International Adaptability - A New Stat

How would people feel about players receiving a new stat called 'Internatational Adaptability'.

Each player gets a rating 0-20 in this field. The higher the rating the better there overall abilities translate to International Matches.

This way English players could still be top notch for their clubs, but when it comes to playing for England they aint going to be rushing to win world cups anytime soon as they are not very good at adapting their domestic games into the international calender.

It could be made a little more complex by adding an 'International Work Rate' and 'International Pressure' stat as well.

What do people think?

I think it's a great idea. International football is no longer a "step up", but it's definitely a completely different environment with which some players cope better than others, and club form is not necessarily a guide. But international management is very much an afterthought in FM, so I can't ever see it being implemented.

This is very much spot on. This should be implemented.

There is absolutely no need for more additional stats apart from the one you suggested.

If you voted No could you at least give your reasons as to why you dont think it should be implemented. Thank You.

I think it can be taken even closer with an additional/hidden stat.

I think an international manager should get an additional stat - or a greyed out stat becomes active when an international role is take on.

The stat should be caleld "Gelability" and it would be based on the past managers experience at win/loss/draw ratio, recent trophies won - say in the last 10 years etc.

All these factored in would give them a rating out of 100 in this new enabled stat.

The players then can only perform at this rating from the manager for the games.

For example, Roy Hodgson gets a 65/100 as he didn't have success at Liverpool, hasn't won competitions recently - therefore Wayne Rooney plays at 65%-80% of his stat levels - same for the rest of the squad. *(The reason I'm not going to 100% is that the manager needs to be better to get 100% out of the players, so a manager with 85/100 would be able to get 85%-100% out of their players).

This stat then changes on how the manger performs on the international scene, if they are knocked out of the competitions earlier than expected - then Roy would slip to 62/100, or if they go further than expected he moves a notch up to 67/100.

This introduces a variable that some players will place closer to their current stat level - while some won't.

You could have 5 players playing at 60%, 3 players at 75% and 2 players at 85%.

The level the players play at is then based on how they are performing at club level - and their current happiness levels etc.

For example, a player that has found themselves benched/injured but called up to the squad would more than likely play worse as they are currently unhappy - but if they're ambitious they might be looking to make a performance to attract attention - so they might play at a higher standard for that game only.

I think it would an intriguing way to have players in international teams play.

* Edit: introduced additional variables

I think it can be taken even closer with an additional/hidden stat.

I think an international manager should get an additional stat - or a greyed out stat becomes active when an international role is take on.

The stat should be caleld "Gelability" and it would be based on the past managers experience at win/loss/draw ratio, recent trophies won - say in the last 10 years etc.

All these factored in would give them a rating out of 100 in this new enabled stat.

The players then can only perform at this rating from the manager for the games.

For example, Roy Hodgson gets a 65/100 as he didn't have success at Liverpool, hasn't won competitions recently - therefore Wayne Rooney plays at 65%-80% of his stat levels - same for the rest of the squad. *(The reason I'm not going to 100% is that the manager needs to be better to get 100% out of the players, so a manager with 85/100 would be able to get 85%-100% out of their players).

This stat then changes on how the manger performs on the international scene, if they are knocked out of the competitions earlier than expected - then Roy would slip to 62/100, or if they go further than expected he moves a notch up to 67/100.

This introduces a variable that some players will place closer to their current stat level - while some won't.

You could have 5 players playing at 60%, 3 players at 75% and 2 players at 85%.

The level the players play at is then based on how they are performing at club level - and their current happiness levels etc.

For example, a player that has found themselves benched/injured but called up to the squad would more than likely play worse as they are currently unhappy - but if they're ambitious they might be looking to make a performance to attract attention - so they might play at a higher standard for that game only.

I think it would an intriguing way to have players in international teams play.

* Edit: introduced additional variables

I admire the passion you clearly have for seeing the international module improve, but I do think we have to be careful not to make this too complex. Perhaps a system like you have devised could be implemented over two or three releases, but I do think for now just a single stat could suffice.

That could free up time to work on international training too ;-)

I don't think it would be that hard to implement that.

If I've won 70% of games as a club manager and I've won several league trophies, the league and finished runner up in the Champions League.

You've got several categories to work out the managers points.

Win Ratio

+

Consistency in League

+

Domestic Cup

+

Consistency in Europe

which would all be factors in hiring an international manager.

Just making up figures - but they could be worked out

Win Ratio = 75%

League = Top 6 last 10 seasons = 60% success

Cup = Last 10 seasons at least quarter final = 70% success

Europe = Last 10 seasons - at least quarter final = 80% success

75+60+70+80=285

71/100

Players will then perform from the mark of 71% of their ability - perhaps 71%-85%

I think it's just about totting up as the game goes along, keeps track of your success rate, or another managers success rate.

It's just figures.

You might be expected to qualify for Europe and you finish 7th in the league - that wouldn't look good on your CV applying for an international role.

Therefore the game would mark your success in that season as 4/10 (or 40%)

If you get automatic qualification that season but don't win the league you get 80% for that year (or 8/10)

It's a matter of totting and doing simple calculations.

Like the idea but it should def be a hidden stat!

How would people feel about players receiving a new stat called 'Internatational Adaptability'.

Each player gets a rating 0-20 in this field. The higher the rating the better there overall abilities translate to International Matches.

This way English players could still be top notch for their clubs, but when it comes to playing for England they aint going to be rushing to win world cups anytime soon as they are not very good at adapting their domestic games into the international calender.

It could be made a little more complex by adding an 'International Work Rate' and 'International Pressure' stat as well.

What do people think?

Don't try to invent something which simply has nothing to do with real life. England's problem is not that players are not "adaptable". England's problem is two-fold: 1) crappy national team managers 2) players are not so good

Don't try to invent something which simply has nothing to do with real life. England's problem is not that players are not "adaptable". England's problem is two-fold: 1) crappy national team managers 2) players are not so good

I disagree with you. Your way would involve reducing the stats of many english players to the point where they would not perform very well for their clubs. We have seen over the past decade many players perform for club but fail to translate that form into International. Jamie Carragher recently revealed he did not have the same passion and drive playing for england as he did for Liverpool. We see it with many english players, so I disagree when you say I am creating a problem that does not exist. You would surely have to have been blind for the past 10 years.

I have to say I am quite shocked the poll is 50/50. It explains why not much love is given to this module and it stagnates every year that passes. Shame.

Don't try to invent something which simply has nothing to do with real life. England's problem is not that players are not "adaptable". England's problem is two-fold: 1) crappy national team managers 2) players are not so good

Not every team has players turning up in the same way they do for their clubs. Why? This is the answer.

I don't see why this can't be done with the current system, using a combination of attributes already in the game; Adaptability, Determination, Consistency and Important Matches.

I don't see why this can't be done with the current system, using a combination of attributes already in the game; Adaptability, Determination, Consistency and Important Matches.

Because those stats apply to both Domestic and International. The idea is to introduce something international specific in an effort to create a more dynamic difference between domestic and international. If you all believe English players perform for their country as well as they do for their clubs then I am gobsmacked.

This idea is dead already by the looks of it. Shame.

Because those stats apply to both Domestic and International. The idea is to introduce something international specific in an effort to create a more dynamic difference between domestic and international. If you all believe English players perform for their country as well as they do for their clubs then I am gobsmacked.

This idea is dead already by the looks of it. Shame.

You don't need to create another stat, simply tweak how the game translates the current attributes for an international fixture. That was my point.

Well if a player has a high pressure and important match stat then it would make sense that they would play well for the national team right?

Yes and an International Adaptability rating would decide to what degree such a tweak takes place. You cannot have it tweaked exactly the same all accross the international board for every single player. Thats not dynamic enough.

Pirlo plays just as well for italy as he does for his club, so I would imagine his IA would be around 18-19, therefore he would still be making the most of his overall stats when on International Duty.

An english player who does very well for his club but struggles to find the same form for england would have an IA of around 14-15. He only makes use of 75% of the ability he performs for his club.

It's quite simple and effective. But clearly a no go.

I would of even gone further and allowed you to employ a Sports Psychologist to the national staff bench. He would be able to improve a players International Adaptability if you asked him to work one on one with a specific player or even a small group of players at the same time.

What I will do is hopefully watch this debate unfold, and consider both sides of the fence. I will then come back in around a weeks time with one final poll on this subject. A more detailed pitch will be put forward with a few concerns addressed and a much better explanation of this system. I think one thing we can all agree on is that the International Module needs to be given some tender loving care. It's one area of the game that could be improved upon a great deal.

I would urge everyone to continue to give their initial thoughts and give reasoning as to why you are on what side of the fence you are on.

Thank you.

I vote no because in my opinion it's something which too often changes over time.

There are lots of players who struggle the first few times they play for their country but then come back after a period of time and thrive, and this attribute would essentially split all players into one of three camps - great for their country, OK for their country, dreadful for their country - and if that attribute is set from day 1 then it's completely unrealistic.

I dont tend to agree but because if you think about it, quite a lot of players would have IA ratings of 19-20 anyway. The vast majority of players wont be effected at all. The england team however....cough cough. We could solve this problem with this I am sure.

I disagree with this, i think there is al ready a stat to determine how well players react under pressure and big games so i think your idea is covered in this.

I disagree with this, i think there is al ready a stat to determine how well players react under pressure and big games so i think your idea is covered in this.

So explain to me how england win the world cup quite a bit since FM2005. Its a massive game killer when england win the world cup 2014. It needs a solution.

Work In Progress......

International Adaptability (IA)

A hidden stat that dictates how well a player carries over his overall attributes to the International environment. If Player A (English) had an IA rating of 15 then he would essentially only be making use of 75% of his overall abilities, however if his IA rating was 20 he would have the potential to make use of all of his abilities as he does domestically.

International Penalty Taking (IPT)

This statistic decides the chances of player converting a penalty during International Appearances. An example would be Player A (English) has a normal penalty rating of 19 but feels under intense pressure when taking them for his country. Therefore his IPT rating would be set at 14 to better reflect that, resulting in a noticeable lower conversion rate.

Sports Psychologist:

Hiring a sports psychologist can depending on their ability greatly improve a players chance of translating current club form into their International appearances. It can improve a players International Adaptability (IA), and International Penalty Taking (IPT) ratings.

ManagerFootball

Why is it a game killer though? on paper england have a great team you can't deny that and also how would adding new attributes change anything if anything adding new attributes is just going to complicate things and probably take away from the game.

There are many reasons why players don't perform internationally you can't just put it down to one stat.

Okay, cut it out guys. Let's get back on topic.

I am a customer too, I am entitled to my opinion as well. I'm sorry you don't like that, but as they say, tough. What is your proposal? Continue to see the Internatioal Module stagnate and suffer in exchange for more media questions and movember fluff. You propose the game just stands still and god forbid it makes any wholesale change even if for the better. Seriously you sound like a very loyal EA customer. :-P

ManagerFootball

Why is it a game killer though? on paper england have a great team you can't deny that and also how would adding new attributes change anything if anything adding new attributes is just going to complicate things and probably take away from the game.

There are many reasons why players don't perform internationally you can't just put it down to one stat.

We have a great team? Do we? Really? This team has nothing on the 1996 team. Are you serious?

I am a customer too, I am entitled to my opinion as well. I'm sorry you don't like that, but as they say, tough. What is your proposal? Continue to see the Internatioal Module stagnate and suffer in exchange for more media questions and movember fluff. You propose the game just stands still and god forbid it makes any wholesale change even if for the better. Seriously you sound like a very loyal EA customer. :-P

I would suggest take over germany at the start of the game and smash the world cup and probably beat england along the way.

I still do not understand why it ruins the whole game if in your simulations england win the world cup, in my previous fm experiences i have seen many suprise world cup winners for instance ireland won it before and the irish league wasn't even selected and sweden have done the same but in football anything can happen and that includes up to england winning the world cup.

We have a great team? Do we? Really? This team has nothing on the 1996 team. Are you serious?

So chamberlain is ****? rooney is ****? barkley is complete ****? what about cahill isn't he a regular at chelsea? yes we don't have gazza and shearer and incey but we still have good players can you honestly say uruguay or italys squads are 100% better on paper i think not. lol just realised i missed out the bit were i said on paper.

I would suggest take over germany at the start of the game and smash the world cup and probably beat england along the way.

I still do not understand why it ruins the whole game if in your simulations england win the world cup, in my previous fm experiences i have seen many suprise world cup winners for instance ireland won it before and the irish league wasn't even selected and sweden have done the same but in football anything can happen and that includes up to england winning the world cup.

If Ireland won it in your game, it clearly shows the International Module is not being loved enough. See if Crystal Palace won the prem in your very first season I'm sure that would not sit well with a lot of people. Ireland winning the world cup doesnt seem to be a problem though. strange.

So chamberlain is ****? rooney is ****? barkley is complete ****? what about cahill isn't he a regular at chelsea? yes we don't have gazza and shearer and incey but we still have good players can you honestly say uruguay or italys squads are 100% better on paper i think not. lol just realised i missed out the bit were i said on paper.

Chamberlain is still learning his trade. He has cool potential, but to say he is the complete world class player is naive.

Rooney has done nothing for England since 2004. Where have you been? Sorry scoring goals against san marino does not cut the mustard. Do it at a world cup Wayne.

Barkley has hardly broke into the first 11. Jesus give the guy time. declaring him great already again is naive. Talk about fantasy bubbles.

Cahill is mistake prone for england. Great for Chelsea. You just gave a reason why IA is a good idea.

Anyone else mate? I guess Glen Johnson is world class too. lmao

If you want to have a true world cup load all leagues of all nations.

He didn't say that they won it straight away. How do you know he wasn't talking 50 years down the line?

I can only speak for myself here but I can't see into the future, I don't know who will win the World Cup this year, or in four years time, or eight years time, or eighty years time.

For all you know England might win it this year, it's not impossible. Right now your problems with the game seem to be that a scenario that is technically possible happens and you don't like it, am I right?

It's technically possible for San Marino to win the world cup, ain't very likely at all though is it. If you believe the game is fine in not making a distinction between domestic and international modules then that's your opinion. You don't agree I get it.

Did anybody expect Greece to win the euros 10 years ago

Take moral for example. Club moral carries over into International periods, it does not change. That effects performances, so thats a flaw as far as I can see. There should be a different dressing room buzz for club and country. If you have won your last three international games when your players join up again there should be better morale around the place irrespective of their moral in the club dressing room.

If Ireland won it in your game, it clearly shows the International Module is not being loved enough. See if Crystal Palace won the prem in your very first season I'm sure that would not sit well with a lot of people. Ireland winning the world cup doesnt seem to be a problem though. strange.

Winning a 38 game league season and winning a cup tournament are completly different remember greece a few years ago?

All i am saying is making it so players are either good internationally or not doesn't make sense if you think these players are too highly rated then your solution is go on the editor and change the ability of these players yourself and problem solved.

Did anybody expect Greece to win the euros 10 years ago

Thats a valid point, but bear in mind a little that was a european championship where statistically shock winners occur more than at world cups. Take 1992 when Denmark won it too. For a world cup you cant find an shock winner at all. Uruguay was a good side back when they won it two times. World cups dont generate Greek or Danish winners. History backs that up.

Thats a valid point, but bear in mind a little that was a european championship where statistically shock winners occur more than at world cups. Take 1992 when Denmark won it too. For a world cup you cant find an shock winner at all. Uruguay was a good side back when they won it two times. World cups dont generate Greek or Danish winners. History backs that up.

So what your saying is they should program into the world cup coding that upsets never happen? come on mate you know thats ridiculous

Really? So a player who had a couple of great games for his country, goes back to his club for a few months before the next international match and for those months his club performs dreadfully, sitting well below where they should be in the league, the player has a rough time too, underperforming, picks up a few little injuries in that time, and his morale is at rock bottom.

He then joins up with the national side again and all of a sudden he's right back on top of the world?

If you don't think that a players morale carries over from club to country in real life then you're deluding yourself.

I'm not saying that past results with the national side won't have an effect, but a player who is in a slump won't suddenly bounce straight out of it because he's had some good games with that national team in the past.

I wouldnt say he is back on top of the world, but he should be feeling a little more optimistic. Maybe he goes from low morale to just average or vice versa. The manager would be reminding them 3 in a row, you been playing well together as a unit. Forget your club form you have been fantastic for me, the team and that shirt. Lets go and get a fourth win.

You're right, there haven't exactly been shock winners at the world cup but let me ask you this.

Were any of the following expected?

Germany humiliating Brazil in the semi final in 2014?

South Korea & Turkey making it to the semi-final in 2002?

Croatia beating the Netherlands to 3rd place in 1998?

Sweden & Bulgaria making the semis in 1994?

Belgium in the semis in 1986?

Poland beating France for 3rd place in 1982?

Poland beating Brazil for 3rd place in 1974?

Almost every year there is a surprise team in the World Cup, a nation that does better than anybody expected. Sure they do tend to fall at the last hurdle, but it doesn't change the fact that almost every year one nation seems to outperform everybody's expectations.

If I see Ireland in a world cup 2018 semi final and lose in FM 2015, I can live with that. I see England win Euro 2016 and Ireland win the 2018 World Cup, game breaker for me....again.

Not every team has players turning up in the same way they do for their clubs. Why? This is the answer.

It's about motivation, and motivation should be in the game. But not as "hidden attribute of a player", but rather something that Manager has.

Also, there should be stats of football federations. FA has crappy stats and it affects quality of national games.

It's about motivation, and motivation should be in the game. But not as "hidden attribute of a player", but rather something that Manager has.

Also, there should be stats of football federations. FA has crappy stats and it affects quality of national games.

Maybe a combination of both a manager and a player stat?

Love the FA stats idea by the way. Needs a bit of thinking on what stats and what they effect.

What you are proposing would essentially kill off the point of THE GAME, which is that players can take over sides and achieve great things with them even if that isn't very likely in real life. I personally love taking over a Conference side and transforming them to the best side in the country, can usually be done in about a dozen years in this game. Is it realistic? No. Is it fun? Yes. I've taken over smaller nations like the Ivory Coast before and won the world cup with a squad that was nowhere near good enough to do it on paper. Was it realistic? No. Was it fun? Yes.

The whole point of a game is for it to be enjoyable, and what you are proposing while it may technically be more realistic, removes a massive amount of FUN, and is therefore a bad idea.

Lets delete your flame baiting from your quote and focus on the meat of the subject at hand.

I am not saying lets kill the game. It would still be possible to do what you want. I'm saying the current International module is too erratic. Get a grip man.

Out of interest what would you propose to improve the International Module?

Ok, let me try one last time.

IT IS A GAME. OF COURSE IT IS NOT GOING TO BE 100% REALISTIC, THAT IS WHAT MAKES IT A GAME. IT WOULD BE PRETTY DAMN BORING IF NOTHING EVER HAPPENED IN THE GAME THAT WASN'T LIKELY IN REAL LIFE.

What you are proposing would essentially kill off the point of THE GAME, which is that players can take over sides and achieve great things with them even if that isn't very likely in real life. I personally love taking over a Conference side and transforming them to the best side in the country, can usually be done in about a dozen years in this game. Is it realistic? No. Is it fun? Yes. I've taken over smaller nations like the Ivory Coast before and won the world cup with a squad that was nowhere near good enough to do it on paper. Was it realistic? No. Was it fun? Yes.

The whole point of a game is for it to be enjoyable, and what you are proposing while it may technically be more realistic, removes a massive amount of FUN, and is therefore a bad idea.

Nope. It's a simulation.

Been thinking a little on that idea about Federations having a couple of stats. You could link that in with both IA and Morale:

Football Federation Stats:

Motivation

The motivation of a Federation has a moderate effect on player morale during International windows. A player who is going through bad form and moral with his club will receive a moderate morale boost during his time in the International set up. A Federations motivation is effected by a nations results on the pitch.

Culture

The culture of a Federation is a major factor in determining the International Adaptability ratings given to players. The higher rated culture a Federation has the higher a players International Adaptability.

Not only for the players but for the nations as well. For example, african countries have difficulties convincing their star players to join the team for matches of small importance. On the other hand, countries like Russia or Greece have very strong principles and the vast majority of players feels great pride in playing in the national team.

Not only for the players but for the nations as well. For example, african countries have difficulties convincing their star players to join the team for matches of small importance. On the other hand, countries like Russia or Greece have very strong principles and the vast majority of players feels great pride in playing in the national team.

I agree, and maybe somehow all of what you just said can be linked to the culture of a federation.

I voted no because I don't like it when partially hidden factors limit the importance of tactics, but I might agree with a stat like "National team dedication" influencing how motivated players are when not playing for their club.

About England overachieving in the game, I think the real problem is the database. English players are just overrated.

Been thinking a little on that idea about Federations having a couple of stats. You could link that in with both IA and Morale:

Football Federation Stats:

Motivation

The motivation of a Federation has a moderate effect on player morale during International windows. A player who is going through bad form and moral with his club will receive a moderate morale boost during his time in the International set up. A Federations motivation is effected by a nations results on the pitch.

Culture

The culture of a Federation is a major factor in determining the International Adaptability ratings given to players. The higher rated culture a Federation has the higher a players International Adaptability.

So if each nation has a culture or more motivation then others surely it would be impossible for a nation to progress so there for the strong footballing nations woulsd always be the same and forever continuing the status quo to me that sounds boring, for me football manager is part fantasy part simulation the whole point is you can achive the impossible with the right effort and commitment if you could not do this it would be boring and there would be no point playing because if your not the best nation/club in the world your ****ed and never will be.

And as you kindly ignored my reply to you earlier i will say it again crystal palace 99% of the time cannot win the league but could they win the fa cup of course they could because its a knockout tournament, look at the champions league do you remember the final between porto and monaco? do you remember liverpool getting to a couple of finals in recent years i can tell you now it was not expected.

At the end of the day there are things about international management that can improve on fm but your not even talking about that your saying the game always simulates matches in a way you disagree with.