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Thread: Next match engine update, fixes so far...( updated 4th February )

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    Default Next match engine update, fixes so far...( updated 4th February )

    With all the ( mostly ) excellent constructive feedback I thought it might be worthwhile sharing what is fixed so far for the next ME update.....I'll update this as we go. Obviously there are some issues reported in this forum that won't be fixed for the next update but a later one, as there are only so many changes we can make without unbalancing things and having no time to rebalance. The most important thing for us is that come release day, we have improved upon the beta version.

    Match v1302
    -----------

    - Fixed bug where keeper would not prevent team mate's poor control from becoming an own goal
    - Fixed one more example of keeper not controlling a backpass
    - Fixed players kicking off not always facing correct direction at start of 2nd half
    - Fixed AI teams not always setting one central midfielder to a defensive duty
    - Improved marking of player running with ball
    - Some ball physics collision fixes including the "hole in the net"
    - Reduced shots from tight angles

    Match v1303
    -----------

    - Fixed players going for the same ball and both avoiding each other leaving ball loose
    - Improved keepers at point blank range slightly
    - Improved keeper judgement coming for ball or making save
    - Improved angle of non held keeper save
    - More last ditch challenges/interceptions in danger area
    - Improved defender positioning in own area
    - Improved player reactions to loose ball
    - Made players in space more likely to try to turn to face opposition goal when on ball
    - Increased use of high risk high reward passes in dangerous areas
    - Fine tuned general pass choice
    - Fixed unrealistic clearances towards own goal

    Match v1304
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    - Midfields shifting across slightly more when defending
    - Tweak to defensive reactions
    - Reduced potential instances of wild clearances behind own goal
    - Toned down some risky passes slightly from 1303

    Match v1305
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    - Fix to stop "ghost" goals ( where ball goes in net and no goal awarded )

    Match v1306
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    - Further fix to ghost goals

    Match v1307
    -----------

    - And another fix to ghost goals

    Match v1308
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    - Temporarily disabled fix for "ghost" goals as its a bit troublesome and we have no time just now
    - Fixed keeper coming to punch ball and then diverting to avoid a collision and hence missing ball completely
    - Fixed some instances of keepers saving ball prematurely and getting little purchase on save
    - Fixed 3 bugs causing keepers not to attempt saves when they should do
    - Fixed keepers making risky quick throws or passes to team mates
    - Further fix for defending crosses
    - Slight tweak to speed of longer passes
    - Fixed wrong team getting throw/corner/goal kick after tackle sends ball out of play
    - Toned down long shots taken on weak foot slightly

    Match v1309 ( Beta Update & Demo )
    -----------

    - Sorted out problem with "ghost goal" fix and re-activated it
    - Fixed keepers trying to come out and intercept dribbled ball they have no chance of
    - Tweaked direct free kicks
    - Tweaked headers slightly

    Match v1310
    -----------

    - Improved player reactions to ball in general
    - More fixes to general keeper issues
    - Small tweak to pressing speed
    - Small tweak to range of D-line depth
    - Small reduction in boring passes by limited players
    - Defenders now drop back at goal kicks when instructed to collect from keeper

    Match v1311 ( release day )
    -----------

    - Fixed keeper fumbling ball on own line for no reason
    - Fixed 2 other small keeper anomalies

    Match v1312 ( release day hotfix! )
    -----------

    - Fixed bug where players still think its a free kick after kick is already taken

    Match v1313
    -----------

    - Refined position of d-line and also the lines in front of it when defending
    - Brought wingers a bit deeper when defending
    - Weaker players more likely to favour direct passes quicker
    - Improved short pass accuracy slightly
    - Tried to increase number of crosses slightly
    - Fine tuned shot accuracy
    - Fixed some minor player on ball decision bugs
    - Improved trajectory of medium length kicks like free kick shots and corners
    - Made players better at offering out ball to team mate
    - Tried to improve player reactions to deflected balls or tackles
    - Made players more willing to slide tackle when opportunity and need arises
    - Fixed some unnatural save directions from keepers
    - Fixed keepers trying to save ball at wrong point when its heading for post or bar
    - Made players slightly better at turning body while on the run
    - Made strongest player stand ground when 2 players collide while going for a header
    - Made goal celebration paths a little bit more varied
    - Fixed comms saying ball well wide when not really that far wide
    - Some ball physics collision tweaks
    - Some team talk fixes

    Match v1314
    -----------

    - Further tuned team shape and d-line position when defending
    - AM strata now comes back to defend unless set to "all out attack"
    - Made d-line shift up when opposing player with ball is successfully pressed
    - Made d-line shift back quicker when attacking player is running with pace at them with the ball
    - Some tweaks to marking of opponents in own area
    - Fixed defenders shifting across as full back engages winger in last third causing bad shape
    - Tried to reduce instances of players heading ball they could control a split second later
    - Some minor fixes relating to player interception of ball
    - Some refinements to off ball movement around ball player
    - Some general tweaks to pass choice and on ball decision making
    - Some more minor keeper save fixes
    - Fixed some instances of woodwork hit not being registered
    - Fixed player not waiting to getup before running off to celebrate after scoring a diving header

    Match v1315
    -----------

    - Fixed ultra rare crash when player shoots from close range
    - Further small refinements to on ball decisions and pass choice
    - Improved direct free kick trajectory slightly
    - Improved crossing aim AI
    - Fine tuned pass and shot accuracy slightly
    - Improved player reaction and awareness of ball generally
    - Improved defensive tracking of player running with ball
    - Slight reduction of player reaction time to fast curling balls
    - Slight reduction of player reaction time when ball a long way away from them especially if not facing it
    - Improved defender lateral positioning when defending wide ball
    - Fixed winger not staying wide when asked to hug touchline and ball on his side in advanced position
    - Goalkeeper should narrow the angle better when a play is running at him at speed
    - Goalkeepers should try to move under the ball path even if they think they can't reach it.
    - Fixed a bug where the keeper fails to catch a ball if it has just hit the crossbar/post
    - Fixed keeper turning ball over bar described as turning it round post
    - Fixed some player collision avoidance issues
    - Fixed a bug where an offside is given instead of a free kick
    for a foul
    - Stop a rare teleport bug with goal celebrations
    - Fixed animation issues whilst player argues with ref
    - Fixed small anomaly in team selection AI

    Match v1316
    -----------

    - Fixed bug causing players to occasionally react too late to pass
    - Improved pressing of opponents slightly
    - Made players more willing to go for a riskier interception if ball receiver is in a goalscoring position
    - Tweaked keeper positioning when facing down attacker
    - Reduced pointless passing slightly
    - Fine tuned chance of speculative passes slightly
    - Refine kick innaccuracy algorithm slightly

    Match v1317
    -----------

    - Fixed defenders not turning quick enough when tracking player running onto through ball
    - Reduced likelyhood of players making pass when in clear cut shooting position

    Match v1318 ( 13.1 ME hotfix )
    -----------

    - Fixed keepers not reacting to powerful close range shots

    Match v1319
    -----------

    - More improvements to on ball decision making and pass choice
    - Improved central midfielder starting position when team is in possession
    - Tweaked midfielder and attacker positions when team is defending
    - Fixed a couple of bugs causing players to fail to turn to face required direction properly
    - Improved facing direction of player marking opponent who is moving onto a pass
    - Fixed bug allowing players being able to partially "go through" other players to get ball without being penalised
    - Small tweaks to improve the way players move onto passes or loose balls
    - Reduced some instances of closing down of keeper when clearly illogical in context of player and his instructions
    - Cleaned up a few bugs that delayed retrieval of ball at set pieces or kick offs

    Match v1320
    -----------

    - A bunch of ball physics fixes mainly related to collisions and ball spin after bounce
    - Reduced slightly unrealistic ball to player deflections
    - More improvements to pass choice AI
    - Tweaks to run with ball and first touch AI
    - Reduced tackles that end in own goals
    - Some tweaks to basic central midfielder positions
    - Fixed some dodgy marking at mid pitch free kicks
    - Improved full back positioning when waiting for short keeper distribution
    - Improved near and far post corner aim point

    Match v1321
    -----------

    - Some further ball physics fixes and refinements
    - Fixed goal not always given if ball stops just over goal line
    - Fixed some rare instances of player collision avoidance failing
    - Further refinements to pass AI
    - Improved pass, shot or header accuracy logic
    - Further improvements to player reactions to the ball
    - Fixed defences staying to deep just after corner taken
    - Refined player positioning when defending free kicks from wide
    - Made players press more collectively and aggressively when required
    - Improved positioning of defenders against attackers running at pace
    - Refined tackling AI a bit
    - Improved facing direction while marking opponent around own area
    - Fixed some more keeper AI bugs

    Match v1322
    -----------

    - Improved collision avoidance AI slightly
    - Fine tuned ball trajectory chosen by player for kick, header etc
    - Fine tuned kick and header accuracy logic
    - Fine tuned pass and general on ball AI
    - Tuned long shot frequency and AI
    - Toned down pressing slightly in certain situations
    - Improved marking and engagement of ball player in wide areas
    - Tuned tackling AI further
    - Couple of small fixes to player reactions
    - Fixed some small player pathing anomalies
    - Fixed a couple of goalkeeper AI anomalies

    Match v1323
    -----------

    - Improved marking and engagement of ball player further
    - Fixed some instances of risky keeper distribution

    Match v1324 13.2
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    - Reverted one change from 1323 that was causing defensive issues
    - Fine tuned kick/header accuracy

    Match v1325 13.2.1
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    - Further refined 1323 code for engagement of ball player
    - Toned down speed players can run with ball a little
    - Slight toning down of run with ball probability
    - Fine tuned kick and header accuracy a little further

    Match v1326
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    - Tuned dribbling generally
    - Fixed issue that counted too many dubious instances of running past opponent
    - Toned down poor decision long shots
    - Fixed some instances of short underhit passes
    - Made keepers more aggressive in meeting short backpasses
    - Slight improvement to defender positioning for short goal kicks
    - Fixed bug that could cause players to try to clear ball from in front of own goal instead of scooping it clear

    Match v1327
    -----------

    - Improved last ditch tackling and engaging of ball close to own goal
    - Slightly reduced defender reactions at lower levels
    - Improved engagement of ball player to reduce effectiveness of running with ball
    - Fixed some instances where defenders dont engage ball player around own area until its too late
    - Further tuned kick and header accuracy
    - Reduced aimless passes into channel from high up pitch
    - Fixed rare instances of dead ball not being delivered correctly into opposing area

    Match v1328
    -----------

    - Further tweaked defending against ball player
    - Fine tuned run past opponent counts slightly further
    - Made dribbling slightly harder to achieve at higher speeds
    - Made most players a favour more direct passes slightly
    - Small fix to player reactions to loose balls

    Match v1329
    -----------

    - Made defenders more aggressive in terms of looking to tackle ball player
    - Fixed players with low closing down settings doing it so high up the pitch
    - Fixed players set to specifically man mark opponent from leaving him too eagerly to engage ball player
    - Small fix to specific man marking when opponent goes close to opposition d-line
    - Fixed some interceptions being logged as tackles
    - Fixed some instances of players playing opposition onside when defending free kicks
    - Fixed some more instances of players not reacting to loose balls
    - Fixed corner phase of play not ending when ball cleared way outside area, causing some bizarre knock ons
    - Fixed rare occurance of play not restarting after a goal

    Match v1330
    -----------

    - Fixed player not trying to turn and shoot when close to goal
    - Fixed rare instances of unrealistically innacurate kicks and passes
    - Fixed some further issues with players closing down or not closing down properly
    - Fixed some headers being unrealistically unchallenged due to collision avoidance code
    - Fixed too many unrealistically weak penalty kicks
    - Fixed some instances of unrealistically poor first touch
    - Fixed players getting stuck in nets when retrieving ball
    - Fixed rare issue causing keepers not to pick up routine ball near edge of own area
    - Reduced crowding of players going for same ball on some crosses/corners
    - Fixed assigned throw in takers not always being used for throws in attacking areas

    Match v1331
    -----------

    - Further refinements to closing down and engagement of the ball player
    - Some fine tuning of the weighting of short passes
    - Made wide midfielders pay a bit more attention to opposition full backs
    - One minor ball physics related fix

    Match v1332
    -----------

    - Fixed unrealistic dallying on ball
    - Less aimless clearances upfield when not under pressure
    - Couple more tweaks to closing down logic
    - Fixed bug where keeper fumbles ball then doesnt react properly
    - Reduced risky passes across defence line
    - Fix for ball passing through net occasionally

    Match v1333
    -----------

    - Couple more small tweaks to closing down logic
    - Further improved wide midfielder tracking of full backs
    - Fixed goal kicks not being taken short
    - Fixed quick free kicks rarely being taken
    - Fixed bug where keeper moves a long distance to retrieve ball at free kick and is caught out of position when its taken quickly
    - Fixed bug where keepers dont always try to dive at attackers' feet
    - Fixed players dropping too deep on some free kicks
    - Fixed a couple of bugs causing keepers not to intercept speculative balls properly
    - Fixed a couple of bugs causing players not to react to loose balls or passes correctly
    - Fixed bug causing player not to attempt jump for ball that he cannot quite reach
    - Tweak to off ball movement
    - Slightly encouraged high reward lofted passes
    - Made players who have just done a burst of running more prone to miscontrol
    - Fixed bug where player may over-run ball unneccesarily
    - Slight toning down on accuracy of more difficult kicks
    - Further fix for incorrect players taking attacking throw ins
    - Team talk fix relating to overfamiliarity with manager talk

    Match v1334
    -----------

    - Improved challenging for headers on long kicks
    - Fixed nasty knock on from 1333 relating to players switching off when taking control of ball
    - Fixed some lofted passes being a bit extreme
    - Reduced power of ball bounce off post and crossbar

    Match v1335
    -----------

    - Fixed rare instances of players dallying on ball ( caused by 1333 change )
    - Yet further tweaks to closing down logic
    - Fixed some instances of keeper short distribution not working
    - Couple more fixes relating to player reactions to ball

    Match v1336
    -----------

    - Reduced some instances of dangerous passes in defensive areas
    - Fixed rare bug where play freezes when two players close to stationary ball
    - Fixed rare bug where quick free kick is decided upon but never taken resulting in deadlock until end of period
    - Fixed unrealistic instances of players deciding to take over receiving ball from team mate

    Match v1337
    -----------

    - Very slight increase in width of defensive unit to try to open play up slightly
    - Fixed bug in pass choice AI that should now result in a bit better decision making
    - Slight reduction in 50:50 challenges for lower aggression players
    - Small ball collision fix

    Match v1338
    -----------

    - Fixed a couple of bugs causing keeper to not try a save
    - Fixed a rare bug causing players to double up on closing down an attacking player prematurely
    - Made first touch a key attribute for sweeper keeper ( needed in team selection/subs )

    So 1326-1338 are where we are with regards to the next update. No release date set just yet.
    Last edited by PaulC; 04-02-2013 at 17:49. Reason: New info

  2. #2
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    Excellent, beta is helping!

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    No far post crosses fix?

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    Crosses might be reduced by the improved marking of a running player? I really hope they can get that fixed until release

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    He did say "so far" watch this space

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    "there are only so many changes we can make without unbalancing things and having no time to rebalance"

    Does this mean no crosses and too many goals fix Paul?

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    What I don't understand is that this has been a 2 year project has it not? How come it's in the state is is now? I would have thought stuff like defending, keeper behaviour and far post crosses would have been looked at.

    Edit. Has the tiredness issue been looked at at all?

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    Good stuff, while people are annoyed at all the bugs in BETA, if you think about the bigger picture SI have alot more 'testers' now to spot all the bugs in time for the full release!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pipo2525 View Post
    "there are only so many changes we can make without unbalancing things and having no time to rebalance"

    Does this mean no crosses and too many goals fix Paul?
    he says they will update it as they go.. BETA has been out for 3 days, lets see how the list looks on November the 1st before we start discussing what might not be fixed for release

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    Hi PaulC, when will the patches be made available? Are you planning on lumping them all together and then just having one big patch come release day or will they be drip fed out?

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    While theres a lot of things annoying me and too many immersion breaking situations -winger to winger goals!! - happening with the ME at the moment, I can see that when the kinks get ironed out this ME is going to be a big step up from the previous one.

    I hope the ME improvements will be updated on a regular basis though. I dont mind the normal day one, pre christmas, feb patches, but as the ME is such a huge part of the game Id like to think it wont be long until we have a more balanced, less immersion breaking ME than we currently have.

    It was a great Idea to have a beta though, it makes things a lot more understandable when there are issues. I hope 2 weeks is enough time to sort out the current issues people are finding, if not Id like to see the beta rolled out a bit earlier next year so there is time for fixes for the day one release /patch.

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    Sports Interactive PaulC's Avatar
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    There are no firm plans for when ME updates will be made, but I know for sure that on release day there will be the changes as per the top of this thread, plus possibly one or two more. After that, with steam then in theory we can update as and when we feel we are ready to. What we wont do is make promises we then find we cannot keep.

    Yes its been a 2 year cycle but the decision to go with this ME instead of 12's was made in recent months. We knew it might be 2 steps forward 1 back initially but its the only way to get it to what you and we want it to be.

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    I certainly appreciate the time schedule/unbalancing argument, but...

    The amount of crosses and goals as a result is absolutely ridiculous, according to steam I've clocked up 15 hours now on the beta and borderline every goal I've seen is from a cross, both conceded and scored. Also I've just conceded directly from a cross that went in the top corner, normally I'd have a laugh about it but in the circumstances it just proves how broken the match engine is with regards to crossing.

    This is an absolute game breaker at the moment, I can clearly see the potential in the game but as it stands the match engine is simply not up to scratch. I hope this can be improved on for release because the game has huge potential.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    There are no firm plans for when ME updates will be made, but I know for sure that on release day there will be the changes as per the top of this thread, plus possibly one or two more. After that, with steam then in theory we can update as and when we feel we are ready to. What we wont do is make promises we then find we cannot keep.

    Yes its been a 2 year cycle but the decision to go with this ME instead of 12's was made in recent months. We knew it might be 2 steps forward 1 back initially but its the only way to get it to what you and we want it to be.
    I appreciate the response, and as someone who hated the one dimensional nature of the last match engine I appreciate a new one. It's great that crosses work (if too well to the far post). The lack of through ball goals is a concern as is the keepers and lack of tackling.

    It seems like teams are happy to let the oppo pass them to death with attempting to stop them. Then bang a goal.
    Last edited by dazbowski; 21-10-2012 at 11:48.

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    I also play the beta version with the best team in the league, and losing by small teams. Happens to be the home losing 1:5. It's really frustrating and I hope that the release of the final version of this problem will be solved!

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    How about the weather? I've played half a season and there hasn't been any yet. Is this a bug or has it not been switched on yet?

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    It seems strange that you made such a key decision a mere months before release, what happened to cause that? How long had you worked on this new Match Engine before that decision was made?

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    The only thing need fixing on crosses is the goalkeepers reactions and the player marking and posistioning.

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    Quote Originally Posted by V50 View Post
    It seems strange that you made such a key decision a mere months before release, what happened to cause that? How long had you worked on this new Match Engine before that decision was made?
    they said they have been working on the ME for 2 years now. So they waited until a few months ago before they decided if it lived up to the standards they wanted.

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    For clarification, Is that one or two more changes to the list at the top or one or two more updates?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HeatherIsBangTidy View Post
    The only thing need fixing on crosses is the goalkeepers reactions and the player marking and posistioning.
    I concur. This is the main problem I am finding at the moment. Regardless of what tactic I use or opposition marking/closing down etc, little changes. If just this one thing is sorted (the less minor bugs can be sorted over the long term) then this ME would be head and shoulders above anything SI have given us before............

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    - Fixed bug where keeper would not prevent team mate's poor control from becoming an own goal
    Oh good, I've given up several own goals because of this and it annoyed me, as the keeper should have been able to prevent each of them.

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    - Reduced shots from tight angles
    That's good, I've both scored and conceded several goals that looked a little odd. I was almost convinced that Clint Dempsey was a Jedi Knight or something, he seemed to have a knack for scoring at the oddest of angles.

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    Is there going to be anything done about the non-existent far post marking?

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    It's a huge step SI is taking with something as new as this ME it feels like no ME before and it's beautiful to see and i'm glad to see you guys will be fixing these angles by release and goalkeeper issues, i hope you guys have plans to improve CB's action, i've had too many goals with the striker winning headers and scoring from crosses while hes between the 2 CB's who are taller and have way better attributes for that, i'm playing with newcastle atm and i think they have some solid CB's it shouldn't be happening so often.

    The way i see it, if you press more, their winger passes to their wingback who crosses and well it's often goal
    If you don't press the winger rushes into the area and scores from angles even a high technical player would miss often

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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliPT View Post
    It's a huge step SI is taking with something as new as this ME it feels like no ME before and it's beautiful to see and i'm glad to see you guys will be fixing these angles by release and goalkeeper issues, i hope you guys have plans to improve CB's action, i've had too many goals with the striker winning headers and scoring from crosses while hes between the 2 CB's who are taller and have way better attributes for that, i'm playing with newcastle atm and i think they have some solid CB's it shouldn't be happening so often.

    The way i see it, if you press more, their winger passes to their wingback who crosses and well it's often goal
    If you don't press the winger rushes into the area and scores from angles even a high technical player would miss often
    The thing is it shouldn't be beautiful to watch. Football at a lot of levels is an ugly game. That teams are finishing games from BSP to Cl finals with 85% passing and all playign wonderful 1-2 touch football is not realistic.

    So Paul do you feel the ME will be polished to a RETAIL release standard come the 2nd ? because it reads like your saying it won't be.

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    There is something wrong with possession in the game too, I mean, I'm getting 60%+ each game and still hardly winning any of them. One of my friends was playing in League 1 and his CM completed 171 passes in one game with 93% accuracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by treble_yell_:-) View Post
    The thing is it shouldn't be beautiful to watch. Football at a lot of levels is an ugly game. That teams are finishing games from BSP to Cl finals with 85% passing and all playign wonderful 1-2 touch football is not realistic.

    So Paul do you feel the ME will be polished to a RETAIL release standard come the 2nd ? because it reads like your saying it won't be.
    While i do understand what you are saying, it ends all on the manager's tactic i mean any average player can play a short 1-2 touch football while keeping possession of course not nearly as good or beautiful as Barcelona or a team filled with star technical players, but if we were looking for that kind of realism where weak teams simply play dull football, then there would need to be different ME's for different level of teams lol otherwise there will always be the chance that we as human managers get some weak team playing like Barcelona in a couple of years

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    Quote Originally Posted by treble_yell_:-) View Post
    The thing is it shouldn't be beautiful to watch. Football at a lot of levels is an ugly game. That teams are finishing games from BSP to Cl finals with 85% passing and all playign wonderful 1-2 touch football is not realistic.

    So Paul do you feel the ME will be polished to a RETAIL release standard come the 2nd ? because it reads like your saying it won't be.
    While i do understand what you are saying, it ends all on the manager's tactic i mean any average player can play a short 1-2 touch football while keeping possession of course not nearly as good or beautiful as Barcelona or a team filled with star technical players, but if we were looking for that kind of realism where weak teams simply play dull football, then there would need to be different ME's for different level of teams lol otherwise there will always be the chance that we as human managers get some weak team playing like Barcelona in a couple of years

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    Match v1302
    -----------

    - Fixed bug where keeper would not prevent team mate's poor control from becoming an own goal
    - Fixed one more example of keeper not controlling a backpass
    - Fixed players kicking off not always facing correct direction at start of 2nd half
    - Fixed AI teams not always setting one central midfielder to a defensive duty
    - Improved marking of player running with ball
    - Some ball physics collision fixes including the "hole in the net"
    - Reduced shots from tight angles

    nice to see reduced shots from tight angles being looked at , that's happened loads on my save.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MakaveliPT View Post
    While i do understand what you are saying, it ends all on the manager's tactic i mean any average player can play a short 1-2 touch football while keeping possession of course not nearly as good or beautiful as Barcelona or a team filled with star technical players, but if we were looking for that kind of realism where weak teams simply play dull football, then there would need to be different ME's for different level of teams lol otherwise there will always be the chance that we as human managers get some weak team playing like Barcelona in a couple of years
    The weak teams would in theory have players with low attributes so it's silly to think multiple match engines would be needed. Players in the lower leagues are not knocking 1-2 touch passes about and finishing games with a team stat of 80%+ pass completion. The Match engine does do a passable job of simulating some nice flowing football , but every single team in the game is doing it that way.

    A big thing was made this year of philosophy , yet we are seeing big physical teams like Stoke playing like Arsenal or Barca.

    i just looked through my fixtures, in 15 games not once have the opposition had a lower pass completion that 76%, 10 games they have 80% or over. Players with a 10 rating for passing are finishing the game with 31/32 passes completed. Something is wrong with passing in the ME , I guess it may be linked to the broken defending.

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    haven't played the beta but will surely try the demo when it comes out. What I wanted to know is: demo ME will be same as beta or closer to release day version? thanks

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    Since you are the manager and since the players will do what you tell them yes you can get players in the lower leagues playing possession football with quick passing of course you'll end up with what? 60% completed passes? maybe less against 80+% on top teams. I'm saying it would need different ME's or at least it would need blockage on what you can do as a manager on lower leagues, otherwise you can get them to play whatever kind of football you want, if that's realistic? of course not but that's how the game goes, so yes you will see Stoke playing like Barca if you are managing stoke and you give them good tactics.

    Plus weak squads have a lot of passes and high % of complete passes and it makes sense, you are weaker you play slow, short passes, narrow formation, wasting time = possession + passes completion and number of passes it makes sense. That's not the problem with the ME, the reason why this happens is because the ability to intercept a ball in this ME is pretty weak and it's been looking at.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyAdams View Post
    How about the weather? I've played half a season and there hasn't been any yet. Is this a bug or has it not been switched on yet?
    I played a match in January where it was snowing, also played in a match where the wind was so strong, the goal kicks were not reaching the halfway line against the wind, and actually started curling back the way it came.

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    Quote Originally Posted by treble_yell_:-) View Post
    So Paul do you feel the ME will be polished to a RETAIL release standard come the 2nd ? because it reads like your saying it won't be.
    I have no idea how to respond to this. It will be what it is, and our best efforts will have gone into it, I promise you that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Internomad View Post
    I played a match in January where it was snowing, also played in a match where the wind was so strong, the goal kicks were not reaching the halfway line against the wind, and actually started curling back the way it came.
    Wind is a little OTT in the beta and is toned down for next ME update.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    Wind is a little OTT in the beta and is toned down for next ME update.
    Glad to hear it, i played my first match in the wind earlier and the goalkicks were mental!

    Was pretty funny actually

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    Has there been any work on 3 Man defences because it was really tough to use them in 2012

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    I really hope Clear incorrect offside and throw in awards are fixed because that really is hard to overlook.

    Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    Yes its been a 2 year cycle but the decision to go with this ME instead of 12's was made in recent months. We knew it might be 2 steps forward 1 back initially but its the only way to get it to what you and we want it to be.
    Can I read about the differences between the two engines anywhere?

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    Paul, apart from the improved marking, can you "convince" the players to tackle a player and not just shadow them as they run towards the goal. It's as if they're scared to tackle the player. And GK has got to improve. He just stands around and watches what's happening in the box as if he were a spectator.

    Oh and 1 more thing .... during a Champions league match, the "behind-the-goal" referee assistant was standing inside the pitch for most of the game !

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    Quote Originally Posted by Os View Post
    I really hope Clear incorrect offside and throw in awards are fixed because that really is hard to overlook.

    Thanks
    And goal kick vs. corner bug too, the decision always goes the wrong way with those too.

    Everytime the opponent tackles the ball from you and it goes out for a throw-in or a corner, the decision goes the wrong way. For some reason the match engine doesn't realize that the opponent touched the ball? It's bloody infuriating, and I can't believe how that could have been missed when testing the match engine. Or maybe the testing has been left for pre-release beta players...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikke View Post
    And goal kick vs. corner bug too, the decision always goes the wrong way with those too.

    Everytime the opponent tackles the ball from you and it goes out for a throw-in or a corner, the decision goes the wrong way. For some reason the match engine doesn't realize that the opponent touched the ball? It's bloody infuriating, and I can't believe how that could have been missed when testing the match engine. Or maybe the testing has been left for pre-release beta players...
    Well it was partly left, because its a Beta. The whole point of a beta is to find and spot as many bugs through public play testing. They never that fact, but they should have been even more obvious, because the whole point is that everyone who pre ordered is in fact a beta tester. What was on offer was a chance to be involved in the beta testing process basically. It was not an advanced polished copy of the game.

    A beta is not the same thing as a demo, far far from it. They are incredibly rough round the edges. There is a demo coming some point next week.

    As an aside, Paul is there a chance of seeing the changelist that came before these i.e the changes between FM12 and what we are currently playing?
    Last edited by themadsheep2001; 22-10-2012 at 08:25.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Internomad View Post
    I played a match in January where it was snowing, also played in a match where the wind was so strong, the goal kicks were not reaching the halfway line against the wind, and actually started curling back the way it came.
    OK, that's good to know. I haven't seen any weather at all in Holland, apart from sun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyAdams View Post
    How about the weather? I've played half a season and there hasn't been any yet. Is this a bug or has it not been switched on yet?
    I'm missing the rain/drizzle that it says in info is happening as well, and the rest of the terrific sun light/shadows/weather effects of FM12. Haven't made it to January yet to see snow, but some variation would be nice to see. Graphics on High

    edit: or I'm playing in Scotland and the grey weather just hadn't changed. 9th game in, rains fine, and saw finally shadows other than just a grey blob at the players feet while playing Aberdeen in a late day game.
    Last edited by Casin; 22-10-2012 at 15:11.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    Yes its been a 2 year cycle but the decision to go with this ME instead of 12's was made in recent months. We knew it might be 2 steps forward 1 back initially but its the only way to get it to what you and we want it to be.
    Couldn't agree more with this, it's obvious to anyone that the ME is the best yet. Yes it has bugs/quirks and they will take awhile to iron out but thats the nature of the beast with FM games. My issues apart form the obvious crossing issue is that the football is too pretty. It looks amazing but unless you are playing at the highest level than it really shouldn't look as it does. When I look at some of the lower league football it really is pretty simple stuff, i'd love to see FM replicate that.

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    You say it's been 2 years plan, so it was quite revolutionary project and I think you should release BETA at least 1month before final version because there are no better testers than big FM fans!

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    ma per caso verrą rilasciato un aggiornamento della beta?

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    What i feel has to be fixed besides crosses being way too efficient is players kind of exploiting this flaw by themselves. they don't even try playing through balls through the middlem they ALWAYS work down the flanks. very one sided at the moment, no use for an AMC whatsoever. Would be glad to see more variation in build up play.

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    Quote Originally Posted by arminio View Post
    You say it's been 2 years plan, so it was quite revolutionary project and I think you should release BETA at least 1month before final version because there are no better testers than big FM fans!
    We've had it in beta for weeks, just not as big or public a beta as this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Time_Consumer View Post
    What i feel has to be fixed besides crosses being way too efficient is players kind of exploiting this flaw by themselves. they don't even try playing through balls through the middlem they ALWAYS work down the flanks. very one sided at the moment, no use for an AMC whatsoever. Would be glad to see more variation in build up play.
    im using a amc and he does well. altho im inter and amc is coutinho or sneijder

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    Please check out my pkm 'Juventus vs Chelsea' on your pkm ftp folder which is a 9 goals thriller all from crosses and poor defending. Also around the 88th minute I score a legit goal but it was given a corner Would have ended 5-5.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PaulC View Post
    We've had it in beta for weeks, just not as big or public a beta as this.
    Just a question in regards to this. I have no idea how to code, nor the length it takes to do it, so I may be naive here, but how weren't these issues seen and rectified during the initial beta testing phase, before the current beta became public? It's not a good look for the FM series, or SI to release a beta version to the public, with such a short period of time before the official release, with such a magnitude of bugs to the match engine which makes the game near unplayable, especially without the firm assurances of match engine being fixed and playable in time for the official release.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thegr8anand View Post
    Please check out my pkm 'Juventus vs Chelsea' on your pkm ftp folder which is a 9 goals thriller all from crosses and poor defending. Also around the 88th minute I score a legit goal but it was given a corner Would have ended 5-5.
    I swear there is a bug with Chelsea, played a season with Newcastle in which we shared a 7-7 and 3-3 draw

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    The next game i just played against Liverpool I won 5-1 with 5 goals coming from crosses.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattStatto View Post
    Just a question in regards to this. I have no idea how to code, nor the length it takes to do it, so I may be naive here, but how weren't these issues seen and rectified during the initial beta testing phase, before the current beta became public? It's not a good look for the FM series, or SI to release a beta version to the public, with such a short period of time before the official release, with such a magnitude of bugs to the match engine which makes the game near unplayable, especially without the firm assurances of match engine being fixed and playable in time for the official release.
    +1 mate
    They'll be releasing a broken game by the looks of it. I really wanna play the game but when you head into a match and concede goal after goal from crosses it just makes you mad! Ive started about 4 or 5 different saves because i get frustrated with it and want to start with a fresh team in the hope it will be different. lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattStatto View Post
    Just a question in regards to this. I have no idea how to code, nor the length it takes to do it, so I may be naive here, but how weren't these issues seen and rectified during the initial beta testing phase, before the current beta became public? It's not a good look for the FM series, or SI to release a beta version to the public, with such a short period of time before the official release, with such a magnitude of bugs to the match engine which makes the game near unplayable, especially without the firm assurances of match engine being fixed and playable in time for the official release.
    Its a public beta, Its not a demo. Its a rough build released to the public for mass play testing and bug spotting. Playabilty and polish isnt really the aim of it. If you were looking for something with polish, wait for the demo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by themadsheep2001 View Post
    Its a public beta, Its not a demo. Its a rough build released to the public for mass play testing and bug spotting. Playabilty and polish isnt really the aim of it. If you were looking for something with polish, wait for the demo.
    He was talking abouts bugs nothing else, it may be a rough build but with full release only a couple of weeks away its a bit worrying that theres big bugs like the crossing problem, which are almost game-breaking for some. I think its fair enough to have a few concerns this close to release.

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    Quote Originally Posted by themadsheep2001 View Post
    Its a public beta, Its not a demo. Its a rough build released to the public for mass play testing and bug spotting. Playabilty and polish isnt really the aim of it. If you were looking for something with polish, wait for the demo.
    I literally don't have any other problems with the game, but the match engine. Everything else from what I've seen is great and a huge improvement. I was just merely commenting on the match engine and how by the sound of things, it doesn't seem like all of the obvious match engine bugs will be fixed in time for launch. I'm not hugely fussed that it's not working now, just as long as it's in working order for the release.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MattStatto View Post
    I literally don't have any other problems with the game, but the match engine. Everything else from what I've seen is great and a huge improvement. I was just merely commenting on the match engine and how by the sound of things, it doesn't seem like all of the obvious match engine bugs will be fixed in time for launch. I'm not hugely fussed that it's not working now, just as long as it's in working order for the release.
    I think you'll be pleasantly suprised how quickly many of these will get turned around before/on release.

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    This is the bugs forum, can we please restrict ourselves to the posting criteria laid down for it, ta muchly.

    PaulC will reopen this thread when he has anything to add.

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