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  1. #1
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    Hi, I thought I'd start a thread specifically for everyone to suggest changes to the match engine. Yes, I realise that there is a wishlist thread already, but it's full of suggestions from people who want to be able to add hot dog stands to their stadium or spend their manager's salary, etc (albeit there are some good suggestions there as well). This should hopefully make it easier for SI to read what people want from the match engine, specifically. I thought this would be a good idea as the forum is currently becoming a bit flooded with posts on the subject.

    GROUND RULES
    With the number of threads that turn into slanging matches here are the ground rules:
    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    <LI> Please make sure you're playing the latest patch (currently 8.0.1) before you suggest changes
    <LI> Please respect others' views, even if you disagree - do so politely
    <LI> Please don't say "this won't be too difficult to implement" unless you are a programmer yourself. The number of times people say that makes me think everyone on here must have a degree in software coding (let me tell you, nothing is "easy", because you have to test every bit of coding)
    <LI> Please don't worry if it's been posted before - let's use this one thread for all suggestions to do with the match engine; it will make the forum tidier
    <LI> Whilst it would be nice if SI post in here, rest assured (as I do) that SI do read all threads, so assume that this thread is being read[/list]
    I will kick things off in the next post.

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    Sorry for the double post, but I just thought of something I meant to add on the last one.

    I haven't noticed the FA fining players or clubs for disciplinary matters outside of managerial behaviour. IRL players are fined by the league for poor discipline, and clubs also accumulate fines for the behaviour of their players. For example, 5 yellow cards in a single match earns the club a fine, as does finishing bottom of the fair play league and various other matters.

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    Cheers Kriss (this thread was started by me, despite the different username!!).

    I had another thought, I'm sure this must have been raised before:

    <LI> When you're watching a penalty shootout, all the players are stood on the halfway line and are kind of mixed up. I'd like to see my team's players all standing together and the opposition's players all standing together.

    <LI> Still on theme of shootouts; why does it take longer for the goalkeeper to walk from the side of his area to his position than for the penalty taker to trudge all the way from the halfway line?

    It's the little things that add the right touches.

  4. #4
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    Hi, I thought I'd start a thread specifically for everyone to suggest changes to the match engine. Yes, I realise that there is a wishlist thread already, but it's full of suggestions from people who want to be able to add hot dog stands to their stadium or spend their manager's salary, etc (albeit there are some good suggestions there as well). This should hopefully make it easier for SI to read what people want from the match engine, specifically. I thought this would be a good idea as the forum is currently becoming a bit flooded with posts on the subject.

    GROUND RULES
    With the number of threads that turn into slanging matches here are the ground rules:
    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    <LI> Please make sure you're playing the latest patch (currently 8.0.1) before you suggest changes
    <LI> Please respect others' views, even if you disagree - do so politely
    <LI> Please don't say "this won't be too difficult to implement" unless you are a programmer yourself. The number of times people say that makes me think everyone on here must have a degree in software coding (let me tell you, nothing is "easy", because you have to test every bit of coding)
    <LI> Please don't worry if it's been posted before - let's use this one thread for all suggestions to do with the match engine; it will make the forum tidier
    <LI> Whilst it would be nice if SI post in here, rest assured (as I do) that SI do read all threads, so assume that this thread is being read[/list]
    I will kick things off in the next post.

  5. #5
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    There are some brilliant and useful ideas here.

    I'd like to see bookings or cautions for unfair distraction, e.g. when someone is taking a throw-in, calling "Over here", (despite not being on their team), and distracting the opposition keeper. As far as I have seen, this doesn't happen. At least it would give an excuse for all those offsides where the player offside isn't actually intefering with play.

    I would also like to see foul throws, possibly related to the Long Throws stat.

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    i would like to see the comments being more informative. I mean, i would like it to inform me when there are man marking on my players like:
    "your player dont have room to play"
    or
    "opp player is following your player all around"

    or maybe tell me of some player not playing well or something.

    I mean i dont want to watch the pitch everytime the AI changes tactics or to see if a player is not performing, i would like to have this info on the match comments. The game would play faster and ppl would understand better what is going on.

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    Would be great to see

    * Goaline controversy - did it cross the line or not?

    * Ball in Corner - Keeping the ball in the corner to waste time at a set piece

    * Diving - does this happen in the game? If not, look out Didier...(i'm a Man Utd fan so unfortunately no Cristiano slagging )

    I think the ball hitting the post does actually happen quite a lot in the game (from what i've seen) but maybe other people have had different experiences??

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    Hmm, Diving is actually in the game.

    I had a player get caught diving after a tackle from a defender inside the box and got a yellow ticket.

    The one thing I would like to see is more intelligence in strikers.

    What I mean is, alot of the time my strikers will be making a run and a defender will come attack, and it seems my players will always move the same way the defender is going making an awkward shot and a wide open space in the box in which my player should have dummied the defender and moved into that space, but instead always puts himself into an awkward shooting position or goes out of the box for a cross.

    Another thing would be Referee controversies. Like you end up in a game where the Referee picks favourites, and you can take the issue to the FA and they fine/suspend the referee. Could be fun, but may occur too often.

    Player/Manager grudges would be neat. If 2 players on the field playing eachother don't like eachother, maybe have them be pains in the neck to eachother, and you could talk to them giving them instructions to ignore the player or intentionally attempt to injure them but with high risk of red cards and fines.

    Umm World Eleven games. Where the best Players of UK or Europe play the best from other parts of the world. In like a friendly.

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    i dont know if this is asked before; but why not collect the top 5 (of 10...) biggest match engine problems, put them in a poll and ask: which of the next problems bugs you THE MOST.
    If you have a lot of anwswers, SI will see what we, players, hate the most.

  10. #10
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    Good thread this.

    Here is what I would like to happen with the ME -

    1. Please cut down the number of shots hit straight at the goalie by at least 50%. Increase goalie's ability to make better saves slightly so one can go "ooooo nearly" a lot more often than at present.

    2. Slightly more attempts at rounding the keeper in one-on-one's please.

    3. Players taking less long shots (even by 25% would be a great improvement). Players who have Shoots Long as a PPM - Player Preferred Move, especially need looking at. Because they hardly respond to tactical instructions to shoot rarely or mixed. And also players whom you play in the AMC position, who you might wish to try putting in more through balls instead, will be the most likely to ignore you and shoot long way too many times.

    4. Increase the accuracy of long shots just a tad. 5-10%.

    5. Allow central defenders to immediately close down a runaway winger breaking through on goal instead of staying fixed in their (central defensive) position. Same for fullbacks who stay back (in the centre) for corners and then will not close down a runaway winger until the central defenders make it back by which time the opposing winger has had a one-on-one he should never had.

    6. Stop defenders simply grinding to a halt when running alongside an opposing striker. If what's going on is a missed tackle, then please show this by having the circle belonging to the defender slide past the attacker, either infront or behind. If what's going on is that the attacker has whacked the defender with an elbow, then please have the running commentary mention this "was that an elbow?".

    7. Fix the Near Post Flick On position for corners (if an attacker heads the ball he heads it straight out, the way it is now). Please ensure that at least some accurate flick-ons or headers to goal are made. There are none whatsoever at the moment.

    8. This is a biggie for me - your choice of passing (Short, Mixed, or Direct) is not reflected in the ME. And I have my entire team on the same passing style. Playing on Short, my players will lob too many balls over the opposition's back line, and playing on Direct there's too much short passing going on. Please make this more reflective of the manager's instructions.

    9. Weather forecasts. Says rain, so I might choose a more Direct style of passing, and then in the first key ME moment which is displayed, the pitch has not a single drop of rain on it. Press tactics... change... play... tiresome. Yes I know weather forecasts aren't always accurate but if I'm supposed to be the manager on the actual blooming pitch I should be able to know if it's wet or not before kick-off, instead of 10 minutes into the game.

    10. Another request to do with corners - please make the player whom you set on "Outside Area" be JUST OUTSIDE the area (on the edge)? Instead of 10-20 yards outside it? So that the corner-taker has the option of passing the ball to him for him to take a shot from the edge of the area, if he happens to be free? The way it is now, you might as well have him on "Stay back" or "Back if needed". At least, make sure he runs towards the edge of the area when the corner is taken, and the corner-takers sometimes choose the option of passing the ball to where he's making the run.

    Taking care of these 10 things, will mean that gamers get a much more thrilling experience out of playing FM 2008. The priorities are bolded.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Skunner:
    The one thing I would like to see is more intelligence in strikers. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    I agree, sometimes I see one striker running, and I mean absolutely haring, towards goal, but to the right or left of the goal from, say, about 30-40 yards out. The other striker (who's more centrally placed) never breaks a neck to get into the area in the middle, which is odd, because he'd be in a great position for a potential tap-in.

    Milamber, I'm afraid your ideas have nothing to do with the ME, and as has been said many times on these forums, those have nothing to do with managing a club - it's the chairmen, not the managers - who make those decisions.

    Dirkjan - good idea, but hopefully this thread will serve as a collection of both problems people have with the ME, and suggestions for improvements in the future.

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    Good thread, in case Paul C doesn't see it I'll try bringing it to his attention, I know he'd be interested.

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    hey, you have to admit cheerleaders were a good idea...

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    In the current FML ME the clock stops at 90 minutes, so although you know how much extra time is being given you can't see the clock ticking and have to wait on the ref.
    It's far better to me.

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    I'd never noticed that before Ackter, but you're right of course.

    I'm certainly not one to request controversial incidents like drug tests, etc, but I was thinking that, in spite of the large number of bookings in the game, there never seems to be any spice in the game. I'd like to see:

    <LI> Players sometimes seeking retribution for a late tackle. So if someone is booked fouling someone, that someone could get booked fouling the other person back. Of course this is rare IRL, so should be rare in the game.

    <LI> I'd quite like to see the occasional mass brawl. Remember in the old Champ Man there was the occasional player hitting a ref? Well, instead of that, let's have a mass brawl, with the result that your club gets charged (and fined) with failure to control players.

    <LI> More bookings for dissent. Also, when the commentary says that so and so is furious with the ref, let's see him and some colleagues harass the ref Chelsea style (God I hate John Terry). Again, this would lead your club into trouble, so you should be prompted to fine the player so that he won't do it again.

    Just think Arsenal vs Chelsea in recent years.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GillsMan_Returns:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nomis07:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TSmith91:
    Player fights, Mass brawls, crowd invasions, streakers, players dying of heart attacks in the middle of games.

    Just a few things which I'd like to see. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Prat </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Can I just remind you of the ground rules please? I don't agree with TSmith's suggestions, either (apart from mass brawls) and his comment on players dying of heart attacks was tasteless in the extreme. But you have to respect others' views, even if they don't match your own.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GillsMan_Returns:
    GROUND RULES
    With the number of threads that turn into slanging matches here are the ground rules:
    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    <LI> Please respect others' views, even if you disagree - do so politely[/list] </div></BLOCKQUOTE> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I refuse to accept someones view that a real life person created in a computer game should have the ability to die. This given the argument from SI that we can't have players with drug bans due to legal reasons is particularly appropriate.

    Given recent events it was highly distasteful and sickening in the extreme, to ask someone to bite their tongue on such a sensitive matter because of a few ficitous ground rules is quite ridiculous as is the interpretation that the statement is someone's actual view or suggestion.

    Offer me an opinion and I will disagree (if necessary) politely, offer me a revolting slur and I will treat it with the contempt it deserves, as I did in my previous post.

    I apologise GillsMan_Returns but IMO the reaction was understandable and justifiable.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jimbokav1971:
    ps. Why the change from the grey &lt;Gillsman&gt; to the proper Gillsman? I always assumed that the &lt; &gt; meant the user had been banned . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Great post, well thought-out responses to other suggestions, and some interesting ideas too. Regards the username, I used to post as GillsMan, but lost all my login details, so had to post as GillsMan_Returns, and created this post using that account. Today I found my login details for GillsMan so asked the mods to delete the GillsMan_Returns profile.

    I like the idea with goalies coming out of the box due to their momentum and I'd like to see some goalies doing things like rushing out and heading the ball on occasion. I'd like more headers and miskicks going straight up in the air as well. Also, would definitely like to see goalies kicking the ball straight out of play. I went to the West Ham vs Man United game recently and Tomas Kuzsak kicked the ball straight out of play three or four times, so this should definitely be implemented. I'd love more options over free kicks and corners. For example, Gillingham used to have a great routine where the corner taker would stand over the ball, someone would run over as if it would be a short corner, but he'd then step over the ball and Nicky Southall would run from deep and spank the ball in from the edge of the area. It would be great if we could implement something similar.

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    Player fights, Mass brawls, crowd invasions, streakers, players dying of heart attacks in the middle of games.

    Just a few things which I'd like to see.

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    - players are constantly waiting the ball, ball too slow?

    - too good GK handling. never seen GK tiping the ball to corner (high shots) after saving.

    - heel pass!!!

    - quicker throw ins
    quicker free kicks -&gt; never seen a qiuck one!!

    - plyers turning more quick (cyrcling?)

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    Not sure if it has anything to do with the ME but I cannot stand the sound effects. They seem to have been unchanged for so many years.

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    Oh, and I have to reconsider my point about not hitting the post enough. I've just hit the post twice in one match, so I'm happy that it does occur - maybe I've not been paying attention enough!

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TSmith91:
    Player fights, Mass brawls, crowd invasions, streakers, players dying of heart attacks in the middle of games.

    Just a few things which I'd like to see. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Prat

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    And another thing, again this must have been mentioned before:

    <LI> there is a slight pause between the ball crossing the line for a goal and the flashing: GOAL TO GILLINGHAM!!! text whenever the goal is going to be disallowed. This means, you rarely cheer a goal to be disallowed, because you know instantly that it's going to be disallowed.

    This might be a deliberate thing, because IRL, you hear the whistle of the referee. It's annoying though.

  24. #24
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    There's a couple of changes I'd like to see
    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    <LI>Players with the ball should not stand on the centre circle and spin around on the spot until they're tackled and lose possession - happens all the time at all levels on mine (and I'm playing quick counter with no HUB)

    <LI>You shuold be able to 'shout' some basic instructions to your team in match without having to go into the overcomplicated tactics team then wait for a break in play (I've had to wait 15 mins for a sub before) before implemented them -should be click a polayer and drag to tell them to move forward/back/in/out.

    <LI>Man marking shouldn't be quote so literal - if I have my DM set to man mark their AMC, he'll disappear out wide and follow him even in his own half - he should only pick him up when we're defending and in our own half

    <LI>I'd actually like to see some player aggression - maybe your less professional/more temperamental players really kicking off and working themselves up, rather than relying on 'faith in ability' at half time for your 27 year old star player to do more than shuffle his feet

    <LI>Throw ins - wtf? sort it out.

    <LI>Current tactical analysis from Asst Manager

    <LI>Better overlapping FB/ backtracking wingers

    <LI>More types of finish

    <LI>Player to player interaction a lot more

    <LI>Bookings for over celebrating

    <LI>Defenders following through balls out of play, mine start towards, give up, then the opposition striker whistles through and keeps it in

    <LI>Better set piece control (maybe a module for training to learn specific moves)[/list]
    As another point, I think the training needs a serious overhaul. If you want a quick striker you'd think you need finishing, aerobic, ball control for first touch and tactics for movement. Nuh-huh. Try DEFENDING for COMPOSURE, which is really important.! You should be able to focus on individual stats for all players, and then your fitness/coaching team would work with the player to achieve those results. Manager - tactics. everything else - coaches. And you should be able to schedule morning and afternoon sessions, and post match warm downs on sundays or whenever.

    Also player direct interaction, meetings with your captain to assess squad mood, and for gods sake sort out your youth team completely. Until then it's just a case of matching tactics to situation (for example beat real madrid with fuerteventura 3-1 by setting my counter up just right. Shockingly unrealistic!) and not a true football simulation.

  25. #25

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by The Gaffovski:
    6. Stop defenders simply grinding to a halt when running alongside an opposing striker. If what's going on is a missed tackle, then please show this by having the circle belonging to the defender slide past the attacker, either infront or behind. If what's going on is that the attacker has whacked the defender with an elbow, then please have the running commentary mention this "was that an elbow?". </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    This one is crucial and needs toning down dramatically. I think it is currently what's bugging me most about the ME.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Currently, in FM08, the competition has a reputation placed against it. But I'd like to see the reputation increase by stage. So the more serious the competition gets, the more serious the clubs take it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    It's not ME related but it is a KEY improvement for FM09.

    All competitions should have changeable reputations. At the moment you can start off with a little team in N.Ireland but even if you go on to win the Champions Leage 30 years later, the reputation, (and therefore the prize money and sponsorship in the league) will remain the same. I would like to see it linked to something like the coefficients.

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    Just another couple of things to do with the ball movement - whilst you can see the ball curl in the air from free kicks and corners, you rarely see that happening with shots (e.g. from the likes of Thierry Henry - or SWP's goal against Everton the other night) or cross-field passes.

    Also, although this was fixed in the 8.0.1 patch I believe, the ball still seems to be a little too high when it nestles in the back of the net for a goal. Maybe it's just me, and maybe it's fine, but that's how it appears on occasion.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Whilst the 4th official signals the MINIMUM amount of overtime, this is usually adhered to IRL. It's only occasionally that it goes over the suggested minimum IRL, yet in the game it happens a bit too often in my opinion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I always thought that the 4th official indicates the amount of injury time that the ref intends to play, so IRL the deviation isn't usually that big.

    In the ME, the variation in the amount of injury time from what is indicated appears also to be a factor of how good the ref is, so games with lower ability refs go on much longer. Longest I've seen in my current game was about 5 minutes at half time plus 7 minutes at full time in a cup game between two U19 sides in the German U-19 cup (I was looking at a player). I would assume they don't use 1st division refs for those games...

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    George Graham - I'm sure I've seen people throwing themselves in front of shots, and I've definitely seen people running over the ball at freekicks. I like the other suggestions though.

    I like Gavin's suggestions too.

    I'd also like to see the keeper getting sent off for handling outside the area very occasionally. It's a very rare event, so maybe it IS in the game though...

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    Totally agree with the cross bar one. Only ever seen it a couple of times and that was when the keeper tipped it onto the bar (Or at least it looked like that, never mentioned the bar in commentary). Never seen a ball actually straight out hit the bar and bounce down, or bounce up in the air.
    I have seen the post hit lots of times in my games, seems about right to me.

    Would like to see a manager sat in the dugout too, and maybe jump out of his seat after a bad decision or bad foul.

    Would also like to see more one touch passing, never see any. The players always seem to take about 5 touches before they can do anything with it.

    It still annoys me that when a ball is played over the top, the defender just stands there or runs the opposite way whilst the striker runs through on goal. Seems to happen all the time.

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    My suggestion is very simple. I'd like to see a "running distance statistics". just like ECC.

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    I'm not sure if this an ME problem at all, but the lack of cup upsets is slightly dissapointing. It's a fine line, really, because you don't want to see an FA Cup final between Crystal Palace and Wolves really, but also, at least in the earlier rounds, it would be nice to see more cup upsets.

    Currently, in FM08, the competition has a reputation placed against it. But I'd like to see the reputation increase by stage. So the more serious the competition gets, the more serious the clubs take it.

    Anyway, I'd like to see a few more cup upsets. Not too many, but a few more. Maybe other people have got other experiences of cup upsets, but they rarely happen for me - the closest I see is a surprising draw (e.g. Leeds could only draw 1-1 with Tamworth). Maybe this has nothing to do with the ME at all though.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by George Graham:
    * Shots coming down off the crossbar. Maybe controversy over whether it crossed the line or not if it comes out.
    </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Oh please no! That will just remind me about my diciplinary hearing last season

    (Which the team that reported me, lost btw - coach was fined £150 )


    The things I mostly want, is better implementation of the rules and more difference on how refs are acting(depending on their level), better ref and AR movements.

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    Anyone remember an old DOS classic called Ultimate Soccer Manager? That had a good stadium manager aspect to it, like choosing hoarding sponsers, adding food stands/restaraunts/merchandise shops, upgrading particular stands rather than the entire stadium (as well as chooing the quality of seats). Not over the top, and loads of fun.

    Also, a game called Italian Soccer Manager from about 12 years ago. That allowed you to upgrade grass quality, floodlights, scoreboard, set maintenace and youth budget etc. They even barred you from being promoted if the pitch wasn't up to scratch, and the quality would degrade over time.

    Also, for those of you who play the best online football sim - http://www.onlinefootballmanager.co.uk - It has a good system for paid subscribers, who can upgrade various portions of the stadium and facilities.

    These options make these games more fun for me. Otherwise, I'm happy with match engine.

  35. #35
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GillsMan_Returns:

    <LI> Whilst the 4th official signals the MINIMUM amount of overtime, this is usually adhered to IRL. It's only occasionally that it goes over the suggested minimum IRL, yet in the game it happens a bit too often in my opinion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Probably the biggest thing that annoys me about this game, regularly i have games going 90 seconds or more over the time given by the 4th official, and on a number of occaisons it has cost me goals(almost got me knocked out of the CL group stages in my last season as i dropped points in 2 group games due to this)

    I have lost count of the amount of times that, when i draw or lose, the oppo goalie has had a blinder, whilst this has not affected my enjoyment too much i do find it a little unrealistic. I think in more cases IRL an oppo defender would have blinder and mark the star striker out of the game, or the strikers would have an off day and miss a lot of chances(see Torres etc versus Man City for instance, Joe Hart was not particularly great, but Dunne and Richards were incredible!!) This just needs to be tweaked a little IMO

  36. #36
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    Hiya Jimbo - don't worry, I took the leap of faith and bought FM08 and it's absolutely fantastic. I'm completely hooked. I might come across as a bit of a fanboy, but that's not to say I think it's perfect or without its faults. But it is a thoroughly enjoyable game. I've patched it o/c.

    I've opened a couple of threads discussing the ME, so yeah, go FM08!


  37. #37
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jimbokav1971:
    I thought I had read in here that someone had requested that GK's should be more prone to come out theur goal and head the ball clear in certain situations.

    I can't find it now bit I;ve just seen it happen. A lot of the time I don't think I'm aware of whether the GK headed it clear or hoofed it clear because the commentary is gone before I see it, but it was the case this time .

    ps. Needless to say the ball went straight to an opposition player who slotted home from 40 yards but it's the thought that counts . </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Fantastic spot. It was me who suggested it, but you've raised an important issue (and other people have done in other suggestions, e.g. the ball hitting the crossbar), that these things do happen in the ME, but we don't always notice them. This is encouraging, because I was concerned about buying FM08 because of the amount of negativity about the ME. But there are quite a lot of important features that HAVE been included. The variety of the ME is very important, and I don't think it's anywhere near the disaster some believe it to be.

    That said, and as SI themselves are often at pains to point out, there's always room for improvement, and hopefully some of the suggestions will be looked at.

  38. #38
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    Sorry posted the above message before I was finished typing.

    What I was trying to get at is FM needs something like ProZone which CM08 uses. I know there have been arguments in the past about if it is necessary or not, or even if it's useful, but after using it for myself it just made that part of the game more enjoyable.

    I don't want to have to buy a library of coaching books off Amazon to understand tactics but at times it feels like that is what SI are forcing us to do. Somewhere along the line they've forgotten that we are gamers first and foremost, not real life managers.

    Better tools to help us analyse our tactics and matches better will help many of us who don't derive any enjoyment out of tactics and the match engine, simply because it's made too inaccessable in it's current state. This is currently the major deficiency of the whole match engine I feel.

  39. #39
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    http://community.sigames.com/eve/for...1/m/2392031673


    this is a link to a thread on the same metter.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GillsMan:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TheFuzzyOne:
    hey, you have to admit cheerleaders were a good idea... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    We had them at Gillingham for one season IRL. A load of 11-14 year old Chatham girls. Queue chants of "get your t*ts out for the lads". Bit wrong really. Hideous idea in all honesty (IRL, anyway). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    man i had to see that. would have been classic. however, hormones would run wild though...

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    Less of players throwing the ball directly out of play from a throw in.

    Yellow cards for overly time wasting.

    Underdog team actually trying something else other than time wasting in first half. I have played teams who take an age to take a throw in the first and second minutes.

    More balanced one-on-ones. i.e. Bellamy gets one chance and puts it away, Torres gets ten and fails to score.

    Players squaring up to each other after a bad tackle, maybe even other team mates getting involved.

    More Xabi Alonso type shots when the keeper goes up for a last minute corner.

    Defender going mad at team mate for playing a forward onside, if playing offsides.

    Captain making some kind of effort to make his team play better.

    Chipped penalties and players waiting for keeper to dive before hitting penalties.

    Wingers dropping back to cover advancing fullback gap.

    Less of players, in my experience mostly wingers, passing the ball into the position they have just vacated only for it to harmlessly run out of play.

    The ability to send subs out to warm up. This could be to get some kind of lift from an underperforming player on the pitch....or maybe just so he can warm up to be brought on.

    Opposition players putting the ball out for injured players, I have only seen players of the same team do this, instead of running around them like they are not there.

    Injury feigning and players going mad at them for doing so.

    Drop balls when ref stops play for bad injury.

    And finally, a little circle with an M on it as my seven year old daughter constantly asks me which dot I am. She cannot grasp the concept of me sat in my real chair whilst everybody else has a representing circle.

  42. #42
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by hufton:


    As for diving, I had Mark Viduka booked for diving in the first half of a game. 5 minutes after half time in the same game Viduka picked up a second booking, also for diving. I don't think players should be able to pick up 2 bookings for the offence in 1 match, surely any player would have the sense not to try to con a referee twice in one game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Limiting the amount of bookings a player can receive for diving would be unrealistic, and the match engine should aim at realism always.

    It should, of course, be rare but never artificially limited.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by something less annoying:
    Interesting point there about players rounding the 'keeper. I don't remember the last time I saw that happen in FM. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Yes, I'd like to second this point. It doesn't happen as often as we'd think IRL, but it certainly happens more IRL than we see in FM.

  44. #44
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    i made a thread a long while back about i wanted to see things like the goalkeeper handling outside the area, goalkeepers pulling down players in the box, mass brawls, and also a small aesthetic point - i think its weird the dugout being at the top because you are actually viewing the pitch from the other side and a manager normally sits in the dugout - so having the dugout on the bottom of the screen please!

  45. #45
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    no offence mate but the last one was really distasteful... (TSmith91)

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    - Fix *indirect free kick crosses*.
    Right now they mostly (almost always) go straight out for a goal kick.

    - I would like an *individual width instruction* for each player.
    I think this is the single most important thing missing from the tactics, right now. We have no way of telling our players to play closer to each other or further, unless we change the whole team setting.

    - An *overlap instruction* would be great.
    This would be set up exactly as the "swap player" instruction does, but it would cause the players to overlap instead.
    Right now we can only do this longitudinally, by messing around with the forward runs. I think overlapping needs its own dedicated option in the individual tactics.

    - More options for attacking set pieces positioning.

  47. #47
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TheFuzzyOne:
    that last one is classic...
    who cares about team talks! bring on cheerleaders NBA style! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Preferably real video and not 2d please.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Wazzerphuk:
    It would also be useful if people were able to cite actual evidence, rather than just saying "currently this does this" with nothing to back it up. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Good idea. I'll dig out some screenshots.

  49. #49
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nomis07:
    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TSmith91:
    Player fights, Mass brawls, crowd invasions, streakers, players dying of heart attacks in the middle of games.

    Just a few things which I'd like to see. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Prat </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    Can I just remind you of the ground rules please? I don't agree with TSmith's suggestions, either (apart from mass brawls) and his comment on players dying of heart attacks was tasteless in the extreme. But you have to respect others' views, even if they don't match your own.

    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GillsMan_Returns:
    GROUND RULES
    With the number of threads that turn into slanging matches here are the ground rules:
    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    <LI> Please respect others' views, even if you disagree - do so politely[/list] </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

  50. #50
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    In a nutshell FM needs something to help analyses matches better because watching the match engine and trying to link it back to tactical settings is a difficult task.

    None of us a privvy to the coding that goes behind the match engine but at most times it feels like that's what us players need to know to even get a basic understanding.

    The match engine and tactics need less ambiguity and needs something to help link the two together.

  51. #51
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    I can confirm that keepers being sent off for handball and players being booked for diving definitely happens in the game, having experienced both instances in the space of 3 games. I had no idea that keepers were ever sent off until I won a penalty where the opposition keeper brought down my striker and was dismissed. However, I was far more disappointed to find that in a later game my keeper came charging off his line and was sent off for handball just outside the area.

    As for diving, I had Mark Viduka booked for diving in the first half of a game. 5 minutes after half time in the same game Viduka picked up a second booking, also for diving. I don't think players should be able to pick up 2 bookings for the offence in 1 match, surely any player would have the sense not to try to con a referee twice in one game.

  52. #52
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    I've only just seen this thread and it makes a refreshing change for a thread like this to exist in GQ nowadays so I'll respond to the points others have made if that's ok, and hopefully this will give me a chance to come up with some ideas of my own while I'm going through it.

    Well done GillsMan .

    ps. Why the change from the grey &lt;Gillsman&gt; to the proper Gillsman? I always assumed that the &lt; &gt; meant the user had been banned .

    1. Booking for midfielders . I must admit that although I found this s problem out of the box, I haven't ancountered a problem with this at all with 8.01. I would probably agree that defenders don't keg booked enough though .

    2. Crossbar being struck. I saw it a few times and then not for ages and have already seen it struck 3 times in the opening 8 or 9 games this season. Doesn't get hit as mich as the post though so I suppose I would agree .

    3. Injury time. Agree . It does seem too high too often for no real reason. If you are watchiung the full match and there are a spate of fouls or 1 team is time-wasting then fair enough, but the given is that there are an additional 2 minutes on top of what is announced and it can often be more.

    4. Shots coming down off the crossbar. I like that one, and even straight up off the crossbar. It doesn;t always have to bounce straight back into play, it could go straight up and cause an almighty scramble underneath.

    5. Keeper mistakes like fumbles etc being flagged in commentary. Yeah, and the weather playing a more importnat role in this sort of thing too.

    6. Free-kicks. To be honest the set-pieces in general need work. I appreciate it must be a VERY hard area to work on, and I do think that things have moved on from FM07, but we need a bit of an overhaul on set-pieces in general, (both attacking and defensive).

    7. Players throwing themselves in the way of shots. I know it's hard to tell from a little blob, but I thought that this happened already. It certainly seems like it to me.

    8. Players shielding the ball to go out for a goalkick. Agreed .

    9. Goaline controversy - did it cross the line or not? Yeah , similar to 2.

    10. Ball in Corner - Keeping the ball in the corner to waste time at a set piece . Isn't this already in the game. I thought that if you instructed the players to time-waste, had a defensive mentality set and instructed free-kicks to be played short then this would happen. Time-wasting in other areas certainly seems more effective.

    11. Diving - does this happen in the game? If not, look out Didier...(i'm a Man Utd fan so unfortunately no Cristiano slagging. Yeah, already a decent addition to the ME.

    12. Mass Brawls. I would like to see this brought back in, if in deed it has been removed. The problem appears to be getting it to happen often enough within the right type of squad, but not too muvh accross the board. It should be the exception rather than the rule and something that you may go seasons and seasons without seeing.

    13. Crowd invasions. No .

    14. Streakers. No .

    15. Players dying. I know this brings out strong feeling in people, (and as someone who's Uncle was in FM07 but passed away and is not now in FM08) I appreciate that it is an emotive issue. The counter argument I would provide to people who want to discuss the subject in a reasonable manner, is that the game already provides the oppsite end of the spectrum by you having the ability to bring your son through the ranks. I suppose it could be argues that if SI have introduced the ability for you to have children and for them to be included in the game, (which is an excellent addition although sadly not one that I have experienced), then it would only be right and fitting for the opposite end of the spectrum to be given the same chances. I can see the pro's and con's, but I must admit that I would be in favour of this being added to the game .

    16. Keepers actually moving at corners and free kicks. I'm gonna have to keep an eye out for this because I can't say that I've noticed .

    17. Players sometimes seeking retribution for a late tackle. Yeah, afters. Like it . Sort of fits in with 12.

    18. More bookins for dissent. Agreed . From too many in FM07 it's gone completely in FM08.

    19. Less of players throwing the ball directly out of play from a throw in. Haven't ever seen that.

    20. Underdog team actually trying something else other than time wasting in first half. Agreed .

    21. More balanced one-on-ones. I think that's a given .

    22. More Xabi Alonso type shots when the keeper goes up for a last minute corner. As someone who's GK has scored approachin 50 goals I can confirm that this not only happens but happens increasingly more often at a higher level. I think this is VERY well coded .

    23. Defender going mad at team mate for playing a forward onside, if playing offsides. Yeah, like it .

    24. Captain making some kind of effort to make his team play better. Haven;t got the foggiest how you wouldn implement something like that but I like the idea .

    25. Chipped penalties and players waiting for keeper to dive before hitting penalties. I think this ties in with 6. Both attacking and defensive set-pieces need a lot of work .

    26. Wingers dropping back to cover advancing fullback gap. If you get the tactical instructions correct I think this is already in the game .

    27. Less of players, in my experience mostly wingers, passing the ball into the position they have just vacated only for it to harmlessly run out of play. Haven't noticed that I'm afraid .

    28. Injury feigning and players going mad at them for doing so. Like it .

    29. Drop balls when ref stops play for bad injury. It's part of the game. It's gotta be in there .

    30 Players seperating at penalty shootout. Great idea. Sometimes they could all line up in a line and other times they could just sit in a group .

    31. Manager jump out of seat. No, because that's us .

    32. More 1 touch passing. I see plenty of that .

    33. It still annoys me that when a ball is played over the top, the defender just stands there or runs the opposite way whilst the striker runs through on goal. Seems to happen all the time. Agreed. It's like the eegit defender is playing offside, (poorly), when you aren't trying to play offsides .

    --------------------------------------------

    Apologies. If Nomis07, TheFuzzyOne or somethinglessannoying suggested anything reasonable, I won't know because they are on my list.

    ---------------------------------------------

    There are some brilliant ideas already but I have come up with acouple of average ones myself.


    GK momentum forcing them out of the box on occasion when retrieving the ball on the edge of the area.

    Subs warming up only behind referees assistant, not the whole length of the pitch, (courtesy of SiBHA).

    I would like to see more headers and miss-kicks going straight up in the air.

    Goal-kicks going straight off the pitch for GK's with poor kicking attributes.

    Far more control over bothy attacking and fdefensice set-pieces. (In particular I want the ability to specify which player to man-mark which player at defensive set-pieces).

    Excellent thread .

  53. #53
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    I would like to know if the player scored with hes head or feet more often. Its always just a "Nice finish", "goal ...xxx scores" or "its in!!!" on corners and rebound, close shots inside the penalty area.

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    I agree with the crossbar and the manager icon.
    I forgot to mention one thing on my last post
    I would really like to be able to scream things from the sideline.
    Like motivate some players, or disagree with the oficial would be great

  55. #55
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Wazzerphuk:
    It would also be useful if people were able to cite actual evidence, rather than just saying "currently this does this" with nothing to back it up. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Yes, examples of these things happening would help a lot

  56. #56
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    I have to say that I'm generally quite happy with the match engine. But I do have a few things I'd like to see changed:
    [LIST]
    <LI> Can the number of bookings be tweaked for midfielders? I play normal tackling, yet Andrew Crofts has 16 yellows and 1 red in 36 games; Adam Miller has 15 yellows and 2 reds in 35 games, Aaron Brown has 7 yellows in 32 games (he is a pussy left winger) whilst Jody Morris (yeah, fair enough) has 9 yellows and 1 red in a similar amount of games. One midfielder might get a lot, but to have three midfielders on a high amount is extraordinary. Conversely, my defenders don't have many bookings.
    <LI> I don't think I've ever seen the crossbar struck. The posts rarely get struck either (unless a goal is scored via the post). This, IMO, should be tweaked up a bit.
    <LI> Whilst the 4th official signals the MINIMUM amount of overtime, this is usually adhered to IRL. It's only occasionally that it goes over the suggested minimum IRL, yet in the game it happens a bit too often in my opinion.

    More suggestions to follow as and when I think of them.

  57. #57
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    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    Players being clean through on an open goal.
    Players storming off after a sub.
    Players rounding the keeper.
    A chip every so often, there were loads in CM but I never see it in FM.
    Goalkeeper red card.
    Pass back rule.
    Players booked for over celebrating.
    Manager getting sent off (this could rely on your reputation and temprement).[/list]
    Oh yeah and a video of cheerleaders at half time rather than a team talk would go down a treat.

  58. #58
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TheFuzzyOne:
    hey, you have to admit cheerleaders were a good idea... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    We had them at Gillingham for one season IRL. A load of 11-14 year old Chatham girls. Queue chants of "get your t*ts out for the lads". Bit wrong really. Hideous idea in all honesty (IRL, anyway).

  59. #59
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    One improvement for the ME concerns players running away from, or right past, the ball. This often happens after set pieces, when players return to their default positions.

    It might be worthwhile having players adopt a position relative to where they are on the field at least until they can find a "moment" to return to their default position.

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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kriss:
    If FM ever has cheer leaders they'll certainly be modelled on Marc Duffy and Graeme Kelly </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    Now I really need some Irn-Bru to avoid getting sick

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    I left out -

    11. When a player shoots really hard, the ball appears to "teleport" from the kicking position into the stands, i.e. it looks ridiculously too fast on the ME. Please slow them down a tad.

  62. #62
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GAVIN42:
    After reading the Fanzine article on "Domino Toppling" i think a problem with implementing these rare events is that by implementing them they end up happening too often, and you would then have people complaining that their keeper gets sent off for handling all the time. I think it must be incredibly hard for SI to get these things just right but i like the principle very much! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

    whs.

  63. #63
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    Gills. Don't be worried about getting the game. Go out and buy it today.

    It was awful out of the box, (don't get me started), but I think the 8.01 patch was pretty good, (less said about the beta patch the better).

    There seem to be issues but nothing that can't be dealt with, (with the possible exception of the Spanish refistration bug).

    The match engine is honestly excellent .

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    Interesting point there about players rounding the 'keeper. I don't remember the last time I saw that happen in FM.

  65. #65
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Nomis07:
    <UL TYPE=SQUARE>
    Players being clean through on an open goal.
    Players storming off after a sub.
    Players rounding the keeper.
    A chip every so often, there were loads in CM but I never see it in FM.
    Goalkeeper red card.
    Pass back rule.
    Players booked for over celebrating.
    Manager getting sent off (this could rely on your reputation and temprement).[/list]
    Oh yeah and a video of cheerleaders at half time rather than a team talk would go down a treat. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    that last one is classic...
    who cares about team talks! bring on cheerleaders NBA style!

  66. #66
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    I thought I had read in here that someone had requested that GK's should be more prone to come out theur goal and head the ball clear in certain situations.

    I can't find it now bit I;ve just seen it happen. A lot of the time I don't think I'm aware of whether the GK headed it clear or hoofed it clear because the commentary is gone before I see it, but it was the case this time .

    ps. Needless to say the ball went straight to an opposition player who slotted home from 40 yards but it's the thought that counts .

  67. #67
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    Gills. I threw my toys out of my pram a bit over the state of the game out of the box, (ok I threw them out of the pram a lot), but I'm really enjoying the game at the moment even with the "grey" isuue and the problems with my favourite new feature "best eleven".

    I'm really enjoying it .

  68. #68
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    Time issues (because game time is precious to me):

    1. Stop making me watch the player walk toward the referee for his booking, ticking off or lecture. Just tell me it happened.

    2. When the ball goes astray prior to a corner, free kick or penalty, have it re-set to the proper location immediately.

    3. When matches go to PKs, don't make me watch one keeper walk out of goal and the other walk in while the next shooter walks to the spot. Somehow, the drama is lost in a computer game.

    4. When a team is timewasting, please don't show me in 2-D. Scan ahead, as the game often does in other instances, and tell me what they did.

    For actual gameplay:

    1. I second those who ask for a little less playing catch with keeper, particularly when the keeper is well out of position and the attacker shoots it right at him anyway.

    2. Players IRL check to the ball, but I never see it in FM. On the contrary, I often see players running away from a pass to them (presumably to make space), thereby allowing a defender to cut out the pass.

    3. Greater differentiation in style and quality of play from lower leagues to premier leagues. Actually, FM08 seems to have made some nice improvements, here, but I'd like to see it continue.

    4. Technically, this is more tactical than ME, but if adopted, the ME would need to be adjusted. Quite often, the instruction I want to be able to give my players is either to play goalside or play ballside. Unfortunately, I can only tell them to tightly mark or close down, which is not the same thing. When I coached IRL, I usually gave instructions of this sort.

  69. #69
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    yes, a manager's seat would be much appreciated
    also i'd like a directors board so if the ball flies there i can have a good ol' laugh at Whelan getting hit

  70. #70
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    Not sure if this has anything to do with the ME but I really cannot stand the sound effects on matchday. They seem to have been unchanged for so many years.

  71. #71
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    the main thing i would like to s added to the match engine is the ability for managers to shout orders at there players who arent performing or following yor orders or to make some tactical changes. and at refs when they make poor decisions. id prefer this to be done with the use of a head set and a list of shoutble commands the computer will recognise, this way my shouting at the screen will have an actual purpose other than merly realeasing my frustration. but a control panel n he screen would do i suppose,lol.

  72. #72
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    <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by GillsMan:
    I've opened a couple of threads discussing the ME, so yeah, go FM08!

    </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
    In fact, I opened this thread! (Albeit, under a different username which has now been deleted).

  73. #73
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    Lets not do this as just things to be fixed though- how about also putting in things we see in games that dont (or we dont think) happen in FM.

    For me Id love to see:

    * Shots coming down off the crossbar. Maybe controversy over whether it crossed the line or not if it comes out.

    * Keeper mistakes like fumbles etc being flagged in commentary.

    * Players running over the ball at freekicks.

    * Quick freekicks.

    * Players throwing themselves in the way of shots.

    * Players shielding the ball to go out for a goalkick.

  74. #74
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    After reading the Fanzine article on "Domino Toppling" i think a problem with implementing these rare events is that by implementing them they end up happening too often, and you would then have people complaining that their keeper gets sent off for handling all the time. I think it must be incredibly hard for SI to get these things just right but i like the principle very much!

  75. #75
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    Keepers actually moving at corners and free kicks.

  76. #76
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    If FM ever has cheer leaders they'll certainly be modelled on Marc Duffy and Graeme Kelly

  77. #77
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    I'd like to see greater interaction with the board, staff etc.

    The board interaction has not been improved in a few years now and one particular feature that I would love to see is a job interview, something that I beleive was available on an old Xbox version.

    A more indepth press conference before big matches would be nice but may become irritating if it happens too often.

    Despite this I would like to stress that adding too many quirky features could be to the detriment of the game and if we want things like sponsorship deals and buying cars etc just look at how crap Fifa Manager is.

  78. #78
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    It would also be useful if people were able to cite actual evidence, rather than just saying "currently this does this" with nothing to back it up.

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