Activation of Football Manager 2009

[bcooper]

Hi,

I've seen reports on here about stores selling the game early and so want to clear up the activation of the game issue.

In the interests of fairness for both retailers and players we have made the decision to turn on the authentication / activation system for street date of 14th November. That decision was taken to try to give everyone a level playing field, for retailers it should mean that there is less incentive to break street date and less disadvantage that do the responsible thing and sell the game on the day of release. For players it means that everyone gets to play the game at the same time and those that have bought or pre-ordered from retailers that hold to the release date aren't left in a position where they wait for their copy whilst others are playing the game.

Despite this, it seems that some retailers are selling the game already. That's disappointing for us as it causes problems and disappointment for the people buying the game, as they won't be able to play it until the release date.

To those that have already bought copies of the game I apologise for the frustration having the game but not playing will cause. It wasn't supposed to be a position you would find yourself in, and I can only ask for your patience in waiting until the release date to play the game. For those of you that will see the game on sale before the 14th, please again understand that you won't be able to play it until release date.

All I can say is that this is done with the best of intentions for you, for the retailers, and to protect the game itself. Please believe me when I say I know how frustrating the situation is, I've been working on the marketing for the game for months and months (we shot the pack image back in May) and I can't wait to actually play the game. I have copies of the game under my desk and I cannot play them for the same reason you can't, and that is the 100% honest truth. Until Friday please continue to play the demo and, when Friday comes round, I hope you enjoy playing the full game as much as I will.

Thanks
Ben

[Lordarod]

Can you explain why was this authentication / activation system was introduced please.

[DougyMarshall]

Well said.

It will certainly keep me from worrying about when i can get a copy, and itll give me a chance to get the multiple games i just got finished.

[Richardav]

thank you for telling us.

[lee50_11]

thanks for the info

[Abs_UK]

question: when does this activation start? 00:01 in the mroning of the 14th?

[Ozzy38]

Can you explain why was this authentication / activation system was introduced please.

Didn't he just explain it? Last year they had to release the game 2 days earlier because so many shops broke the law and released it before the date.

[Lordarod]

Didn't he just explain it? Last year they had to release the game 2 days earlier because so many shops broke the law and released it before the date.

--sorry.

[Cullen89]

Hi,

I've seen reports on here about stores selling the game early and so want to clear up the activation of the game issue.

In the interests of fairness for both retailers and players we have made the decision to turn on the authentication / activation system for street date of 14th November. That decision was taken to try to give everyone a level playing field, for retailers it should mean that there is less incentive to break street date and less disadvantage that do the responsible thing and sell the game on the day of release. For players it means that everyone gets to play the game at the same time and those that have bought or pre-ordered from retailers that hold to the release date aren't left in a position where they wait for their copy whilst others are playing the game.

Despite this, it seems that some retailers are selling the game already. That's disappointing for us as it causes problems and disappointment for the people buying the game, as they won't be able to play it until the release date.

To those that have already bought copies of the game I apologise for the frustration having the game but not playing will cause. It wasn't supposed to be a position you would find yourself in, and I can only ask for your patience in waiting until the release date to play the game. For those of you that will see the game on sale before the 14th, please again understand that you won't be able to play it until release date.

All I can say is that this is done with the best of intentions for you, for the retailers, and to protect the game itself. Please believe me when I say I know how frustrating the situation is, I've been working on the marketing for the game for months and months (we shot the pack image back in May) and I can't wait to actually play the game. I have copies of the game under my desk and I cannot play them for the same reason you can't, and that is the 100% honest truth. Until Friday please continue to play the demo and, when Friday comes round, I hope you enjoy playing the full game as much as I will.

Thanks
Ben

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

[jaradthescot]

Thanks for the explanation

[Mr.S!N]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

What are you going on about?

[Ozzy38]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs.

Please, enlighten us and tell us the truth. What's the real, dark reason for the authentication process? I bet it's interesting!

[jod123]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

What are you on about?

[Abs_UK]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

Why do i have the feeling you are actually trying to start arguments or looking to find faults with everything?

oh yea and the demo is not unplayable for me.. iam enjoying actually..

[VonBlade]

Hi,
All I can say is that this is done with the best of intentions for you, for the retailers, and to protect the game itself.

Well let's see shall we.

Best intentions for us. Some people have paid for and got a game they can't yet play. Doesn't help them. Those of us who pre-order incase Play or whatever deliver a day early. Doesn't help them. People who haven't yet got the game. Can't help them can it.

Ok let's try the retailers. They sell a game, make money from it, don't care if you can play it or not. Can't see how this activation system helps them, or even if they'd notice it. Ok let's try the game.

The game itself. How does it need protecting from people playing it early? Will it get all upset because it didn't have time to get a hair cut or press its suit before it was needed? Unlikely *grin*. Perhaps it's a protection from piracy. Well nothing has ever worked in that department either. Damn this isn't holding up to much scrutiny is it.

Maybe it's the secret option D and that's Sega/SI not being inundated with bug reports and technical queries before they were expecting them.

Hmmmm. Answers on a postcard as who exactly it protects.
VB

[Kriss]

cause we aint mugs.

Some are obviously.

[Cullen89]

Please, enlighten us and tell us the truth. What's the real, dark reason for the authentication process? I bet it's interesting!

What are you going on about?

My comment was in reference to this "I have copies of the game under my desk and I cannot play them for the same reason you can't, and that is the 100% honest truth". I take real issue to being treated like I'm sort of muppet. Fair enough, he works for the company so there must be some perks (early release and all that) but don't come on here patronising people who also have the game and can't actually play it.

[Cullen89]

Some are obviously.

I put it to you: only a "mug" would be a sycophant.

[Glyn]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

You post iin another thread asking for someone to tell us 'what the script is', then when they take the time to do so, you sit there and baldly say you disbelieve it. Presumably you'd already decided what the situation is and approached this thread with a closed mind. Perhaps you'll enlighten us all with your superior knowledge?

[Kriss]

I put it to you: only a "mug" would be a sycophant.

Nope, only a mug would buy a product which is not useable until an advertised date and then expect the company to change it's carefully planned procedure because he's impatient.

[r0x0r]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

Do you work for Eidos?

What is this wool they are pulling over our eyes? If they wanted us to be able to activate, we would be able to. If it was an invalid batch of cd keys issue, some would already be in, and they'd WANT to recall the others pre-launch.

[treble_yell_:-)]

so its got nothing to do with soft anchor encrypting the software until the day of release ?

http://www.sddt.com/Commentary/artic...de=20080922tbi

[Mr.S!N]

My comment was in reference to this "I have copies of the game under my desk and I cannot play them for the same reason you can't, and that is the 100% honest truth". I take real issue to being treated like I'm sort of muppet. Fair enough, he works for the company so there must be some perks (early release and all that) but don't come on here patronising people who also have the game and can't actually play it.

Why is it so hard to belive that? If he works in the Marketing department for SEGA why would he have special treatment from SI?

Its the same kind of thing for me, I work at company who in turn works for 20th Century Fox.....but I dont get to see any films earlier than you would.

[Glyn]

Fair enough, he works for the company

He doesn't work for SI, so would have no real access to the game code other than manufactured copies, which would require authentication the same as everybody else's. The mods will probably get their copies a couple of days early, but we'll have to wait the same as everybody else too.

But no doubt you'll think I'm lying as well.

[bcooper]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

Sorry Cullen89, that is the truth. I can only assume you are referring to me not being able to play the code. That is true. I have access to the demo like everyone else. I've come on here to respond to people's questions and I am not pulling the wool over your, or anyone else's, eyes.
In terms of the demo, I don't by any means agree that it is unplayable , however that is something that has been covered in other threads.

[ReallyMadrid]

If one would find the demo unplayable, then being able to play the full game won't change matters, because it would be exactly the same since the patch isn't out yet. So that's no reason to complain about this authentication.

I wonder though if like some people on this forum have remarked already, if the illegal gamers will be able to play the game before the ones that actually buy it?

Not that this would necessarily make the authentication a bad (or good) thing, but it would be somewhat weird.

[balaban]

I wonder though if like some people on this forum have remarked already, if the illegal gamers will be able to play the game before the ones that actually buy it?

In the game industry these days, that's the norm rather than the exception

[bcooper]

My comment was in reference to this "I have copies of the game under my desk and I cannot play them for the same reason you can't, and that is the 100% honest truth". I take real issue to being treated like I'm sort of muppet. Fair enough, he works for the company so there must be some perks (early release and all that) but don't come on here patronising people who also have the game and can't actually play it.

I was treating you like an adult by being honest with you, not a muppet, and I wasn't patronising you, sorry if you think I was. Usually we get to play games early that are published by us. That's even normally the case with FM, and would be with FMH09. However, the authentication servers are not on, I can't activate the copies I have of FM09 any more than anyone else as I have retail copies that need authenticating.
There are plenty of perks of the job, but playing FM09 this year early isn't one of them. However, that's not the point of my post and I hope whether you believe me or not doesn't derail the thread.

Thanks
Ben

[Richardav]

bcooper

sorry just asking what team are you on the demo or planning to be when you play the full game

[Cullen89]

I was treating you like an adult by being honest with you, not a muppet, and I wasn't patronising you, sorry if you think I was. Usually we get to play games early that are published by us. That's even normally the case with FM, and would be with FMH09. However, the authentication servers are not on, I can't activate the copies I have of FM09 any more than anyone else as I have retail copies that need authenticating.
There are plenty of perks of the job, but playing FM09 this year early isn't one of them. However, that's not the point of my post and I hope whether you believe me or not doesn't derail the thread.

Thanks
Ben

You have my sincerest apologies then mate. I will no longer post in this thread.

[03bault]

good idea **** those idiots who get it early and want to play. too right you shoud wait for relsease date like everybody else

[craigy18181]

Sorry Cullen89, that is the truth. I can only assume you are referring to me not being able to play the code. That is true. I have access to the demo like everyone else. I've come on here to respond to people's questions and I am not pulling the wool over your, or anyone else's, eyes.
In terms of the demo, I don't by any means agree that it is unplayable , however that is something that has been covered in other threads.

we all appreicate your time ben. thanks for the response

[Mr.S!N]

bcooper.....I don't suppose you'd be able to tell us the time you can activate over Steam, and whether the patch will be available at that same time or later in the day?

[Peter G]

Yeah like I believe that for a second "mate". Don't try pull the wool over our eyes sunshine cause we aint mugs. Also, fantastic advice keep playing the demo! Eh, one, small problem captain it's not actually playable.

You see this is what really get's my goat, people who moan about the game , when i doubt they've even looked at it in detail and completely disregard the work that the producers have put into actually making the game for us, the retailer. Miles and the others, sorry don't know your names, have put in countless hours of work to make sure that they release the demo and the full game on time to certain specifications. They haven't failed from my recolection in 5 years of FM'ing. Miles even said in his recent blog that some members of the team had been up since 4am in the morning, with shifts the next day from 9am in the morning.

How would you feel to be told that despite losing sleep, literally, the game wasn't good enough without at least explaining the problems or at least giving a decent reason to why it's not playable. You sitting there saying that you simply can't play it doesn't help the game develop, it hinders it because they rely on customer feedback to add to the game and make it better for next years release. So for god sake at least state why you don't think it's playable.

I'm not saying that you don't have a voice and that we should just accept rubbish games when they are made but some people give no regard to the work they put in and are totally ignorant in what they say. I for one would like to thank SI for making the game for the past 5 years and to keep up the good work.

[Richardav]

You see this is what really get's my goat, people who moan about the game , when i doubt they've even looked at it in detail and completely disregard the work that the producers have put into actually making the game for us, the retailer. Miles and the others, sorry don't know your names, have put in countless hours of work to make sure that they release the demo and the full game on time to certain specifications. They haven't failed from my recolection in 5 years of FM'ing. Miles even said in his recent blog that some members of the team had been up since 4am in the morning, with shifts the next day from 9am in the morning.

How would you feel to be told that despite losing sleep, literally, the game wasn't good enough without at least explaining the problems or at least giving a decent reason to why it's not playable. You sitting there saying that you simply can't play it doesn't help the game develop, it hinders it because they rely on customer feedback to add to the game and make it better for next years release. So for god sake at least state why you don't think it's playable.

I'm not saying that you don't have a voice and that we should just accept rubbish games when they are made but some people give no regard to the work they put in and are totally ignorant in what they say. I for one would like to thank SI for making the game for the past 5 years and to keep up the good work.

well said mate

[saberhagen83]

good idea **** those idiots who get it early and want to play. too right you shoud wait for relsease date like everybody else

That's kinda silly. So if you go into a store and find a game you would like to buy (not knowing actual release dates). You buy it, come home and find out you cannot activate it. Potential loss in sales I think...

Sure the stores selling these games early are doing wrong. But why is the customer punished for it? You have to remember not everyone playing games are surfing through all these forums and official sites for games they pick up in a store. I didn't come to any SI/FM site before last year.

[Cullen89]

You see this is what really get's my goat, people who moan about the game , when i doubt they've even looked at it in detail and completely disregard the work that the producers have put into actually making the game for us, the retailer. Miles and the others, sorry don't know your names, have put in countless hours of work to make sure that they release the demo and the full game on time to certain specifications. They haven't failed from my recolection in 5 years of FM'ing. Miles even said in his recent blog that some members of the team had been up since 4am in the morning, with shifts the next day from 9am in the morning.

How would you feel to be told that despite losing sleep, literally, the game wasn't good enough without at least explaining the problems or at least giving a decent reason to why it's not playable. You sitting there saying that you simply can't play it doesn't help the game develop, it hinders it because they rely on customer feedback to add to the game and make it better for next years release. So for god sake at least state why you don't think it's playable.

I'm not saying that you don't have a voice and that we should just accept rubbish games when they are made but some people give no regard to the work they put in and are totally ignorant in what they say. I for one would like to thank SI for making the game for the past 5 years and to keep up the good work.

Here mate I live in the real world! I don't have time to look in detail at the inner workings of the game. And do you know why? Because if I did I wouldn't have a job, and ultimately I wouldn't be able to buy FM. So excuse me for living the life I can only afford to. Don't get me wrong I can emphasis with the guys who put the shifts, as a working man myself (7-5, Monday to Friday) but regardless I still get grief at work, but it's like water off a ducks back mate. Another thing, I've been a member here for nearly 5 years and I've never really posted mainly because I've always enjoyed and never had grievances from the games, so don't accuse me of posting stuff just for the sake of it because that's just not the case.

[Peter G]

For the record i'm 16 as of yesterday.

It was aimed directly at you, it was aimed at the people who always moan.

[Ozzy38]

That's kinda silly. So if you go into a store and find a game you would like to buy (not knowing actual release dates). You buy it, come home and find out you cannot activate it. Potential loss in sales I think...

Wrong. FM won't sell less because buyers will realize, or even know as they're buying, that they're buying before the release date. When they have purchased and taken it home, why wouldl they bother returning it just to buy it again, but with a risk it's no longer in stock?

These are the same people who can't be arsed to complain about the shop in the first place and find a scapegoat.

Sure the stores selling these games early are doing wrong. But why is the customer punished for it?

The customers aren't 'punished' in the slightest and if you're suggesting they are, you're being dramatic. Football Manager isn't emergency supplies, the game is released on the 14th. Whether you buy the physical package in advance still doesn't stop the fact that the game is released at a date where everyone gets it.

You have to remember not everyone playing games are surfing through all these forums and official sites for games they pick up in a store. I didn't come to any SI/FM site before last year.

They will look around for why the authntication code. If they don't hav ethe intelligence to figure out it's befor ethe release date, so of course it won't work, they'll find out what's going on with a little seaching, assuming it isn't alreay apparent in some documentation.

[Suttface]

Has Cullen89 gone yet? I'll check the attic, you check the cellar...

[jimhagen2309]

on the steam website they are unlocking the game on 13th october does this still mean waiting till 14th for authenticating it

[saberhagen83]

Wrong. FM won't sell less because buyers will realize, or even know as they're buying, that they're buying before the release date. When they have purchased and taken it home, why wouldl they bother returning it just to buy it again, but with a risk it's no longer in stock?

Seriously, how would they know the actual release date when picking it up at the store? Does the shop have a big sign somewhere that says they are selling it way early or something? Seriously a game that doesn't work will be returned by some people. This has been the case of other games having DRM systems, as well as slightly false advertising.

The customers aren't 'punished' in the slightest and if you're suggesting they are, you're being dramatic. Football Manager isn't emergency supplies, the game is released on the 14th. Whether you buy the physical package in advance still doesn't stop the fact that the game is released at a date where everyone gets it.

Right it's a GAME not a state secret, so what really is the big deal if a customer picks this up a bit early and can actually play it straight out of the box? I couldn't care less if 1000 people were playing it right now and I wasn't.

They will look around for why the authntication code. If they don't hav ethe intelligence to figure out it's befor ethe release date, so of course it won't work, they'll find out what's going on with a little seaching, assuming it isn't alreay apparent in some documentation.

Again, how will they know the release date? Yes they have to search for it. That shouldn't have to be done if you have bought the game! You really do expect everyone will just accept it's not working for a week? Sorry, I cannot see that happening. I'm not saying they will loose countless sales, but even loosing 10, 20, 100...whatever, it's bad enough IMHO. I'm just glad I haven't pre-ordered it and will certainly NOT be getting this a day early or anything...

[Gregg Carter]

on the steam website they are unlocking the game on 13th october does this still mean waiting till 14th for authenticating it

i suspect it'll be so that it will allow you to download the game itself to make sure that it's downloaded in time for the 14th.

[Ozzy38]

Seriously, how would they know the actual release date when picking it up at the store? Does the shop have a big sign somewhere that says they are selling it way early or something? Seriously a game that doesn't work will be returned by some people. This has been the case of other games having DRM systems, as well as slightly false advertising.

If they wanted the game so early, they will know the release date. They're not going to go in and go "hey there's Football Manager 2009. It only just got released and I didn't want it, but now that I see it I'm gonna buy it". Some stores do have a release date list also.

It is not a case of the game not working, it is a case of going through the process, then finding out what's happening and it would take little intelligence or knowledge to do this.

Right it's a GAME not a state secret, so what really is the big deal if a customer picks this up a bit early and can actually play it straight out of the box?

Yes it is illegal.

I couldn't care less if 1000 people were playing it right now and I wasn't.

And you are not everyone.

You really do expect everyone will just accept it's not working for a week?

Again, the game does work. It is a case of using the authenticating process, it not working. So then they will troubleshoot and contact support, either by goign to these forums ,which we ahve seen, contacting by phone or so on.

In fact if it was not working by computer, the very first thing I'd imagine everyone would do was try it by phone, at which point they will discover that they have to wait to play it at the release date. They will then say "but I bought it", and they will be informed the shop illegally sold it early. If the customer then has a problem with SI or Sega and not the shop because of this, tough luck to them, they need to get a brain. They should have a problem with the shop.

Either way they have paid for the game and they will play it just like everyone else.

[Gregg Carter]

Seriously, how would they know the actual release date when picking it up at the store? Does the shop have a big sign somewhere that says they are selling it way early or something? Seriously a game that doesn't work will be returned by some people. This has been the case of other games having DRM systems, as well as slightly false advertising.



Right it's a GAME not a state secret, so what really is the big deal if a customer picks this up a bit early and can actually play it straight out of the box? I couldn't care less if 1000 people were playing it right now and I wasn't.



Again, how will they know the release date? Yes they have to search for it. That shouldn't have to be done if you have bought the game! You really do expect everyone will just accept it's not working for a week? Sorry, I cannot see that happening. I'm not saying they will loose countless sales, but even loosing 10, 20, 100...whatever, it's bad enough IMHO. I'm just glad I haven't pre-ordered it and will certainly NOT be getting this a day early or anything...

They'll take it back to the shop - The shop will have to explain to them why the game is not working.

If they explain it in a way that suggests negativity towards Sports Interactive or SEGA and they find out about this, they can take the store to court.

If they explain it in a way that shows they sold it early and that they were in the wrong to do so, then it makes them look stupid and hopefully prevents them doing it in the future.

Games have release dates for a very good reason. It's good that the stores are being punished now for breaking them. Of course it's a shame that the consumer loses out, but that's an unfortunate situation of which SI have no responsibility towards at all.

[GillsMan]

Many people are unhappy about this - but fail to understand why it is that Sega would want to ensure that all stores sell the game at the same time (it is fairly obvious after all). The alternative, after learning that stores can't be trusted to stick to release dates is to either:

1) add authentication which, like the OP said, disincentivises stores from selling games early, or
2) only dispatch the games on 13 November, with the inevitable consequence that some stores won't receive them on time resulting in FURTHER disappointment.

[saberhagen83]

Games have release dates for a very good reason. It's good that the stores are being punished now for breaking them. Of course it's a shame that the consumer loses out, but that's an unfortunate situation of which SI have no responsibility towards at all.

Which would bring me to the question as to why the game has been sent out to retailers this early with a week untill release? Fully knowing that early releases always happen. Usually games come out a day or two before actual release, not a week. There must be some sort of shipping plan in use in order that every country/store would get the game on time but not too early either. I would have expected they send it out early next week, or possibly friday this week at the earliest.

And I agree, it is good that the store is puished. But I guess we'll never agree on the fact the buyer cannot play it out of the box. But then again, I'm very much anti-DRM.

[GillsMan]

Which would bring me to the question as to why the game has been sent out to retailers this early with a week untill release? Fully knowing that early releases always happen. Usually games come out a day or two before actual release, not a week. There must be some sort of shipping plan in use in order that every country/store would get the game on time but not too early either. I would have expected they send it out early next week, or possibly friday this week at the earliest.

And I agree, it is good that the store is puished. But I guess we'll never agree on the fact the buyer cannot play it out of the box. But then again, I'm very much anti-DRM.

To ensure that stores have full stock so that the gamers aren't disappointed when the store doesn't have the game on the day of release (which they'd invariably blame on the distributor).

[Major Raver]

They will have to activate at midnight between the 13th and 14th Nov, as if they don't do it till say 10am for example then customers will have the right to say they were sold a product on day of release and not able to use it the moment they had purchased without being given prior warning. The stores that sold the game on day will have to offer refunds for this and then have "legal practice" against the suppliers.

If you have a 24 hour store open that sells the game at 2am in the morning on the 14th November, no one is breaking any rules, but if they can't play this game due to an activation code not being available, then they do have grounds to say they have been sold the item "under false care of promise".

Now whilst its unlikely for any customer is to sue for this, i'm sure some idiot will try though, the bad press and PR could be very damaging. No matter how some will say it won't, I think your find once the press gets its teeth in and makes a big deal, it will damage. How many times have been seen a company say no problems, only to fall flat on its face?

I hope that Friday's forum isn't full of can't play due to the code not working threads, because the truth is the people that have bought the game on friday wanting to play it do deserve to be treated with respect. My big worry is some technical hitch that is out of SI's control happens and you then have thousands of very non understanding fans disgruntled! Please Sega and SI, I understand your reasonings and not wanting to be ripped off by pirates, but don't get this wrong for the fans on the 14th November! We are all very loyal, well most are

[Colorado]

Seriously, wind your neck in. Your coming across like a right one.

You remind of a kid who can't have a toy.

"don't patronise me" etc.. fool..

[GillsMan]

They will have to activate at midnight between the 13th and 14th Nov, as if they don't do it till say 10am for example then customers will have the right to say they were sold a product on day of release and not able to use it the moment they had purchased without being given prior warning. The stores that sold the game on day will have to offer refunds for this and then have "legal practice" against the suppliers.

If you have a 24 hour store open that sells the game at 2am in the morning on the 14th November, no one is breaking any rules, but if they can't play this game due to an activation code not being available, then they do have grounds to say they have been sold the item "under false care of promise".

Now whilst its unlikely for any customer is to sue for this, i'm sure some idiot will try though, the bad press and PR could be very damaging. No matter how some will say it won't, I think your find once the press gets its teeth in and makes a big deal, it will damage. How many times have been seen a company say no problems, only to fall flat on its face?

I hope that Friday's forum isn't full of can't play due to the code not working threads, because the truth is the people that have bought the game on friday wanting to play it do deserve to be treated with respect. My big worry is some technical hitch that is out of SI's control happens and you then have thousands of very non understanding fans disgruntled! Please Sega and SI, I understand your reasonings and not wanting to be ripped off by pirates, but don't get this wrong for the fans on the 14th November! We are all very loyal, well most are

As to your first point, it just wouldn't fly. Wouldn't fly at all. Think Sega are the first company to do this? Think Microsoft would still be doing if it was illegal and they had to keep paying out in court?

No. If you couldn't play the game until you activated it - what legislation would you sue under? In fact, I'll make it easier for you (because you couldn't sue under the grounds you suggested ) - what consumer legislation could, potentially, have been breached?


Sheesh. Perspective people, perspective.

As to your second point - I agree, I hope there are no activation problems too! I'm not buying the game til the new year, but I agree that it would be a disaster if the activation process was flawed.

[Alexandre]

Same question from other thread: If I got my copy before release day I could play it on Macintosh since there is no activation for Mac, couldn't I?

I know, it's unplayable without the patch. SI is smart, they made it so buggy assuming stores would sell FM before November 14th.

[Major Raver]

Gillsman, if someone is sold an item that they cannot use on the date that the manufacture says then they have been sold the item under false conditions! That is fact mate. No point in arguing with you, feel feel to ask trading standards! The point is that the realse date is for the 14th November, so as long as people are able to use the purchase on that date no problem, but if they cant then problems! The realease date is 14th November, not 10.30 on the 14th November and I think your find you have to put down a time if that is the case! You don't pay for a meal in a restaurant when you book a table and then be told you can't eat it on the day you have bought it or for another 10 hours.

My post wasn't a attack on anyone, it was a case of anyone moaning they had to wait till the 14th, well tough as SI games have the right to do that. And I pray for SI's hard work nothing goes wrong out of their control, as they don't deserve that. So mate, shiissh, read peoples posts properly first!

[Suttface]

Same question from other thread: If I got my copy before release day I could play it on Macintosh since there is no activation for Mac, couldn't I?

I know, it's unplayable without the patch. SI is smart, they made it so buggy assuming stores would sell FM before November 14th.

What does this even mean? Is this another post suggesting SI deliberately put bugs in their game? Get a grip.

[anthonykch]

that mean even tho i purchase a box game i still need to get online and activate it ????

[GillsMan]

Gillsman, if someone is sold an item that they cannot use on the date that the manufacture says then they have been sold the item under false conditions! That is fact mate. No point in arguing with you, feel feel to ask trading standards! The point is that the realse date is for the 14th November, so as long as people are able to use the purchase on that date no problem, but if they cant then problems! The realease date is 14th November, not 10.30 on the 14th November and I think your find you have to put down a time if that is the case! You don't pay for a meal in a restaurant when you book a table and then be told you can't eat it on the day you have bought it or for another 10 hours.

My post wasn't a attack on anyone, it was a case of anyone moaning they had to wait till the 14th, well tough as SI games have the right to do that. And I pray for SI's hard work nothing goes wrong out of their control, as they don't deserve that. So mate, shiissh, read peoples posts properly first!

Mate, I deal with Trading Standards on a fairly frequent basis, and my opinion of them couldn't be lower if I tried - bunch of clueless, idiotic you-know-whats. I'd suggest that YOU are probably more knowledgeable about their legislation than they are! Anyway, I digress. The thing is, you're taking the rationale when buying ordinary objects (such as a car) and applying it to the purchase of digital products - in this case software. You never actually own the software you purchase, you just buy the right to use the software, subject to the conditions set out by the distributor/developer. I don't think you'll get very far with your law suit - but best of luck to you anyway!

Edit - oh, and I did read your post properly. Not sure why you think I didn't?

[ron.e]

What are the ways in-which you can activate the game anyway?

[Alexandre]

Same question from other thread: If I got my copy before release day I could play it on Macintosh since there is no activation for Mac, couldn't I?

I know, it's unplayable without the patch. SI is smart, they made it so buggy assuming stores would sell FM before November 14th.

What does this even mean? Is this another post suggesting SI deliberately put bugs in their game? Get a grip.

It means I will be a great game, but without a patch I couldn't play the game even if I want, so doesn't matter whether there are some stores selling it or not.

[GillsMan]

What are the ways in-which you can activate the game anyway?

Online (inc Steam) and toll-free telephone number. Is there a postal option? Not sure - there should be, but I don't think there is.

[Gregg Carter]

Which would bring me to the question as to why the game has been sent out to retailers this early with a week untill release? Fully knowing that early releases always happen. Usually games come out a day or two before actual release, not a week. There must be some sort of shipping plan in use in order that every country/store would get the game on time but not too early either. I would have expected they send it out early next week, or possibly friday this week at the earliest.

And I agree, it is good that the store is puished. But I guess we'll never agree on the fact the buyer cannot play it out of the box. But then again, I'm very much anti-DRM.

I used to work in a GAME store. Going back around 6 years now. Even then, we'd be getting stock in of a game steadily for a week before the release date when it's a major seller. Earlier too in some cases.

It's standard procedure in the industry to ensure that there is enough supply to meet demand. A major reason that some games are sold out in the first weekend and not on shelves for another week or so in some cases these days is because some companies try to limit the amount of stock to prevent the street date being broken.

[Major Raver]

Gillsman, in my first post I said "Now whilst its unlikely for any customer is to sue for this, i'm sure some idiot will try though, the bad press and PR could be very damaging." You say you did read my post properly, yet you make a very poor statement of "I don't think you'll get very far with your law suit - but best of luck to you anyway!" Where have I said I would sue, think SI games are breaking the law, or am I against what they are doing???? In fact I said "it was a case of anyone moaning they had to wait till the 14th, well tough as SI games have the right to do that. And I pray for SI's hard work nothing goes wrong out of their control, as they don't deserve that."

Shocking accusations mate, your out of order. And as for trading standards, I don't care one bit for the charactor or IQ of the people who work for them, my point was what the regulations state.

I'm afriad you have made a poor argument, and have shown you didn't understand my post at all. To twist it the way you have shows that maybe you should have a look at your own charactor before commenting on others!

[Scott McC]

I work in a shop that stocks games and we normally get them earlier on in the week before the release on a Friday. However, they are very clearly marked with their release date and any retailer who has any clue what they're doing will not sell them before that date. We have a chart plan in-store that shows what games are currently out and in our chart and what games are upcoming for the following week. If a retailer is selling them early (especially this early) then they're either completely incompetent or fully aware they are breaking the street date, presumably hoping to get more business because of it.

EDIT: Obviously the retailers are entirely at fault here. The customer might not even be aware of the November 14th release date or assumed it has been changed.

[bdgr]

Well let's see shall we.

Best intentions for us. Some people have paid for and got a game they can't yet play. Doesn't help them. Those of us who pre-order incase Play or whatever deliver a day early. Doesn't help them. People who haven't yet got the game. Can't help them can it.

Ok let's try the retailers. They sell a game, make money from it, don't care if you can play it or not. Can't see how this activation system helps them, or even if they'd notice it. Ok let's try the game.

The game itself. How does it need protecting from people playing it early? Will it get all upset because it didn't have time to get a hair cut or press its suit before it was needed? Unlikely *grin*. Perhaps it's a protection from piracy. Well nothing has ever worked in that department either. Damn this isn't holding up to much scrutiny is it.

Maybe it's the secret option D and that's Sega/SI not being inundated with bug reports and technical queries before they were expecting them.

Hmmmm. Answers on a postcard as who exactly it protects.
VB

If you buy the game (any game) before the release date and can't play it due to an activation code being needed that won't work until the release date, then i'm sorry but it's your own damn fault for buying it before its officially released!! The shop you purchase the game from in this instance is trading illegally which in turn means that you have acted illegally by purchasing said product! Excuse me if I don't have any sympathy. Wait till the release date like everybody else does and stop being such an annoying little tit!

[Gregg Carter]

Gillsman, if someone is sold an item that they cannot use on the date that the manufacture says then they have been sold the item under false conditions! That is fact mate. No point in arguing with you, feel feel to ask trading standards! The point is that the realse date is for the 14th November, so as long as people are able to use the purchase on that date no problem, but if they cant then problems! The realease date is 14th November, not 10.30 on the 14th November and I think your find you have to put down a time if that is the case! You don't pay for a meal in a restaurant when you book a table and then be told you can't eat it on the day you have bought it or for another 10 hours.

My post wasn't a attack on anyone, it was a case of anyone moaning they had to wait till the 14th, well tough as SI games have the right to do that. And I pray for SI's hard work nothing goes wrong out of their control, as they don't deserve that. So mate, shiissh, read peoples posts properly first!

Standard trading hours start at 9am. So it would be reasonable for them to turn them on in time for standard trading hours.

Pretty sure that if (and it is an if) SI turn the Activation servers on for around 7 or 8am on the 14th November, that the response most people (outside of SI Towers) will get when complaining that they couldn't play the game at 3am in the morning will be "aww, diddums"

[Schotsmannetje]

Can someone confirm or deny that FM09 on Mac doesn't have to be registered to be able to play it? It's a rumour that's spreading around on this forum and I would really like to know as I only use Macs and apparently they're already selling the game here in The Netherlands where I live.

Besides that, would it be illegal if I would be able to buy and play the game before the release date?

[GillsMan]

1) Gillsman, in my first post I said "Now whilst its unlikely for any customer is to sue for this, i'm sure some idiot will try though, the bad press and PR could be very damaging." You say you did read my post properly, yet you make a very poor statement of "I don't think you'll get very far with your law suit - but best of luck to you anyway!" Where have I said I would sue, think SI games are breaking the law, or am I against what they are doing???? In fact I said "it was a case of anyone moaning they had to wait till the 14th, well tough as SI games have the right to do that. And I pray for SI's hard work nothing goes wrong out of their control, as they don't deserve that."

2) Shocking accusations mate, your out of order. And as for trading standards, I don't care one bit for the charactor or IQ of the people who work for them, my point was what the regulations state.

3) I'm afriad you have made a poor argument, and have shown you didn't understand my post at all. To twist it the way you have shows that maybe you should have a look at your own charactor before commenting on others!

1) The "best of luck in your lawsuit" was tongue in cheek - I didn't realise you'd take it literally. Sorry about that, one of the problems with posting on a message board is that it's not so easy to translate tone. I'd hoped that the made it clear I wasn't being serious, but I should have used the safety wink:

2) You're the one that suggested I asked Trading Standards. I was just offering a little titbit on my experiences with them. I thought it was quite clear that was simply an aside and wasn't intended to devalue your argument in any way.

3) I haven't commented on anyone's character? Calm down a little bit, I've not made a personal attack on anyone. I've just offered my POV. I've respected your argument, it's a shame you couldn't do the same.

[Abs_UK]

Can someone confirm or deny that FM09 on Mac doesn't have to be registered to be able to play it? It's a rumour that's spreading around on this forum and I would really like to know as I only use Macs and apparently they're already selling the game here in The Netherlands where I live.

Besides that, would it be illegal if I would be able to buy and play the game before the release date?

Why would it be illegal for you to buy, as you are buying a original copy.. however it will be illegal for the retailer to sell it to you...

[KUBI]

Can someone confirm or deny that FM09 on Mac doesn't have to be registered to be able to play it?

It's not a rumour, it's confirmed by SI, because there is no authenticiation service like steam for the mac.

It will work as the years before: To load the game the disk must be in the dvd device.

[Gregg Carter]

Why would it be illegal for you to buy, as you are buying a original copy.. however it will be illegal for the retailer to sell it to you...

because you are party to a contract that is in breech of another contract.

[Abs_UK]

because you are party to a contract that is in breech of another contract.

ok if i went and bought the game from TheGame shop before release date, and did not know how am i breaching any laws? its the retailers who know have sold it and i bought my copy thinking its fully legal..

[Gregg Carter]

ok if i went and bought the game from TheGame shop before release date, and did not know how am i breaching any laws? its the retailers who know have sold it and i bought my copy thinking its fully legal..

Ignorance isn't a defence in a court of law, however it is very unlikely that you would be prosecuted in a situation like this as common sense would prevail.

I'll give you an example.

You buy a Car off a dodgy car salesman - It's a stolen car.

You don't know this at the time, but when it's discovered to be the case, you have the car taken away from you.

You won't be prosecuted for it at all, just be left to feel silly for not doing all the proper checks when purchasing.

[VonBlade]

It's not a rumour, it's confirmed by SI, because there is no authenticiation service like steam for the mac.

It will work as the years before: To load the game the disk must be in the dvd device.

But Mac users can still pick up the phone right? Surely they aren't that backwards? *evil grin*.

Ahhh. Maybe the whole "not enough Mac users to bother copy-protecting it" is the true issue. So we can dispense with the facade that it's about a holistic end-user program tailored to provide a synergised release date experience, and agree it's all about the Benjamins.

Which we knew anyway but still....
VB

[Cleansation515]

If it wasnt pathetic enough that SI started using this crazy DRM ******** they also wont turn on the auth servers before release ?! It can never be the customers fault that he bought it before street date, good God i havent been able to get my dirty hands on this because i would be ****ed.

What if the game gets cracked before release ? Do we still not get to auth our games then ? I will cancel my order and download that then, typical video game biz today with the pirates getting the better version and before release.

Sorry about me being so angry but i havent had anything but trouble with Biohsock, red alert 3 and spore when i tried isntalling my LEGAL copy while the pirates were playing theirs.

[Abs_UK]

Ignorance isn't a defence in a court of law, however it is very unlikely that you would be prosecuted in a situation like this as common sense would prevail.

I'll give you an example.

You buy a Car off a dodgy car salesman - It's a stolen car.

You don't know this at the time, but when it's discovered to be the case, you have the car taken away from you.

You won't be prosecuted for it at all, just be left to feel silly for not doing all the proper checks when purchasing.

Well to counter that there is always HPI checks.. and another thing is say if i was to buy the car from a big car dealer?

Anyway i agree its silly talking about that, because that aint never gona happen

[GillsMan]

What if the game gets cracked before release ? Do we still not get to auth our games then ? I will cancel my order and download that then, typical video game biz today with the pirates getting the better version and before release.

Bye bye. *waves*

And VonBlade - I love your eternal cynicism! Between your cynicism and my optimism, there has to be the perfect medium!

[VonBlade]

Lmao. Thanks. I wear my misanthrope badge with pride

A cynic is an optimist with experience.
VB

[jptykes]

ok if i went and bought the game from TheGame shop before release date, and did not know how am i breaching any laws? its the retailers who know have sold it and i bought my copy thinking its fully legal..

Ignorance is no defence in the eyes of the law. That's why it's no use claiming you didn't know the speed limit if you're pulled over by the police, for example.

[Schotsmannetje]

I find it a very interesting issue though.

So basically as a Mac user, if I find the game tomorrow downtown (and here in Rotterdam, Holland you have a lot of "dodgy"/alternative games shops so the chance is there) I'd be able to play it, but it wouldn't be undefiled so to speak?

[Abs_UK]

What if the game gets cracked before release ? Do we still not get to auth our games then ? I will cancel my order and download that then, typical video game biz today with the pirates getting the better version and before release.

You been here since 2007 and should know not to make a comment like this...

[GillsMan]

A cynic is an optimist with experience.
VB

Yeah, well an optimist is a cynic on prozac.

What if the game gets cracked before release ? Do we still not get to auth our games then ? I will cancel my order and download that then, typical video game biz today with the pirates getting the better version and before release.

Sorry about me being so angry but i havent had anything but trouble with Biohsock, red alert 3 and spore when i tried isntalling my LEGAL copy while the pirates were playing theirs.

Yeah, BioShock was a horrendous example of how DRM can be bad, in fairness. Absolutely massively failed legitimate buyers.

[Abs_UK]

Ignorance is no defence in the eyes of the law. That's why it's no use claiming you didn't know the speed limit if you're pulled over by the police, for example.

completly different story..

Anyway i have never broken any law and dont intend to

[Cleansation515]

You been here since 2007 and should know not to make a comment like this...

I know but couldnt care less if i got banned for saying the truth, it isnt that hard getting a new ip and register again, dont use my account for anything else than see threads in hidden forums anyway.

[Schotsmannetje]

Ignorance is no defence in the eyes of the law. That's why it's no use claiming you didn't know the speed limit if you're pulled over by the police, for example.

That's not the same in my opinion (even though I know not how the law works). Speed limit is a rule for citizens, release dates surely only apply to retailers and not to costumers? You really can't expect people to walk through a music shop, see a CD they've been waiting for, from which they expected to come out a week later, and think: "Oh hang on I can't buy that CD yet, the release date is next monday."

[VonBlade]

I know but couldnt care less if i got banned for saying the truth, it isnt that hard getting a new ip and register again, dont use my account for anything else than see threads in hidden forums anyway and writing half-baked rantings and letting SI know I'm going to be pirating this game.

Fixed it for you.

[Cleansation515]

That's not the same in my opinion (even though I know not how the law works). Speed limit is a rule for citizens, release dates surely only apply to retailers and not to costumers? You really can't expect people to walk through a music shop, see a CD they've been waiting for, from which they expected to come out a week later and think: "Oh hang on I can't buy that CD yet, the release date is next monday."

Exactly, if anything Sega should stop sending out copies to small stores before release if they are so uptight about it. Sad that you go the EA way now Sega/SI.

Fixed it for you.

Only with the new pathetic copy protection.

[GillsMan]

Exactly, if anything Sega should stop sending out copies to small stores before release if they are so uptight about it. Sad that you go the EA way now Sega/SI.

That's right, penalise small businesses. Great idea.

[Cleansation515]

That's right, penalise small businesses. Great idea.

Is it better to penalise the legal customers who bought the game ? Great idea yes. The best idea would be for them to have the auth servers turned on.

[KUBI]

I guess the problem is the European release date. In the past it was first released in the UK and one or two weeks later on the continent. When a game comes to the retailer, they sell it. It's the wholesale who should hold it back until the official release date. It's a logistik problem and you need strong departments in every country to have the control.

[Gregg Carter]

Is it better to penalise the legal customers who bought the game ? Great idea yes. The best idea would be for them to have the auth servers turned on.

and then what is the deterrent for game stores to not break release dates in the future?

[T-Bag]

Whats happened here is proof that no game should ever use any kind of BS system like this.

[GillsMan]

Is it better to penalise the legal customers who bought the game ? Great idea yes. The best idea would be for them to have the auth servers turned on.

Sorry - in what way have customers been penalised?? The game was never available to play before 14th Nov anyway.

[Gregg Carter]

Whats happened here is proof that no game should ever use any kind of BS system like this.

No, What has happened here is proof that Game Stores cannot be trusted to not break the law.

[Cleansation515]

Sorry - in what way have customers been penalised?? The game was never available to play before 14th Nov anyway.

It doesnt say anywhere on the box "Cant be played before 14th nov" does it ? If it does then fair enough but yes some game stores releases it early often and it should be their problems dealing with SI not the customers who bought it.

[KUBI]

It's a real academic discussion, if people who can buy the game now should play it or not. When you buy a CD and the official release date is in one week, will you wait or will you put it in your player and listen? There is no activation restriction on the macintosh. You can´t blame anyone who does not want to wait until christmas, when the present is already in his room...

[VonBlade]

It doesnt say anywhere on the box "Cant be played before 14th nov" does it ?

Good point. Come on guys who've got it. Does it? Anywhere on the box? Hell even in the EULA?

[Ozzy38]

Why should it?

[Schotsmannetje]

and then what is the deterrent for game stores to not break release dates in the future?

I don't know what it's like in England, but here in The Netherlands games, films and CD's are always available in stores before the official release date, so it wouldn't make a difference here anyway. And I'm not only talking about smaller shops, but also the Dutch equivalents of Harrods and HMV break release dates as if they don't exist.

I don't get the point of release dates anyway. I know from a guy that works for Media Markt (big multimedia/electronics megastore-chain in Europe) that they got Fifa 09 2,5 (!) weeks in advance. Why send games that early anyway? I know they use a small margin in case there are logistical problems but almost 3 weeks in advance is just ridiculous.

You can't send games 3 weeks before the release date and then react surprised when the next day there are illegal copies on the net and costumers already have legal copies a week before the planned release date.

[Gregg Carter]

It doesn't have to.

The contract between SI/SEGA & The Vendors will state that the game has a release date of the 14th November. The contract between SI/SEGA and the Vendors that ensures they will be provided with stock of the game will be dependent on them agreeing not to sell the game before the 14th November.

If they have broken the contractual agreement, then they are at fault. SI have no responsibility whatsoever towards people who have a copy of the game due to this situation. If people are unhappy with the situation, then it is the responsibility of the vendor to deal with the situation.

[mertle]

this got to be the most pathetic excuse yet to justify restricting legit buyers from playing a game they purchased.

Sorry it has to be said how many on here have never been bothered about little charlie down the road getting lucky of having the game early in past versions because the postman delivered it early. Because I have not been jelous yes but not to want scream my head off call foul and demand the game to be released. On shops doing early release then do what most companies do stop them selling it by not giving them the game until it official release day that way NO BODY SUFFERS.

Whats so simple I am with Cleansation515 which makes the whole situation a complete farce that those who buy the game going to get massive raw deal. What was hard about looking after a storage medium CD/DVD. I wonder how many in 6 months will lose the code as manuals are more easily lost than a CD/DVD assuming the activation code will be on this like most activation codes.

I admit to losing many manuals myself over the years as you look at them for some guidance and forget to put it back then stupidly panicking if its an EA activasion rubbish one. CD/DVD are precious anybody loses them dont deserve a game simple. Its been the basis of computing forever to look after them only ones who break or go faulty I have sympythy. I admit they can crack as the boxes holding the disks have always been rubbish but I use those folders or even the 10 disk/50 disk cases to look after them and problem solved Never broken a disk ever by doing this.

[T-Bag]

You buy a legitimate product then you expect to be able to use it. You shouldn't be under any obligation to register it or any such nonsense to help the publisher's misguided delusions that it will somehow help piracy. You buy something, it's yours to use as you see fit... end of.