It's been a few days now, what is DEFINITELY going to get fixed?

[Sy13]

This is to SI...

Now that the forums are awash with the problems and bugs that people are experiencing, can SI please confirm in a list the issues they are planning to fix for definite in the release-day patch?

For example, we know injuries and premature text flashing before a goal is getting the attention, but what about all the other stuff like:

- Repeated offers from AI for one of your players, they just won't go away.
- 2D jerkiness and graphical glitches.
- Game freezing, crashing.
- Transfer news all jumbled and not in date order.
- Rapid degradation of physical condition in matches.
- Penalty shoot-outs... displayed goal scorers on match stats screen doesn't tally with live match screen.
- Following enquiries, AI teams saying they will accept £xxx for a player only to then reject it and demand double.
- in 3D mode, players just standing still for 5 seconds at a time and then having the ball taken off them.
- Keepers not diving for the ball when facing a penalty, just standing there.

Of course, there are plenty of other niggles that I haven't listed.
My question is, what exactly are SI planning on correcting for day 1. I'm sure by now they have sat down and discussed what can be sorted in time. So, what are they?

Keep up the good work lads.

[the blue ferret]

I actually find the physical degradation quite refreshing, it might be a little too severe, but perhaps more accurate than previous FM's. They have changed a lot in 09, you just have to take on board that different figures have a slightly different meaning in the new game. Plus making sure your tactics are such that your players dont tire too quickly and your training schedule is sufficent

[reflection22]

This is to SI...

Now that the forums are awash with the problems and bugs that people are experiencing, can SI please confirm in a list the issues they are planning to fix for definite in the release-day patch?

For example, we know injuries and premature text flashing before a goal is getting the attention, but what about all the other stuff like:

- Rapid degradation of physical condition in matches.

The degradation of physical condition is the most important issue that needs fixing, in my opinion. Resting a player for a week, and him still being on 91% condition, that sort of thing would really annoy me if it was still there after the first patch. It's a gamebreaker, as someone said in another thread. However, there was a similar problem with FM08 before the patches, so I have every confidence they will fix this as a priority.

[Ranbir]

It is a bit fast. Certain players are known to be capable of lasting 90 minutes and aren't doing so, even when I work them less. Lampard for me springs to mind. Either my assman is wrong or Lampard really is getting 'exhausted' rather quickly and frequently.

My real main concern that gets fixed in a patch right now is separate speed controls for Match and Highlights. I'm surprised SI decided to change that. I hope that isn't hard coded.

[bobatwal]

do the care, this will really test SI

[reflection22]

It is a bit fast. Certain players are known to be capable of lasting 90 minutes and aren't doing so, even when I work them less. Lampard for me springs to mind. Either my assman is wrong or Lampard really is getting 'exhausted' rather quickly and frequently.

My real main concern that gets fixed in a patch right now is separate speed controls for Match and Highlights. I'm surprised SI decided to change that. I hope that isn't hard coded.

Yea, the rapid deterioration of condition seems to be mainly a problem with midfielders and wingers. I have to rotate my whole midfield on a game by game basis, unless I want to start players on 85-90%. Subbing them off to try and rest them doesn't help either, as they don't 'regain' any fitness at your full-time team talk, like those who played the full 90 minutes do.

[Toothless Gibbon]

My real main concern that gets fixed in a patch right now is separate speed controls for Match and Highlights. I'm surprised SI decided to change that. I hope that isn't hard coded.

Im pretty sure that wont be in a patch.

[Nicolai87]

- Repeated offers from AI for one of your players, they just won't go away.
- 2D jerkiness and graphical glitches.
- Rapid degradation of physical condition in matches.

I don't really agree with the first point you're making. Real Madrid came in for Toure and tabled a bid of £6.5m, which I obviously turned down. They then continued to bid all the way up to £19.5 which I also rejected. They then tried the same bid again, which I turned down again, and after that I haven't heard anything from them. They actually made bids of £8.5m, £12m, £15m, £17m and then £19.5m twice. I really liked that.

The 2D jerkiness and graphical glitches is something I haven't experienced at all. The only graphical issues I've had is the "r" after 90:00, and it's happened twice that the game freeze, but the players are still making the running motion but nothing is happening and the time stops. A quick alt+tab in and out of FM solved this, though.

- Rapid degradation of physical condition in matches. Agreed.
I mean, Michael Kightley has a stamina of 10 (which is incredibly low for him), and I could understand that he finishes some games with a condition of 70%, but not below as sometimes happends in FM09. But then you take Xavi who started every game in my 10-game Barca save with more than 93%, who has a stamina of 16, but still ended up having a condition of 60-65% after about 50 minutes in almost every game.

I have a feeling that player condition goes down way too much in the first half, while it seems normal in the 2nd half. I.e. players dropping from 95% to 65% after the first half, and finishes the match with 62%. Happened to me alot.

[Sy13]

- Repeated offers from AI for one of your players, they just won't go away.
- 2D jerkiness and graphical glitches.
- Rapid degradation of physical condition in matches.

I don't really agree with the first point you're making. Real Madrid came in for Toure and tabled a bid of £6.5m, which I obviously turned down. They then continued to bid all the way up to £19.5 which I also rejected. They then tried the same bid again, which I turned down again, and after that I haven't heard anything from them. They actually made bids of £8.5m, £12m, £15m, £17m and then £19.5m twice. I really liked that.

I completely take on board what you're saying here. It is a very neat feature. I do think it needs a slight tweak though. For example, some people are reporting AI trying over and over again to loan a particular player which, of course, automatically gets rejected as directed by the user. However, the AI won't back off and keeps on making the same enquiry about the loan without taking the hint.

[SmurfDude]

I agree with all the problems you listed, they all really need to be sorted for release day. Because aside from that list, I can't think of much else that needs fixing

[reflection22]

I completely take on board what you're saying here. It is a very neat feature. I do think it needs a slight tweak though. For example, some people are reporting AI trying over and over again to loan a particular player which, of course, automatically gets rejected as directed by the user. However, the AI won't back off and keeps on making the same enquiry about the loan without taking the hint.

Why not just set it to reject all loan offers? That should put them off, and if not, at least you won't have to actually deal with it, it will be rejected automatically.

[kirkster69]

You forgot the dodgy keyboard bug that makes text llooookk lliikkee tthhiiss

[Nicolai87]

Keyboard thing is something that I've never experienced, by SI has promised that it will be fixed for the patch for those who have problems.

[Nicolai87]

Why not just set it to reject all loan offers? That should put them off, and if not, at least you won't have to actually deal with it, it will be rejected automatically.

Hm, does that work if, let's say, 10 club wants to loan a player from me. I set it to reject all loan offers and all of those 10 offers will automatically cancelled. But do the game remember this in two weeks time and will auto-reject a loan offer made for the same player?

[reflection22]

Hm, does that work if, let's say, 10 club wants to loan a player from me. I set it to reject all loan offers and all of those 10 offers will automatically cancelled. But do the game remember this in two weeks time and will auto-reject a loan offer made for the same player?

I believe so, yea. It should still work unless you manually change their loan status on the players' transfer status section. After you set it to reject all loan offers, this should always be the case until you change it yourself.

[Aussie King]

The rapid degradation of physical condition during a match frustrates me same with the keyboard

[kirkster69]

does anyone else think the 3d graphics arn't that good either? Is that the final product or just put together quickly for the demo?

[reflection22]

The rapid degradation of physical condition during a match frustrates me same with the keyboard

And it's nothing to do with pre-season games etc, this is in november, december it's still happening. It's a clear problem, that's been established. Do you find it's mostly your midfielders with whom you're having the trouble with condition degredation?

[SmurfDude]

does anyone else think the 3d graphics arn't that good either? Is that the final product or just put together quickly for the demo?

I'm perfectly happy with the 3D graphics, that isn't an issue at all

[Sy13]

The only reason I want to know if this stuff is going to get fixed is because it'll decide if I buy it or not. I'm going on holiday that weekend with no internet access so I want to play FM09 without these issues. If SI can promise these things will be fixed on day one then I'll buy it on day one. Otherwise, I'll stick with 07.

[Nicolai87]

And it's nothing to do with pre-season games etc, this is in november, december it's still happening. It's a clear problem, that's been established. Do you find it's mostly your midfielders with whom you're having the trouble with condition degredation?

I am, definitely. My two central midfielders and my wingers would have been carried off the pitch if their conditions went as low in real life as it does on FM. My two wingers have closing down "own area", while my two central midfielders have "own half", so surely that can't be the problem seeing as it worked just fine on FM08. Didn't change the training at all, either.

[kirkster69]

I didn't say I wasn't happy; it’s a good feature and all. I just wanted to know people’s opinions on the general quality of the graphics. I’ve seen somewhere in the game you can set detail levels for the sky and other things and as far as I know I’ve set everything on high but I think it looks very dated (especially the players) when compared to PES09 or FIFA for example.

[Nicolai87]

The only reason I want to know if this stuff is going to get fixed is because it'll decide if I buy it or not. I'm going on holiday that weekend with no internet access so I want to play FM09 without these issues. If SI can promise these things will be fixed on day one then I'll buy it on day one. Otherwise, I'll stick with 07.

Well, you're out of luck if you leave thursday night or on friday before the patch is released. It will only be available through download, not fixed for the DVD-version which I assume is the version you're getting.

[Aussie King]

And it's nothing to do with pre-season games etc, this is in november, december it's still happening. It's a clear problem, that's been established. Do you find it's mostly your midfielders with whom you're having the trouble with condition degredation?

yeah.Also the transfers I can't see a difference in

[Sy13]

Well, you're out of luck if you leave thursday night or on friday before the patch is released. It will only be available through download, not fixed for the DVD-version which I assume is the version you're getting.

No, I don't leave til the Sunday so I can get it patched beforehand. That's why I'm asking if my list at the top of page 1 will be addressed for day one.

[SmurfDude]

yeah.Also the transfers I can't see a difference in

Well you aren't looking very hard then. There's a definite improvement

[reflection22]

I am, definitely. My two central midfielders and my wingers would have been carried off the pitch if their conditions went as low in real life as it does on FM. My two wingers have closing down "own area", while my two central midfielders have "own half", so surely that can't be the problem seeing as it worked just fine on FM08. Didn't change the training at all, either.

Lol it seems the condition problem is definitely mainly with the midfielders/wingers. A lot of people have said exactly the same thing. I rotate my whole midfield in every game, even then, a weeks rest often isn't enough to get them much over 90%.

[Nicolai87]

My midfielders usually go up to around 95% but drops severly in every game. I think the condition-regeneration immediately after a match isn't high enough in FM09, as opposed to in FM08. I'm not 100% sure about this, though, but I'm not going to install FM2008 again just to compare.

But let's say that this is an issue. My example would then be that, as soon as a match was over in FM08, the players regained 20 condition-points, while in FM09 they only regain 10 condition-points. This would make up the difference between 100% after a weeks rest in 08, and only 90% or so in FM09.

And I thought I was clever buying two central midfielders for my Arsenal team for competition for the places in the starting eleven. Looks like I bought them for replacement after 50-60 minutes instead!

[reflection22]

My midfielders usually go up to around 95% but drops severly in every game. I think the condition-regeneration immediately after a match isn't high enough in FM09, as opposed to in FM08. I'm not 100% sure about this, though, but I'm not going to install FM2008 again just to compare.

But let's say that this is an issue. My example would then be that, as soon as a match was over in FM08, the players regained 20 condition-points, while in FM09 they only regain 10 condition-points. This would make up the difference between 100% after a weeks rest in 08, and only 90% or so in FM09.

And I thought I was clever buying two central midfielders for my Arsenal team for competition for the places in the starting eleven. Looks like I bought them for replacement after 50-60 minutes instead!

The problem with condition regeneration is purely with the players who you subsitute, thus compounding the condition degredation and making it worse. I think all players always only regained about 10% immediately after a match in past FMs. The problem with FM09 is, and this is purely a bug, no arguments, players who you sub/take off in games don't immediately regain any condition after the final whistle. Only those who played the whole game do, whereas in past FMs the players who you subsituted would do the same. You have to have a bit of an eagle eye to notice this, but a few other people have too already.

The key to noticing this is to look at a substitued players condition after 89 minutes, and look at someone who's been on the whole game's condition too. Then when you give a full-time team talk, watch how the guys who played the full 90 minutes jumps up 10%, while the ones you subbed off stays stuck on what he was on on 89 minutes. That then negatively affects the subbed players' condition for the next game, when if anything you'd expect him to be nicely rested. This is a major issue.

[Mr.S!N]

I didn't say I wasn't happy; it’s a good feature and all. I just wanted to know people’s opinions on the general quality of the graphics. I’ve seen somewhere in the game you can set detail levels for the sky and other things and as far as I know I’ve set everything on high but I think it looks very dated (especially the players) when compared to PES09 or FIFA for example.

It was never going to be anywhere near Fifa levels. Remember that last year they had a 2D circle spinning round on your screen. Compared to that its a million times better.

[SmurfDude]

The problem with condition regeneration is purely with the players who you subsitute, thus compounding the condition degredation and making it worse. I think all players always only regained about 10% immediately after a match in past FMs. The problem with FM09 is, and this is purely a bug, no arguments, players who you sub/take off in games don't immediately regain any condition after the final whistle. Only those who played the whole game do, whereas in past FMs the players who you subsituted would do the same. You have to have a bit of an eagle eye to notice this, but a few other people have too already. This is a major issue.

Has it been posted in the bug forum? It'll get more attention there

[reflection22]

Has it been posted in the bug forum? It'll get more attention there

Yea it has, I'm just re-iterating the point about players you sub in a few threads to make sure it gets sorted. It's vital it does, as it's a clear bug.

[crafty bison]

Im pretty sure that wont be in a patch.

I agree, but it really SHOULD be. It ruins the match experience.

[Samsung]

Must say the keyboard thing is most annoying.... I dont really have any technical issues with the 3D etc etc. Transfers still a little dodgy

however never really noticed the fatigue thing...

[Socdk]

You forgot the dodgy keyboard bug that makes text llooookk lliikkee tthhiiss

It definately needs fixing, but for a quick work-around try windowing your game (You can still scale it up to full screen and even have quick access to your FireFox/IE tab at the bottom with a link ready to SI community forums )

I also agree with the players condition during matches. You have to put in a lot of effort to keep your players match ready which is a temendous pain -especially when you're playing a weaker team like danish clubs.

About the 2D being jerky. I suspect it's because the game renders both 2D and the 3D at the same time. That's really an awful mistake considering that SI are professionals. But I cut SI some slack since it's their first 3D project. Some are fortunate not to be affected by this since they have computers that can well cope. I have a mediocre computer and while it runs most of the game pretty neatly the matches are just a tad bit "jerky".
I doubt this can be fixed in any patches since it would probably require heavy re-coding... -However I'm just guessing and assuming here. I don't know much about coding so I wouldn't know for sure.

On long term I would like to see the database being updated a bit. Especially when it comes to leagues outside England, Spain, Italy, Germany etc. etc. (A good example would be the danish league ). Off course these players should not be star players but it really seems like a lot of teams and players are underrated just to make them weak. I know this since SI have stated earlier that lower rep leagues will be harsher looked upon than higher leagues. Meaning that you might be good at heading in Norway but this doesn't mean your a good header in EPL. However I think that the top teams in the danish leagues have proven these recent years that they are catching up in some ways.
A quick example could be Atiba Hutchinson from FCK. Atiba is an incredibly flairy and somewhat technically skilled player who scores from the edge of the area ever so often (Not due to him being a skilled long range shooter, but because he has flair). His major skills should be Technique, Flair yet those are; Technique 12 and Flair 8. This annoys me since it heavily degrades danish teams (And other lesser leagues) and takes something away from the reality of the game.
If I have to edit myself I will. But I would rather not as I know myself well enough to know that I'd be giving my favorite players a tad too much skill .

That last part was beginning to stray off topic. Sorry

[Nicolai87]

Well, the keyboard bug (which definetly will be fixed for the patch, and is something that I've never experienced myself), is a tiny, tiny bug compared to injuries and player conditions. I think we should focus on those two which haven't been 100% announced for the patch (player conditions not even announced in the first place, and they will only fix injuries if they find errors in their comparisons with Physioroom.com).

[backpackant]

Since SI are currently working on fixing all the things people have been mentioning, I doubt you'll get an answer until either a) they've fixed them or b) they know how long it will take to fix.

Hypothetical Scenario:
If points 1,2,3 and 7 are fixable in the day one patch it will be announced probably 24 hours before the patch is available, with a note to points 5,6,8 and 9 that says a patch for this will be available, say, 1st December.

Asking SI to announce when they'll announce stuff is just taking them away from the work they need to do. I'm sure they have a list of priorities, with things like injuries and 3D jerky graphics. Yesterday they said they were actually buying new chips to test the 3D view on (Intel ones, like my 9-month old laptop) so I'd rather they come up with a solution to these rather than telling me when it might be resolved.

I'm sure we'll know as soon as they do.

[Ranbir]

That's annoying then, having to manually slow down the replays each time.

[brt]

That's annoying then, having to manually slow down the replays each time.

Yep, I don't like it too.

[reflection22]

Yep, I don't like it too.

I'm also not a fan of combining the match speed and highlights sliders into one. It was a lot simpler when they were seperate. If it ain't broke, don't fix it comes to mind...that said, changing it back wouldn't be at the top of my priority list right now.

[Sy13]

^
Yes, I want the two sliders back as well, but with all the other issues it's further down on my priority list.

[Glyn]

It's all very well moaning about not knowing what's definitely going to be fixed in the patch, but you have to realise that fixes just don't happen at the click of your fingers.

Before any fix can be definitely announced in the patch fixlist, there is a sequence of events that has to happen:

1. SI are informed of a problem.
2. SI have to try and get the full details of the circumstances of the problem (not always easy, you'll have seen yourself how unhelpful a lot of posts can be in this respect), whether it's a software or a hardware problem, then
3. SI have to try and recreate the problem, in order to
4. Work out exactly why it's happening, so that
5. A fix can worked out, which then has to undergo
6. Testing to ensure that the fix itself doesn't cause any other problems. (if it does, then go back to step 5).

I would imagine that a lot of the problems that have been brought to SI's attention are somewhere in the middle of this procedure. They will not be definitely announced until SI are happy that they've passed Step 6. There may be problems they're working on that take longer to sort out than release day, for lots of reasons. It certainly doesn't mean they're ignoring them, but they will not make any rash promises to definitely have a fix rady by a certain date. You also have to realise that fixes have to be prioritised and that some fixes are deemed of less importance than others.

[Ranbir]

Understandable, Glyn. Luckily the speed slider can breeze through the sequence!

[Tristan]

the injuries are so anoying lol. I hear the 1st patch is comming out on the 14th of november.

[daredevilz87]

i agree with u totally...im using a high-end laptop and the Fm2009 demo is really sluggish and it freezes...its kinda annoying when i havent save for a month and it just freeze and i'll have to restart it....i have experienced almost all the bugs u listed...i just hope SI will do something with it,i wont be buying FM2009 with all these bugs...i have been waiting for a year for FM2009 and i hope it will not disappoint me...with what im seeing right now,there is lot of things to do for SI before 14th November...hope they get them all fixed up and i'll definitely buy my copy of FM2009.

[smithers08]

Player conditioning is the biggest factor for me . I have had 4 players injured for 2-3 months after only 3 friendly games , and all the other players are stuck on 60-70% fitness levels . Or is this SI adding more realism ?

[Sy13]

Come on SI, it's nearly Thursday. How about an update???