Fighting the losing battle.

Hi

I really need some help/advice.

Very brief save history.

Started with Grimsby Town in conference. In the first season, finished 7th, very inconsistent, but finished the season strongly. Also won The FA Trophy. Successful season in my eyes and to the fans and chairman.

Second season, I improved on some weak areas in playing staff, started where we left off from the end of previous season and saw it through to win the league.

Third season, now in league 2, we started extremely well, winning 7 out of the first 9 games. Then lost 2 on the trot and morale has died. I've now only picked up 2 draws in 9 games, losing 7... All of a sudden, we are giving away penalties, letting 2 goal leads slip and missing all the clear cut chances, hitting the wood work or blasting them straight at the keeper. Obviously this is down to confidence/morale, but without winning a game (which seems impossible at the moment) I'm really stuck. I was loving this save, I wanted to get them all the way to the top however long it took but I'm worried il get the sack if this carries on!!

And help welcome.

Schedule a friendly against a very weak opponent. That is one of the very few ways to improve morale immediately.

in the middle of the season though, it's difficult to play a friendly against a pub-team (due to the tight schedule)

might be worth doing - give them a easybeats game rather than training for a few days (set them to 3 days rest around the game)

or just give them a rest completely for a day, remember that they're human too (and the schedule only gets worse from here)

if you have to, just reset the tactic and start from scratch (even if you just recreate it with a 'new' tactic)

alternatively, just play defensively for a little bit (and praise them for not conceding - every little helps)

you could also try a team meeting, so look at that too (form has tailed off a little bit in recent weeks)

Thanks will give it a go.

I did hold a team meeting, got the morale up a bit but lost so it went straight back down again!

Will try the friendly.

If your morale 'died' after only 2 losses, then you're very poor at managing morale during team talks and press conferences. Granted it's an older version, but on FM14 I had a run of 6 or 7 straight losses and morale was still "okay".

If your morale 'died' after only 2 losses, then you're very poor at managing morale during team talks and press conferences. Granted it's an older version, but on FM14 I had a run of 6 or 7 straight losses and morale was still "okay".

Ok maybe died is exaggerated, but because I was so used to seeing so high, to have yellows and oranges next people's names scared the living daylight a if me. Panicked I guess...

New tactic, go back to basics and try and battle out a clean sheet/1-0 win. Lower leagues IMO is all about pace, get some pacey forwards/wingers in when you can and play counter attacking football. In the low league I always just go for the basics, CB's who can tackle, CM's who can pass, and forwards who are quick and can finish.

Oh and use the loan system to get a parent club or under 21 aged players for 0% wages from prem sides, these can make a massive difference in the lower leagues, a good spine borrowed from a big club can really help.

Oh and use the loan system to get a parent club or under 21 aged players for 0% wages from prem sides, these can make a massive difference in the lower leagues, a good spine borrowed from a big club can really help.

Tried this, and the board never come back with anything!! So frustrating.

I am beginning to lose the will to live at the minute. I am having players two footing people, giving away penalties willy nilly. I never had any of this trouble last season. I've never encountered a losing streak, up hill battle like this before, in any of the previous versions. Feel like I am being kicked while I am down... several times!

Sounds like frustration by the players. That's something you could be managing better. Take pressure off, give them confidence etc.

New tactic, go back to basics and try and battle out a clean sheet/1-0 win. Lower leagues IMO is all about pace, get some pacey forwards/wingers in when you can and play counter attacking football. In the low league I always just go for the basics, CB's who can tackle, CM's who can pass, and forwards who are quick and can finish.

Yeah, Ive done this a lot in the past, but felt like trying to play a better brand of football. It worked in the first two seasons, but I suppose going up a division, would always make this more difficult.

Sounds like frustration by the players. That's something you could be managing better. Take pressure off, give them confidence etc.

Take pressure off?? Just in the team talks?

Take pressure off?? Just in the team talks?

I'm wondering, where are you predicted to finish in the league and where are you sitting in the league now?

I'm wondering, where are you predicted to finish in the league and where are you sitting in the league now?

Media prediction is 12th, I am sitting in 15th. I was top after first 7 games, and it has fell apart since then. Just lost again, shots hitting the bar on a couple of occasions, but no red cards or penalties given away!!

Doesn't sound good. Any chance of posting your complete tactic?

Doesn't sound good. Any chance of posting your complete tactic?

I can, but I will be a bit annoyed if it gets ripped to shreds, when it has been working well all this time... what's the easiest way of posting do you suggest?

I can, but I will be a bit annoyed if it gets ripped to shreds, when it has been working well all this time...

You mean the 2 seasons before this one, when you were in a lower division than this one? Where were you predicted to finish in those?

what's the easiest way of posting do you suggest?

Either type out the roles, duties, TIs, etc or upload a screenshot to a site like Imgur or Photobucket and post the link here.

You mean the 2 seasons before this one, when you were in a lower division than this one? Where were you predicted to finish in those?

Yes. In the first season, I was predicted to finish 5th (from memory) but finished 7th, although we won the FA Trophy. The second season, I cannot remember where we were predicted to finish, but the board minimum requirement was top half of the table. We stuttered over the line a bit, but we had opened up such a big lead it didn't matter. The stutter was probably due to the amount of injuries we picked up.

Yes. In the first season, I was predicted to finish 5th (from memory) but finished 7th, although we won the FA Trophy. The second season, I cannot remember where we were predicted to finish, but the board minimum requirement was top half of the table. We stuttered over the line a bit, but we had opened up such a big lead it didn't matter. The stutter was probably due to the amount of injuries we picked up.

So you were one of the favourites in that league and you're only mid-table quality now. More teams are looking to get at you it seems. I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a tactical issue here too.

How are you losing? Any patterns you can see when conceding goals?

My Formation

DLF (Attack)

IF (Support) Winger (Attack)

BWM (Support) CM (Defend) AP (Attack)

WB(Attack) CB (Defend) CB (Cover) WB (Support)

GK (def)

So you were one of the favourites in that league and you're only mid-table quality now. More teams are looking to get at you it seems. I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a tactical issue here too.

How are you losing? Any patterns you can see when conceding goals?

Sorry, no we got promoted to League 2, this is my first season in this league.

We are losing, by not taking our chances I would say. The games (other than against the top sides) are fairly even. The last game, we took the lead, they replied within minutes from a wing cross to a giant who headed it home. It finished 1-1.

My Formation

DLF (Attack)

IF (Support) Winger (Attack)

BWM (Support) CM (Defend) AP (Attack)

WB(Attack) CB (Defend) CB (Cover) WB (Support)

GK (def)

Mentality? TIs?

Without those even, it's clear that you're very (completely?) reliant on the DLF to score your goals. If he's not performing, you're going to struggle.

Mentality? TIs?

Without those even, it's clear that you're very (completely?) reliant on the DLF to score your goals. If he's not performing, you're going to struggle.

See last season, I had goals from both my attacking wide men, but yes, we have struggled for goals this season.

Mentality is Standard at the start of every game. Team Shape is Flexible.

My Team Instructions were:

Pass into space

Work ball into box

Play Wider

Close down more

Stay on Feet

Higher Tempo

As I said this was working fine, it was winning the ball back as soon as we'd lost it and were putting teams under a lot of pressure. Our tackling stats were one of the highest in the conference.

However, with the struggle I have faced since getting promoted, I have just these two instructions:

Pass into space

Work ball into box

We finally won a game!! Away from home against a team above us. We really hung on towards the end. I changed TI's to Narrow and Drop Deeper and it started to restrict their chances, but they still hit the post in injury time... feel quite fortunate to win, but the team talk afterwards has certainly helped with confidence.

The headline after was "Lucky Grimsby Celebrate Unlikely Win"... that is pretty much true.

At least you managed a win now.

At least you managed a win now.

Yeah, not convincing though. Can you see any major flaws in the tactical side?

Just been through a club takeover and the new chairman has assured me my job is safe

Post #23.

Post #23.

Is that not in my post number 24?

That covers the first 2 words of that post. I posted a line underneath that.

Without those even, it's clear that you're very (completely?) reliant on the DLF to score your goals. If he's not performing, you're going to struggle.

That covers the first 2 words of that post. I posted a line underneath that.

As I said, I had goals in lots of other areas of the team. There was a 5 game spell where my centre forward didn't score, but both my attacking wide players were wreaking havoc. They cannot hit a barn door now. I have just lost 3 out of 4 again. It doesn't matter whether I dominate possession or not, I cannot score anymore. There strikers however get once chance and bang, a goal. I just cannot get my head around how something was working so well, to being completely inept now. I'm going from a club hero to zero in 4-5 months.

Don't worry wasting your time, I've been sacked.

I cannot seriously understand how this has happened... how I can be near on indestructible, to becoming a non-league pub team in the space of couple of months... nothing changed!! And from 1st in League 2 after two trophies in the conference to slipping all the way to 19th and getting sacked.

Seeing that low morale can increase individual mistakes and the ball being dropped, it may have been worth bringing up that this is a pretty aggressive set-up if pushed like that trough every match for 90 minutes, and no "play narrower" instruction nor mentality will hugely change that. Both wide defenders being set to wing back all game will always encourage them to make attacking runs going all the way up with every attack, and engage into dribblings too. This is apparent from the in-game descriptions as well as the individual instructons, where "gets further forward" is enabled for a WB on both support and attack duties. As far as I see, except for the defend duty player in midfield everybody is encouraged forward to some degree from his positions and engage in attacking movement. It is mainly the wide defenders though as wing backs on support and attack duty are the second most aggressive role after complete wing backs.

Not a way to minimze risk or holding onto a slender lead either way, though it's always guess work as to what's actually happened in individual matches. As a slight hint, the AI is a bit drastic in that on occasion, but when it has taken a lead and simply wants to defend a score, it sometimes goes all the way and may put both wide defenders on defend duty, so as to have always a number of players who always stay in behind the ball, when its play breaks down (obviously little threat when it attacks, but also impossible to hard to attack on the counter), and no wing backs who are encouraged to dribble. When a wing back starts to dribble, he typically does so deeper on the pitch than wide attacking players such as wingers, which obviously can be dangerous. The AI can go exactly the opposite too though, like when chasing a game, and throw everything it has forward. That's one area where focusing on statistics can be completely misleading -- in some matches it may only ever push forward and have a go aggressively at goal when you go up, for instance. It doesn't matter if previously it sat back and kept things tight for 80 minutes allowing you to have 248789347% of possession and some additional shots until your break-through comes. When it has a chance to equalize within the remaining time, it may at least try. In the 2d view or a 3d camera that allows fully overview you'll get a better feel of things. Of course being an average at best team, and there's no indication of otherwise, promoted side and all, seriously lacking confidence can be a bit of a struggle regardless (speaking of which, that confidence has "died" after 2 matches sounds harsh -- unless players weren't put under added pressure and slammed, that from my experience wouldn't happen just like that in such a scenario).

I cannot seriously understand how this has happened... how I can be near on indestructible, to becoming a non-league pub team in the space of couple of months... nothing changed!! And from 1st in League 2 after two trophies in the conference to slipping all the way to 19th and getting sacked.

We've been over this? Because you weren't league favourites anymore. Teams aren't sitting back as much against the new boys. Like it or not, you ARE reliant on your DLF to make something happen. The others may have pitched in with goals before, but you were favourites against teams who took you more seriously (and would be more cautious) so there would be TIME for the others to get involved. You didn't have that time here. It was DLF or very little else.

Defensively you may have been open against teams not sitting back. If you managed to take the ball into the opposition's final third, for instance, a quick counter will see most of your players very high up field, with the CM/D staying back, but utterly alone in midfield to cope with on-rushing players and of course the two DCs. In fact, you'll probably struggle to win the midfield battle in general with that setup as the CM/D has a lot of work to do because the other two won't be helping him much.

Ok so what do you suggest? I've been through so many forums on here about formations and tactics and mine was based on something similar I found. It was working so I stuck with it.

I've got another job so id like some help.

What do you need help with?

Ok so what do you suggest? I've been through so many forums on here about formations and tactics and mine was based on something similar I found. It was working so I stuck with it.

I've got another job so id like some help.

Your tactic wasn't bad by any means but my opinion would be it needed some small tweaks.

I would also say you need to get used to recognising what is happening on the field and adapting to it. This is where your team instructions come in, you need to be looking at the game on the pitch and be able to identify which part of your tactic is working or not working.

Away from the field you need to look at your expectations. The media thought you would finish 12th so you were a mid-table team. Every team goes through good patches & bad patches in a season, you went through a good patch early on and were high in the league but this was a false position. Eventually the bad patch came, you dropped to a realistic position but you panicked to some degree.

Everything by the sounds of things!

I liked the formation I had but obviously something was wrong and as you said I was reliant on my striker.

On many posts I read you should aim for one attacking defender, one attacking midfielder and an attacking striker. Helps creates movement etc but also a balance.

I'm in league 1 now with a team near relegation who want me to get them to mid table by the end of the season.

Everything by the sounds of things!

I liked the formation I had but obviously something was wrong and as you said I was reliant on my striker.

On many posts I read you should aim for one attacking defender, one attacking midfielder and an attacking striker. Helps creates movement etc but also a balance.

I'm in league 1 now with a team near relegation who want me to get them to mid table by the end of the season.

Creating movement is very important, yes. An AP/A will not be bursting forward to give you that movement though, regardless of him having an Attack duty. If you wanted him to, that's not going to happen. He will push up high late into moves though. You had 1 attacking midfielder on Attack, yes, but it was the winger and he'll stay wide. Combine that with the AP/A not pushing up early enough and the IF/S sitting deep as his duty suggests, Lukaku would be alone a lot.

The How To Play FM15 and Pairs & Combinations threads are great to get you started and thinking about combinations.

IMO sometimes a tactic just 'dies' and will never get you results unless you 'rest' it for a while.

When this happens to me I switch to a vastly different tactic, but I test the tactic by playing the same game over say 30 times, with 5 different tactics but 5 in a row with each say. I write all the scores down and see what was the most successful, I write down if I deserved to win, the score etc. I just reload the game over and over, for the purpose of tactical testing (usually do this pre season), then once I know which works for my team I roll with that tactic for a season/until I hit a terrible run.

Semi cheating maybe, but I'm sure in real life you could use this in training for figure out what works for your side.

Even the thought of replaying the same game 30 times makes me nauseous. Surely it's quicker just to watch the matches you're playing and spot what works and what doesn't, and tweak it from there?

IMO sometimes a tactic just 'dies' and will never get you results unless you 'rest' it for a while.

Its not that the tactic dies its the situation.

Maybe the opposition change shape, maybe they just tweak it so that they are more offensive or defensive.

Basically though whatever the opposition have done differently nullifies the tactics you have been using and you need to adapt to those changes maybe by changing your shape or maybe just by tweaking the shape you have.

When this happens to me I switch to a vastly different tactic, but I test the tactic by playing the same game over say 30 times, with 5 different tactics but 5 in a row with each say. I write all the scores down and see what was the most successful, I write down if I deserved to win, the score etc. I just reload the game over and over, for the purpose of tactical testing (usually do this pre season), then once I know which works for my team I roll with that tactic for a season/until I hit a terrible run.

Semi cheating maybe, but I'm sure in real life you could use this in training for figure out what works for your side.

I've said it before in other threads, you'll learn nothing by playing the same match over & over "testing tactics"

A tactic is not something that should be viewed as working or not working, it should be viewed as flexible, changing, adapting to suit what is happens in a single match.

The tactic wasn't that bad. It was just one-dimensional attacking-wise and a bit too open defensively. I've seen a LOT worse.

As for replaying, it's not something I like doing. Especially not if you're only going to judge a tactic by scorelines. It completely overlooks the fact that matches are dynamic and all you'll end up doing (at best) is making a tactic that's good at beating that team. It's much more useful to spend a tenth (or less) of that time to watch the tactic and see if your players are in space, have passing options, contribute defensively the way you want them to and in general doing what you want them to. It usually takes me 2 or 3 friendlies (watching the first 5-10mins in full and the rest in Comprehesive, just because I want to) to set up a tactic and fine-tune it to 90% of what it'll end up being.

Guides are fairly generic. Following them to the T you'll have a reasonably balanced tactics in most of the cases, and usually don't hugely suffer (though what you do during the match obviously influences loads... already talked about how the AI may switch things around during a match). What guides mean when they argue that you should ideally have an attacking defender and an attacking midfielder is a role/duty that pushes players forward, make regular attacking runs from his default defensive position. Usually that applies for attack duties, but for roles such as the wing backs, that's an exception, as even the support duties have that enabled. Typically you can filter that from the in-game text, and if not, you can take a look at the individual player instructions and check whether "gets further forward" is enabled. That is meant. Curiously the DLF/attack stops being an actually deep-lying player, and I've always wondered about that, as he has "gets further forward" activated, which means he'll always be ahead of play by making runs always. In your case he regularly pushes ahead of play as there's no AMC behind him (?) nor an MC given a role/duty that has that "gets further forward" thingie enabled. The DLF/attack is an outright oxymoron, btw, you can't be a "deep-lying forward" whilst being encouraged to rush ahead of play at every opportunity. Never had an idea what he's meant to represent, if somebody would enlighten me I'd be grateful.

By the semantics of guides, both wide defenders are put on an "attack duty", as far as information is provided, always, home or away, against far superior opposition playing aggressively and inferior one sitting back, for 90 minutes. I think it's not strongly advocated around here, a lot of people simply switch through mentality and may add a shout here and there, which is immediately more sensible if the role/duties used as well as the formation lends itself to things being more balanced (this one is balanced towards attack, it also has wide attacking players apparently). But it is really those duties /forward runs, that have the biggest influence how risky you are going to play in a lot of ways. There's a small overlap with mentality, there's a big one if you keep players on auto duty even (aggressive mentality=auto duty players on attack duty, etc.), but an attacking wing back will always be an attacking wing back who rather than keeping his position tries to get forward with everyone of your attacks - and eventually leaves space behind that whoever stays back has to cover instead.

It's all guess work as to what's actually going on, the AI tactically isn't that super awesome too, however it plays matches dynamically up to keeping lots of players always behind the ball on defend duty vs. vice versa (see above), which can happen in the same match accordingly to the score line, typically. Sometimes it simply plays for a draw right from kick-off, even, barely committing players forward (something not suggested by any guide, but it has its time and place). On rare occasion the AI shockingly may even switch the formation during a match. Tactical discussions are in a sense often weird, as they talk about this one duty/formation set-up as if it was supposed to be something forever fixed in place, whereas there's a reason you can train and gel two wholly different formations, and contrary to any guides, there are defend duties for almost any position on the pitch too. If you don't want any that, go for something more balanced, there are still download tactics around apparently, plus there's an AI manager too. By AI logics (and mine too), by the info provided you always play comparably aggressively for the win and for yet another goal regardless of score line, 90 minutes, any opposition, home away, etc. Be reasonable and don't overcomplicate matters. In the end you're likely mostly always the underdog, what would you expect of a team that always plays a fairly aggressive basic formation (wide attacking players visibly don't track back as readily as wide midfielders in the ML/MR position), coupled with aggressive and forward pushing players like that throughout an entire season against any opposition for 90 minutes? You weren't indestructible either way given that you are freshly promoted, you were riding on the wave of previous success and likely a fortunate initial fixture list.

Ok thanks for all the help.

I have always been a one tactic man, playing a style (or trying) that I like to watch. I have refused to go to a defensive, route one style when playing away against a better team. Is that wrong? Do I need to just get over it and do anything for the win... ? Possibly but what I am worried about is having to go changing tactic from game to game having completed a complex study on the opposition. Knowing what to do during games and spotting what is going wrong I always thought was a strength but the lack of patience in me told me not to watch every game if I was winning all the time because I could get through the season quicker. However what I didn't do was start watching them when I went on my losing streak, mainly because I thought my tactic was fine before, it must be something else...

After many years of playing CM and FM09 and FM11, it seems playing FM14 and FM15 there's a lot I haven't learnt, or it's not a simple as "any old tactic", "buy loads of good players" and "click win, click win".

I have always been a one tactic man, playing a style (or trying) that I like to watch. I have refused to go to a defensive, route one style when playing away against a better team. Is that wrong?

No! :-) Saves are dynamic, nobody has any insights into what was really going on, but personal guess:

- Your players are average at best for the new level overall, struggling is always a possibility (in FM "loads of good players" can still make up for all kinds of crap to an extent depending on their relative quality, such as non-strategies such as "drop off and hoof the ball forward to the lone striker" for 90 minutes). Loads of player still excel at putting up excellent squads for their level and performing due to that. Questioning if you have such a side available.

- You initially, partly aided by high confidence, possibly fixture list, had a good run of results after promotion

- That stopped and heads dropped quickly, possibly aided by your own doing. Average sides+low morale/confidence = a side struggling, individual mistakes can increase, players drop the ball during build up play more often. Not all the time. But it in can happen. Any player who advances, and 7 out of 10 outfield players are given some license, including the entire flanks due to the WBs who will always look to go all the way up both, has to rush back into position. Against players/teams who are significantly stronger than previous ones.

- your tactics isn't "any old tactics", in parts largely due to the 2 WBs, it is a pretty aggressive one, as everbody except the CM/D is given some license to advance, the wide defenders massively so (one click of the mouse would change that ASAP, like changing the WB/s to a FB/s, as the FB/s does not have "GETS FURTHER FORWARD" enabled by default. For added safety, a FB/a contrary to a WB/a is also not given additional encouragement to dribble all the time ("dribble more" is not activated by default)

- centrally you're not sticking to the forum advice mentioned, as you have a lone forward without an AMC sticking behind on an attack duty, btw. Those typically rush ahead of play, and if nobody is around them or following them they're not involved in build-up play and sometimes isolated when they get the ball. AI teams on occasion do this too (again, they're no genius), just saying

- you generally appear to have flawed or limited ideas of how to increase risk or decrease risk overall, like playing safer when taking a lead vs. vice versa or being more cautious because you have realized that heads have dropped (taking out "play wider" appears a bit simplistic -- and you don't appear to notice that your wide defenders accordingly to their role description leave position to push up all game). If your starting tactics was more balanced rather than all wide defenders pushing up all game on both flanks, and given license to dribble, for instance, that probably wouldn't hurt as much

You don't need to randomly outright change styles and formations. There's tons of people playing the game that never change much of a thing from their starting tactics. There nothing that's fundamentally changed at the core. In particular how the AI is approaching matches . You still have the stubborn spoilsports that just sit back on occasion for 90 minutes that try to frustrate you (typically heavy underdogs), you have those that do the opposite (typically favorites). You have sides trying to keep the damage to a minimum, you have those that aggressively push for an equalizer when you take the lead. It's hard to tell, but that with a freshly promoted team really doesn't sound balanced enough as a starting/main tactic to be suitable for all those scenarios, in particular when morale is low. But if I'd have to guess, the above is what might have happened. If you want to have another go, you can retire from the save, add a new manager and apply for the team anew, by the way.

No! :-) Saves are dynamic, nobody has any insights into what was really going on, but personal guess:

- Your players are average at best for the new level overall, struggling is always a possibility (in FM "loads of good players" can still make up for all kinds of crap to an extent depending on their relative quality, such as non-strategies such as "drop off and hoof the ball forward to the lone striker" for 90 minutes). Loads of player still excel at putting up excellent squads for their level and performing due to that. Questioning if you have such a side available.

- You initially, partly aided by high confidence, possibly fixture list, had a good run of results after promotion

- That stopped and heads dropped quickly, possibly aided by your own doing. Average sides+low morale/confidence = a side struggling, individual mistakes can increase, players drop the ball during build up play more often. Not all the time. But it in can happen. Any player who advances, and 7 out of 10 outfield players are given some license, including the entire flanks due to the WBs who will always look to go all the way up both, has to rush back into position. Against players/teams who are significantly stronger than previous ones.

- your tactics isn't "any old tactics", in parts largely due to the 2 WBs, it is a pretty aggressive one, as everbody except the CM/D is given some license to advance, the wide defenders massively so (one click of the mouse would change that ASAP, like changing the WB/s to a FB/s, as the FB/s does not have "GETS FURTHER FORWARD" enabled by default. For added safety, a FB/a contrary to a WB/a is also not given additional encouragement to dribble all the time ("dribble more" is not activated by default)

- centrally you're not sticking to the forum advice mentioned, as you have a lone forward without an AMC sticking behind on an attack duty, btw. Those typically rush ahead of play, and if nobody is around them or following them they're not involved in build-up play and sometimes isolated when they get the ball. AI teams on occasion do this too (again, they're no genius), just saying

- you generally appear to have flawed or limited ideas of how to increase risk or decrease risk overall, like playing safer when taking a lead vs. vice versa or being more cautious because you have realized that heads have dropped (taking out "play wider" appears a bit simplistic -- and you don't appear to notice that your wide defenders accordingly to their role description leave position to push up all game). If your starting tactics was more balanced rather than all wide defenders pushing up all game on both flanks, and given license to dribble, for instance, that probably wouldn't hurt as much

You don't need to randomly outright change styles and formations. There's tons of people playing the game that never change much of a thing from their starting tactics. There nothing that's fundamentally changed at the core. In particular how the AI is approaching matches . You still have the stubborn spoilsports that just sit back on occasion for 90 minutes that try to frustrate you (typically heavy underdogs), you have those that do the opposite (typically favorites). You have sides trying to keep the damage to a minimum, you have those that aggressively push for an equalizer when you take the lead. It's hard to tell, but that with a freshly promoted team really doesn't sound balanced enough as a starting/main tactic to be suitable for all those scenarios, in particular when morale is low. But if I'd have to guess, the above is what might have happened. If you want to have another go, you can retire from the save, add a new manager and apply for the team anew, by the way.

Thanks again. I didn't think too much about my wing backs... Just that when we were attacking they'd get high enough up the pitch to produce good crosses as they both had high crossing stats (better than my wingers)!

Il take all of this into my new job at Walsall, hopefully I can continue to learn and come back with some sort of update of progress. May need some more help!!

Thanks again. I didn't think too much about my wing backs... Just that when we were attacking they'd get high enough up the pitch to produce good crosses as they both had high crossing stats (better than my wingers)!

Well every decision has an impact on attack and defense. Every time they advance, they may leave somebody into space unmarked. (This is Montoya as a WB/s on the right flank, just as in your setup, in fact it's an exact replica including the same bog-"standard" mentality, being caught out of position after a passing mistake/ the attacking move is intercepted. The interception could also resulted off a failed dribbling (wbs are given license to dribble on any duty). The eventual move from the opponents comes to nothing, but just to illustrate (as argued the AI on occasion is sometimes this overly cautious, it puts both wide defenders on defend duty so that they NEVER leave their position ever for entire matches) .

At about 0:07 Montoya starts his attacking run he's encouraged to always make eventually, and leaves a guy completely into space unmarked. In turn, as the WB has left position, one of the centre backs who covers, the right one, has to leave his position too to deal with the player left by the wing back (0:14). If players are caught out off position it's always a card house effect. You have one of those wide players always looking to surge forward on both sides of the pitch. On the left flank you'll see the WB/a who's already all the way up when the video starts. Not arguing this to be good nor bad, that is besides the point. But obviously it shifts the balance of a tactics towards some added risk straight out of the box.

[video=youtube;dty4sD_47Qw]

So what's the point in wing backs??

The position/role description in-game, as much as people criticise it, can tell you.

Thanks Guys

Would you be ok to look at a couple of tactics I am going to go with for my new club (Walsall)? During the games, because I was winning I got lazy and didn't watch to see what was happening, this is down to me. I don't expect you to help with that, as I should really see what is happening and be able to react, but I would like to create a home / favourites tactic and an away/underdogs tactic. If you could cast your eye over them and still me if you see any obvious flaws straight away it would be appreciated.