulars. I had now a full defense (and keeper) that couldn't speak the native language and the two center backs were left-footed. It was not clear cut chances they were getting at this point (first 20 mins), they hit a couple of long range as far as I can remember plus a couple of lapses in concentration from defenders.

I generally have the best defensive stats in the league but it requires that the defense is 'moulded' and have the right stats, age and experience. If it was the case that these tactics are vunerable from crosses I think I would have lost a lot more. I have the full backs running with ball and crossing from byline sometimes and I do admit that you can get caught out at times, but there are risks and rewards that a Gamer also has to take into consideration. It takes time to build up a good defense as illustrated below:

League Table:http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/5927/watfordleaguetable.jpg

I wasn’t questioning your tactic, just pointing out something I noticed and wondered if that may have had anything to do with the loss. If the opposition had a strong aerial threat and were having good success with getting crosses into the box, it might have been the cause of conceding some of the goals. I didn’t see the game but 35% completed crosses for the opposition is quite high and would have been something that concerned me.

It’s interesting that you say your squad have only recently started blending as I have nine new signings going in to my first season in the Premiership and after four games I’m getting the message that they have started blending well together. There must be other factors involved that sometimes increase the time it takes to blend, maybe player personality?

If the odds were close, which I expect they were, I would most probably have used the same pre match team talk as you did “We can win this” but like you said maybe there was a bit of rivalry and “For the fans” would been better. It’s so difficult to get it right all the time isn’t it?

You were a bit unfortunate with your captain and two other regulars missing but the two left footed centre backs shouldn’t have been that much of a problem although it is nice to have one left and one right footer there.

An enjoyable read anyway, keep it coming

[footynut]

I think it is an interresting observation you have brought forth, Footynut, so I've just been looking more into the issue. I think it might be combination of things that might allow my opponent to get more crosses in at the present time. First I noticed that my jumping and heading stats are not that good on a team average, the next thing could also be that my Keeper is not very good in the air and low command of area stats. And the communication issue in defense might also contribute to this. I looked at other games to notice if any patterns emerged, but I think that when things are right you wont allow your opposition that much space.

I played a recent game where the opposition had a giant of a centre forward and two wingers that had great crossing stats so I used the OI to mark them tightly and close down always which restricted the amount of successful crosses they had.

Mind you, saying that I still lost the game 4-3

[Loversleaper]

I played a recent game where the opposition had a giant of a centre forward and two wingers that had great crossing stats so I used the OI to mark them tightly and close down always which restricted the amount of successful crosses they had.

Mind you, saying that I still lost the game 4-3

I never use OI, just can't myself around to it. When I did test them out I personally thought that they have a lot of flip side alternatives, so it was one or the other kind of thing. I think the global settings and the emphasis on the team moving in a more strategic manner should be enough to have a great defense. It is of course up to the User but my experience is that it is not all that nessessary.

When your team 'gelled' quickly was your reputation continental or world class? I just have noticed during the course of the game that manager reputation effects the time it takes for players to gell, of course there are other things like player adaptbility and what nation they come from. It took 29 games for me with a low reputation and over 30 foreign signings to just blend in well together. If my reputation was world class then it would have taken about 15 games. I am guessing that your players adaptbility stats were very high...

[footynut]

I never use OI, just can't myself around to it. When I did test them out I personally thought that they have a lot of flip side alternatives, so it was one or the other kind of thing. I think the global settings and the emphasis on the team moving in a more strategic manner should be enough to have a great defense. It is of course up to the User but my experience is that it is not all that nessessary.

When your team 'gelled' quickly was your reputation continental or world class? I just have noticed during the course of the game that manager reputation effects the time it takes for players to gell, of course there are other things like player adaptbility and what nation they come from. It took 29 games for me with a low reputation and over 30 foreign signings to just blend in well together. If my reputation was world class then it would have taken about 15 games. I am guessing that your players adaptbility stats were very high...

I understand what you’re saying about OI and I think you’ve already proved that it’s not essential to use them, but I’m not sure and I think by using them it’s a safe way to make sure that specific threats are not missed.

My reputation is “National” so I’m not quite sure why the team is blending well so early. I thought it would be more of a problem when I signed, actually come to think of it, ten new players with five or six going straight in to the first team! Maybe I got lucky and like you said the players I signed had high adaptability stats.

[Loversleaper]

Game 41: MKD - Tranmere. Slight home favorites in nice dry weather. Tranmere are an okay team so I think the Argentina tactic is good choice. I probably need to be ready to change up to the SirAlex tactic if I feel that I am not producing enough. "We can win this".

0-1 (30min), changed to SirAlex tactic.

1-1 (40min),

Half time 1-1: "Disapointing", we are not in front.

Match Stats:http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/4398/game41tm.jpg

Analysis: "Sympathise", we should have won it I think. It is a case that I have to carry on using High Pressure tactics to break down opponents on home ground. I knew as soon as they scored. Tactical blunder from my side, but had enough chances to win it.

Verdict: "Don't hold back at home"

Game 42: Wallsaw - MKD. Slight favorites here on a short rainy pitch. I have been noticing that I have to be more daring in my tactical behavior, so I was going to use the Athletico(11) tactic but I wanted to see if I could go more wide. Wide offers a little more action so I'll see if my team can cope with the Benitez tactic. "We can win this".

Half time 0-0: "We can win this", don't give up...

0-1 (55min), changed to the Athletico(6) tactic.

0-2 (75min), changed to the defensive full backs.

Match Stats:http://img30.imageshack.us/img30/815/game42ws.jpg

Analysis: Couldn't help myself going more defensive when I went in front. Worked out well with the Benitez tactic and think it is not the last time I used this tactic. But on the otherside it was a drastic game for me, lost my captain Center Back for 6-7 weeks plus 2 other of my best players. A few knocks as well leaves me now with 5 regulars out for the next 2-4 weeks at least. "Well done" for the victory.

Verdict: "Good I brought in some free loans to fill the gaps"

Game 43: Hereford - MKD: Huge favorites on a dry short pitch. Hereford are dead last now and out of form. I will use the most attacking away formation so far: the Claudio tactic. Mentality(13) so we should be going more forward than backwards. "For the fans", nice and easy we're huge favorites.

0-1 (19min),

Half time 0-1: "Encourage", we are in control so let's get one more.

0-2 (58min), changed to the Italy tactic.

Match Stats:http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/4967/game43hf.jpg

Analysis: "Well done", we came here for the win and we got it. No complaints, we're handling more advanced settings and players are performing even though we are happered with injuries.

Vedict: "Is my team really Master class for this league?"

Game 44: Millwall - MKD (JP Trophy South Final leg 2). Slight underdogs on a short dry pitch. I was quite nervous before this game as I have those mentioned injuries. I know they are going to try and storm me because they are down by two. I will have to use the Athletico(6) tactic and see if I could hold them back, soak up their attacks and counter them. "Warned against complancy", didn't have many choices that made sense so I stuck with this one.

1-0 (13min),

2-0 (45+1min),

Half time 2-0: The aggregate score is equal. We were doing statistically better than them but something had to happen now. Changed to the Italy tactic to see if a 50-50 appoach couldn't win the game for me.

2-1 (65min), stuck with the tactic due to Millwall's difficulty dealing with my team.

(79min) changed to the defensive fullback settings.

Match Stats:http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/9530/game44mw.jpg

Analysis: Tactically we were more or less spot on. It is pyschologically difficult to play too daring when you want to protect a 2-0 advantage from the first leg. When I changed to the Italy tactic we pretty much controlled the rest of the game. "Good result", because funnily enough we were slight underdogs in both of these matches, 3-2 aggregate. Going to meet Oldham in the absolute JP Trophy final and I have already hammered them in the league.

Verdict: "The operation was a success, but in this case the patient died"

Game 45: MKD - Cheltenham. Clear home favorites and did you guess that it was showering? Well it is, so MilanHighPress tactic. "I expect a win", they are one of the struggling sides in the league.

1-0 (22min),

2-0 (27min),

Half time 2-0: I didn't think we were that enthusiastic in our performance. Wanted to see the effects of not saying anything.

3-0 (73min),

3-1 (79min),

Match Stats:http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/5493/game45ct.jpg

Analysis: We were playing result orientated football so "well done" for the result.

Verdict: "Some of the second string are getting better"

[Loversleaper]

Game 46: Carlisle - MKD. Slight underdogs on a rainy long pitch. Carlisle are not doing too bad in the league but I hammered them last we met. I think the Athletico(11) tactic is pefect for the match. "We can win this".

0-1 (44min),

Halftime 0-1: "Encourage", we can easily get one more and that is why I am not going to change down to the Athletico(6) tactic just yet.

1-1 (53min),

1-2 (81min), changed to the Athletico(6) tactic and implemented the defensive fullback settings.

Match Stats:http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/5368/game46cl.jpg

Analysis: I was a little worried when they scored and was wondering if I should have switched down when they did but felt we were in overall control of the situation. No doubt in my mind to close shop when we hit the second, "well done" for the victory.

Verdict: "Patience sometimes works out"

Game 47: MKD - Oldham. Comfortable home favorites in dry weather. I want to teach Oldham a lesson before we meet in the JP Final so I will unlease SirAlex tactic on them. "I expect a win", got to show them our strength.

1-0 (7min),

2-0 (29min),

Half time 2-0: "Pleased", there was basically one team on the pitch.

Match Stats:http://img179.imageshack.us/img179/693/game47oa.jpg

Analysis: The opposition were only really firing wild shots after the 60th minute. Never felt threatened so "well done".

Verdict: "I can beat this team in the final"

Game 48: Brighton - MKD. Slight underdogs on a wet short pitch. Brighton are in form right now and I have some irretating injuries to key players. The situation will clear up soon. I am getting a good idea which players are really injury prone, as it is generally the same players out most of the time (no wonder their clubs sold them cheap... like I am going to have to do soon). I'll start out more defensive with Athletico(6) this time due to circumstances and see where to go from there. "We can win this".

1-0 (20min),

1-1 (23min),

Half time 1-1: "We can still win this", I was already contemplating my next move but luckily we scored soon after them. I don't know if I want to go more attacking as the case is I have three new players in the back line. I think it is too risky.

Match Stats:http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/6074/game48ba.jpg

Analysis: A real boring game. I stuck back and Brighton wasn't really going for it, it was if we were both satisfied with the result so nothing happened. If it were a tight titel race and I needed the win I would have gone for it regardless. These are the decisiones we make, I am far in front so no need to chance it. "Sympathise" for the sake of team moral.

Verdict: "I might be a little too tactical"

Game 49: MKD - Peterborough. Comfortable home favorites and it is time to bring out the umbrella, it's going to pour. The MilanHighPress tactic, Peterborough are in 18th place out of 24 so they are far down enough in the league that I can "expect a win".

1-0 (20min),

2-0 (25min),

Half time 2-0: "Pleased", it was only MKD on the field so far.

3-0 (64min), changed to the MilanNormal tactic and implemented the defensive fullbacks settings to see if I could stop a late comeback.

3-1 (71min),

Match Stats:http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/8089/game49pu.jpg

Analysis: I tried to stop the late comeback but the tactical decision effected the Match Stats in a negative way. Untill the the tactical change the opposition had 3 or 4 shots at goal and we had 56%possession. The changed didn't help the cause at all, so food for thought for the future.

Verdict: "Attack sometimes is the best defense"

Game 50: Stockport - MKD. I was slight favorites on a breezy (dry) pitch with no indications on what pitch size it was, so of course it is a normal sized pitch. I've decided on the Italy tactic, "we can win this".

Half time 0-0: I though that "we can win this" but some of the players were under-par so they had to be notified that I was "disappointed" with them.

Match Stats:http://img141.imageshack.us/img141/3076/game50sc.jpg

Analysis: We should have won so I was "sypathising" with them. Again if I were in a close title race I would consider going more attacking, maybe wait untill around the 60th minute but remember to look closely at what is going on in the match.

Verdict: "Only 9 more games to go"

[qadsawee79]

Hi LL ... I am really a big fan of your work .... I have a question for you ... I use the 442 pack with my chelsea team ... and I try to follow your match strategy hints i am doing fine but my only concern is that neither Drogba or Anelka get to score (btw i tried the instructions you gave at the op on how to setup a strong striker and a regular striker) but it seems to me that is not working and also i didn't buy any new players so no reason to be afraid of team gelling ... is there any way to improve my strikers contribution to the game ?? shall i tick the target man box ?? and thanks in advance

[Loversleaper]

Hi LL ... I am really a big fan of your work .... I have a question for you ... I use the 442 pack with my chelsea team ... and I try to follow your match strategy hints i am doing fine but my only concern is that neither Drogba or Anelka get to score (btw i tried the instructions you gave at the op on how to setup a strong striker and a regular striker) but it seems to me that is not working and also i didn't buy any new players so no reason to be afraid of team gelling ... is there any way to improve my strikers contribution to the game ?? shall i tick the target man box ?? and thanks in advance

I would have Drogba on the right and Anelka on the left. I wouldn't change the free role or the run with ball setting for Anelka though. You have to hang those two in the press if they do not score regularily, if Drogba is a key player then you should expect a performance from him in most matches. After the last 9 games I will show how my team generally did though the season and we can take a look at the strikers. They should score at least 20 a peice (the ones you have). Chelsea usually play differently than the 4-4-2 so maybe they might have to get used to it, but I would try it for a while and see how it goes. Remember as Chelsea you are going to have to play more offensively than how I played with MKD. High Pressure at home, but you have one of those teams that can handle the settings in the Arsene tactic so I would definatly consider this if the weather allows it. The Claudio tactic mostly away from home as large favorites, or the Benitez/Italy tactics as slight favorites. Use the Athletico(6) for really difficult away games were you won the first leg against another giant, otherwise the Capello tactic for your slight underdog away tactic. Good luck...

[Loversleaper]

Observations: We are getting to a point in the tournement where teams are playing much more tactically. I am pretty much in the Master area regarding what type of manager I am at the moment and which type of tactics I can implement. If this were a tight title race you are going to have to go for it and play the Claudio tactic away from home where you need the win, as mentioned it sometimes is good to wait untill the 60th minute before you do so. There is always a risk/reward element when you are deciding how much you should be attacking or defending, but usually if you have the right type of players for these circumstances (determination is key) then you should do better than worse. Of course you need to have the ability to change and make tweaks and take a little time in the match itself because there can be little things that turn things into your advantage and every point counts in a title race.

Fixture Part 3:http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/9663/fixturepart3.jpg NB! missing fixtures will appear in part 4.

League table 38 rounds:http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/776/leaguetableround38mkd.jpg

[emphyrio]

Congratulations on a really excellent series of posts and detailed range of tactics.

As someone new to FM09 (although I played 07 extensively), just a few questions:

Your model suggests changing tactics quite frequently between and even within matches. Does this have an impact on the team gelling? In previous versions of the game I've found that chopping and changing tactics doesn't work very well. Is it better to use related tactics, e.g. all 4-4-2s, if you using several tactics across a season?

I notice as well that you use free roles very frequently. Can you get away with this when you are playing with lower league teams (I usually start in Serie C1/A)?

KUTGW!

[Loversleaper]

Congratulations on a really excellent series of posts and detailed range of tactics.

As someone new to FM09 (although I played 07 extensively), just a few questions:

Your model suggests changing tactics quite frequently between and even within matches. Does this have an impact on the team gelling? In previous versions of the game I've found that chopping and changing tactics doesn't work very well. Is it better to use related tactics, e.g. all 4-4-2s, if you using several tactics across a season?

I notice as well that you use free roles very frequently. Can you get away with this when you are playing with lower league teams (I usually start in Serie C1/A)?

KUTGW!

Of course you have noticed in the game intself in the tactic section that it has a default attacking, normal and a defensive tactic for every tactical formation. I am basically following those three ideologies and was hoping that Gamers can get an idea which type of tactic will work for given situations. It is not so much about changing, but more for what reason you need to change. If you over-commit yourself with mentalities and closing down & defensive line settings then you will suffer resultwise, and this thread was meant to show Gamers which type of mentality (attacking, normal or defensive) can work for a given situation.

You are not really changing tactics, they are still all 4-4-2 formation. If you changed from a 4-4-2 to a 4-3-3 then you might experience some difficulties, but I don't think the side effects will be too hard to deal with as long as you know what you are doing Mentality-wise. Haven't you ever notice your opponent change their style of play, for example when you see the text "he is in no hurry" in a set-piece situation or see them rushing to get the ball back in play? The AI is also changing strategies, so if they can we can.

Serie C in Italy is not much different then the Coca-Cola league one in England. With the exception of one match I have used the forward with the free role and the strong stiker that holds up on ball combination in all the matches. I can't see anything wrong so far with the players handling these settings, they are playing quite well. I think this strike force combination is one of the better ones in the game so I stick with it, I might have to change a few players that can handle the situation better but I am always looking for something better.

[TheVulture]

I just discovered this post yesterday and have played with your 4-3-2-1/4-2-3-1 pack... only played thee games but I can already say that you did a wonderfull job!

Am I correct that the whole pack 4-3-2-1/4-2-3-1 can be used (in all it's forms) without causing confusion within the team if I change tactics much... I am asking this because for example the Ancelotti has other positions than for example the Spalletti...

[Loversleaper]

I just discovered this post yesterday and have played with your 4-3-2-1/4-2-3-1 pack... only played thee games but I can already say that you did a wonderfull job!

Am I correct that the whole pack 4-3-2-1/4-2-3-1 can be used (in all it's forms) without causing confusion within the team if I change tactics much... I am asking this because for example the Ancelotti has other positions than for example the Spalletti...

I haven't experienced anything out of the ordinary when changing between the 4-2-3-1 and the 4-3-2-1 tactics. I always include the 4-3-3 tactics so I have a lot of variety when choosing tactics, usually in the leagues in southern Europe you will be facing a lot more 'creative' tactical formations so it can be an advantage when you want to use a defensive midfielder (anchor man) or the attacking midfielder. You can easily get your team to handle different forrmations just as long as you have a good idea on which mentality framework will work for the next given match.

[TheVulture]

I haven't experienced anything out of the ordinary when changing between the 4-2-3-1 and the 4-3-2-1 tactics. I always include the 4-3-3 tactics so I have a lot of variety when choosing tactics, usually in the leagues in southern Europe you will be facing a lot more 'creative' tactical formations so it can be an advantage when you want to use a defensive midfielder (anchor man) or the attacking midfielder. You can easily get your team to handle different forrmations just as long as you have a good idea on which mentality framework will work for the next given match.

Ok thanks... I haven't played that many matches but I will continue this evening... but in all three matches I played your tactics proved very good! very impressive stuff!

[SFraser]

Definatly some impressive stuff imo. Worth keeping around for FM10 for the thought process at the very least.

I have not looked at the PKM's you have provided yet Loversleaper but Hearts of Iron 3 has been gnawing at my brain and taking up most of free time recently.

I was going to watch that match where you got a Premier League team down to 49% pass accuracy but then they released a patch for HOI3

Great thread, hope to contribute more, and I really hope you give my winger suggestions another look. Favoured foot and width look to me to be significantly important in Wing tactics.

[Loversleaper]

Definatly some impressive stuff imo. Worth keeping around for FM10 for the thought process at the very least.

I have not looked at the PKM's you have provided yet Loversleaper but Hearts of Iron 3 has been gnawing at my brain and taking up most of free time recently.

I was going to watch that match where you got a Premier League team down to 49% pass accuracy but then they released a patch for HOI3

Great thread, hope to contribute more, and I really hope you give my winger suggestions another look. Favoured foot and width look to me to be significantly important in Wing tactics.

You are not as suprised as you are going to be when you see (in the PKM) that West Brom actually used most of their perferred line-up. I will include the play-maker winger instructions as soon as I have a moment. I am just finishing up the screen shots for the remainder of the MKD season, so I'll post them here in an hour or so with a little conclusion (just thinking what to include right now). Good luck with the HO13...

[Loversleaper]

Game 51: MKD - Millwall. Slight home favorites in wet weather (it's a trend). I am top so I will carry on playing as the Master manager as described in the first posts in the thread so I will use the MilanHighPress due to the horrible pitch conditions. "We can win this", they are another one of the top teams but I know we can do it.

Half time 0-0: "We can win this", we are playing better then them. Even with some of the second string due to a couple of injuries.

Match Stats:http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/4364/game51mw.jpg

Analysis: I had to sympathise. Next match is the JP Trophy final and I didn't really want to upset the moral in the squad and played it 'safe'. My normal starters in attack were out and the two back ups weren't dangerous enough. I probably need the two main choices to over-power Millwall's defensive capability and we couldn't do that on the day.

Vedict: "Couldn't over-power opposition's defensive capability with our attacking capability"

Game 52: MKD - Oldham (JP Trophy Final): Slight favorites on this beautiful sunny day at Wembley. Best pitch we have seen all season and for once it isn't raining. The cup final is usually always played on neutral pitches so no one has the home advantage. I have found through time that Mentality(13) is one of the better mentalities to use in a final, especially if you are favorite. But still the cup final doesn't nessassarily follow any real type of mentality rules as you might have in other compititions where you are playing home and away to different types of opponents (re: some strong, some weak). When I have a world class squad one of my favrites is the Capello tactic which uses a mentality of (6) which is defensive, and I will use this even if I were favorite (which usually you are not to begin with). You have a possibility to express your self as long as you don't over-commit your-self, because the commen thing about finals is that you are up against another very good team. For this occasion I would like to try out the Brazil tactic, it is a little narrow (naturally defensive aspect) slow short passing and hopefully we can out play Oldham once again as I have beaten them twice in the league. But this is a whole different game so "we can win this", you've come this far.

Half time 0-0: "We can win this", we have 63% possession and looks like it is only a question of time.

1-0 (80min),

Match Stats:http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/16/game52ohjpf.jpg

Analysis: We outplayed them with possession. They tried after we scored and won a little back on the stats but "well done" we won it. Most of my players still can't speak the language but they still must have understood the importance of the game.

Verdict: "The passing was a joy to watch"

Game 53: MKD - Huddersfield. Comfortable home favorites and back to rain. I think we should get our arms down and I want to still keep this squad on their toes even though we have run away with the league, so the MilanHighPress tactic for this game. I want to see/show how to keep up in an imaginary title race so the lads (and me) are prepared with this possibility if/when it arises. "I expect a win", I know you can win so show that we can stay foccused.

1-0 (11min),

1-1 (18min),

Half time 1-1: "For the fans" fellas, apparently they were a little shaken that I expected a win against a relatively strong team. Wanted to ease up the pressure but stuck with the tactic.

2-1 (62min),

(78min) defensive full backs.

Match Stats:http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/9674/game53hu.jpg

Analysis: "Well done" we got in the end, and "delighted" to an over-performer. We were really dangerous when we had our chances but didn't really take them. We struggled a little in first half but things picked up and felt we had the game in the 2nd half. But remember we were playing more result orientated football due to weather conditions.

Verdict: "Be more aware of opponents before you demand a victory"

Game 54: Colchester - MKD. Slight underdogs on a narrow wet pitch. It never stops raining does it? Colchester are in the top six so I have decided the rivalry might be there so "for the fans". Athletico(11) tactic because I believe we are stronger and want to play my chance.

0-1 (23min), changed to Athletico(6) tactic.

1-1 (32min), changed back to Athletico(11) tactic.

Half time: "We can win this", we were better but I truly regret attempting to go more defensive too early.

1-2 (48min),

(60min) changed to Athletico(6) tactic, and changed to the defensive fullback at the 77minute.

1-3 (90+3min), they pushed we scored.

Match Stats:http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/2811/game54ch.jpg

Analysis: "Well done" we did actually better than expected. I made the right tactical change when I waited until the 60th minute, where as at the 23rd minute it was too drastic and unessassary.

Verdict: "Getting stronger tactically away from home"

Game 55: MKD - Swindon. Comfortable home favorites in nice sunny dry weather (who'd a thought?). Time for the SirAlex but Swindon are not a bottem half team so "we can win this".

Half time 0-0: "Disappointing", we are not in front so we got to do better.

1-0 (50min),

2-0 (72min),

Match Stats:http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/7550/game55st.jpg

Ananlysis: "We done", they picked up after the break and won it.

Vedict: "Got to win the unessassary matches as well"

[speed_demon]

Loversleaper please help. I'm playing as Arsenal and am currently using the tactic arsene role theory, I have no problems scoring goals but my team can't help but concede nearly every match. Also what tactic should i use against Man utd and Liverpool as i always struggle against thes two, home and away.

[Loversleaper]

Game 56: Southend - MKD. Slight underdogs on a wet short pitch. Short pitches are a little different then narrow pitches and I wanted to try out the Benitez tactic which is a little more daring then the Athletico(11), and I have moved up a place in the manager chain so this sounds about right. "We can win", even though we are slight underdogs. I have all my center backs out except for two 18 year olds so this will be fun.

1-0 (7min),

1-1 (20min),

Half time1-1: I still think that "we can win this". We are doing ok, but the two young guns in central defense are all over the place (re: they are disobeying instuctions).

2-1 (50min),

2-2 (62min),

Match Stats:http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/6800/game56st.jpg

Analysis: "Disappointing" with the performance. We need more points so this will hopefully motivate them for the next match. The central defense was a mess, even my two back ups were out.

Verdict: "Luckily this is not the Premier League, we would have been murdered with that defense"

Game 57: Bristol Rovers - MKD. Slight favorites on a dry short pitch. Time to play some football on the ground so we will go with the Italy tactic. "We can win this", Bristol Rovers are fighting for 6th place (which is a play-off position) so they might go for it.

0-1 (22min),

0-2 (39min),

Half time 0-2: "Pleased" we are back on track. No need to play more defensively as we are really in control here.

0-3 (48min),

1-3 (54min),

Match Stats:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/3762/game57br.jpg

Ananlysis: "Well done", this team enjoys playing football on the ground as it allows them to really show their talent compared to opponent. Shame we don't get to do this more often.

Verdict: "thinking of moving south to the sun"

Game 58: MKD - Crewe. Huge home favorites in nice sunny weather (summer is almost upon us). I want to win our last home game of the season and finish off in style in front of the fans. No better way than to do this with SirAlex tactic. "I expect a win", the fans have supported you the whole way.

1-0 (11min),

2-0 (30min),

Half time 2-0: "Don't let your performance drop", can you handle the pressure that will be expected of you in the future?

3-0 (73min),

Match Stats:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/5008/game58caf.jpg

Ananlysis: My team is back to full strength, though some of them were lacking match fitness. They dealt with the expectancy quite nicely. Crewe tried to flood the midfield with 5 men but we still had the game, "well done" you did your duties.

Verdict: "Handling pressure is the only way to stay on top"

Game 59: Yeovil - MKD: Huge away favorites on a narrow pitch in the pouring rain (monsoon?). I wanted to play the most attacking away tactic that I think the quality will allow me, which is the Claudio tactic but due to the rain I will tweak the passing setting from (12mixed) to (13direct). "We can win this", so we can finish in style.

Half time 0-0: "We can win", we should be in front by at least 2.

Match Stats:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/9644/game59yt.jpg

Analysis: I was "disappointed" that we didn't score. I wanted to remind them of the task at hand because next season is going to be a whole different story with a lot more quality opponents. I hope they think of this over the summer and hope they meet up next season with motivation.

Verdict: "Hi, my name is Rain and you'll be seeing a lot more of me next season"

[Loversleaper]

Loversleaper please help. I'm playing as Arsenal and am currently using the tactic arsene role theory, I have no problems scoring goals but my team can't help but concede nearly every match. Also what tactic should i use against Man utd and Liverpool as i always struggle against thes two, home and away.

I don't know how strong you are compared to them, but my guess would be the Argentina tactic unless you really drop in possession during a match, that means that Man U or Liverpool is playing more defensively against you so then if this is the case then the SirAlex could prove to be quite effective. If the weather is bad I would go for the MilanHighPress. But when the weather allows it against the poorer opposition you should be using the Arsene tactic.

Away I would use the Capello tactic, weather permitting. If the weather is really bad it will most likely be one of the Athletico tactics...

P.S. the Arsene role theory, isn't that someone else's tactic? I don't know if you meant you used the tactics from this thread?

[speed_demon]

The role theory is somebody elses tactic yes, iv'e only just come across this thread(which is very good by the way), i downloaded the tactics which i will start to use straight away, usually against Man utd and Liverpool the possession is usually quite even, I just never seem to be able to get a good grip on the game throughout the 90 mins.

[Loversleaper]

End of Season: I would like to point out that there is a certain pattern that I have used, and the way I have illustrated it is that I have tried things out before (with Watford) and that is why I know about the increase in stature that allows one to become more attacking. Higher up the leagues might not allow you to progress in the same manner that was done with this MK Dons game, it might take some teams several seasons to break into the title race. Everything in the club must grow (facilities, coaches, ect..) because this allows the professionalism the club has to attract the best of the best of the football talent. Attacking football wins more matches when playing against defensive opponents than playing cautious against cautious (which will randomise the outcome of a game more often and you don't want that if you want to win in the long run). Over-commiting yourself by being too attacking on the other hand can prove to be fatal especially away from home, there is a fine balance when choosing mentality frameworks and it might take a little practice to get it right. Tipping the balance your way in tact with your form, but you need the quality to back it up. This is because if you overperform drastically with a poorer squad then you may encounter situations where your overall attacking capability won't over-ride a very strong defending capability. This is why it is so important to get the right players, with perferable lots of determination as this allows you to be more demanding and motivating players to perform at the top of their ability in the most crutial times during the season which could influence the outcome of the season. You might have noticed I played around using most of the tactics in the 4-4-2 pack but weather had me on the other end tactically. You might have noticed it is only a few changes that I make during games with the exception of a few tough games where I had to be more tactical to bring home a point or three.

As soon as the players go on holiday I put all the players back into the fitness training regime which will first end at the last week berfore the next season league fixtures start. My guess is that I will have to basically play the same way next season as I have done in this one, the only difference is that I most likely will not do as well as I did this season. If I were to have a decent chance it is important that I change out the entire squad except for a player or three. I strongly recommend that Gamers look in the Good Player Forum and get the shortlist with all the exciting young talent that is featured at the start of the game. With the right knowledge you can essemble a team that is strong enough but you have to be very strategic as my wage budget (for example) won't allow me to go on a shopping spree. It is sometimes wise to look at players that are released from their contracts at higher clubs and even though they might appear that they do not want to go to your club they sometimes do except a contract where they are a 'key player'. The SI have left a little door open for this to happen but they want you to take a little time and do your homework. Every season look to upgrade your scouting and put a little effort into it, you will most likely find grreat players that will bring your club to the next level.

Final League Table:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/2918/finaleaguetable.jpg

Squad Statistics:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/4318/squadstatsmkd.jpg

My main three strikers scored 20, 17 and 16 respectively, generally my strikers did quite well. My right midfielder scored an incredible 13 and my left back Valdir scored 8 (he was my penalty taker). O'Hanlon was my best header so he got a few on set pieces (8 total).

Other Vital Statistics:

Top Score List:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/3766/topscorelist.jpg

Assist List:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/6683/playerassists.jpg

Player Ratings:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/8927/playerratings.jpg

Team Corners:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/200/teamcorners.jpg

Team Indirect FK:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/6105/teamindirectfreekicks.jpg

Team Direct FK:http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/456/teamdirectfreekicks.jpg

Viewing the statistics: As you can see I did quite well with just simple mixed set-peice instructions. The statistics show that we scored basically a whopping 77 league goals from open play which is quite good. My strikers did quite well with the free role and the hold up on ball (Hulst had 18 strength) roles even at this level, I was unsure if they could cope but I guess this game has a you compared to opponent aspect that allows this to happen. If there are any statistics or questions any one has please feel free to do so. Thanks to those that have followed the thread so far and showed your support.

[TheVulture]

I used your tactics again (4-3-2-1/4-2-3-1) and they are simply awesome... Most memorable was the 2-1 victory with my team (Man City) over rivals Man United... especially if you're trailing 0-1 in the 80th minute... I changed from Benitez (because of the rain) to Spalletti and I won with goals in the 88th and 89th minute!

[JackDavies]

Found this extremely useful, and i hope you continue as it is much appreciated

[Krumeca]

Thank you for sharing this with us Loversleaper! I decided to start using your sets 4 days ago and the results are simply fantastic. The only tweak i make is restricting the crossing - all set to rarely. Oh and no free role, i doubt my fast strikers can cope with it.

My unbeaten run could have been longer but i was slow with implementing the defensive full backs at home against Leeds. 2-0 was not good enough for me :confused:

http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr297/krumeca/vsLeeds.jpg

http://i493.photobucket.com/albums/rr297/krumeca/Dover2.jpg

Sorry for my english and thanks again

[keller]

Loversleaper, any chance of posting a link to the 08 8.0.2 version of the tactics? Can`t find a good link on your previous threads.

[Loversleaper]

Loversleaper, any chance of posting a link to the 08 8.0.2 version of the tactics? Can`t find a good link on your previous threads.

The link should be at the bottem of post#2 in the Tactical Central & Insight Thread, I just checked both links out and can't see why there should be any problems with the download. There is a mediafire and a easy-share option, if you have any difficulties please give me a more detailed explaination what you are experiencing when you hit the link and I will try to see what the problem is. Thanks...

[keller]

Are those tactics for fm 08? If yes, then silly me...

[TheVulture]

Lovesleaper, I have a question about the tactics that I use away most frequently, both the Cappello and the Ancelotti are good but I find it sometimes hard to score, especially at lowranked teams... I think it has something to do with my CM"s missing certain attacking skills.. could you describe what kind of players are the best to use at those positions... the only one I have in my current squad that I think fits both defensively and attackingwise is Miquel Veloso...

[Kung]

Im playing @ the end of my 1st season with Lazio,gona give ur tactics a try again after been trying ur exelent tactics for the previous patch,mostly i guess i will try the alternative tactics like mourinho and the non 4-4-2 tactics,ill let u know how it goes

[Kung]

1st game,i totally thrashed cagliari @ home 4-1

i used 4-2-3-1 benitez since i was at home and it was shower. NICE start,i dominated big the game

[Kung]

2nd game was Atalanta away,tougher opponents,dry weather.

I started using tapia 4-3-3 and did ok,when i got a goal i switched to 4-4-1-1 tapia and result stod.

Intresting was i dominated possession 60-40 this game 1-0 ccc to me,so im pleased..

3rd game i used mourinho (15) against bologna @ home,won unipressive 1-0

last game i played away from siena,i used 4-3-2-1 Ancelotti.

I won 3-1 but 2 goal came by freekicks,not that impressed,good result aneway.

Ended 6th in the serie A,looking forward to europe and a new season wich i will start with ur tactics and see how we perform.

I probably will loose some key players,Pandev for sure,maybe carizzo and my right wingback. need to bring in some good midfielders i guess.

[Loversleaper]

Lovesleaper, I have a question about the tactics that I use away most frequently, both the Cappello and the Ancelotti are good but I find it sometimes hard to score, especially at lowranked teams... I think it has something to do with my CM"s missing certain attacking skills.. could you describe what kind of players are the best to use at those positions... the only one I have in my current squad that I think fits both defensively and attackingwise is Miquel Veloso...

Capello and Ancelotti were not designed for being large favorites away from home, they were designed for the better teams that are slight underdogs away from home. If you are away to low ranked teams you need to implement a higher mentality framework, in my experience it is better to use mentalities between (10) and (13) depending how big a favorite you are. I think that when you use mentality of (6) or (8) away it works better when opponents attack your team (which is usually the case when you are underdog) so you can counter-attack and exploit their players being out of position (which these tactics are good at), but this won't nessassarily work against a defensive/compact team (like low ranked teams usually play). I can imagine a cautious approach against another cautious tactic will cause a more random outcome which won't always go in your favor, you have to attack slightly more against these types of opponents...

[Loversleaper]

2nd game was Atalanta away,tougher opponents,dry weather.

I started using tapia 4-3-3 and did ok,when i got a goal i switched to 4-4-1-1 tapia and result stod.

Intresting was i dominated possession 60-40 this game 1-0 ccc to me,so im pleased..

3rd game i used mourinho (15) against bologna @ home,won unipressive 1-0

last game i played away from siena,i used 4-3-2-1 Ancelotti.

I won 3-1 but 2 goal came by freekicks,not that impressed,good result aneway.

Ended 6th in the serie A,looking forward to europe and a new season wich i will start with ur tactics and see how we perform.

I probably will loose some key players,Pandev for sure,maybe carizzo and my right wingback. need to bring in some good midfielders i guess.

First of all, Mourinho(15) is a High Pressure tactic and I wouldn't recommend that teams use it at the start of the season. This is because you and your team have to go through a little 'gelling' phase and usually opposition teams don't play too defensively at the start of the season (due to no form indication). When you start having 'form' with results then you should be looking to break down defensive/compact opponents with these type of tactics (re: High Pressure Tactics) on home ground. If you met Bologna after you had a good run of results then they would most likely play a lot more defensive against you making the High Pressure Ideology a stronger tactic.

Your team might not play so well at the start (most starts of seasons can be a little rough) but it is more about getting results and form/moral, when you have been at your club for a while your team should get a lot better. If you change tactics around a lot to start with they might have difficulties adjusting but in the long run they should handle this more easily. I think you should look more closely at which Mentality frameworks work better for certain situations, because the Mentality framework is probably the most important thing to get right when playing the ME...

[Kung]

First of all, Mourinho(15) is a High Pressure tactic and I wouldn't recommend that teams use it at the start of the season. This is because you and your team have to go through a little 'gelling' phase and usually opposition teams don't play too defensively at the start of the season (due to no form indication). When you start having 'form' with results then you should be looking to break down defensive/compact opponents with these type of tactics (re: High Pressure Tactics) on home ground. If you met Bologna after you had a good run of results then they would most likely play a lot more defensive against you making the High Pressure Ideology a stronger tactic.

Your team might not play so well at the start (most starts of seasons can be a little rough) but it is more about getting results and form/moral, when you have been at your club for a while your team should get a lot better. If you change tactics around a lot to start with they might have difficulties adjusting but in the long run they should handle this more easily. I think you should look more closely at which Mentality frameworks work better for certain situations, because the Mentality framework is probably the most important thing to get right when playing the ME...

hmm,it was the ending of my season,bout to start a new season now

[SFraser]

My strikers did quite well with the free role and the hold up on ball (Hulst had 18 strength) roles even at this level, I was unsure if they could cope but I guess this game has a you compared to opponent aspect that allows this to happen. If there are any statistics or questions any one has please feel free to do so. Thanks to those that have followed the thread so far and showed your support.

Great observation there that echoes much of what I have seen while at the same time bringing to the fore 3 critical issues for strikers, Free Roles, HUB and seperation or lack thereof for Mentality and FW Runs.

Dealing with Mentality and FW Runs first, it is my observation that link-up play between two strikers reaches it's maximum when these instructions are similar but conversely delivery of the ball to either striker reaches it minimum. The reasoning for this is that when two strikers are on similar mentality and FW Runs, they are timing runs equivelant to passes and timing passes equivelant to runs. In terms of aggression of movement and delivery, both players are essentially "on the same wavelength". When the opponents defence is on the back foot or under pressure this "equivelance of wavelength" between runs, passes and moves is completely destructive. Yes the precision of passing accuracy or run timing or run direction is still attribute determined, but the evaluation of risk and the favouring of forward action is identical, therefore you are left only with discrepancies in accuracy and player intelligence. You are not compensating for variations in "attacking desire".

The fundamental problem here is ofcourse that when the ball is in midfield or defence, both players are making similar runs and holding similar positions. The "mantra" of FCd and FCa has in my opinion emerged firstly to distrurb the opponents defensive line and create space and secondly to link up with MCa and MCd in a staggered formation. These are not wrong, and not only are they not wrong but they do indeed achieve the disruption of flat back fours and flat midfields etc. but in doing so they sacrifice tandem unity between strikers, AND midfielders. Think of the entire situation as being the difference between Gerrard and Torres versus Yorke and Cole, although that is not exactly accurate.

The benefit of split mentalities and split runs is initial tactical disruption of the opponent and the ability to produce the decisive ball first time. The negative is the lack of continued interaction and link-up play brought about by variations in instructions, and the isolation of the furthest striker.

The benefit of equal mentalities and equal runs is the constant partner, the player equal to your current positioning and action, and the ultimate benefit is undefendable interaction between players with every touch of the ball. The negative is the initial stability of the defence and easy defence against the first ball.

There are always solutions to these respective problems, but there are no solutions to either when the manager is unaware of the precise issue.

The second critical issue is the use of Free Role and Hold Up Ball. In my opinion these are not necessarilly two distinct tactical options although they can be, instead they are fundamentally linked or atleast should be considered as two sides of the same coin. Ultimately you should consider the implications of one without the other, one with the other and the other without the first and so on.

With them both ticked then obviously the player drops into space and then takes a controlling touch and weighs up his option, giving him maximum opportunity to consider possibilities and ultimately counter-acting any negative effects of composure and tempo, but that is only a part of the story. To understand the story you must understand the actions and impact of either and then both.

HUB.

The HUB instruction is not an instruction whereby you tell a player to wrestle with the opponent. Nor is it an instruction to tell the player to wait untill someone in his own team runs ahead of him. The best description of HUB is probably to take double the time allowed by tempo to decide upon the next move. At maximum Tempo this generally means taking a touch and then passing the ball or making the move, all the while that time is used to evaluate options. At maximum Tempo I find HUB to be the difference between a touch or a punt in defenders, a touch or a pass in midfielder, a touch or a dribble in wingers and the difference a snap volley or a controlled finish in strikers.

For a striker inside the box, HUB is the difference between a first time volley screaming over the bar or a half volley curling into the net.

For a winger HUB is the difference between knocking the ball past the fullback with the first touch, or taking a touch then dribbling past the fullback.

For an FC or AMC then HUB is the difference between a first time chip to a striker, or a little dragback followed by a throughball to a running MC.

Indeed I have seen Aguero employ HUB by a double stepover, dragback and then strong foot chip on the edge of the box with maximum CF.

Hold Up Ball means take your time for me.

Obviously when you are being challenged by a defender or have your back against the CB or you are in a crowded space then HUB is difficult to pull off. Likewise you might want your strikers to play maximum Tempo but your Fullbacks keep launching it 70 yards to the head of Messi. Maybe your keeper keeps punting it upfield instead of knocking it wide to a fullback.

You can USE HUB to decide whether your winger cuts inside past the fullback with his first touch or draws the fullback out. Are you playing Wide? Use HUB on wingers. Are you playing narrow? Then crank up the tempo and play without HUB on your wingers but HUB on your strikers and midfielders.

Judicious use of HUB is one of the more cunning individual tactical tricks available in the game. No doubt everyone can see how it applies to the lone striker in the FCd-FCa setup mentioned above.

Free Role.

Again not some completely random, unintelligable instruction that implies one thing and does another. Free Role tells your players to move into space.

The lone striker drops deep, the wide winger hugs the touchline, the narrow winger drops deep or moves out wide. Play with Free Role off and the lone striker plays on the shoulder, the wide winger does likewise and the narrow winger surges between the fullback and CB.

End of Season: I would like to point out that there is a certain pattern that I have used, and the way I have illustrated it is that I have tried things out before (with Watford) and that is why I know about the increase in stature that allows one to become more attacking. Higher up the leagues might not allow you to progress in the same manner that was done with this MK Dons game, it might take some teams several seasons to break into the title race. Everything in the club must grow (facilities, coaches, ect..) because this allows the professionalism the club has to attract the best of the best of the football talent. Attacking football wins more matches when playing against defensive opponents than playing cautious against cautious (which will randomise the outcome of a game more often and you don't want that if you want to win in the long run). Over-commiting yourself by being too attacking on the other hand can prove to be fatal especially away from home, there is a fine balance when choosing mentality frameworks and it might take a little practice to get it right. Tipping the balance your way in tact with your form, but you need the quality to back it up. This is because if you overperform drastically with a poorer squad then you may encounter situations where your overall attacking capability won't over-ride a very strong defending capability. This is why it is so important to get the right players, with perferable lots of determination as this allows you to be more demanding and motivating players to perform at the top of their ability in the most crutial times during the season which could influence the outcome of the season. You might have noticed I played around using most of the tactics in the 4-4-2 pack but weather had me on the other end tactically. You might have noticed it is only a few changes that I make during games with the exception of a few tough games where I had to be more tactical to bring home a point or three.

Another great set of observations. I especially appreciate the point about everything at the club having to grow.

I wont go into these points just now lest this page turn into a wall of my rambling text, but you are bringing up some awesome stuff in these pages and I hope you do not mind my input.

[Loversleaper]

I wont go into these points just now lest this page turn into a wall of my rambling text, but you are bringing up some awesome stuff in these pages and I hope you do not mind my input.

Not at all. Any input is welcome and if it leads to a healthy discussion then it can only be a plus. I appreciate that many have different styles and there can be a lot of individual tweaking that can help out in making tactics that are more 'sound', but I haven't really dwelled on this. There are others that have done plenty of work in these areas, this thread has a different ideology behind it. I am trying to get Gamers familiar with the Mentality reality that lies behind the tactical side of FM. The bottem principles in this thread is finding out how tactics work on the 'surface', how deep you go is up to the Gamer's personal views. I am trying to share my views on how to build up tactics and what mechanisms that Gamers can use that make tactics workable. When to use width or when do you have to use high closing down and defensive line, what signs to look for when playing the ME that tells you what can be done (maybe not that second but for the future).

This thread get's misunderstood a lot, it is not about these tactics being good or anything like that, it is more a question if the User knows what tactics to use (in a situation) and why they even work. If you get a good idea how to use the tactics in this thread then you are only a 'small stone throw' away from knowing how to make/create your own tactics and knowing when they can work at that given time. Also the art of knowing your teams overall capability in conjunction with what type of tactics you can allow yourself to play. For example, I think there are far too many Gamers that haven't realised things like how hard it is for teams to play with too much width or too much closing down and they overestimate their capability. I have also tried to the best of my ability to explain how the sliders work in conjunction with one and other that can assist people in building/creating their own tactics. I think it is good to personalise your team but you have to get the ground principles right first, and this is what I have been trying to do.

On the subject of the Free Role forward and the Hold Up On Ball striker: The scenario is that usually the striker holds on to the ball untill the free role forward gets into position. The Free Role/HUB combination has the two strikers behaving much differently, even though they have the same mentality. I was always a big fan of split mentality systems and have always practiced it. I will always use ideologies that work and will convvince myself through testing, but if I experience something else more 'consistant' I will go with that even though it breaks my own personal ideology. Right now I have been having great personal success with a global ideology and visually I have got my team playing more as a unit and moving strategically, you can call it a personal style of play. Others have different styles where they have more personalised tweaks, different passing for different parts of the pitch. Global settings work best, in my personal view (and testing), I can for example achieve over 80% pass completion and never do I have less than 88% tackles won. This is the style of manager I am, it might be more cautious then some other managers but I am going for the win and if the situation allows me to do it in style then I most likely will do so.

By the way did you ever see the MK Dons - West Brom PKM? If you view the whole match (I know it will take 15 minutes or so) but it will give you an indication on just how strong you can get your team to play (even with a poor 'ungelled' squad) and produce incredible displays (like the PKM mentioned) with very simple global settings. Take a look and tell me that it isn't feasible...

[Hektor]

Nice work, again, Loversleaper! I lost interest in the game months ago when I tried to vary things a bit and try formations other than 4-4-2 as a result of taking over a big team with no real wingers. I'm having a lot of fun with it now, though, so thanks.

One change I tried, after finding that the 4-3-2-1 Spalletti formation didn't keep possession so well at home in good weather, was adopt the Brazil setup in a 4-3-2-1 fomation. What do you think? So far, I'm keeping clean sheets every game and getting about 65% possession.

Also, have you ever tried a 4-3-1-2? I've had a few problems with playing a really talented striker, who holds up the ball well but hardly ever scores, on his own. Maybe it's a question of finding a better striker, but I might try playing with two when I'm having difficulty scoring late in games.

[Loversleaper]

Nice work, again, Loversleaper! I lost interest in the game months ago when I tried to vary things a bit and try formations other than 4-4-2 as a result of taking over a big team with no real wingers. I'm having a lot of fun with it now, though, so thanks.

One change I tried, after finding that the 4-3-2-1 Spalletti formation didn't keep possession so well at home in good weather, was adopt the Brazil setup in a 4-3-2-1 fomation. What do you think? So far, I'm keeping clean sheets every game and getting about 65% possession.

Also, have you ever tried a 4-3-1-2? I've had a few problems with playing a really talented striker, who holds up the ball well but hardly ever scores, on his own. Maybe it's a question of finding a better striker, but I might try playing with two when I'm having difficulty scoring late in games.

I think it was a good choice when you made a 4-3-2-1 and used the Brazil settings. In the download versions I used the striker that holds up on ball as it is a more 'safe' choice, but having said that I have used the fast forward settings for the 'lone striker' many times. I depends who you have, if I had a player like Wagner Love then you wouldn't be doing him any favors by telling him to hold up on ball, he should run with ball and if he is tightly marked then I would also give him a free role.

You can of course use the tactical settings in other formations, but not all will work due to maybe width or something else conflicts with the formation. That's why I thought turning the Brazil into a 4-3-2-1 was a good choice because the settings 'compliment' the formation. 4-3-3 is the hardest tactic to play due to it having so wide width, but you have to play wide for the tactic to work thoroughly otherwise you will be looking at a lot of games where there are hardly any goals.

I noticed that there are several small mistakes with the 4-3-3 (settings/set pieces) that I have to address (at one point) that will make the tactics more functionable. I've noticed a little bug with the defensive corner settings where the striker should go back but doesn't always (maybe to do with mentality?), I forgot to tick the counter-attack button on the 4-3-3_Tapia and I think it is best to remove Free Roles on the Wingers in the 4-3-3_Guardiola tactic.

One thing I have noticed is that you can use a lot more of the High Pressure tactics later on in the game when playing at home as long as you have a good chance against your opponent. In my 6th season with Watford in the EPL I have several times this season (still early on) that I have to play MilanNomal away from home against the bottem teams. The more you go up in the World Rankings the more you have to attack and put opposition underpressure. I think it is quite annoying that opponents now are time-wasting so much that it is very difficult to dominate possession against them because you basically have to press them the whole game, they are heavily time-wasting even though they are behind by 3 goals...

[Loversleaper]

I've 'upgraded' all the tactic sets and added a few tactics that I felt really were missing. I had noticed some small mistakes here and there which I have fixed and also fine-tuned some set-peice instructions.

Regarding the 4-3-3: Remember you need to assemble a good team to be thoroughly successful with this formation. The defensive tactics in this pack are more result orientated football style and not always that nice to look at, but the offensive tactics usually get a lot of crowd pleasing credit. You are playing mostly wide which could leave you quite vunerable unless you have the top line players. I suggest that you will mostly be playing the 4-1-2-2-1_Arsene at home against the real poor quality sides in you league, at home against better squads I suggest the Guardiola or Mourinho(15). Definatly use the Mourinho(15) on home field where the weather is rainy, just tweak the passing from (12mixed) to (13direct). Away as large favorites against poor opposition I would go with the Mourinho(13) and as slight favorite Mourinho(10), but remember sometimes you are large favorites against some of the better teams and here I would be 'safe' and start out with Mourinho(10) and see if I can over-power them first before I would attempt to switch up to Mourinho(13). You have to get a 'feel' for things because sometimes the match odds might not give an exact indication on your teams overall capability compared to opponents' overall capability. If you incounter situations where you are underdog and you don't think it is a good idea to attempt the Mourinho(10) then I would see if 4-1-4-1_Tapia can hold the opposition from goal and grab one myself, Olexiy is mainly designed for these situations in rainy weather. The Hiddink tactic is a more quite style of play and was more designed for those times you reach the cup final or you are playing on a neutral pitch, you can use this as a home tactic but if you are struggling with possession then you have to do one of two things: either switch up to one of the High Pressure tactics or if you absolutly like this tactic then raise the closing down to (18) and defensive line to (13) making it a High Pressure tactic (simple tweak: also raise Center Backs individual closing down to 8). And finally, added the All Out Attack version for the 4-3-3.

Regarding the 4-2-3-1/4-3-2-1: Added an All Out Attack version: 4-2-3-1_Laudrup, but as mentioned for better weather. Use the 4-2-4_England'66 in rainy weather.

Regarding the 4-4-2: Added the 4-4-2_Tapia which is a tactic that is 'inbetween' the Capello and the Athletico(6). Changed Claudio to his surname (re:Ranieri).

General info: Remember when you are starting out season you should play more safe and look at match indications (match stats) before you start playing more offensively. You need to estiblish form before you start pushing forward and usually the indication is when you notice your opponent time-wasting and you might experience low possession but still you are out numbering them in shots. The Arsene is a tactic that implements a high mentality (18) and you will experience times at home where you need to play this 'extreme' to beak down Compact/Defensive/highTime-Wasting opponents. Also another fun thing I have noticed is that some formations work better against other formations because you can close out 'positional threats', for example using an anchor man when opponents use attacking midfielder(s) (or vice-versa) or using a tactic with pushed up wingers against an opponent that has 3 at the back. If you think about formations you can make good assumptions, for example I have experienced problems when I play against a narrow 4-1-2-1-2 (diamond) formation because the teams that use it always aim to take possession, but using the 4-1-2-2-1 tactic against can proove to be quite effective. When you and your team have gelled (and you have a decent team) you can start to attempt to play High Pressure at home against teams that you should have a good chance of beating, the better your reputation the quicker you will experience the possibilties of going more attacking. If the rumours are true then these tactics should work just fine for FM10. Good luck...

[drevil1969]

Very tasty tactics, used loveleapers last set and they were good too. Only have one question and thats teamtalks, looked at a few posts about them and getting slightly mixed up lol

[rich ruzzian]

I will give these Mourinho tactics a try with Chelsea and see if they will work.

[Corkey]

Will the new 4-3-3 set work for Hull City who are Relegation Candidates?

[MarkieSharkie]

Hey Loversleaper, been a fan of your work but never downloaded any of the tactics as i normally wait to see what everything is like on the final patch. Im really enjoying these sets and trying to pick up on the tell tell signs, however i find that sometimes it looks like i made the correct choices according to the match stats, but then i can lose heavily, im playing as sunderland using the tactician style, now this may be wher i have gone wrong and i should be using the relegation battelers, could you just enlighten me on what you would have used to start of with?

[Loversleaper]

Corkey: The 4-3-3 (4-1-2-2-1) tactics use more Wide Width and this can be difficult for lower quality teams to implement. It can be done but I think it is risky, you need to aquire good players (and coaches) fast and when you do it shouldn't be that much of a problem. I've explained elsewhere in this thread why it is risky to use the 4-3-3 set, and as a Relegation Battler I would be safe and use the 4-4-2 (preferably the narrower tactics) to stabalise results (and aquiring the right players). I would basically play the same way as I did in the MK Dons game.

MarkieSharkie: Take a look at how I played the MK Dons game because this is how I basically would have started out as Sunderland. But one thing you should know is that it is easier to overperform in the lower leagues than in the EPL where opponents are much better so you might be playing more cautiously the first season (more like the Relegation Battler). I don't know how long time it takes for you and your team to gell, but usually the first 15 games (at least) are always going to be difficult. These tactics don't guarentee you a win but if you get the hang of how to use the tactics and when, then you should be matching the opponent statwise giving you a chance to grab the win or a point. You have to go all out attack sometimes in the last ten minutes to get back into games or going for the three points at home when you are tied. I find that it is nessassary to change tactics sometimes during games to tip the balance more your way and it will take practice to get them right. As Sunderland you should be able to fight for one of those places that give access to European Compitition (7th spot) but you need a couple of good signings just looking at the initial squad.

Reading the match stats:

Home favorite: you are not controlling possession means that you are not closing down enough and maybe not high enough with the Mentality setting. If you are playing direct football then you can't always expect to controll possession but if you are not out numbering them in shots then this still applies (need for higher closing down).

Opponent is high time wasting during the match: you see the text "he is in no rush to take the goal kick" or something similar then you can attempt to go more attacking then the normal assumption.

Away favorite: this can be tricky. Let's say that you started out with a Mentality (13) framework but your opponent is getting more goal chances than you then you have to switch down to a Mentality (10) framework. If you are using a Mentality framework of (10) or (11) and you are not controlling possession in the game then you first should switch down to a more defensive tactic and see how the match stats react, but if you are controlling the game and you are not getting quality chances on goal then you have to switch up to a Mentality (13) framework. It might not be successful everytime but you should do better then worse in the long run and it might take some games before you get a good idea of what the match stats are telling you and what you should do about it.

But overall what you are experiencing is that you are up against an AI attacking mechanism or a defensive mechanism, and the AI might change between them during a game. The advanced AI also has 'degrees' within these mechanisms so usually the first changes you make are the ones close to the first assumption you make tactic wise. The first season as a rookie coach and/or a lot of new players will have a bearing on how you play in contrast to a gelled squad with talented players, which means playing more cautiously untill you aquire result form or you see your opponents time-wasting...

[Wijnand fens]

Home (heavy favorite): Guardiola

Home (close odds): Hiddink

Home (heavy underdog): Mourinho(10)

Away (heavy favorite): Mourinho(10)/(13)

Away (close odds): Tapia

Away (heavy underdog): Allegri/Athletico

Get a goal (last 10 minutes): England'66

Shut up shop (last 15 minutes): Allegri/Athletico with no forward runs on full backs + crossing from deep.

This works amazing!!!

[Beardeye]

Damn you Loversleaper- your well written and insightful post prompted me to reinstall FM09 and I am now addicted again.

I did a quick start game with small database with Kilmarnock (to test your tactics)- expectations were to avoid relegation. I have made not one signing and after 7 games am second in the league. I also beat Hearts 4-1 in the cup and Celtic 2-1 at home.

Your observations about overriding AI mentality seem to hold some water. I have only used Athletico 6 + 11 to start, and switch up to Milan Normal or High Press when necessary.

I may now start a career game, if my girlfriend doesnt kill me first.