Injuries discussion thread.

Just wondering if people are getting players injured way too much? I feel like my whole team is in the physio chambers. Every game at least one player picks up a small injury -- like a yellow type of injury.

Just wondering if anyone else is having these issues?

A lot of people may disagree with me but I still believe the increase in injuries is down to squad management or maybe I'm just extremely lucky. Currently in March and have 0 injuries. My most common injuries are the players who are susceptible to injuries.

I think in terms of the yellow injuries you mentioned, SI should give you more information on what happened instead of choosing whether to keep him on and finding out what's actually wrong with him after the match.

Ever since the January transfer update I have had the same issue. I've played 30 games and my squad is 24 strong, with majority playing 15 games or more, so it can't be down to management or rotation. Prior to the update I wouldn't get as many injuries, but it seems every game I'm having to make enforced changes.

yep and all we get is there isn't a problem, i'm sorry but i've done extensive testing now with multiple teams, tactics and training, same **** every time

yep and all we get is there isn't a problem, i'm sorry but i've done extensive testing now with multiple teams, tactics and training, same **** every time

So what do you want them to do about it, if they are happy with the way injuries are portrayed? Have you uploaded your save?

So what do you want them to do about it, if they are happy with the way injuries are portrayed? Have you uploaded your save?

What about these ghost injuries?. Where a player is forced off injured but come full time, theres no physio report and the player could theoretically play/train again the day after.

What about these ghost injuries?. Where a player is forced off injured but come full time, theres no physio report and the player could theoretically play/train again the day after.

Players can be forced off with a knock but be ok irl tbf. I would like all injuries to have a report though "player suffered knock to part x, but will be fit to train"

yep and all we get is there isn't a problem, i'm sorry but i've done extensive testing now with multiple teams, tactics and training, same **** every time

So where is the evidence of all this testing?

Its no good sitting on your PC, lets see the evidence, start a thread (Maybe in the bugs forum), providing the details backed up by pictures and/or a save game.

How do you expect anything to be done if you don't provide the information needed?

Players can be forced off with a knock but be ok irl tbf. I would like all injuries to have a report though "player suffered knock to part x, but will be fit to train"

That player forced off with any injury wouldn't train the following day (assuming he is normally supposed to) and I speak from personal experience. Any player that picks up a knock that is minor enough to mean the player can resume training at the next session is usually taken off at the manager's discretion rather than forced off. To add to the idea of getting reports on all injured players, I'd like to see the physio interact during the match when a player picks up a knock so you can use your own judgement whether the knock warrants a sub or not.

Finally the amount of time out for injured players looks too much. I doubt a gash would keep a player out for 2 or 3 weeks. Martin Skrtel has had 2 gashes on the head in the last 14 months during games but thanks to the good old staple gun, stayed in the match.

Injuries haven't been touched for a long time now and its an area thats long overdue an update to link it more to the ME and improve the balance of match/training injuries.

Hopefully its near the top of the list for FM16.

So where is the evidence of all this testing?

Its no good sitting on your PC, lets see the evidence, start a thread (Maybe in the bugs forum), providing the details backed up by pictures and/or a save game.

How do you expect anything to be done if you don't provide the information needed?

yeah like it matters?

no fixes coming FM 16 will have a completely different ME and other stuff

let's just wait for 16.3 and the same merry-go-round

yeah like it matters?

no fixes coming FM 16 will have a completely different ME and other stuff

let's just wait for 16.3 and the same merry-go-round

When you inevitably complaing about it in FM16 (despite them not making changes in nearly two years on this point), this post will be particularly pertinent.

yeah like it matters?

no fixes coming FM 16 will have a completely different ME and other stuff

let's just wait for 16.3 and the same merry-go-round

Thats a great attitude you have there

Why isn't everyone experiencing loads of injuries?

Maybe you could do more to lower the number of injuries you are receiving or maybe you don't know what a realistic number of injuries is?

I like the idea of having more information available to you when a player is a yellow injury in game. I mean that is what the physio is there for. They have mics on their kit so when they go out to see what is wrong they can relay that info to the gaffer. I think physios need to play a larger role in the game when a player is injured like giving you information. How detailed it is would depend on how good your physio is. That would be a great idea.

I like the idea of having more information available to you when a player is a yellow injury in game. I mean that is what the physio is there for. They have mics on their kit so when they go out to see what is wrong they can relay that info to the gaffer. I think physios need to play a larger role in the game when a player is injured like giving you information. How detailed it is would depend on how good your physio is. That would be a great idea.

Yes, their role in FM isn't active enough on matchdays. Maybe add a new staff role for a club/tunnel doctor. Club doctors are present on match days and play a big role at football clubs and tunnel doctors have become mandatory for all Premier League clubs this season.

Thats a great attitude you have there

Why isn't everyone experiencing loads of injuries?

Maybe you could do more to lower the number of injuries you are receiving or maybe you don't know what a realistic number of injuries is?

you say the same thing everytime so because you are lucky enough to not have them there's not a problem

funny how after 15.3 there were a large number who did get them out of the blue

so tell me is 4 injuries per game a good realistic number? are all my players brittle boned?

like i've already said i've changed numerous tactics for long periods, changed my coaches and physios and fitness, changed my entire squad, changed teams, changed saves

so tell me, what more can i try?

3 or 4 injuries in 15.2.1 to main squad and about 9 total injuries including u21 and u18 , i'd say that was a realistic number compared to 9 main squad (all the time not a phase) and 16 total injuries throughout the squads

so going back to this realistic thing, is it realistic to never be able to fill a bench up? is it realistic to make all 3 subs then like clockwork get 2 red injuries? sure maybe 1 game out of 30 it happens but this is happening like every 3 games and the players must have some major genetic disorders

never mind though, just have to go back to fm14 or wait for fm16 as this game is broken for me, maybe not you or many others but that doesn't excuse the fact that many others are getting excessive injuries

but it hasn't been altered, it's just our imagination that they have suddenl;y changed in 1 patch despite the same training and coaches

it got to the point where i'd hold back my star players from the starting lineup until i'd have my usual red injury within 5 mins game time, then a 2nd one just after half time

Half Time teamtalk "i'm not happy go out there and get injured" wasn't an option

Are you going to upload your save? If not, please dont repeatedly post the same thing.

It hasn't been altered in 2 years, and they are happy with the current rate, though plans for other aspects.

Englandmanager - If you don't provide details, no one can help.

you say the same thing everytime so because you are lucky enough to not have them there's not a problem

No thats not what I'm saying or anyone else for that matter.

There are loads of players not experiencing any injury issues therefore its not clear there is an issue.

All I am saying to anyone who thinks they have an issue is provide the evidence of it otherwise how does SI or anyone else know there is one.

You said yourself that you have done "extensive testing" in post #4 of this thread, so lets see the results, is it such a problem to post what you have identified so that everyone benefits?

No thats not what I'm saying or anyone else for that matter.

There are loads of players not experiencing any injury issues therefore its not clear there is an issue.

All I am saying to anyone who thinks they have an issue is provide the evidence of it otherwise how does SI or anyone else know there is one.

You said yourself that you have done "extensive testing" in post #4 of this thread, so lets see the results, is it such a problem to post what you have identified so that everyone benefits?

SI would welcome such save info from a user. Confused as to why it's struggle to get it tbh.

I used to get quite a few injuries from sending my bench players (who needed match fitness) to play in reserve games. That was until I took a step back and thought about it.

These players had 50-60% match fitness and, mindlessly, I just set them available for 90mins. They'll never make 90mins! Now I select them to get 45 mins as a starting point and increasing it as needed. Problem solved.

it's the only problems for me on an otherwise top game, it's more frustrating than anything

i've gone back to fm14 anyway as i can't cope haha

FA cup semi final vs Arsenal, i am Everton and 2 days before it, i get 3 physio reports 2 from my strikers out for 2 weeks each and my main AMC, that happens but when you already have an uncontrollable injury crisis it's a tad game breaking after a hard long season

that practically ruined my 4-3-1-2 formation and game plan....... GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

where can i find save games to upload?

I used to get quite a few injuries from sending my bench players (who needed match fitness) to play in reserve games. That was until I took a step back and thought about it.

These players had 50-60% match fitness and, mindlessly, I just set them available for 90mins. They'll never make 90mins! Now I select them to get 45 mins as a starting point and increasing it as needed. Problem solved.

Hi

So based on the fitness % then

Would low Match Fitness also be a cause for this?

If I have a player returning from injury and he is 94% fitness but 60% match fitness (so severely lacking I'd imagine)

... could this be a risk as well ?

I haven't come across this but apart from a shocking 2 week period I've always been very lucky with injuries .. so thought I'd check my understanding (or lack of!! )

Hi

So based on the fitness % then

Would low Match Fitness also be a cause for this?

If I have a player returning from injury and he is 94% fitness but 60% match fitness (so severely lacking I'd imagine)

... could this be a risk as well ?

I haven't come across this but apart from a shocking 2 week period I've always been very lucky with injuries .. so thought I'd check my understanding (or lack of!! )

You're getting fitness mixed up with condition. He's talking about match fitness. So, yes if you have a player with 60% match fitness you want to slowly build up his playing time in the reserves.

where can i find save games to upload?

Wherever you saved them on your PC.

Find the save file and upload it to somewhere like: http://www.filedropper.com/

Then post the link in the thread so people can download and look at it.

Thats a great attitude you have there

Why isn't everyone experiencing loads of injuries?

Maybe you could do more to lower the number of injuries you are receiving or maybe you don't know what a realistic number of injuries is?

Is the official party line that no changes were made to injuries with the patch?

Just interested to know because from my experience since the patch has come out, there is absolutely an increase in the number of injuries. That's actually not a complaint - I think the number of injuries we get now is more realistic than before, when with careful squad management I rarely had more than one player unavailable at a time, and could invariably put out a first-choice eleven when that is quite rare IRL. But if nothing was specifically changed regarding injuries for this patch, it seems absolutely certain to me that something else is affecting it. I'm using more or less the exact same tactics as I was pre-patch and have changed very little in my general approach, but the number of injuries has increased massively.

Again, this is not a complaint - I completely accept that injuries occur in football and do honestly believe it's more realistic than it was before (albeit probably going slightly too far in the opposite direction), and more immersive for it - I *like* having to find a way of masking the loss of key players without affecting performance too much, it adds an extra layer of depth to the game...but there is certainly something affecting the number of injuries that crop up, whether this was intended or not.

The problem with telling people to upload evidence is that it's not possible to upload both pre and post-patch evidence for comparison. I could post up a list of the injuries on my current game, and you would (rightly) say "what's your problem, the number tallies closely to how often injuries occur in real life"...but I can no longer post pre-patch details to show how rarely injuries occurred.

Just interested to know because from my experience since the patch has come out, there is absolutely an increase in the number of injuries. That's actually not a complaint - I think the number of injuries we get now is more realistic than before, when with careful squad management I rarely had more than one player unavailable at a time. But if nothing was specifically changed regarding injuries for this patch, it seems absolutely certain to me that something else is affecting it. I'm using more or less the exact same tactics as I was pre-patch and have changed very little in my general approach, but the number of injuries has increased massively.

Right, with the right squad management you shouldn't have any problems. Problem is that most of the people who are experiencing injuries want to blame the game first instead of trying to figure out what's actually going wrong.

Hi

So based on the fitness % then

Would low Match Fitness also be a cause for this?

If I have a player returning from injury and he is 94% fitness but 60% match fitness (so severely lacking I'd imagine)

... could this be a risk as well ?

I haven't come across this but apart from a shocking 2 week period I've always been very lucky with injuries .. so thought I'd check my understanding (or lack of!! )

That was exactly my point! They're more at risk because they're not match fit so condition % would drop much quicker in-game. Lower condition in-fame = bigger chance of injuries.

Is the official party line that no changes were made to injuries with the patch?

Just interested to know because from my experience since the patch has come out, there is absolutely an increase in the number of injuries. That's actually not a complaint - I think the number of injuries we get now is more realistic than before, when with careful squad management I rarely had more than one player unavailable at a time. But if nothing was specifically changed regarding injuries for this patch, it seems absolutely certain to me that something else is affecting it. I'm using more or less the exact same tactics as I was pre-patch and have changed very little in my general approach, but the number of injuries has increased massively.

Again, this is not a complaint - I completely accept that injuries occur in football and do honestly believe it's more realistic than it was before (albeit probably going slightly too far in the opposite direction), and more immersive for it - I *like* having to find a way of masking the loss of key players without affecting performance too much...but there is certainly something affecting the number of injuries that crop up, whether this was intended or not.

Officially SI have said they made no changes to the injury ratio.

However there seems to be a theory going around that players now lose slightly more condition than before which has a knock effect of causing more injuries.

Unfortunately there isn't enough evidence being provided to prove if there is an issue or not. Virtually none of the users who have an issue with injuries have uploaded a save, provided stats from it or anything, they simply make short posts on the forum complaining about injuries.

Right, with the right squad management you shouldn't have any problems. Problem is that most of the people who are experiencing injuries want to blame the game first instead of trying to figure out what's actually going wrong.

TBH I'm mainly making these points in response to the implied (haven't actually seen it confirmed officially) point that nothing has been changed with regard to injuries, because if this is the case then it's worth SI knowing that for a lot of people, injuries have increased hugely. It's not a question of blame, it's a question of SI being made aware that somewhere in the code one change may have had an inadvertent knock-on effect. Regardless of whether it's through poor squad management, dodgy tactics or anything else, if someone's set-up has remained unchanged pre and post-patch and injuries have ramped up, SI need to know that as it's an unintended change.

TBH I'm mainly making these points in response to the implied (haven't actually seen it confirmed officially) point that nothing has been changed with regard to injuries, because if this is the case then it's worth SI knowing that for a lot of people, injuries have increased hugely. It's not a question of blame, it's a question of SI being made aware that somewhere in the code one change may have had an inadvertent knock-on effect. Regardless of whether it's through poor squad management, dodgy tactics or anything else, if someone's set-up has remained unchanged pre and post-patch and injuries have ramped up, SI need to know that as it's an unintended change.

I'm sure they're fully aware by now.

Officially SI have said they made no changes to the injury ratio.

However there seems to be a theory going around that players now lose slightly more condition than before which has a knock effect of causing more injuries.

Unfortunately there isn't enough evidence being provided to prove if there is an issue or not. Virtually none of the users who have an issue with injuries have uploaded a save, provided stats from it or anything, they simply make short posts on the forum complaining about injuries.

Yeah well unfortunately there are a lot of people who are more interested in complaining than actually seeing their complaints solved.

Here is some slightly vague anecdotal evidence. In my last pre-patch game, I had two long-term (i.e. more than a week, as an arbitrary figure) injuries with my Spurs team - Younes Kaboul and Erik Lamela. I had a few other short-term injuries where players missed the odd game or were technically available but not worth risking, unfortunately I can't remember the precise details. But I'm pretty sure the two long-term injuries leading up to Christmas 2014 is correct - Lamela out for a month, Kaboul out for two months.

In my current, post-patch game, I have just hit December and long-term (again, more than a week) injuries have been as follows:

Adebayor (thigh strain, 2 weeks/chest injury, 2 weeks)

Kaboul (groin strain, 3 weeks/damaged elbow, 11 days)

Chadli (dislocated shoulder, 2 months/fractured wrist, 6 weeks)

Chiriches (back strain, 3 weeks)

Fazio (twisted knee, 2 weeks)

Paulinho (gashed leg, 10 days)

Mason (hip injury, 2 months)

Eriksen (gashed leg, 11 days/pulled hamstring, 3 weeks/strained wrist, 10 days)

Lamela (sprained ankle, 4 weeks)

Bentaleb (gashed leg, 11 days/thigh strain, 11 days)

Townsend (damaged knee cap, 4 weeks)

Seventeen injuries, none of which have come from over-use (I've played 26 games, none of those mentioned have played more than 16). Tactics almost exactly the same. Interestingly there are zero repeat injuries which could have been a potential cause. Chadli and Eriksen both got injured as soon as they came back (not too early - both returned as subs with 90%+ condition), which I put down as my own fault, maybe I should have waited even longer - but as you can see none of their injuries were related.

I cannot say with total conviction that in the pre-patch game I didn't have any other injuries. It's possible I missed a couple. But certainly nowhere near that many. If some people have noticed similar increases then clearly there IS an issue, regardless of whether others have been unaffected.

The main point to remember is that how people are managing or mis-managing their team is not the issue - the issue is that people are experiencing different number of injuries pre and post-patch without changing the way they have been managing or mis-managing their team.

TBH I'm mainly making these points in response to the implied (haven't actually seen it confirmed officially) point that nothing has been changed with regard to injuries, because if this is the case then it's worth SI knowing that for a lot of people, injuries have increased hugely. It's not a question of blame, it's a question of SI being made aware that somewhere in the code one change may have had an inadvertent knock-on effect. Regardless of whether it's through poor squad management, dodgy tactics or anything else, if someone's set-up has remained unchanged pre and post-patch and injuries have ramped up, SI need to know that as it's an unintended change.

It was confirmed sometime back that they havent made any changes to injuries this patch, or indeed this edition. Hasnt been touched in 2 years ahead of other changes they want to make. The closest you get to fitness of any kind is that players lose condition a bit more easily than before, but that's about. Also has to be said that after every patch for the last 2 years people have said "they are getting more injuries" without anything actually changing. See 15.2. for example.

I have about 5 different saves on the go, and I honestly haven't noticed any difference in the amount of players injured from before the last update. In fact, as I posted in another thread, on my Bath save on FMC, I've currently got no injuries. In fact, the most I have across any of the saves is five in my Hereford save, but four of those occurred before the update.

It could be that for some users changes to the ME have made in-game squad management more vital, but I've always been the type of manager who obsesses over my players fitness anyway, so I've not really noticed any difference.

Seventeen injuries, none of which have come from over-use (I've played 26 games, none of those mentioned have played more than 16). Tactics almost exactly the same. Interestingly there are zero repeat injuries which could have been a potential cause. Chadli and Eriksen both got injured as soon as they came back (not too early - both returned as subs with 90%+ condition), which I put down as my own fault, maybe I should have waited even longer - but as you can see none of their injuries were related.

17 injuries over 26 games is higher than the stats I collated from both my own save & Hairyculls in the feedback thread.

Is it excessive compared to RL? probably not, maybe a little high but you haven't mentioned your squad size or if any of your players are injury prone which could swing the figures making them look better or worse.

I cannot say with total conviction that in the pre-patch game I didn't have any other injuries. It's possible I missed a couple. But certainly nowhere near that many. If some people have noticed similar increases then clearly there IS an issue, regardless of whether others have been unaffected.

The main point to remember is that how people are managing or mis-managing their team is not the issue - the issue is that people are experiencing different number of injuries pre and post-patch without changing the way they have been managing or mis-managing their team.

Thats absolutely not the main point, at least IMO.

FM aims to be a simulation therefore people can do things which have a positive or negative effect on the amount of injuries they get. This could be anything from squad building, fitness management, squad rotation, tactics, training and possibly other things as well.

SI should aim for the number of injuries to be in line with RL based on the average user using average levels of everything over a significant period of time. If other users choose to do things which increase the injury risk then they quite correctly should suffer a higher rate of injuries over time.

This is where it stops being a black & white situation with many things to consider:

A) Number of injuries when compared to number of games, length of time and size of squad.

B) Ratio of match/training injuries.

C) Ratio of length of injuries (More short term, less long term).

D) How many/what rato of in match knocks become injuries after the match.

E) The choices a user makes - Training, tactics, squad rotation etc.

^I would add in the player himself: Injury-proneness, stamina, natural fitness.

^I would add in the player himself: Injury-proneness, stamina, natural fitness.

These are three key components a lot of people miss, primarily because it wasn't punished enough in previous versions of the game.

At the moment (touch wood) very few of my players are picking up long term injuries (2 months or more) that are keeping them out of the team. I'll maybe have 2 or 3 at the most at any one time. But I am noticing that a lot of my players are picking up knocks during the game that greatly affects their condition, and when their condition drops sometimes it only goes back up by a few %, so I end up subbing them early. It could be just unlucky that I've got a few players who don't seem able to shake off knocks in my team.

The main point to remember is that how people are managing or mis-managing their team is not the issue - the issue is that people are experiencing different number of injuries pre and post-patch without changing the way they have been managing or mis-managing their team.

I have not seen an increase or a decrease in the number of injuries my players receive. Mis-managing players is absolutely the cause. Too intensive with training and/or tactics with high tempo and lots of pressing was what led to injuries early in the game for me. Now I get barely any injuries.

Current injury list is four players long

2 out with cold

1 with a damaged knee cap

1 with Fractured wrist

I have just played about 20 matches since the patch and it seems to be about the same, that said I just had a frustrating game where in the first half I got 3 red injuries and 2 yellow, everyone was match fit and fitness wasn't bellow 94% for anyone. But I think the opposition was told to tackle hard and the ref was rather lenient this game, frustrating yes, out of the ordinary yes, but it seems like an unlucky game.

These are three key components a lot of people miss, primarily because it wasn't punished enough in previous versions of the game.

Injuries (and avoiding them) start with my transfers.

This is all to say nothing of the fact that all injuries, and their frequency of occurrence, are 100% editable pre-game.

If you think there are too many injuries then lower the frequency of injuries.

How is this still a thing?

A lot of problems with injuries can result from low condition, low match fitness and jadedness (which effects condition during matches). And luck.

If a manager (the manager being myself :-) and this is purely my opinion and experience that I've enjoyed) is firefighting injuries, this is what he would do -

- Make sure he has enough physios with good physio stats. If nothing else he has better estimates when players will be back and help manage the depth of the team for injured positions.

- Turn team training intensity to low or very low - this will limit jadedness increases (which effects condition during matches). Additionally there will be less injuries from training injuries due to low conditions.

- Consider resting players before a match to improve condition so they are less likely to get injured during the match.

- Consider resting players after a match to prevent injuries during training (the manager wouldn't do this if training is set to low or very low intensity - but might if there are a lot of injuries)

- Stamina effects condition, so consider changing general training to fitness for a chunk of the season for stamina gains.

- Stye of play effects condition. Flogging his players with super high tempo, closing opposition down, getting them stuck in against stronger more aggressive side will effect condition. Worth thinking about for those looming injuries.

- Ensures he has the best fitness staff.

- Plays players in under 21 teams till match fit for 45 minutes max.

- Doesn't always talk about himself in the third person.

This is all to say nothing of the fact that all injuries, and their frequency of occurrence, are 100% editable pre-game.

If you think there are too many injuries then lower the frequency of injuries.

How is this still a thing?

What? Are you talking about the editor?

I have never touched it and certainly not to make the game more palatable for myself, you shouldn't need to imho.

I have not seen an increase or a decrease in the number of injuries my players receive. Mis-managing players is absolutely the cause.

Sorry, but you are missing the point here. Once again, to clarify...

Regardless of whether a player is managing or mismanaging the side, if there is a significant difference between pre and post-patch injury records using the same tactics, then there is an issue outside of how you are managing the side.

In my case, I wasn't mismanaging my players - as I mentioned before, every one of those long-term injuries were to players who were not playing regularly. However even if I WAS over-working players, this mismanagement did not change between pre and post-patch - nothing changed about the way I set the side up or used the players, any mistakes I was making in this regard were occurring both pre-patch when I wasn't experiencing huge numbers of injuries, and post-patch when I was - so while it might be reasonable to say that post-patch my injury record is due to mismanagement, it is not reasonable to put the CHANGE in injury records pre and post-patch down to mismanagement, because there were no changes either tactically or in terms of how I used my squad.

That is the point. To clarify for the third time, my posts in here are not complaints about my injury record (as I mentioned previously, I think the injuries are much closer to real life now, even if people find it frustrating that it makes the game more difficult) - they are points intended to highlight a potential issue in view of the fact that SI did not intentionally change anything about injuries in the patch, because this sort of unintended knock-on effect is something they might well need to be aware of.

Regardless of whether a player is managing or mismanaging the side, if there is a significant difference between pre and post-patch injury records using the same tactics, then there is an issue outside of how you are managing the side.

Significant difference based on what?

What? Are you talking about the editor?

I have never touched it and certainly not to make the game more palatable for myself, you shouldn't need to imho.

But the point is, you can. Whether you should have to or not doesn't come into it really - if a particular user doesn't like the way injuries are, even when SI have said that they're happy with how they are, then they have the tools to make it more palatable to them.

I don't understand why someone would just sit in impotent rage at something that clearly isn't going to change, when they can change it for themselves.

Sorry, but you are missing the point here. Once again, to clarify...

Regardless of whether a player is managing or mismanaging the side, if there is a significant difference between pre and post-patch injury records using the same tactics, then there is an issue outside of how you are managing the side. In my case, I wasn't mismanaging my players - as I mentioned before, every one of those long-term injuries were to players who were not playing regularly.

However even if I WAS over-working players, this mismanagement did not change between pre and post-patch - nothing changed about the way I set the side up or used the players, any mistakes I was making in this regard were occurring both pre-patch when I wasn't experiencing huge numbers of injuries, and post-patch when I was - so while it might be reasonable to say that post-patch my injury record is due to mismanagement, it is not reasonable to put the CHANGE in injury records pre and post-patch down to mismanagement, because there were no changes either tactically or in terms of how I used my squad.

That is the point. To clarify for the third time, my posts in here are not complaints about my injury record (as I mentioned previously, I think the injuries are much closer to real life now, even if people find it frustrating that it makes the game more difficult) - they are points intended to highlight a potential issue in view of the fact that SI did not intentionally change anything about injuries in the patch, because this sort of unintended knock-on effect is something they might well need to be aware of.

If someone wanted to highlight something to SI, then they should upload their save.

Significant difference based on what?

I'm not sure what you mean here. Assuming you mean what is my justification for claiming there are significant differences between pre and post-patch injury records - see post #33.

themadsheep2001 - as I said earlier, uploading saves to check the difference between injury records pre and post-patch is only helpful if you have both pre and post-patch saves of the same game for comparison. Unless someone is able to provide save data for the exact same game both pre and post-patch, there's nothing to compare it to. I'm happy to upload my current save post-patch, but all that shows is that I have a normal injury record - there's no pre-patch of the same game to highlight the difference in injury records.