Learning PPMs

I have searched through threads here and I haven't found what I'm looking for.

What is needed for a player to learn a PPM successfully? Specifically, which attributes must the coach have?

If I recall correctly, playing time is needed, but even with a lot of playing time, a lot of time the player fails to learn/unlearn a PPM.

That unfortunately is part of the "brilliant" black box design of FM, they don't document this stuff, so we are all guessing and in case of PPM's that take a long time, it's really gnarly to guess wrong.

I use backroom staff recommendation and tutoring to give PPM's to players.

If the staff have the PPM they get an edge in teaching it, I think.

If I want to teach a PPM to a player, I try using my highest star coach and if he says no, I rarely go against his recommendation. (By the Way, asking to do a PPM that the trainer things is bad, usually means they will suggest one that will work instead.)

You can insist anyway and will have some chance of succeeding in PPM training even against recommendations. fx.I have a super CM/A that I (stupidly) tutored by a DM and gave stay back at all times, if I try to remove it the coaches say I'm crazy, but if I stick to it, it should get unlearned, but it could take a few tries.

Only thing I might have figured out, is that Shoots With Power could be related to strength.

I have searched through threads here and I haven't found what I'm looking for.

What is needed for a player to learn a PPM successfully? Specifically, which attributes must the coach have?

If I recall correctly, playing time is needed, but even with a lot of playing time, a lot of time the player fails to learn/unlearn a PPM.

PPM learning is akin to Tutoring - it doesn't matter how carefully you select the people involved, it can still fail - there is no 100% guarantee of success.

That being said, you can *perhaps* improve the chances of success with logical selections: ask a relevant coach to undertake the PPM training (eg., ask your defensive coach to carry out defense related PPMs). You can also temporarily reduce or stop individual training plans for the player(s) involved as PPM and individual training time is shared - less time on individual training means more time on PPM training, and vice versa. One other thought - players with high professionalism train better. Whether that impacts PPM success or not I don't know, but it seems logical as well (a guess).

Alternatively you can ask a senior player to pass on a PPM to a younger player via Tutoring. This has the advantage of not impacting on your individual training plans, but will impact on a player's personality and determination as well as their PPMs. I personally never use Tutoring to pass on a PPM for this reason unless the Tutor has a good personality and determination.

In terms of playing time, I only ever teach PPMs to my up and coming youngsters who will be playing in my Youth teams anyway.

One thing that's for sure is that your coaches' advice is useless. One time I told my coach to get my signing to unlearn "gets forward at all times". The coach told me the player wouldn't be able to do it... then he got it done in literally five days.

I second WaveMotion's post.

Depends on what PPM you are making your player learn. Eg, tries killer ball often, your player will need good vision and passing, probably 14 and above. Or curls ball, good technique.

probably 14 and above

I don't think there is an absolute skill limit in terms of ability. That would mean lower league players can't learn preferred moves. I think it's more a question of what a player excels at. In my save Jan Vertonghen has 14 vision and passing but he probably isn't going to learn "tries killer balls often" while Jamie Ness playing at Crewe in league one also has 14 vision and passing and is probably a much more likely candidate to lean that PPM.

Thank You all very much for your response.

Some of the stuff makes sense (such as stopping individual skill training) so I will give it a shot. I just wanted to know if there is something I missed, some attributes or sth like that. Obviously there isn't

Also, I mostly teach PPMs to youngsters so I do not know how much will canceling individual training hinder their progress

There is no need to cancel individual training (although you can if you want to of course).

There is probably an "optimal" way of min/maxing this - personally I get my tutoring done first to ensure a player has high professionalism, set individual training to "average" and then start a PPM. If they complain their work load is too high, I reduce individual training to "low". I don't know if that is the "optimal" way, but more often than not I get decent results.

There is no need to cancel individual training (although you can if you want to of course).

Right you don't have to, but if the player is not professional or otherwise blessed with a good personality he will bitch and moan about it. Does it ever get beyond moaning? I honestly don't know, but I do try to keep training reasonable as it *may* actually hurt the progress if not. Now this is for individuals, so if I have a team doing something and they are all the same and a couple complain about the workload I leave it go, and eventually I know I will move those complainers on. Anyway, if you add a PPM and keep the individual focus and he doesn't complain great. If he does I might look to drop the individual training.

**Note: this is one area that I don't think is clear, and I'd love it if there was an empirical statement about the effect of unhappiness in training on training performance, if any.

Right you don't have to, but if the player is not professional or otherwise blessed with a good personality he will bitch and moan about it. Does it ever get beyond moaning? I honestly don't know, but I do try to keep training reasonable as it *may* actually hurt the progress if not. Now this is for individuals, so if I have a team doing something and they are all the same and a couple complain about the workload I leave it go, and eventually I know I will move those complainers on. Anyway, if you add a PPM and keep the individual focus and he doesn't complain great. If he does I might look to drop the individual training.

**Note: this is one area that I don't think is clear, and I'd love it if there was an empirical statement about the effect of unhappiness in training on training performance, if any.

I reckon them being unhappy is likely to compound the effect of their unprofessionalism, but with some players it is just impossible to bother dealing with them. Wayne Rooney for example, would bitch at a light training program to such an extent you would have to change the entire team training set up just to satisfy him. At that point, unless a player can be tutored to grow up, it is far simpler to just get rid. Coincidently, with Rooney, he started bitching about starting pre season too early. That started upsetting the rest of the squad, the first time I've seen someone moaning about training having an actual knock on squad harmony.

Personally, I think Rooney got the short end of the stick in being marked low on professionalism (on that save file anyway), but basically, having those players around aren't worth the hassle for me.

Personally, I think Rooney got the short end of the stick in being marked low on professionalism (on that save file anyway), but basically, having those players around aren't worth the hassle for me.

At the end of the day, yes, unless they are so good that they can't be reasonably replaced. For me, that is never an issue as there isn't a lack of parity in players at the conference and below

try give light to none individual training to the player u want to learn/unlearn a ppm. go see someone's development tab menu. under the individual training & new PPM & position training u should see how focus the said player doing something, representated by %. the more % he get focused on PPM training should increase the speed n chance to learn it

but it is all comes back to his personality, and how hard is your general training too. A player with low professional tends to refuse harder training

try give light to none individual training to the player u want to learn/unlearn a ppm. go see someone's development tab menu. under the individual training & new PPM & position training u should see how focus the said player doing something, representated by %. the more % he get focused on PPM training should increase the speed n chance to learn it

but it is all comes back to his personality, and how hard is your general training too. A player with low professional tends to refuse harder training

yeah, I hate when they complain about too much training..

anyway, a lot of good tips here, I will try to incorporate it next time I'm playing full FM