Tactics Creator vs. Classic Sliders

[mrdorf]

What's the advantages?
I personally prefer the TC as it helps me visually see what I'm trying to do with my team. I'm still by no means a master of this game, but I'm beginning to understand how to implement ideas I've thought of personally or taken from this forum. I understand that those that understand the ME can use Classic Sliders to 'exploit' or gain an advantage over the AI but how is this achieved?

[milnerpoint]

Its two questions really, firstly, the TC is just a set of templates that goes over the top of using the sliders option, so anything you can do with sliders you can do with the TC and vice versa, i prefer the TC i hate using the sliders, but each to their own with that side of things.
Exploiting the ME can be done with both the sliders and TC if you know what to do, im not going into examples of what can be done, there are plenty thread on here if you want to find them, but it involves focusing on certain tactical area's the AI is not good at defending.

[mrdorf]

Not really into exploiting sliders. I just read somewhere (can't remember where, now) that people use the classic sliders to do so.

[milnerpoint]

Like i say you can use both to exploit the ME, they both have exactly the same affect on the ME and do exactly the same things, they just look different.

[welshace]

i use both...

and has nothing to do with exploiting deficiencies in the engine..

I use the TC to create general overviews of my tactics.. to get a 'ballpark' idea of one if you like... then I use the classic sliders to implement them properly, fine tune to what I want my players to achieve..

bottom line is that the TC is easier and quicker to use, but Classic leaves you with much more control over your tactics and the ability to better fine tune them.

[mrdorf]

i use both...

and has nothing to do with exploiting deficiencies in the engine..

I use the TC to create general overviews of my tactics.. to get a 'ballpark' idea of one if you like... then I use the classic sliders to implement them properly, fine tune to what I want my players to achieve..

bottom line is that the TC is easier and quicker to use, but Classic leaves you with much more control over your tactics and the ability to better fine tune them.

How? Sorry if I'm not understanding what you're saying, I understand the TC implements your ideas based off how it interprets how roles and duties function and then you can adjust them by ticking the box and moving the sliders up and down. How is classic giving you more control?

[Kenco]

TC all the way, the best feature ever added to the game.

[marty78]

TC all the way, the best feature ever added to the game.

Couldn't agree more.

[milnerpoint]

How? Sorry if I'm not understanding what you're saying, I understand the TC implements your ideas based off how it interprets how roles and duties function and then you can adjust them by ticking the box and moving the sliders up and down. How is classic giving you more control?

It doesnt, you have exactly the same amount of control using the TC as you do with the sliders, every single thing that you do with the sliders can be done with the TC and vice versa.

[robertcornell68]

I use the TC with a few tweaks. For example my DMC is a deep lying playmaker with hard tackling.

The introduction of the TC made it far easier to design complex tactics without spending hours shifting those damn sliders around.

[easternhawk2]

I'm with Welshace and use both. Set up the basic areas of the tactic with the TC, then fine tune it to my players strengths and weaknesses afterwards.

[BiggusD]

How? Sorry if I'm not understanding what you're saying, I understand the TC implements your ideas based off how it interprets how roles and duties function and then you can adjust them by ticking the box and moving the sliders up and down. How is classic giving you more control?

What you describe IS the Classic method. There is no difference between ticking off a slider to adjust it manually and a classic tactic.

[mrdorf]

What you describe IS the Classic method. There is no difference between ticking off a slider to adjust it manually and a classic tactic.

Thanks. TC made so much more sense as I could not get my head around the Classic Sliders. Now I can set up a player to play as an Anchor Man without having to adjust too much.

[welshace]

what biggus said.. ticking the sliders is just another way of using classic

[welshace]

Thanks. TC made so much more sense as I could not get my head around the Classic Sliders. Now I can set up a player to play as an Anchor Man without having to adjust too much.

the other thing is to set them as anchor.. and see what the sliders are showing... that will be the basic method of setting up an anchor... so the TC makes it easy to learn the sliders too

and i agree, best addition to the game in ages

[Siven]

I use the TC also with a few player instructions tweaks here and there depending on players.

It also makes better use of the touchline shouts than the classic set does, and a well used shout ingame can be a game changer.

[The_Damaja]

TC is far more realistic, its by no means perfect but its alright. The sliders just seem silly to me. Do you think managers tell players to have a mentality of 14 on a scale of 1-21 etc or whatever it goes up to? I understand the TC implements a similar system but it feels better to tell someone to be a poacher than telling them all the individual instructions.

Each to their own though, this is just my personal opinion.

[Sussex Hammer]

Still use classic as just cannot get on with the TC and shouts. Rather have 2 or 3 classic tactics that I use for various situations.

[mrdorf]

Still use classic as just cannot get on with the TC and shouts. Rather have 2 or 3 classic tactics that I use for various situations.

Why would Classic Sliders be better? Surely just telling players to be an Anchor Man or DLF would be easier than asking someone to close down 10 or something like that. Although I understand you can get them to be less aggressive in closing down by adjusting the sliders in TC, at least I'm able to have base to work on with it.

[BiggusD]

TC is far more realistic, its by no means perfect but its alright. The sliders just seem silly to me. Do you think managers tell players to have a mentality of 14 on a scale of 1-21 etc or whatever it goes up to? I understand the TC implements a similar system but it feels better to tell someone to be a poacher than telling them all the individual instructions.

Each to their own though, this is just my personal opinion.

Except poachers are fast players sneaking around near the central defenders and the offside line waiting to find that little space that they need to get a shot in. They do not dribble often. They are simply lurkers with one purpose; scoring goals. If you use the standard Poacher role in FM, you don't get a poacher but an attacking powerhouse that contributes greatly to chance creation just because he runs often with the ball. If you want a real poacher role, set Run With Ball to rarely.

Most of the other roles have similar problems.

I don't see how giving a specific set of slider instructions a name changes anything. You can do this with Classic as well, you know. I call my two defensive midfielders with these instructions Ballwinners because that is what they do:



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Just because the TC operates with other instructions for their defensive midfielders doesn't mean that my instructions are not representing such a real-life role. I just wanted my midfielders to be more aggressive, that's all. If anything, as passive as the default dmc's are, I find the behaviour of mine more realistic.

[Sussex Hammer]

Why would Classic Sliders be better? Surely just telling players to be an Anchor Man or DLF would be easier than asking someone to close down 10 or something like that. Although I understand you can get them to be less aggressive in closing down by adjusting the sliders in TC, at least I'm able to have base to work on with it.

Couple of reasons really but mainly just personal preferance.. I just like to try and do well at the game with my own tactic and ideas. IMO the TC is someone elses ideas so once you have allocated each position it's just someone elses opinion of how the sliders should be for each position. If you then change the sliders a little or untick a box or two it becomes a Classic Tactic anyway! Just feel more in control with classic.

Second reason is I find it's easier with Classic to find if something works, or doesn't because Classic doesn't use shouts. Maybe it's because I play on Key Highlights I could never get into shouts and if I asked team to play wide and then seconds later asked them to narrow up I couldn't work out if we scored a goal because of my first shout or my second, whereas if I tinker classic and something comes off I will save that tactic to implement the improvement I have seen.

I might be scratching my nose with my elbow so to speak but it's just my personal preferance and I hope Classic always stays in because I doubt I would buy the game if it became TC only.

[Karnage94]

I have almost exclusively used the TC since it's introduction and I only make some very small adjustments to what is there such as longs shots or keeper distribution. It can take 5 minutes to create a good tactic that you can change on the fly whereas with the old classic method, it was a lot of tweaking and adjusting and creating multiple tactics for different scenarios. It suits some but definitely not me.

[Nocuous]

Most people have nailed it. Use the TC to build a basic frame work, then the CS to fine tune the system. Works like a charms. Then in game, I use the sliders again for minor alterations. I also have a bank of saved tactical systems I can break out for when I want to make a big tactical change.

[SCIAG]

Until shouts are compatible with Classic Tactics then I will use the Tactics Creator. It's an interface which is quicker to use.

I miss the greater degree of control over what my players are doing, but the shouts save a lot of time.

[Sir_Liam]

I stubbornly stuck with the classic system until a year ago when I decided to give the tactics creator a proper chance.

My reason for sticking with the classic tactics for a while was because I liked the control, but also because I felt I achieved better results, as my first few games with the TC were poor.

I'm happy I'm using the TC now though. I guess I've got used to it, and I probably understand more now how the various instructions affect the match engine.

[Sussex Hammer]

Another reason I thought of is that when I made shouts with the TC I honestly didn't see any real difference at the way my team played. Again that may be because I always use Key Highlights and therefore didn't notice subtle changes but I always felt not in control as to what was happening.

[sjm]

I use the classic tactics because I often find myself disagreeing with the settings the TC wants to use and once you start overriding the settings you've got a classic tactic anyway (and shouts are rendered pretty much useless in the process if you override a lot of settings). I have sometimes started a tactic with the TC before converting to classic simply to get a quick template up.

I'd love to be able to define my own shouts and my own templates for different positions from within the game though. The shouts are a great idea but useless to me in their present form.

[mrdorf]

Couple of reasons really but mainly just personal preferance.. I just like to try and do well at the game with my own tactic and ideas. IMO the TC is someone elses ideas so once you have allocated each position it's just someone elses opinion of how the sliders should be for each position. If you then change the sliders a little or untick a box or two it becomes a Classic Tactic anyway! Just feel more in control with classic.

Second reason is I find it's easier with Classic to find if something works, or doesn't because Classic doesn't use shouts. Maybe it's because I play on Key Highlights I could never get into shouts and if I asked team to play wide and then seconds later asked them to narrow up I couldn't work out if we scored a goal because of my first shout or my second, whereas if I tinker classic and something comes off I will save that tactic to implement the improvement I have seen.

I might be scratching my nose with my elbow so to speak but it's just my personal preferance and I hope Classic always stays in because I doubt I would buy the game if it became TC only.

Fair enough. I see why you would want to use Classic instead. I'm prefer TC, though as I just feel I understand how things work better and then make minor adjustments according to what I see on the pitch.